Healthy Itachi vs Pain (concluded)

[MinatoSparkle]

Itachi Seals via torsuka blade Or Pain use Chibaku tensei weird

did you read the arguments presented?

Itachi can control the time dilation however he likes, and Tsukuyomi isn't his only genjutsu anyway. He has many others that can easily incapacitate.

No, it's strictly mental. The mental damage just happens to affect some people physically.
But yeah, nah, it was anime only and was not a genjutsu surprisingly enough lol.

I know he can control the time dilation, but no matter how he does, it'll be a picosecond in the real world, so if he wants to incapacitate then go for the kill a normal genjutsu is a better option.

Hm, but do the bodies have a mind to damage really? Would that affect Nagato himself in that case? Kinda hard to tell since a sharingan user never fought Pain.

Well that's a pretty interesting jutsu then.

 

[Arkenis]

did you read the arguments presented?

I know he can control the time dilation, but no matter how he does, it'll be a picosecond in the real world, so if he wants to incapacitate then go for the kill a normal genjutsu is a better option.

Hm, but do the bodies have a mind to damage really? Would that affect Nagato himself in that case? Kinda hard to tell since a sharingan user never fought Pain.

Well that's a pretty interesting jutsu then.

I think the fact sound genjutsu messed up the paths yet their ears shouldn't work if the brain doesn't but they still get affected so I think genjutsu would from itachi.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I think the fact sound genjutsu messed up the paths yet their ears shouldn't work if the brain doesn't but they still get affected so I think genjutsu would from itachi.

Hm...fair point, though it might be more like because the sound waves are filled with chakra, it disrupted the chakra sent from Nagato. Pretty headcanony though, so you might be right. Man, Pain is weird.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Hm...fair point, though it might be more like because the sound waves are filled with chakra, it disrupted the chakra sent from Nagato. Pretty headcanony though, so you might be right. Man, Pain is weird.

Visual genjutsu disrupts chakra as well, all forms of genjutsu do.

 

[LightReinh12345]

did you read the arguments presented?

Not all but most of them

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Not all but most of them

But you're not sure who you agree with? chibaku tensei counters have been mentioned.

 

[Arkenis]

I think I said who I think wins but I'll say again in case this helps @LightReinh12345

So Itachi's win cons that are easily done are Amaterasu spread, Speed advantage, Likely tsukuyomi (if you agree genjutsu can effect the paths)

Pains win cons that are best for him are Soul removal, A wide scale shinra tensei, Chibaku Tensei (takes time to actually form but has strong gravity pull that itachi can't get out of, and Spamming the paths abilities


Ways Itachi counters most of Pain's win cons are through speed, better defense (yata mirror), stopping the chibaku tensei in a different way (probably loses if pain goes with this first), Amaterasu negs most paths.

Ways Pain counters Itachi's wins are Absorption of amaterasu or shinra tenseing it off, Likely overwhelming Itachi (still yata mirror should prevent this easily).

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

I still think pain should win because he'll find himself cornered immediately by itachi and he'll use the chibaku tensei. Itachi can't kill the chibaku tensei since him alone couldn't do anything to it and needed chakra mode naruto and bee's help.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

It's very out of character for Nagato to use Chibaku Tensei early in a fight. It also depends on how close the fight is to Nagato's location. If it's far enough away, he'll need to get closer first, something that Itachi won't just sit back and allow.

At the end of the day, I believe the fight will be over before CT becomes a factor, but that's somewhat up to personal interpretation I guess.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Well itachi can take care of the preta path with the totsuka blade and at the same time use amaterasu on the naraka path, that would basically be enough motivation for nagato to use catastrophic planetary construction, the distance depends on OP, if nagato can't use CPC then the pains get stomped.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Well itachi can take care of the preta path with the totsuka blade and at the same time use amaterasu on the naraka path, that would basically be enough motivation for nagato to use catastrophic planetary construction, the distance depends on OP, if nagato can't use CPC then the pains get stomped.

