Kamen Rider Transduality Revision "II"

[Omazio2019]

Then what about good and evil? Certainly those who transcend time yet have no concept of good and evil which is non-time dualities

 

[Firestorm808]

Transcending good and evil is more of a morality thing than something you can have an immunity from.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Before we get into the meaning of those words, allow me to explain the context of Zi-O II itself.

Back in this thread, it has been accepted that Zi-O II should scale above Decade Armor, which scales to the real Decade. This scaling chain is significant because Zi-O II is Sougo's next evolution after Ohma Zi-O in the original timeline.

Originally, Zi-O used this form to defeat every Rider out there, including Decade and Gaim. Hence, the playback for him literally claims that his power transcends all riders. In other words, Zi-O II's transcendence places him above a transdual being who has become one with all existence and is no longer bound by destruction-creation.

The context is that becoming king requires Sougo to stand above anything because every Rider is below him, no matter if you're the destroyer of worlds or have a transcendent existence.

 

[ImmortalDread]

@Firestorm808 You don't need to show immunity, you can also show transcendence, and it qualifies.

 

[Firestorm808]

@Firestorm808 You don't need to show immunity, you can also show transcendence, and it qualifies.

Per the ability page, you need to justify being qualitatively superior or immune to the effects of what you transcend.

We have seen examples of immunity from time-related stuff, but what about examples of qualitatively superior/immunity from the other stuff mentioned stuff?

 

[Firestorm808]

Before we get into the meaning of those words, allow me to explain the context of Zi-O II itself.

Back in this thread, it has been accepted that Zi-O II should scale above Decade Armor, which scales to the real Decade. This scaling chain is significant because Zi-O II is Sougo's next evolution after Ohma Zi-O in the original timeline.

Originally, Zi-O used this form to defeat every Rider out there, including Decade and Gaim. Hence, the playback for him literally claims that his power transcends all riders. In other words, Zi-O II's transcendence places him above a transdual being who has become one with all existence and is no longer bound by destruction-creation.

The context is that becoming king requires Sougo to stand above anything because every Rider is below him, no matter if you're the destroyer of worlds or have a transcendent existence.

It has been determined in a previous thread that MoB Gaim gets Transduality T1 for the Creation/Destruction Cycle

For Zi-O Forms w/ Gaim Watch, he atm gets Transduality T1 for Time and Creation/Destruction Cycle via Gaim. For Transduality T2 we need assurance that he has qualitatively superior/immunity from the other stuff. From what I recall, he isn't no-selling other riders with powers still within dualities. The lower forms of Zi-O, I have doubts of T2.

I could see Oma Zi-O possibly having T2 it because he no sells everything thrown at him in the series and is the Ultimate Form.

 

[Omazio2019]

Well actually Gaim novel also said the other thing beside destruction and creation. It's good and bad, malice-hostility and hero will
When Sougo become Zi-O II, he transcend time and all riders those represent good-evil, hostile-hero that is why he can beat Another Rider (Another Ryuga) without the relate Legend Rider (Ryuga). And also he is immune to Another Ryuga's Attack Reflection which can reflect any kind of attack, even create a mirror version of Geiz (Mirror World reflect the law of reality itself)

 

[Jamesthetaker]

It has been determined in a previous thread that MoB Gaim gets Transduality T1 for the Creation/Destruction Cycle

For Zi-O Forms w/ Gaim Watch, he atm gets Transduality T1 for Time and Creation/Destruction Cycle via Gaim. For Transduality T2 we need assurance that he has qualitatively superior/immunity from the other stuff. From what I recall, he isn't no-selling other riders with powers still within dualities. The lower forms of Zi-O, I have doubts of T2.

I could see Oma Zi-O possibly having T2 it because he no sells everything thrown at him in the series and is the Ultimate Form.

Yes, I would argue that only the stronger form of Zi-O would have TD 2. That being said, the content of this revision might change in a future revision, per what the OP said.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/kamen-rider-transduality-revision-ii.145476/#post-5274071

 

[Fixxed]

@Firestorm808 You don't need to show immunity, you can also show transcendence, and it qualifies.

You must

Because in nondual state, you him self is transcending/unbounded by duality, but nondual is not enough for have TD

 

[ImmortalDread]

Difference between nonduality and transduality is "qualitative superiority or showing immunity"

It is explicitly there in standards

 

[Fixxed]

Difference between nonduality and transduality is "qualitative superiority or showing immunity"

It is explicitly there in standards

Yes, because that you must show some kind of immunity

Transcending or unbound something without context can mean just resistance, not make it necessary qualitative superior or immune

 

[ImmortalDread]

You are actually wrong. It's said "qualitative superiority or immunity."

And why would this be resistance? The context is talking about dual systems.

 

[Fixxed]

You are actually wrong. It's said "qualitative superiority or immunity."

And why would this be resistance? The context is talking about dual systems.

Bruh because of that i says you must have to show some kind of immunity

And here i talking about the word "transcending/unbounded". That word is not necessary make the character in the state of immunity/qualitative superior

 

[ImmortalDread]

Show me the standards that says this. Because it clearly gave two options.

 

[Fixxed]

Show me the standards that says this. Because it clearly gave two options.

And the two option is to proof a qualitative superior or immunity. So proof that if you want have TD

 

[ImmortalDread]

I agree? Did disagree with that? What I disagreed with your statement is you need those two "requirements" (which they are not, rather two options) to prove your TD.

Maybe due to your language you could not explain it, then my bad but you worded it wrong.

 

[Fixxed]

What I disagreed with your statement is you need those two "requirements"

Where and when i say that??

 

[ImmortalDread]

You must

Because in nondual state, you him self is transcending/unbounded by duality, but nondual is not enough for have TD

.

 

[Fixxed]

.

And where in that, i write you must have both requirement to have TD?

 

[ImmortalDread]

You literally quoted on me saying it is two options and you say :you must. So it means you disagree.

Eh, let's drop it.