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Fate revision thread (continuation)

Diinou HotHead said:
I'm skeptical of that too, so I came asking, honestly incredulous that such a feat can qualify.
Click to expand...
Do you remember that blue text where BB says she can't feel the concept of death, and Karna gives his armor to Jinako?? All the way down at the bottom of that chapter it says that BB, and the mooncell still erased her (Jinako). Right??? im not misreading that lol??
 
TheUpgradeManHaHaxD said:
Diinou HotHead said:
I'm skeptical of that too, so I came asking, honestly incredulous that such a feat can qualify.
Click to expand...
Do you remember that blue text where BB says she can't feel the concept of death, and Karna gives his armor to Jinako?? All the way down at the bottom of that chapter it says that BB, and the mooncell still erased her (Jinako). Right??? im not misreading that lol??
Click to expand...
She didn't have it. Karna gave it to her at the end of Extra, after you beat Leo, and SE.RA.PH. is resetting itself, so K&K is gone with Near Side Jinako.

Talking about Karna, I still don't see any instance of BB unsuccessfully altering K&K, they don't even interact, except for that one time when she kidnaps Jinako.
 
Anyways, let's start with Extra & CCC chain first:

Baseline 2A < Kiara < Lv. 999 Melt < Mooncell = Pre-Mooncell BB < Buddha < Post-Mooncell BB < CCC Playables

Not sure about Kiara and Melt's place for scaling so low, but eh.

Why Buddha is above the Mooncell is because he won't be erased by it even if it tried to (apparently), while Pre-Mooncell BB was still under threats of getting erased.
 
Kiara should be around Saver's level wherever he gets put

she should also be above or equal to CCC playables but eh
 
John985 said:
Kiara is also a Bodhisattva. That's one of the reason we dont know the scaling chain.
Click to expand...
Then that might be a feat to scale him somewhere below BB. Because I don't remember Kiara overpowering the playables in an actual fight, just Anti-Human NP that's specifically for beating humans which got overpowered by the Sakuras.
 
This is one of the reason, the scaling is hard for nasuverse. Compatibilty is important. Just like Paul said, Kiara is equal to Saver and Saver is one of the servant that can ignore the Moon Cell, like Amaterasu.

There's also the fact that, the damage of Kiara to Gilgamesh is massive compare to Mumei.

As far as the setting and lore are concerned, the Servant who would be hit with the least damage would be Archer, and Gilgamesh would be damaged the most.
 
>What's this about 2-A?

The OP has a summary of the proposed tier and has explanations and some counters against some would-be arguments. If you have any questions, you can ask it here.
 
John985 said:
This is one of the reason, the scaling is hard for nasuverse. Compatibilty is important. Just like Paul said, Kiara is equal to Saver and Saver is one of the servant that can ignore the Moon Cell, like Amaterasu.
There's also the fact that, the damage of Kiara to Gilgamesh is massive compare to Mumei.

As far as the setting and lore are concerned, the Servant who would be hit with the least damage would be Archer, and Gilgamesh would be damaged the most.
Click to expand...
Ignoring the Mooncell can be interpreted as being superior to it. So it would at least put them above the Mooncell.

But wasn't Kiara's damage from her NP? The one that kills anything with a desire. Mumei is but a hero, while Gil is a king with desire for all treasures and stuffs.
 
We know about BB. we got her so?rted out, but don't we have statements of Goetia bruning infinite possibilities or something like that?? Considering the Nasuverse terminology. That would be 2-A right?? we could scale from Goetia for this characters we are unsure of.
 
Ignroing the Mooncell doesn't mean your superior to it in terms of AP at least. Arc Brunsted was stated to not be superior to the Mooncell nor was she the strongest when within the Mooncell world, but she had more "authority" than the Mooncell.

Imo its more to do with hax.[1]
 
Paul Frank said:
Goetia and Tiamat would scale from beast Kiara and Kama I'm pretty sure
Click to expand...
I thought Goetia has a statement of burning the infintie possibilities?? a 2-A feat???? I guess i'll go looking for it.
 
Well, then take my chain for "Authority Scaling" then, because there are some in the chain who I believe scale to hax only, and not AP (Namely Buddha and Melt)
 
John985 said:
This is the scan for Goetia.
https://imgur.com/6it71LL
Click to expand...
So, when we combine these 2 scans [1] and this one [2]

Geotia also has a 2-A feat now.

Edit: this should hopefully fix the scaling, but when trying to "blure" the lines of "Extra/Timeline" Vs "Grand Order/Timeline" things might get messy with that scaling...

