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Elden Ring General Discussion

What's the consensus on the co-op in ER lore? We can invade or wander in parallel worlds (world = universe in the context of Elden Ring), while other Tarnished can do the same into our universe. Moreover, some of the wanderings and invasions are AI/scripted and have a part in the lore, so doesn't this mean that ER has a multiverse?

Multiple Lands Between with the same set of creatures, demigods, and gods as well as an Erdtree govering order in all of existence. The only difference is in the path that the Tarnished of that particular reality takes. This also explains why we see multiple Erdtrees in the backdrop of Elden Beast's arena. What are your thoughts on this?
 
CrisisCrysis said:
What's the consensus on the co-op in ER lore? We can invade or wander in parallel worlds (world = universe in the context of Elden Ring), while other Tarnished can do the same into our universe. Moreover, some of the wanderings and invasions are AI/scripted and have a part in the lore, so doesn't this mean that ER has a multiverse?

Multiple Lands Between with the same set of creatures, demigods, and gods as well as an Erdtree govering order in all of existence. The only difference is in the path that the Tarnished of that particular reality takes. This also explains why we see multiple Erdtrees in the backdrop of Elden Beast's arena. What are your thoughts on this?
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I think in Elden Ring, it’s more implied that NPCs and other player characters all exist in one world. While mechanically, they are able to fight bosses and get weapons that we already have, in the world there isn’t anything that implies they are from different universes or times like in Dark Souls (even though that in it’s own right also doesn’t have anything to do with alternate dimensions).
 
Deceived3596 said:
High 4-C Radahn holding back Falling Star Beasts who are most definitely actual stars guys please believe me.
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well if you think about it if Radahan was really holding back real stars then it'd take an astronomical amount of time to notice any change in position in them from the night sky. As ya know the light has to travel all those lights years to reach us. And since the meteorites/falling star beast are just the closest things that's why we see them move when Radahan's collapsing stars spell is undone from his death. So I believe we should revisit this issue after Fromsoft implements a real-time night sky in their game and then wait 5000 years. After that, it should be pretty conclusive if he was holding back real stars or not. (he was btw(/s)((or am I???)))
 
Latin_Rhythms said:
well if you think about it if Radahan was really holding back real stars then it'd take an astronomical amount of time to notice any change in position in them from the night sky. As ya know the light has to travel all those lights years to reach us. And since the meteorites/falling star beast are just the closest things that's why we see them move when Radahan's collapsing stars spell is undone from his death. So I believe we should revisit this issue after Fromsoft implements a real-time night sky in their game and then wait 5000 years. After that, it should be pretty conclusive if he was holding back real stars or not. (he was btw(/s)((or am I???)))
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I agree FRA. We need to wait 5000 years.
 
Latin_Rhythms said:
well if you think about it if Radahan was really holding back real stars then it'd take an astronomical amount of time to notice any change in position in them from the night sky. As ya know the light has to travel all those lights years to reach us. And since the meteorites/falling star beast are just the closest things that's why we see them move when Radahan's collapsing stars spell is undone from his death. So I believe we should revisit this issue after Fromsoft implements a real-time night sky in their game and then wait 5000 years. After that, it should be pretty conclusive if he was holding back real stars or not. (he was btw(/s)((or am I???)))
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That's so crazy, hit that turbulence for me.
 
I always understood this Radahn feat as like, he isn't literally holding Ranni's fate, more like stopping everyone from getting to Nekron, which is something Ranni wanted to.

Makes no sense for stars to move like that when Radahn is finally defeated.
 
M3X_2.0 said:
I always understood this Radahn feat as like, he isn't literally holding Ranni's fate, more like stopping everyone from getting to Nekron, which is something Ranni wanted to.

Makes no sense for stars to move like that when Radahn is finally defeated.
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I disagree with the fate thing. There are several items and pieces of dialogue stating that fate is in the stars. So holding back the stars whatever they may be, balls of burning gas or falling star beast is stopping fate from progressing. additionally in the jarren/sellen questline Iji says since the stars are back in motion that Sellens immortality is gone. pretty much saying that since her fate was held up with the stars. It was impossible for her to die. So Radahan was literally stopping fate from progressing. the meteor hitting Limgrave and opening the path to Nokron is just apart of Rannis fate. Since it opens the path for her to slay her two fingers and the tarnished to become her lord, eventually leading her to become the God of the age of stars.

