Garou and Orochi Updates

[ByAsura]

After getting stomped by Rover, Garou starts to adapt to Psykos' telekinesis.

Here he resists it, and little by little gains even more resistance. Psykos directly states he's evolving. He later also breaks out of Telekinetic Rubble.

Orochi casually overpowers this Garou. Garou survives being crushed, and briefly dodges Orochi's attack. Garou later adapts, and continues to dodge and outru Orochi's attack.

Orochi can also transform and shift his limbs, but Garou can dodge his beams, and withstand their high temperature. Garou also blocks his punch and withstands getting flung away. It is stated that he's stronger though.

It's revealed Orochi can adapt to combat styles, and produces a ton of dragons from his limbs.

Here's some images for the mutated states.

 

[Damage3245]

I'm pretty sure the 'updates' you've mentioned have already been added to Garou and Orochi's profiles.

 

[ByAsura]

Some have been added, but there's barely any information, scans, etc. It barely mentions any of this, and there's literally no mention of the Psykos stuff.

 

[Dienomite22]

As said in the previous upgrade thread Garou should also get Fighting Spirit(I know it's stat amp as well but this without using Abandonment) just like Metal Bat since Murata went out of his way to point out Garou using "Metal Bat's" Fighting Spirit.

Not saying Garou copied Metal Bat's Fighting Spirit, I am saying Garou's Fighting Spirit is pointed out to be in reference to Metal Bat's Fighting Spirit.

 

[ByAsura]

Ok.

 

[Dienomite22]

Also, I agree with adding everything you said and Orochi should get pics and explanation of his use of WSRF

 

[Damage3245]

As said in the previous upgrade thread Garou should also get Fighting Spirit(I know it's stat amp as well but this without using Abandonment) just like Metal Bat since Murata went out of his way to point out Garou using "Metal Bat's" Fighting Spirit.
Not saying Garou copied Metal Bat's Fighting Spirit, I am saying Garou's Fighting Spirit is pointed out to be in reference to Metal Bat's Fighting Spirit.

Garou has Fighting Spirit in his list of techniques on his profile.

And I do think he copied it.

 

[Dienomite22]

Oh didn't see it, anyways I don't agree with Garou being able to copy something like Fighting Spirit because it's not really an ability or something that Garou's mimicry can copy or have been shown to copy, it's just something brought on by willpower, mental state, and emotion.

 

[Damage3245]

There's no reason given in the manga why Garou would be unable to copy that mental state/emotion.

 

[Dienomite22]

He was never shown to copy anything other than fighting techniques, unless Garou is shown to outright copy an emotion or anything like that in the future of the manga the Fighting Spirit thing could be assumed to be a product of his mental state and love for battles that Metal Bat "helped" him realize.

 

[Damage3245]

He was never shown to copy anything other than fighting techniques, unless Garou is shown to outright copy an emotion or anything like that in the future of the manga the Fighting Spirit thing should be assumed to be a product of his mental state and love for battles that Metal Bat helped him realize.

I disagree completely. There is no known prequisite to Fighting Spirit that would prevent Garou from using it.

To give an example: It is impossible for Garou to copy Genos' energy blasts because he lacks the technological enhancements necessary to fire them.

This is not the case with Fighting Spirit. There is absolutely nothing preventing Garou from copying it. Trying to stick with "Garou can't copy this" when no reason has been given is just head-canon.

 

[Dienomite22]

Garou not being able to copy Genos' abilities because Genos is a cyborg although is true, that isn't my argument.

Garou has never been showed to copy abilities besides fighting techniques. And the thought that Garou needs to copy a mental state is ridiculous.

Fighting Spirit is literally a mental and emotional mindset and you're saying Garou can copy that as if it were an ability. I would agree if you show Garou doing this any other time in the manga.

 

[Damage3245]

Why would Garou need to have done this any other time in the manga? If this is, for instance, the first time Garou displays the ability then there won't be any previous times. Just because a characters uses an ability for the first time doesn't mean they don't have it.

But let me be clear how about how logical it is.

After his major fights, Garous typically uses something from his opponent in a future fight. He copies it.

Against TTM, he copies Tanktop Tackle.

Against Bomb, he copies Whirlwind Iron Cutting Fist.

Against Watchdog Man, he copies his dog movements.

Against Metal Bat, you're saying he copies nothing? Despite the fact that you think Garou is now using Fighting Spirit for the first time in the series, after fighting Metal Bat, you think it's unconnected to that fight at all?

I don't know how much more the authors could spell it out:

1) Garou copies something from his opponents fighting style during battles.


2) Fighting Spirit, althought strictly speaking isn't a technique, is a part of Metal Bat's fighting style.


3) Garou fights Metal Bat, observes his fighting style.


4) Later Garou displays Fighting Spirit. He thinks of Metal Bat. He says "Huh, is this Fighting Spirit?"


To me there is no other way of interpreting that than Garou copied Fighting Spirit.

