Featured Matchup 2! Lightning VS Zygarde

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Not to mention Overclock.

 

[GimmyJibbsJr]

Going with Zygarde for the reasons given above by Cal

tbh there is little way she could even hit zygarde if he goes to his maximum range, as his range FAR exceeds Lightning's.

 

[Kaltias]

There is Odin.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Range arguments are kind of abused here. Both start off at a fair distance from each other, if Zygarde tries to run, Lightning can easily catch him. Not to meantion slow down or even stop time.

 

[PaChi2]

What part of Lightning teleporting or using Odin to close the range do you not comprehend?

Also, like, Zygarde cannot win here. Lightning timestops and destroys the dragon.

(Sorry if I sounded aggressive)

 

[Overlord775]

Range arguments are kind of abused here. Both start off at a fair distance from each other,

the OP didn't specify, so for SBA they are 4 km from each other

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Stop has literally always been a status effect in Final Fantasy... Frog isn't just transmutation and Petrify isn't just petrification there either. They're status effects. I mean, is poison in most RPGs a status? Yes. Does that mean into not poison manipulation?

 

[Schnee_One]

I'm honestly getting annoyed here.

Said reasons above have been contradicted time and time again? Nah, whatever "Reasons Above"

(Sigh)

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

To give my vote. Lightning takes this for the simple fact that she not only can slow down and stop time, but she has Odin to close the distance if Zygarde somehow gets away and she can teleport. Not only that, it won't take long for her to figure out his massively weakness to ice. Not to mention she has Arise so that she can resurrect herself upon death. Lighting takes this 8/10 in my honest opinion.

 

[CrackerVolley]

Not only that, it won't take long for her to figure out his massively weakness to ice.

Camoflage, M8....

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Stop has literally always been a status effect in Final Fantasy... Frog isn't just transmutation and Petrify isn't just petrification there either. They're status effects. I mean, is poison in most RPGs a status? Yes. Does that mean into not poison manipulation?

Yeah and? Stop isn't a status in Pokemon and thus we cannot assume safeguard protects them from statuses the series does not have.

 

[PaChi2]

Stopga: It resets all allies and enemies' ATB gauges while canceling all actions in use. This is useful for stopping a boss who is about to use a powerful attack.

@Cal this is not a status move. Its time manipulation (here as ATB manipulation cuz game mechanics).

@Overlord Lightning riding Odin can cross that distance fairly easily.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Camouflage removes his crippling ice weakness, and if she could teleport with that range, it would be on her profile. Furthermore, don't really see her teleporting into the air to get stokes in being beneficial. If anything, it puts her at a bad position as she's wide open in free fall, leaving her open for Core Enforcer.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Not only that, it won't take long for her to figure out his massively weakness to ice.

Camoflage, M8....

Can't do so if he's frozen in time.

 

[Kaltias]

@Cal

The thing is that in Pokemon it isn't a status effect. Zygarde negs what is a status effect in Pokemon

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Dragon and @Kal. That's...not how SBA works... One series having something that the other doesn't isn't grounds for it being ignored. An exaggerated case would be like saying that because x series doesn't have magical defense, they'd get one shot by Firaga because it's assumed to be zero. If stopped time existed in the games for anyone other than Dialga, you'd have a point. But that's not the case.

@PaChi. Looked at the FF Wiki. It's a status.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

"Camouflage removes his crippling ice weakness"

Can't camouflage if he's frozen in time. Unless your saying Zygarde can move in stopped time.

"and if she could teleport with that range, it would be on her profile. Furthermore, don't really see her teleporting into the air to get stokes in being beneficial"

Odin exists y'know.

"If anything, it puts her at a bad position as she's wide open in free fall, leaving her open for Core Enforcer."

Forcefields.

 

[Overlord775]

@Dragon cuz she's totally going to start the fight by time stopping

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

@Dragon. That's...not how SBA works...

You're abusing SBA. That will not fly and you know good and well that it won't be accepted. It isn't a status in Pokemon, as such safeguard does not protect it. If it did then that mean Time Stop would never work on a safeguard user. We do not treat any other verse like this.

 

[PaChi2]

@Cal

No. Look at Stopga in FF XIII. its different.

 

[Schnee_One]

She doesn't need too, if she ever see's herself at a disadvantage, she'll use it and take the win.

That is, IF she doesn't use it at the start, she's rather....Insanely focused on killing her enemy as quickly as possible.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

@Dragon cuz she's totally going to start the fight by time stopping

She quite literally can. We've treated FF characters like Cloud and such the same way. Lightning is no different.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

...no we haven't. Cloud wins normally through massive AP advantage and his other statuses.

@Dragon. Check edited message.

 

[Kaltias]

SBA?

I'm saying that it being a status effect in-game doesn't make it necessarily something Zygarde can negate. For example, I have no doubt that he would nope being staggered, but he has never resisted time manipulation. Like, I know games where Death Manipulation is a status effect. Doesn't mean that Zygarde would take it and shrugg it off

 

[Schnee_One]

You missed his point.

We treat characters in FF as if they're fully serious which they usually are, there's no reason not to take the best way out.

Also yeah, saying that because it's a status effect in FF which means Zygarde can resist it when he's never shown resisting such a think is a clear misuse of Verse Equalization.

 

[Overlord775]

there's no reason not to take the best way out.

CIS ?

 

[PaChi2]

Light is anything but carefree. She will go for the killing as soon as the battle starts.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Cloud vs Piedmon. Main thing against Piedmon was Stop along with a Massive AP gap.

Make a CRT for and see how that goes. This is honestly pure BS to be blunt. Never have we treated verses like that. Show me a time where we have allowed. Suddenly, Safeguard protects against Time Manipulation? This is abusing the term to suit your needs. Sorry, If I come across as rude, but that is the honest truth.

If you really believe this is the case, make a threas and see how it goes.

 

[Schnee_One]

CIS ?

Doesn't exist for FF protags

Also, my Edit above, I agree with Dragon

 

[Overlord775]

ok

 

[PaChi2]

@Gargoyle probably in Bartz's case.... CIS... nvm.

So, @Op should the votes based on Cal's reasoning be valid even if we have prooved how lightning can counter each one and beat Zyg?

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I guess Takumi Aiba's Digimon with the Master Barrier are resistant to Stop now due to it half-nulling all Cyber Sleuth Statuses. See the issue here Cal? If we allow this, then we would have to allow it for every RPG. In which we do not.

 

[Newendigo]

Dang it, this one is hard.

Inconclusive for now, both partys can counter each abilities, both can buff/debuff stats, can induce status effects, can become resistant with a move or nullificate the other powers, etc etc etc.

Though, I could lean to Lightning due to time manipulation, but I'm not sure.

 

[PaChi2]

Also, note that, should anything go wrong, Light still can resurrect thanks to odin.

 

[Schnee_One]

^She won't need it but this is also true.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Exactly, no matter what, the moment she dies, she comes right back. Not to mention with Odin it is 2 vs 1.

 

[Overlord775]

i think lightning would win, she has time manipulation, resurection, has higher AP and has a summon that is on par with her and has a durability negation attack and even if Zygarde tries to fly she could send odin after him or just ask odin to trasport her

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

Changing my vote to Lightning via Time Manipulation and Ice Manipulation

And Resurrection

 

[Schnee_One]

2 votes for Light, 1 removed fromZy

 

[BoomeYang]

I love how people keep mentioning Camouflage to remove his weakness, when Lightning not only has several elemental attacks, but also spells that can cripple Zygarde's resistaces to said elemental attacks.