General DC Comics Discussion Thread

[Ehnkr2beboh]

Well, them being put on his profile is a given, but sure I'll post them on this thread too.

Is stated to have almost Infinite Willpower

Action Comics #585

is considered to have will stronger than even his muscles

Superman Annual #7

increased four Green Lantern's construct's power by 20% by adding his willpower

Action Comics #589

Was believed by the Spectre (Hal Jordan) to have the strongest will in creation once his own will started fading, resisted Emperor Joker trying to break him with his will and faith

Superman: The Man of Steel #105

shut down Etrigan's magic with his will and conviction,

Action Comics #762

overpowered Guy Gardner in a contest of will in an alternate timeline

Action Comics Annual #3. This one is probably the one that's the most questionable due to being an alt timeline, but I still want to see what others think before removing it.

withstood Gog torturing him for over 200 years

Action Comics #825

and his will can influence the flow of time

Superman: Man of Steel #118

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out. I will unlock Post-Crisis Superman's page for you to edit then.

Tell me here when you are done.

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

Alright, I did the edit and I think I didn't make any mistakes. I didn't add the Guy thing since I didn't get much input on it, but tbh I think the justification is fine without it. I think you can close it now.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you. I have done so.

I had to do some cleanup work on your edits though:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Superman_(Post-Crisis)?type=revision&diff=7759752&oldid=7759743

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

Ah thanks, I'll keep those corrections in mind next time I edit a page.
It's kinda funny, despite somehow being on this wiki for over 6 years, I've only actually handled page edits a handful of times, so I've never really learned all the proper ways to do things.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Well, you can check my linked edits above to see how to handle short links, but you have to learn improved sentence structures on your own.

 

[ImmortalDread]

@Antvasima I don't want to derail the other staff thread with this question, but are you gonna create a public thread for scaling discussion?

 

[Deagonx]

@Antvasima I don't want to derail the other staff thread with this question, but are you gonna create a public thread for scaling discussion?

Are you referring to scaling the cosmologies in the split?

 

[ImmortalDread]

Are you referring to scaling the cosmologies in the split?

Yap

 

[Deagonx]

Yap

First the split needs to be approved. Then a discussion will be had about where to split the cosmology, and then we can get more into tiering changes

 

[ImmortalDread]

Welp, I assume the real discussion and issues will start in scaling.

 

[Antvasima]

I am worried about too much spam, derailing, and toxicity though, so maybe it would be better to post it in the staff forum and have regular members apply to our staff for posting there? I am not certain.

Anyway, that is a future problem to consider. It will likely take quite a while to (hopefully) get even the cosmology split itself accepted.

 

[MattSatire]

I can't wait for this

 

[ImmortalDread]

Don't think tbh anyone will disagree, I myself who has little knowledge about it, read everything, don't see any issues with it.

Likewise, the scaling one will be significant issue for everyone.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you, and noted. It seems best to have knowledgeable regular members first apply to our staff by explaining what kind of issues they want to argue about before they are allowed to post there then. So the arguments do not get too hostile and chaotic.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Thank you, and noted. It seems best to have knowledgeable regular members first apply to our staff by explaining what kind of issues they want to argue about before they are allowed to post there then. So the arguments do not get too hostile and chaotic.

Sure thing, I will always ask the admin and show them the post before I post it to make sure, so it does not get chaotic at all.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. That is good then.

 

[Shadow_Somnius]

Hmm.. where would this feat put Post Crisis Supes?

Spoiler

 

[Vondoom]

Source wall tier varies as it exists in every dimension, this should be unknown.

 

[Deagonx]

Source wall tier varies as it exists in every dimension, this should be unknown

The Source Wall isn't weaker in lower dimensions or something like that.

 

[Shadow_Somnius]

The Source Wall isn't weaker in lower dimensions or something like that.

Wouldn't this put him well above Tier 4?

 

[Vondoom]

The Source Wall isn't weaker in lower dimensions or something like that.

