Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
So if I understand correctly, Maki's head and arm started moving at the same time (which I didn't deny), and then Maki successfully moved her head away from the trajectory of the bullet before the panel where she clasps her hand on the bullet, correct?
And that it is possible her head and arm moved at different speeds and distances, even if they started moving at the same time.
If we got really technical, the body/head movement would take place after the arm, but that's beside the point. The arm movement and the body/head movement did travel different distances, however, they are not separate movements, the movement of body/head are a result of her momentum moving them. Maki isn't moving as in "Moves her arm and moves her body", its "Its moves her arm, which causes the body/head to move". Any example would be stretching your arm forward "You stretching your arms causes your body/torso to turn". I mean, if its bullet catching or just simple everyday movements, different speeds.Do we all agree that:
- Maki successfully moved her head away from the trajectory of the bullet before the panel where she clasps her hand on the bullet
- It is possible Maki's head and arm moved at different speeds and distances (even if they started moving at the same time)
The 220 was based off the arguments made by Dr._whiteee, if there is a better reason to use the 73-120 range in your example, I would like to hear it.Why 220 m/s specifically when we can cherrypick all sort of speeds from cartridges that wouldn't fit into a Colt Python?
As explained earlier, her head movement isn't consciously moving her head, its the shift of momentum that her arm moving a to catch the bullet at great speeds, cause her to shift her body/head to the side. Using the same example "stretching your arm forward", stretching it forward, causes the body/torso to shift/turn as a result, not out of complete conscious effort, stretching your arm out faster or hard will cause the turn to bigger and faster, because of the momentum. That's what is happening with Maki.The timeframe should only apply to her head moving away from the bullet.
Afterwards there is no need for her hand to catch the bullet before it travels 4.7 cm. she could catch it after the bullet travels 10 cm or 15 cm for example with no issue.
Dr._Whiteee's calc takes into account the feat for what it is, Maki catching the bullet as it is inches away from her face. The body/head movement is inconsequential to the calc, as it has no bearing. Its merely a by product of Maki's shift of momentum of moving to catch the bullet at high speeds.Dr. White assumes that Maki moved her head away, and then uses the timeframe it would've taken the bullet to hit Maki's head if it stood still to calculate the speed of Maki's arm catching the bullet.
My calc was based on a proposal to solve the discrepancy (Maki's head being much further than the bullet when she caught it) by having Maki bend backwards while catching the bullet. Though a simpler proposal would be to simply have Maki's head move to the side.
There are other feats of maki dodging/blocking bullets above, can you please calc those as well , so maybe we get some support evidence?@LIFE_OF_KING would you be willing to apply the new calc rating to the relevant profiles?
Adding to that the whole bullet shot thing happened while mai was having a monologue on how she hates maki, homever the databooks do claim mai used rubber bullets against the students because otherwise she would get in trouble, homever that can aply only to her regular bullets not the jujutsu made one, so is very ifft ether or not that was a rubber bulletI do think it does make more sense to use a normal bullet for the gun's speed, since the bullet we're shown that Mai shoots doesn't look like a rubber one. And due to Maki's unique nature in the Jujutsu World, Mai has less reason to use a rubber to try and hit her sister than she would anyone else. It's not as big for her as it is for most other sorcerers.
It is saffer i guessI feel based on what is currently known, it is best to use rubber bullet speeds.
I was under the impression that the forum had come together and ruled the instance to be a rubber bullet.I think more proof for that bullet being a real one is the damage suffered by both Nobaru and Maki from the two separate bullets. Nobaru shows no sign of bleeding or anything of that nature from a surpise shot to her head, however Maki's hand is shown bleeding after catching the bullet. It really does seem like Mai used a real bullet against Maki.
However, if people still think we should go with a rubber I'll concede. Do we have a speed for rubber bullets fired from the revolver we see or a gun comparable to it?
Pretty sure most agree with 220m/s given the justification outlined in my blog which has gotten two mod agreements barring you changing your mind.We never actually saw her move her head, so I still think Dr. White's method is the right one.
You need to choose the speed of the bullet you are going to use though.
Can you calc the other instances maki catched bullets though, it may serve as supporting evidencePretty sure most agree with 220m/s given the justification outlined in my blog which has gotten two mod agreements barring you changing your mind.