See, the thing is, Naruto destroyed these two paths, and Pain still didn't immediately attempt to run away in order to use CT. It's just a literal last resort for him, after absolutely everything else fails.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Unrelated question to the thread, if Itachi seals a Path into the Gourd can the Animal Path summon back the sealed Path out of the Gourd?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Unrelated question to the thread, if Itachi seals a Path into the Gourd can the Animal Path summon back the sealed Path out of the Gourd?

No. Summoning Jutsu can't circumvent Sealing. Remember when Edo Madara tried to summon Kurama during the war?

 

[KingAllen30]

So is this thread result was Solo king strikes again??

 

[KingAllen30]

I’m more interested in Nagato vs Itachi (healthy) ngl

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

No. Summoning Jutsu can't circumvent Sealing. Remember when Edo Madara tried to summon Kurama during the war?

But what about the almighty Substitution Justu

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

See, the thing is, Naruto destroyed these two paths, and Pain still didn't immediately attempt to run away in order to use CT. It's just a literal last resort for him, after absolutely everything else fails.

I think nagato would be smart enough to realize that itachi would stomp him if he doesn't use it but good point.

 

[KingAllen30]

Btw what is the wincon to each side?

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Itachi has amaterasu, susanoo, and speed in his favour, pain has chibaku tensei and that's it really.

 

[KingAllen30]

is Pain likely to used Chibaku? Because iirc he used it on Naruto when his back was on the wall. And also can Itachi kill all of them fast enough before Pain used that technique?

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

IMO if itachi kills the naraka and preta paths, nagato would just realize it's futile to fight itachi and would just use chibaku tensei, but he might not still.

 

[KingAllen30]

I meannn even when he being stomps by 6 tails he still doesn’t used it until later in the fight

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Also, I'd like to point out that this late into the fight, Itachi would've certainly figured out the Deva Path's 5 second cool down, and would most definitely try to take advantage of it.

 

[KingAllen30]

Also, I'd like to point out that this late into the fight, Itachi would've certainly figured out the Deva Path's 5 second cool down, and would most definitely try to take advantage of it.

Yeah that 5 second cooldown is really crucial and Itachi def will notice it

 

[BlastX]

What happens if Itachi seals the Deva Path with Totsuka blade early on?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

What happens if Itachi seals the Deva Path with Totsuka blade early on?

He stomps the rest since they're far less problematic and powerful. Half of them are non-combat types to begin with.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

What happens if Itachi seals the Deva Path with Totsuka blade early on?

Oh shit... I was gonna say that the naraka path can bring the deva path back but it can't, if itachi actually does that he wins.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

So is this thread result was Solo king strikes again??

Should I consider that a vote?

 

[KingAllen30]

Yes

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Yes

added

Unrelated question to the thread, if Itachi seals a Path into the Gourd can the Animal Path summon back the sealed Path out of the Gourd?

Do you have a vote?

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

I also vote itachi, if itachi seals the deva path then nagato has no win conditions and nagato is unlikely to use the CPC anyway.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I also vote itachi, if itachi seals the deva path then nagato has no win conditions and nagato is unlikely to use the CPC anyway.

I assume you mean chibaku tensei, but why do you call it cpc?

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

I am a nerd so I sometimes call it catastrophic planetary construction because it sounds cool.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Construction? Last I heard it was Devastation

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

That's the translation I read. There's the translation that you probably know where they call it planetary devastation but I like catastrophic planetary construction better.

 

[LightReinh12345]

I think I said who I think wins but I'll say again in case this helps @LightReinh12345

So Itachi's win cons that are easily done are Amaterasu spread, Speed advantage, Likely tsukuyomi (if you agree genjutsu can effect the paths)

Pains win cons that are best for him are Soul removal, A wide scale shinra tensei, Chibaku Tensei (takes time to actually form but has strong gravity pull that itachi can't get out of, and Spamming the paths abilities


Ways Itachi counters most of Pain's win cons are through speed, better defense (yata mirror), stopping the chibaku tensei in a different way (probably loses if pain goes with this first), Amaterasu negs most paths.

Ways Pain counters Itachi's wins are Absorption of amaterasu or shinra tenseing it off, Likely overwhelming Itachi (still yata mirror should prevent this easily).