I thought it would be weaker or stronger according to the dimension it's in, I guess I'm wrong. But what tier is the source wall currently? cause old tier is 1-A, and we can't possibly make superman 1-A highest would be infinite strength as whatever out or added to infinite is infinite which the source wall is.

 

[Deagonx]

Wouldn't this put him well above Tier 4?

I am not clear on what he's doing in this scan. Did he destroy the entire wall or something?

 

[Hasty12345]

it's probably an outlier, even if the feat does quantify that high

More "Superman wins coz Superman" bs

 

[NHTkenshin2]

it's probably an outlier, even if the feat does quantify that high

More "Superman wins coz Superman" bs

I mean with the story of superman he can get a varies immune to outliers rating

Cuz y'know hope and good wins in the end or something

 

[Hasty12345]

I mean with the story of superman he can get a varies immune to outliers rating

Cuz y'know hope and good wins in the end or something

How it should be

 

[Vondoom]

I am not clear on what he's doing in this scan. Did he destroy the entire wall or something?

I interpreted it as removing a little chunk of the source wall since the staff was part of it.

 

[Deagonx]

I interpreted it as removing a little chunk of the source wall since the staff was part of it.

Tbh I'd barely call it a feat. That won't scale him to the wall.

 

[Antvasima]

I am not clear on what he's doing in this scan. Did he destroy the entire wall or something?

He appears to have broken free Highfather's staff after the latter was trapped in the Source Wall.

I do not know how to scale it properly though.

 

[Deagonx]

Personally, I would not use this for scaling at all.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, it is likely too hard to quantify properly.

 

[Robo432343]

is map of the multiverse still be used to scale stuff

 

[Deagonx]

should the map of the multiverse still be used to scale stuff

In what way

 

[Robo432343]

In what way

the cosmology

 

[Robo432343]

I feel like the Void in vertigo cosmology is 1-A because it doesn't matter how many creations you fill it up with
does that even qualify for outerversal tier?

 

[Hasty12345]

So with the cosmology split, how will character pages look?

They're already separated into pre and post crisis and rebirth or whatever the division may be, will each key have cosmology sub-keys where applicable? And how do we decide how pre-crisis cosmology stuff fits into each authors cosmology if at all?

 

[Deagonx]

I feel like the Void in vertigo cosmology is 1-A because it doesn't matter how many creations you fill it up with
does that even qualify for outerversal tier?

This was discussed earlier in the thread. The "can't fill it with creations" concept was assessed to only be 1 level of transcendence.

So with the cosmology split, how will character pages look?

They're already separated into pre and post crisis and rebirth or whatever the division may be, will each key have cosmology sub-keys where applicable? And how do we decide how pre-crisis cosmology stuff fits into each authors cosmology if at all?

Much of this hasn't been decided definitively yet, as we are in uncharted territory with this in some respects.

However, it's important to note a couple of things.

1) The vast majority of characters won't have cosmology keys at all, as their tier won't involve cosmological concepts

2) Of the ones who do scale to cosmologies, the vast majority will only have significant showings in one (Perpetua and Thought Robot for example) which means it will only be annotated that they scale to X cosmology.

For those who have significant portrayals in multiple cosmologies (Dream of the Endless comes to mind) I assume it'll be handled similar to things like Rebirth/Post-Crisis.

Pre-Crisis hasn't been discussed that much in terms of a cosmology split. I don't know that much about it, but the impression I get is that the era was pretty contradictory in general but that the main profiles for PC characters don't really involve mashing together contradictory cosmologies.

 

[Hasty12345]

For those who have significant portrayals in multiple cosmologies (Dream of the Endless comes to mind) I assume it'll be handled similar to things like Rebirth/Post-Crisis.

So I take it not many characters if any have significant showings in pre-crisis and multiple cosmologies of the post crisis and rebirth eras?

 

[Deagonx]

So I take it not many characters if any have significant showings in pre-crisis and multiple cosmologies of the post crisis and rebirth eras?

I don't know of any, no.

 

[Robo432343]

This was discussed earlier in the thread. The "can't fill it with creations" concept was assessed to only be 1 level of transcendence.

what does that even mean