I don't calc (speed feats at least) lol. I can't imagine they wouldn't be in the same range or better though so may not need to be calced unless trying to squeeze everything from them.Can you calc the other instances maki catched bullets though, it may serve as supporting evidence
OkI don't calc (speed feats at least) lol. I can't imagine they wouldn't be in the same range or better though so may not need to be calced unless trying to squeeze everything from them.
Even Dr. White and PowerToScale previously stated that Maki moved her head to the side.We never actually saw her move her head, so I still think Dr. White's method is the right one.
Height from bullet to top of head: (1.7 x 73)/(963) = 0.12887 m Width of half of Maki's head: (1.7 x 42)/(963) = 0.074143 m Timeframe: 0.047/60 = 0.00078333 s Moving head down speed: 0.12887/0.00078333 = 164.52 m/s [Subsonic] Moving head to the side speed: 0.074143/0.00078333 = 94.651 m/s [Subsonic] |
So why not use the head's movement to get the speed of her body/head?As explained earlier, her head movement isn't consciously moving her head, its the shift of momentum that her arm moving a to catch the bullet at great speeds, cause her to shift her body/head to the side. Using the same example "stretching your arm forward", stretching it forward, causes the body/torso to shift/turn as a result, not out of complete conscious effort, stretching your arm out faster or hard will cause the turn to bigger and faster, because of the momentum. That's what is happening with Maki.
She was previously shooting with rubber bullets just fine, and from Momo's reaction using regular bullets on humans is a no-no, and Mai isn't the type to go against authority.I do think it does make more sense to use a normal bullet for the gun's speed, since the bullet we're shown that Mai shoots doesn't look like a rubber one. And due to Maki's unique nature in the Jujutsu World, Mai has less reason to use a rubber to try and hit her sister than she would anyone else. It's not as big for her as it is for most other sorcerers.
I'm not saying Mai was trying to kill Maki. More that Maki is tougher than most others but Todo and Yuji (who she tried to shoot earlier with real bullets so its not like Mai wouldn't have them on her) so rubber bullets are unlikely to be much of a threat like they would be for the others. What more, we're shown a clear difference in the actual danger of these bullets by how Maki's hand is hurt by just catching Mai's while Nobara gets headshotted with no sign of blood and is just knocked out.She was previously shooting with rubber bullets just fine, and from Momo's reaction using regular bullets on humans is a no-no, and Mai isn't the type to go against authority.
The answer is already in my statement. Because the body/head movement is inconsequential. Her head movement isn't intentionally moving her head; it's the shift in momentum caused by her arm moving at high speeds to catch the bullet, which causes her body/head to shift to the side. Furthermore the feat is highlighted as her catching the bullet.So why not use the head's movement to get the speed of her body/head?
Maki needs to move her head away before the bullet travels 4.7 cm.
She doesn't need to finish catching the bullet before it travels 4.7 cm.
Firstly, The calc focuses on the head movement, which is wrong. As I've stated, The movement of the body and head is minimal. Her head movement is produced by a change of momentum induced by her arm moving at high speeds to catch the bullet, which causes her body and head to shift to the side. Her catching the bullet is also cited in the manga as the feat, not the head movement.Even Dr. White and PowerToScale previously stated that Maki moved her head to the side.
Maki's head was no longer close to the bullet nearly to the same extent (19.7 cm of empty space from the bullet to the right side of the panel); assuming continuity and that the bullet moved in a straight line this means that Maki's head moved away.
Update the calc to use the head for movement as a second method:
Jujutsu Kaisen: Mai's Bullet Catch - Super Hyper Enhanced Ultra Cursed Edition
vsbattles.fandom.com
Height from bullet to top of head: (1.7 x 73)/(963) = 0.12887 m
Width of half of Maki's head: (1.7 x 42)/(963) = 0.074143 m
Timeframe: 0.047/60 = 0.00078333 s
Moving head down speed: 0.12887/0.00078333 = 164.52 m/s [Subsonic]
Moving head to the side speed: 0.074143/0.00078333 = 94.651 m/s [Subsonic]
@Duedate8898 @Therefir @Dr._whiteeeSo should somebody apply the results of the calculation that Therefir accepted now, or does it need to be updated from rubber bullet to regular bullet speed first?
The rubber bullet end is fine, I think me and duedate are waiting to see what therefor feels about real bullet speed.Or do we need to do something else here based on other conclusions? I may have misunderstood.
