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Joseph Joestar VS Qrow Branwen

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I understand for part 4, but in no way did part 3 Joseph become any less intelligent. Just see his fight with Empress.

Yes. His tactics are persisely why he is able to take out opponents much more skilled than him, such as the Pillar Men. And we see his on-the-fly tactical skills in his fight with Empress in Part 3. Qrow's semblance isn't broken prob manip like Hajime's; the most it does it make him lose less often.

Eh, he has HP to supplement them.
 
Again i bring up the example of Ruby, who is consistently able to land extremely precise shots with her sniper rifle even at close range and who just seconds before Qrow showed up was able to make a precision shot over Tyrian's shoulder, being unable to hit a close target that is standing still due to Qrow being there. Qrow's semblance can absolutely affect someone's ability to fight or take actions properly and he has demonstrated the ability to make such a thing happen, and this was done without focusing his bad luck.
 
Remember the Sun and Darby? Yeah no, Part 3 Joseph was a dumbass.

Impressing Dio is not such a big accomplisment either (Dio is also super dumb compared to the pillar men), part 2 Joseph could have countered time stop with his projectiles or hiding in a place Dio wouldnt look in the 5 seconds he could stop time in.
 
Most of Part 3 Joseph's senilism was part of a gag, joke, or PIS. Most of the time he's serious (DIO, Empress), he employs great tactics. Only in Part 4 is his mental/physical state seriously addressed.

Joseph's even more of a crack shot. He's able to preform similar feats with firing off a soda bottle cap.

What feats does he have while focusing? If we don't have any, we can't assume more than what he has shown.
 
@Dargoo Joseph never did so rapid fire at close range, and Qrow's semblance would hamper his accuracy
 
Yes, he has. Examples being his use of his Tommy Gun, and most of the soda feats were at a remarkably close range. Having an invisible hamon conductor that can trap his opponents is also sort of a big deal.

It wouldn't hamper his accuracy directly, it would indirectly cause him to be less accurate (light in the eyes, dust, etc.). Even then, Qrow's semblance doesn't save him from every hit, and given Joseph's skills the first couple of attacks will more than likely land.
 
It might not, the problem with Qrow's semblence is that it seems to be completely random. We have no idea who it's going to effect, what it's going to do, I feel that arguing that his semblence will be some game changing factor is a little far-fetched.
 
It hampered Ruby's accuracy directly, she went from a precision sniper to not being able to hit a stationary target from close range

Yeah and Old Joseph doesnt lead with Hamon so even if he hits Qrow it likely wont be charged with Hamon until later in the fight
 
We don't know if it was his luck manip that caused that. At best the only direct feat we have is the buildings falling apart due to his warnings. And in that case it wouldn't be probability manip but rather a form of mind manip, as probability has nothing to do with how accurate you are; environmental conditions are the major factor when it comes to chance. In short, a skilled sniper doesn't miss because they suddenly become a poor shot, the environment would just be in a bad positon for them to fire at their best.

However, he leads with HP, which he often charges with Hamon. He just wouldn't apply Hamon to himself.
 
@Dargoo Yes it was his luck manip, Ruby visibly struggles to him them even when theyre standing still despite having no issue before Qrow showed up
 
Ruby struggling to land a hit on Tyrian seems much more like he's just faster than her; even in the fight they were moving a bit faster than she could track. She's also trying to aim as he's engaging Tyria, so she's obviously trying not to hit her own uncle. You're giving the prob manip feats that it doesn't even really have.

And again, messing with someone's firearms skills is not probability manip.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Tyrian
He was quite literally standing still and Ruby missed him, he didnt even dodge
Click to expand...
from what I rememeber Tyrain was moving his tail around during that scene could be wrong though.
 
No, you'd just be assuming powers off of something completely unrelated to it.

At best you have PIS with Ruby's aim.
 
Its really not PIS, in the episode directly after the fight with Tyrian Qrow explains that all the problems in the fight were due to his semblance causing bad luck
 
> character missing a shot

> passive mind manip

Okay.

He just explains his embalmer has an influence. He didn't singkehandedly cause every mishap in that fight, and poor aim doesn't line up with his own description of his ability.
 
It really does when the person who missed the shot is a sniper with years of training who can consistently hit extremely precision shots against moving targets
 
If ruby had missed more than one shot I would agree with weekly, but it was just one so I'm hesitant to say it was Qrow's semblence and not mearly human error.
 
Even the greatest sniper misses a shot every now and again. To say that it's impossible and that it has to be Qrow's semblence sounds pretty far-fetched to me.
 
Yet he doesn't explain that he's causing people to miss. He just talks about the bad luck and his curse.

I already explained how they are separate, stop trying to add abilities from circumstance.
 