Yes good Job for depicting this for me
If Itachi Spams amaterasu that much he will loose his chakra reserve significantly
& The Counters you mentioned can go either way so I am Voting incon it will depend who negs the others first

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Yes good Job but if Itachi Spams amaterasu that much he will loose his chakra reserve significantly
& The Counters you mentioned can go either way so I am Voting incon it will depend who negs the others first

Amaterasu alone could take out most of the paths. And Itachi's significant speed advantage should mean he negs first in most scenarios (especially if you consider that Itachi>=EMS Sasuke who has relativistic reactions). Using a crow clone substitution or exploding shadow clone would work very well if Pain tried pulling him in or absorbing his soul, and yata mirror on either the humaoid or armored susanoo blocks a strong shinra tensei.

 

[LightReinh12345]

But you're not sure who you agree with? chibaku tensei counters have been mentioned.

Kinda Vague I am Voting incon

Amaterasu alone could take out most of the paths. And Itachi's significant speed advantage should mean he negs first in most scenarios (especially if you consider that Itachi>=EMS Sasuke who has relativistic reactions). Using a crow clone substitution or exploding shadow clone would work very well if Pain tried pulling him in or absorbing his soul, and yata mirror on either the humaoid or armored susanoo blocks a strong shinra tensei.

Speed Isnt Equalised here?!?
Anyway The thing is pain while fighting naruto was pretty much nerfed due to fighting the whole leaf Village, Performing A Titanic shinra tensei he couldnt pull out the soul of naruto since he cant even kill him he was Holding back to not kill him & Naruto Has all info of him which even kakashi & jiraiya didnt know at that point still after these massive disadvantages guess what pain bodied him it took Kurama's influence on his hatred to transform into V2 6 tails cloak Kyuubi
I dont think even healthy itachi has this much chakra reserve to beat all six paths of pain by spamming susanoo & amaterasu after defeating five paths his chakra reserve would drop that will affect his other stats this will give pain advantage to incon & itachi does not know which pain absorbs ninjutsu unless he fights them so first few amaterasu would be likely absorbed

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Kinda Vague I am Voting incon

Speed Isnt Equalised here?!?
Anyway The thing is pain while fighting naruto was pretty much nerfed due to fighting the whole leaf Village, Performing A Titanic shinra tensei he couldnt pull out the soul of naruto since he cant even kill him he was Holding back to not kill him & Naruto Has all info of him which even kakashi & jiraiya didnt know at that point still after these massive disadvantages guess what pain bodied him it took Kurama's influence on his hatred to transform into V2 6 tails cloak Kyuubi
I dont think even healthy itachi has this much chakra reserve to beat all six paths of pain by spamming susanoo & amaterasu after defeating five paths his chakra reserve would drop that will affect his other stats this will give pain advantage to incon & itachi does not know which pain absorbs ninjutsu unless he fights them so first few amaterasu would be likely absorbed

No I stated that in OP.

I know, but SM Naruto<<Healthy Itachi. Also it wouldn't take THAT long for Itachi to defeat Pain. He's a quick fighter like Minato that tries to end fights as quickly as possible with a lot of finesse. He wouldn't spam susanoo and amaterasu, just use them in moderation to deal with Pain. Also if Itachi sees the preta path holding out its hands, it'll be obvious he's the one who can absorb ninjutsu and he'll proceed to kill him with taijutsu or a fire style shuriken barrage. Preta might absorb the fire but those dozens of shuriken are gonna stab right into him.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

No I stated that in OP.

I know, but SM Naruto<<Healthy Itachi. Also it wouldn't take THAT long for Itachi to defeat Pain. He's a quick fighter like Minato that tries to end fights as quickly as possible with a lot of finesse. He wouldn't spam susanoo and amaterasu, just use them in moderation to deal with Pain. Also if Itachi sees the preta path holding out its hands, it'll be obvious he's the one who can absorb ninjutsu and he'll proceed to kill him with taijutsu or a fire style shuriken barrage. Preta might absorb the fire but those dozens of shuriken are gonna stab right into him.

Itachi is only winning if he spams totsuka blade with amaterasu or else pain just outlasts. He easily wins if he seals deva path, then pain can literally not win.