 

[ByAsura]

Ok, i sort of agree that it's weird for someone who's been shown to mimic fighting styles and techniques to absorb a power up, but it's not really contradicted or impossible, and, as Damage said, it's part of Bad's normal arsenal. Either way, the both of you should use some evidence from the series, as in times he has or has failed to use power ups.

 

[Damage3245]

Ok, i sort of agree that it's weird for someone who's been shown to mimic fighting styles and techniques to absorb a power up, but it's not really contradicted or impossible, and, as Damage said, it's part of Bad's normal arsenal. Either way, the both of you should use some evidence from the series, as in times he has or has failed to use power ups.

I've listed the times that he has fought an S-Class Hero or equivalent (like Bomb) in the manga and every time other than Genos, Garou has clearly used the same fighting style as each of those opponents.

 

[ByAsura]

Not fighting style, power up, i already know he can assume fighting styles, i read the manga. Also i know the point about it being a fighting style, but it's also a power up.

 

[Damage3245]

Not fighting style, power up. Also i know the point about it being a fighting style, but it's also a power up.

Sure, it's a fighting style that acts as a temporary power-up. I don't see the problem with that.

 

[ByAsura]

I guess that can work.

 

[Dienomite22]

@Damage3245

I get what you are saying but Garou referencing Metal Bat's Fighting Spirit doesn't automatically mean he has copied it and we have seen multiple instances were said Fighting Spirit would have been useful and Garou having tremendous "fighting spirit" before his direct acknowledgement of it, like in the fights you've mentioned above besides TankTop Master.

Throughout the whole fight with Metal Bat vs Garou, it is mentioned that his "Fighting Spirit" is because of Metal Bat's huge willpower and not an ability or anything like that of some sort and what has Garou been repeatedly shown to have? huge willpower, which is why he can also use Fighting Spirit, not because he copied it from Metal Bat as if he is Megaman or something.

Fighting Spirit is a mental state brought on by amazing willpower. Metal Bat has amazing willpower so he can use Fighting Spirit. Garou also has amazing willpower so Garou uses Fighting Spirit. Not Metal Bat uses Fighting Spirit, Garou sees Fighting Spirit being used, Garou copies and uses it. That's my point.

Also, human Garou not wanting to use WSRSF should be taken off from being a weakness, he's been shown to use it multiple times without caring that it reminds him of Bang and it was the first thing he used on Metal Bat, Golden Ball, and Watchdog Man all of which he was going easy on or wasn't taken seriously before the fights began.

 

[Damage3245]

I agree on removing that weakness from Garou's profile.

I still think Garou (effectively) copied either Metal Bat's fighting spirit or his usage of fighting spirit. Either way, he only began using it in the latest chapter. Maybe ONE and Murata will clear up the issue.

 

[Dienomite22]

I hope you are actually right in the Fighting Spirit argument, to be honest, I want him to become even more stronger and gain more hax.

 

[ByAsura]

Bump

 

[Damage3245]

What precisely are the changes that you want? Can you summarize them?

 

[ByAsura]

Added that he adapted to overpower Psyk's Telekinesis, and that he actually fought Orochi, which there's only one or two mentions in their profiles.

 

[Damage3245]

He already has Psychic Resistance on there with mention of Psykos and Tatsumaki. And he has Orochi mentioned in his Durability and Heat Resistance sections.

We can't put it in his AP section because he never landed a hit on Orochi.

 

[ByAsura]

Resisting is also part of his AP, because he didn't just withstand it, he also punched rocks away and withstood them.

He blocked a hit from Orochi, there's also the slightest of mention of his speed feats against Orochi when there's a ton in the fight.

Orochi has barely any of this in his profile.

 

[Damage3245]

Punching a few rocks is way below what his current AP is rated at and not worth mentioning.

Yes, he blocked a hit; that's why it's mentioned in the durability section.

And his fight with Orochi is already mentioned in the speed section.

 

[ByAsura]

Punching away and overpowering scores of rocks that were being telekinetically hurled and pressed on him by a full power Psykos, also meaning his resistance wouldn't work here.

That's why it should also be mentioned in the AP section, since he fully stopped it. Also, no it's not "Survived fighting against Overgrown Rover and Orochi" is the only mention.

Which i already explained; some is there, but a very minimal amount. It also says he just dodged it, which is untrue, he outran it and continued to get faster while running from it, which he couldn't even do before.

There's also no scans and much more missing information for this, especially in Orochi's case, as you'll see by the OP. None of the stuff on Garou's profile even mentions that he got stronger, faster, and more durable after fighting OR, and continued to do so while fighting Orochi.

 

[Damage3245]

It doesn't need to. Profiles don't mention every single feat done by a character. The most important info is in there

 

[ByAsura]

So getting quite significantly stronger and constantly growing even more isn't "the most important info"? Even fighting Psykos would be in that category. Also, there isn't a "most important info" here if there's basically none.

 

[Damage3245]

He already has Evolution, Adaptation and Accelerated Development in his abilities list.

 

[ByAsura]

Which doesn't matter. All the fights in the Webcomic are shown (with the exception of OG due to retcons), yet these don't even have detail. Plus that doesn't cover why the feats (with the exception of getting stronger) shouldn't be added.