Hamon already has mind control properties. It's not out of the ordinary to assume that any passive mind manip from his semblance would be ignored entirely, if that is indeed how it functions.

My point about luck was to illustrate all the shitty situations Joseph found himself in, and has still managed to get through via his own quick thinking and abilities, even impossible ones. I don't see any way Qrow's semblance is really going to have him take the win. It's going to annoy Joseph and he'll feel like he can't do anything right, but again, he'll come out on top eventually, due to the fact that there are some things that can't be stopped via bad luck (like someone stabbing you) and that Qrow's semblance is merely chance, not a guarentee.

...

Anyways, we've gotten a bit off-topic. Weekly, why are you still using the buckshot argument? Joseph is in a fight against a sniper, he literally cannot hit him if he just keeps his distance. That doesn't mean he can't force Qrow to stop sniping, though. How?

The Joestar Secret Technique! My man decides to book it, non-stop running as far away from Qrow as he can. He's done it against another opponent he could not defeat, Kars. He's done it to a stand he had no idea on harming, Empress. He's going to run away from an explosive sniper, and that's final. He knows what he has to do, get to the city streets and lose him. Qrow is going to be forced to refrain from using his buckshot for fear of destroying property or endangering citizens, who are especially at risk because of his semblance. There's less room for something to go wrong if he decides to just stab Joseph, so that is exactly what he does.

Through this LIKELY if not expected course of action, Qrow will be forced to fight Joseph in hand-to-hand combat. He catches up, Joseph realises and lets him. They proceed to fight. For the sake of argument, Qrow is more skilled in fighting. He starts off throwing punches, kicks and other fancy blows from his sword all of which are able to connect, but not harm Joseph. Regardless, he is ragdolled around the streets rather amusingly.

Eventually, the old man is not having it. This has been the most embarassing day of his life, can his luck get any worse? He finally resorts to using his secret weapon: HAMON! He starts practicing his breathing in the middle of his beatdown, now making more of an attempt to block every blow rather than the important ones. Qrow's had about enough to, and activates his scythe in an attempt to just lob Joseph's head off. He does so and swings... but Joseph catches it! His prosthetic arm! He acknowledges that it's been a long time since he's used this, but activates the nail in the coffin for Qrow: Sendo Hamon Overdrive. He actively floods the scythe he's holding onto with dangerous amounts of hamon, something that normal people are unable to see, only commenting that the person seems glowing and full of life rather than witnessing the electricity.

Essentially charging Qrow like a battery through his own scythe, the drunk begins to lose his motor functions. Regardless of if he was undead or not, small amounts of hamon have been shown to steal bodily control from non-hamon users. Instead, he is being charged with a dangerous amount, shutting down major organs instead. This is the end for Qrow. Joseph follows up with another overdrive or punch to his opponents face, knocking them out.
 
TLDR: Joseph runs away like he always does, forcing Qrow not to shoot out of fear of his explosive rounds potentially harming a bystander or property. He instead engages in hand-to-hand and begins kicking Joseph's ass over and over. Still, Qrow is only >18 tons against a 64 ton opponent so Joseph isn't dead or anything. He begins to use hamon, grabs his enemies blade or scythe with his prosthetic arm and pumps him full of hamon, snowballing immediately into a win for Joseph.
 
While I don't disagree with Prof in Joseph winning, I feel like something is off about including bystanders as an integral part of your vote, as otherwise every standard Superman fight would have him massively holding back and taking hits just to prevent casualties.
 
Okay, well if we assume it is evacuated Qrow is still not inclined to destroy the homes and shelters of people who live there, not when he can use his sword.

If it was bloodlusted it wouldn't be an issue. If he was evil it wouldn't be an issue either.
 
I mean, you're not wrong, I'm just feeling something off about it; stuff outside the opponent is hardly ever talked about in SBA threads even when the two characters fighting are strict pacifists.
 
Well this battle doesn't take place in a void, and there is nothing about SBA that the areas are uninhabited or even fake. Would Qrow even know that?

Unless I see a rule telling me otherwise I think it's fine to assume that Qrow is not going to blow up city streets, cars and houses in an effort to hurt Joseph from a distance, especially when there is increased risk of bad luck for others because of his semblance. There's more room for error and something bad to happen when shooting an explosive round into the street, rather than swinging a sword.
 
I mean...he was just fine with tearing up parts of Beacon while students were in the area during his fight with Winter, and buildings got wrecked as a side effect of him fighting Tyrian
 
His fight with Tyrian was in a ruined abbandoned city, Weekly. It had already been destroyed. His fight with Winter was also on HER government property, and he didn't cause any significant damage to it anyway.
 
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