The stars moving like that is probably because they were meteorites/falling star beast Radahan was holding back from landing in the lands between. They just continued their motion into the atmosphere after his spells dispersal. After all one of them do hit Limgrave and opens the path to Nokron.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Some of y'all have never heard of figurative writing or poetic writing, and it shows.
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I get where you're coming from, but, I think it's pretty literal this time. There are just a lot plot points that involve fate, that can only go forward after Radahan's death, who is mentioned time and time again to be holding fate in stasis. It's just too literal for me to see it as figurative writing.
 
Latin_Rhythms said:
well if you think about it if Radahan was really holding back real stars then it'd take an astronomical amount of time to notice any change in position in them from the night sky. As ya know the light has to travel all those lights years to reach us. And since the meteorites/falling star beast are just the closest things that's why we see them move when Radahan's collapsing stars spell is undone from his death. So I believe we should revisit this issue after Fromsoft implements a real-time night sky in their game and then wait 5000 years. After that, it should be pretty conclusive if he was holding back real stars or not. (he was btw(/s)((or am I???)))
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Granted, the story of Radahn battling the stars is arguably thousands of years in the past, so I think people could visually see differences after some time. Plus, it’s less about the literal viewing of the stars, and more the fact that their movements are stopped. While people like the Carians can see their fate and glean truths from the stars, what actually matters is the fact that their fates are intrinsically linked too them. With Radahn halting them, none of the Carians fate’s (like Ranni’s can progress), even if she knows what their fates are.
 
Latin_Rhythms said:
I get where you're coming from, but, I think it's pretty literal this time. There are just a lot plot points that involve fate, that can only go forward after Radahan's death, who is mentioned time and time again to be holding fate in stasis. It's just too literal for me to see it as figurative writing.
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It is. He's likely just trolling. At least, I hope so.
 
Chritin said:
I think in Elden Ring, it’s more implied that NPCs and other player characters all exist in one world. While mechanically, they are able to fight bosses and get weapons that we already have, in the world there isn’t anything that implies they are from different universes or times like in Dark Souls (even though that in it’s own right also doesn’t have anything to do with alternate dimensions).
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I mean, we blatantly get NPCs that invade "our world". And we often wander into/invade "their world" as well. The game clearly draws a distinction between the worlds of the player and the AIs, so why are we assuming that they're all in the "same world"? That goes against basic comprehension.

Not to mention, it can't literally be in the same world because individual Lands Between are universal in scope. As implied by several quotes, the starry sky is a part of the world, there are galaxies as well based on a drawing in Ranni's room in one of the endings. The Erdtree also keeps ALL of existence in order.

It'd be contradictory if everything is taking place in different parts of the same planet or universe. There can't be multiple Radahns holding up the stars in the same world, there can't be multiple Elden Rings commanding the stars in the same world, there can't be multiple Erdtrees keeping all of existence in order, etc.
 
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If you can find any explanation in lore through the coop items I think it’s fine. Just like Bloodborne where it’s explained about different worlds.
 
CrisisCrysis said:
I mean, we blatantly get NPCs that invade "our world". And we often wander into/invade "their world" as well. The game clearly draws a distinction between the worlds of the player and the AIs, so why are we assuming that they're all in the "same world"? That goes against basic comprehension.

Not to mention, it can't literally be in the same world because individual Lands Between are universal in scope. As implied by several quotes, the starry sky is a part of the world, there are galaxies as well based on a drawing in Ranni's room in one of the endings. The Erdtree also keeps ALL of existence in order.

It'd be contradictory if everything is taking place in different parts of the same planet or universe. There can't be multiple Radahns holding up the stars in the same world, there can't be multiple Elden Rings commanding the stars in the same world, there can't be multiple Erdtrees keeping all of existence in order, etc.
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I feel like my main issue with the whole idea of them being parallel worlds is the fact we don’t get an explanation for why we can go into other “worlds”. Like I said before, unlike in Dark Souls where we get an actual explanation on the convoluted flow of time (which again, also has nothing to do with multiple worlds), in Elden Ring it’s kinda left up in the air.

Like I said, I think a lot of the evidence pointing towards it being multiple universes are just gameplay mechanics. Hell, the only thing close to an explanation we get iirc is Igon who asks us to “summon his soul”, although that’s a unique case since outside of the fight with Bayle he’s crippled.

It also kind of doesn’t make sense why there would be invasions into other realities in the world of Elden Ring to begin with? Like, why would the Recusants care to hunt tarnished in alternate worlds with little to no effect on their own? Same for the blood fingers. Idk, it just seems odd to me for the various factions to focus on that if they didn’t effect the world they preside in.
 