For now: wouldn't it be best to keep them separate???
 
No! I'll never let Arjunater go 2A

The Goetia case seems to scale only to Ars Armadel Salomonis right? He's talking about the bands of light.
 
the problem is trying to figure out where she belongs right??? Where would Tiamat rank on the scaling chain between Goetia, Kiara, and Tiamat???

yeah its only with his Ars Armadel Salomonis. The one he burnt everything with, i get them mixed up ;~;

It also required prep time didn't it??? So it would only be 2-A in AP but not durability maybe????

2-A Mashu Sheld Incoming
 
>The scaling currently isn't separate though thanks to beast Kiara

This. Kiara said herself that she's weaker than Goetia, and Kiara is somewhere in the 2-A Mooncell scaling chain.

Like what Shiroyasha and others said, everyone Low 2-C should just be 2-A.
 
And BB is > than Tiamat????

btw the Mooncell has 3 infinite sized 4D spaces

  • Imaginary Number Space (which is likely where the Multiverse is)
  • BB's Caine Space/Bug Space (For some reason its a separate layer entirely, but still apart of the Imaginary Number Space but somehow "The Bottom most Layer." but its still an infinite sized 4D space.)
  • Passionlips Breast Valley (though that could also be Imaginary Number Space)
So the Mooncell alone should be 3 infinities x baseling 2-A right??
 
ShinyMagicalGirl said:
>The scaling currently isn't separate though thanks to beast Kiara
This. Kiara said herself that she's weaker than Goetia, and Kiara is somewhere in the 2-A Mooncell scaling chain.

Like what Shiroyasha and others said, everyone Low 2-C should just be 2-A.
Click to expand...
The one that gets to scale to Goetia is Beast Kiara though. The one in the 2A chain is CCC Kiara.
 
Wasn't there a statement that says CCC Kiara and FGO Kiara are nearly equal in power or something?

I'm sure the others knowledgeable on FGO can answer this.
 
Like I said earlier the current scaling the verse uses would push every single low 2-C up to 2-A

We can debate the scaling chains at a later time although they are kinda hard to make due to compatibility issues between characters
 
That's what I've been saying...

We don't have a go sign yet, but so far 3 mods are fine with this, Cal is in the middle of analyzing this (I think?) so I guess we have to wait still.
 
If Beast Kiara can be scaled from her CCC self, then I think we just have to change "High 3-A, likely Low 2C" to "2-A" from the Low 2Cs
 
Okay so... BB > Goetia => Tiamat > Beast Kiara (whon should be comparable to her CCC self?) Strictly AP only is what I'm referring too btw.
 
Oh yeah, don't forget that Mountain Level Saver should have "2-A via the operation of parallel worlds", "2-A via control of the moon cell" or just "2-A via Chakravartin's authority." I am learning towards one of the previous 2
 
The chain branches: CCC only: Baseline < Kiara < Lv.999 Meltlilith < Mooncell & Pre-Mooncell BB < Post-Mooncell BB < CCC Playables < Amaterasu

It then branches off at Kiara and goes:

FGO: CCC Kiara = Beast Kiara = Kama < Hindu Gods < Arjuna Alter & Super Karna

As for Authority chain, I think Buddha is somewhere above the Mooncell, but I don't see much that suggest he's above Post-Mooncell BB
 
We have no clear indication as to who is stronger when it comes to gods.

Type-Moon wiki lists Amaterasu to be on the level of Velber, for example. This definitely does not mean she is the strongest. Statement that Arcueid is the only being capable of fighting Amaterasu is as wild and vague as it is unsupported, since she is supposed to be on the level of sun gods. I would not put her above CCC playbles, but among them. Simply because we don't have details on how powerful she is, and Gilgamesh stands above other CCC playables.


Does anyone have the scan that says Grand Order Kiara is equal to CCC one, or that she has her power? It would have to be included if you want to scale Beasts from her.
 
Her mats

https://www.reddit.com/r/grandorder/comments/99xs6n/the_profile_of_sesshouin_kiara_from_fategrand/

Nega Saver A

The fate of the beast who tried to bring salvation only to her own world, while possessing the qualifications to be a messiah (Saver).

Every skill possessed by the Saver and Ruler class is nullified, targets with magic stat not exceeding A rank are charmed with a 300% probability and the effect of buffs cast by Kiara are increased by 200%.

Although the scale of the existence of the Pleasure Deva that was born once on the moon is superior to Beast III, they say that she had no choice but to withdraw when faced with a messiah since she did not possess this skill.
 
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