I actually think using a real bullet should be fine, her hand is bleeding and the injuries caused by rubber bullets are different (don't look at it), not to mention that rubber bullets are usually way bigger than that.The rubber bullet end is fine, I think me and duedate are waiting to see what therefor feels about real bullet speed.
I have updated the blog using real bullet speed and got hypersonic results.Okay. Thank you for helping out.
A calculation for real bullets seems fine to use then.
If the timeframe is based on the position of the head, and she is no longer constrained by said timeframe because her head moved much further away than the distance the timeframe is based on, then head movement sounds very consequential to me. And this is not a minor detail; this is something that can massively inflate the result.The answer is already in my statement. Because the body/head movement is inconsequential. Her head movement isn't intentionally moving her head; it's the shift in momentum caused by her arm moving at high speeds to catch the bullet, which causes her body/head to shift to the side. Furthermore the feat is highlighted as her catching the bullet.
Just because Maki needs to move 4cm doesn't mean she does. It doesn't matter how far she needs to move, only how far she DOES move, which we can see is greater.
[...]
Firstly, The calc focuses on the head movement, which is wrong. As I've stated, The movement of the body and head is minimal. Her head movement is produced by a change of momentum induced by her arm moving at high speeds to catch the bullet, which causes her body and head to shift to the side. Her catching the bullet is also cited in the manga as the feat, not the head movement.
She needs to move half the width of her face within that timeframe. After that timeframe she can do whatever she wants; such as catching the bullet, moving her head further, swinging her body a far greater distance, etc.Secondly, assuming the head movement is accepted, properly calc it by using what is shown, not your own bare minimum assumption, to downplay the feat. Assuming Maki only moved half her face width, when we have visual evidence of her moving far greater.
This is what's on my mindSo the other topic awaiting discussion and evaluation is the implication of Projection Sorcery on the verse's speed and scaling.
I am not understanding what you’re getting at here with the constrained timeframe/movement. Can you reword your sentence?If the timeframe is based on the position of the head, and she is no longer constrained by said timeframe because her head moved much further away than the distance the timeframe is based on, then head movement sounds very consequential to me. And this is not a minor detail; this is something that can massively inflate the result.
The same can be said for you, how do you know her first reaction wasn’t “Catch the bullet”? The difference is that mine is backed by the contextual evidence, the whole feat being her catching the bullet and stating it to be catching the bullet, and the visual evidence, the visuals prioritizing the bullet catching and for it being the main focus and not her head.Lots of assumptions. How do you know her first reaction wasn't "I need to get my head away from the bullet", or that she reflexively both tried to dodge the bullet and catch it?
The first line: The timeframe is based on the distance between the bullet and Maki, the feat is completed within the timeframe. (I feel like that’s what you’re trying to say, but just worded badly).The timeframe is based on the feat being completed before the bullet moves a certain distance, not how far Maki needs to move.
We can prove that Maki moved her head away before that timeframe.
We can't prove that Maki finished catching the bullet before that timeframe.
This is not how that works. It doesn’t matter how much she NEEDS to move but how much she DOES move. We don’t cut the movement down to whatever they need, we use their shown movement.She needs to move half the width of her face within that timeframe. After that timeframe she can do whatever she wants; such as catching the bullet, moving her head further, swinging her body a far greater distance, etc.
There’s nothing to it really. Naobito and Naoyo using their projection sorcery at its top/best are faster than everyone but Gojo, as stated by the manga. It has no bearing on other character speeds. It’s just that simple.So the other topic awaiting discussion and evaluation is the implication of Projection Sorcery on the verse's speed and scaling.
Uh? This is BS an actual BSThere’s nothing to it really. Naobito and Naoyo using their projection sorcery at its top/best are faster than everyone but Gojo, as stated by the manga. It has no bearing on other character speeds. It’s just that simple.
Because the statement has nothing to do with any other character. Nothing in the statement affects other characters, it literally only refers to a very weakened Maki.Uh? This is BS an actual BS
Why won't in verse statements about the characters actual speed have no bearing on their speed? Does that even make any sense to you?
A very weakened maki that is more powerful than any other version of maki and those who scaled to the previous maki?Because the statement has nothing to do with any other character. Nothing in the statement affects other characters, it literally only refers to a very weakened Maki.