M3X_2.0 said:
If you can find any explanation in lore through the coop items I think it’s fine. Just like Bloodborne where it’s explained about different worlds.
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Was there ever an explanation in bloodborne, let alone one using parallel worlds? I never even really thought about that tbh. Same for Sekiro, although that only used messages
 
Chritin said:
Like I said, I think a lot of the evidence pointing towards it being multiple universes are just gameplay mechanics.
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I'd have considered this argument, had the invasions/wanderings NOT been a part of the lore/story. But, as we know at certain locations in the Lands Between, there are several AI invasions as well as our invasions into worlds with AI Tarnished. This means that the world hopping is done canonically, albeit the why and how aren't exactly know like you pointed out. Moreover, if they're NOT different worlds, there'd be several contradictions such as the ones that I pointed out.

The multiple Erdtrees we see in Elden Beast's arena further solidify this, as the Erdtree defines order in all of existence. Multiple Erdtrees would mean that there are multiple existence(s)/realities. I believe this much evidence is enough for a verse like Elden Ring, as its medieval fantasy setting simply doesn't allow for fairly modern cosmological terms such as "universe" being used.
 
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Chritin said:
Was there ever an explanation in bloodborne, let alone one using parallel worlds? I never even really thought about that tbh. Same for Sekiro, although that only used messages
Click to expand...
Great old bell discovered in the underground labyrinth.
Its ring resonates across worlds, and the first hunter used it as a special signal to call hunters from other worlds to cross the gap and cooperate.
A human must use Insight to ring this uncanny bell, but the benefits of cross-world cooperation are many.
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One of the resonating bells that cross the gaps of worlds. This bell is cracked and stained with the blood of beasts.

A human must expend Insight to ring this uncanny bell.

The old hunters, who have long passed from the dream but cannot forget the feeling of the hunt, rely upon messengers to relay their thoughts.

Ring the bell at their side, and they are certain to give a listen.

For the night of the hunt is long, and unchanging."
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Small bell discovered in the old underground labyrinth.

Its ring resonates across worlds, and the first hunter used it as a special signal to call hunters from other worlds to cross the gap and cooperate.

This bell resonates with its counterpart, the Beckoning Bell. Ring to help hunters in other worlds.
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A blood-stained bell discovered in the old underground labyrinth.

One of the resonating bells that cross the gaps of the worlds, but this one knells for misfortune and malice.

The Sinister Bell is an object of dark thoughts. Ring it to become the enemy of a hunter in another world.
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In Bloodborne's case, it cannot be the same universe or anything. There cannot be many of the same Great Ones like Formless Odeon or MP. "Worlds" is very much about different universes
 
M3X_2.0 said:
In Bloodborne's case, it cannot be the same universe or anything. There cannot be many of the same Great Ones like Formless Odeon or MP. "Worlds" is very much about different universes
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Oh shit, this is like surprisingly significant? I might have to look into this in the future. PLEASE I JUST WANT TIER 2 BLOODBORNE PLEEEEEAAAAAAASE.
 
Chritin said:
Was there ever an explanation in bloodborne, let alone one using parallel worlds? I never even really thought about that tbh. Same for Sekiro, although that only used messages
Click to expand...
M3X_2.0 said:
In Bloodborne's case, it cannot be the same universe or anything. There cannot be many of the same Great Ones like Formless Odeon or MP. "Worlds" is very much about different universes
Click to expand...
yeah I agree with this, In Elden ring it's multiplayer items do mention other worlds but it feels more like a gameplay explanation than a real lore thing. It just has much less flowery language to imply it's actually calling to other worlds/universes.
Item for online play.
(Can also be used from the Multiplayer menu.)

Creates a summon sign for cooperative multiplayer.
Arrive as a cooperator (Furled Finger) with the objective of defeating the area boss of the world to which you were summoned.

A finger of corpse wax, furled like a hook.
It is a relic of those who came before, left to help those who would come after.
Click to expand...
Item for online play.
(Can also be used from the Multiplayer menu.)

Send a cooperative summon sign to several nearby summoning pools (activated pools only).

In cooperative multiplayer, your objective will be to defeat the area boss of the world to which you were summoned.
Click to expand...
Item for online play.
(Can also be used from the Multiplayer menu.)

Attempts an invasion of another player's world.
If successful, you will arrive as an invader (Bloody Finger) with the objective of defeating the Host of Fingers of that world.

Glistening blood has been siphoned into the nail of this finger. Its sickly pale skin feels nothing now, but the nail still aches with sweetest pain.
Click to expand...
etc. doesn't mean I'm against multiple worlds being the explanation for multiplayer in Elden Ring though or just existing. I do think that the multiple Erdtrees in the Elden beast arena are symbols for the other universes the greater will has created. But again it does feel like it's more calling upon another soul when you do summon for multiplayer than creating a connection between different universes.
 
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