Duel of the Deuteragonists (Uryū [7] vs Sasuke [0]) (GRACE CONCLUDED)

[ReaperAndBlues]

So hopefully this isn't a horrible stomp in Uryu's favor and we can actually have a Bleach match that isn't "SC ggs" or some other broken hax.

TYBW Uryu and Six Paths Sasuke will be used (Both 5-C)

Speed is equalized and both have standard equipment, BUT, Sasuke does not have the Tailed Beasts (No Six Paths Susanoo).

Sasuke "You have your brother's eyes" Uchiha:

Uryū "No u" Ishida: 7

"I heard you were pretty strong" (Incon):

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Bump

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

For all that will say "Soul Crush ggs" or anything that would make it a stomp in Uryu's favor, I'd like to remind you Quincies do not have Soul Crush (except Yhwach and Jugram) and Uryu does have Antithesis for hax, but it isn't on the level of Sternitter hax like Gremmy's Subjective Reality and death hax or Lille Barro's intangibility and immortality. Uryu's arrows may have EE, But Sasuke can also resist EE (although I'm uncertain if this counts for Soul-based EE). Uryu has wincons, but before I address both, I will get into why Sasuke doesn't stomp.

For those who say that Sasuke can just put Uryu in a Genjutsu, that will not work for a few reasons:

1. Soul Physiology covers Illusions via scaling from Kenpachi's Reiatsu and Uryu at this point is stronger than SS Kenpachi.

2. Genjutsu does not affect souls as the Infinite Tsukuyomi couldn't put Edos in a Genjutsu, although that would apply for when Uryu is a soul but for this case he is in a physical form, which brings in the second reason relevant for this fight:

2.5. Genjutsu cannot affect Reikaku. Bleach characters have a spiritual way that they see enemies called Reikaku, and Sasuke can't affect Reikaku and if he catches Uryu in a Genjutsu due to the last point, he will see him through Reikaku because the two are separate, but can occasionally intertwine in the heat of combat.

3. The Antithesis. If Uryu gets caught in a Genjutsu despite all of this, he can just reverse the events and put Sasuke in a Genjutsu by changing the cause and effect from Sasuke putting him in a Genjutsu to Uryu putting him in a Genjutsu instead.

4. Uryu is a genius. Kind of a weird point, but if Uryu gets Genjutsu'd, he'll figure out it's an illusion and find some way to break out such as forcing himself out via intense pain, which he would still be able to fight like how Byakuya cut his muscles against Zonmari.

So my take on wincons are this

1. Uryu can use his Seele Schnider to dura neg Sasuke and can combine that with Hirenkyaku to perception-blitz him and potentially one shot.

2. He can catch him in a trap which he can set by baiting Sasuke into CQC and use Sprenger either by catching him in Gritz to set it up, or by using Hirenkyaku and using his arrows to distract him.

3. He can outlast Sasuke at range and make him reach his limit of using Susanoo and hit him with a couple of Quincy arrows, which although Sasuke resists EE, Quincy arrows will target his soul and Sasuke (if he can resist) can only do so much against a high-tier Quincy. Also since Uryu is much more skilled in LRC than Sasuke is and has Danmaku that can potentially home in on his target.

4. He can use Quincy matter manip and peel away at Sasuke's Susanoo along with his body.

5. If Sasuke tries Amaterasu, he can just reverse it onto him and force Sasuke to get rid of it himself.

6. If he can survive any attack he throws at him such as Katon (which he typically starts with) he can use Antithesis to reverse it on Sasuke and dura neg that way.

Sasuke's wincons are:

1. Get him into CQC which he will have the advantage of Analytical Prediction and better CQC skill.

2. Abuse HHP and switch positions between the two in certain situations.

3. Force him into CQC with Universal Pull and hit him with Flame Control.

However, not everything Sasuke has will work, for example:

1. Preta Path. The Preta Path won't work because Uryu has a different energy system that can't be equalized (trust me, this site has tried), and Soul Ripping won't work because Uryu's Body and Soul are intertwined, so separating them will just make Uryu turn into a spiritual being, which would actually hurt Sauske more than help him since now he can't directly touch his soul. Not to mention Soul Manip Resistance in Bleach is much higher than Naruto, so Sasuke might not even be able to pull it out.

2. Amaterasu. It was never shown to just insta kill someone, it typically takes time to deal damage and Uryu hard counters it with The Antithesis.

3. Genjutsu. Already had a whole section explaining why it won't work.

4. Chidori. If Sasuke hits Uryu's organs, it won't utterly annihilate him. Weaker Bleach characters have been shown surviving with severed body parts, organs ripped out, and full on holes blown through them. So Uryu would reverse the damage on Sasuke.

5. Sharingan Copying. Sasuke's Physiology will not allow him to copy Uryu's stuff.

So I'll say Uryu FRA (yes the OP can vote)

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Uryu fra

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Uryu fra

Counted

 

[Kidkinsey]

Genjutsu works on souls/the dead. Kabuto GJ'd itachi, sasuke GJ'd itachi to get him OUT of the Genjutsu and Itachi literally used kotoamatsukami on HIMSELF to break him out of kabutos control. The reason infinite tsukyomi didn't work is because the edo hokages bodies were already white zetsu and a few other reason

Uryu 6th sense MIGHT only help if it was just illusions in the enviorment sasuke would use, but I fail to see how being able to see reikaku is gonna help when sasuke leaves him Paralyzed or just puts him to sleep. Also unlike KS ( not tryna start a war I promise) genjutsu can take place IN the victims mind so idek how much being able to see reikaku would even matter here as the battle will be taking place in his mind. Lastly intense pain dosent break u out of occular genjutsu

 

[Arcker123]

Kinsey we've had this talk before.

The Bleach sixth sense means he's not getting caught in a genjutsu in the first place.

 

[Kidkinsey]

We've talked about it but that ain't mean I agreed

 

[Arcker123]

You don't actually have an argument against it.

Uryu doesn't actually use his sight in battles. Shunsui explains as much. Sasuke's genjutsu needs sight, as shown by Kabuto, which Uryu would be shutting off instinctively to use his sixth sense.

(Scans for this are on soul phys)

 

[Arcker123]

Genjutsu works on souls/the dead. Kabuto GJ'd itachi, sasuke GJ'd itachi to get him OUT of the Genjutsu and Itachi literally used kotoamatsukami on HIMSELF to break him out of kabutos control. The reason infinite tsukyomi didn't work is because the edo hokages bodies were already white zetsu and a few other reason

Edo tensei are souls trapped in physical bodies. Not a completely disembodied corporeal object like Uryu is. These two are not equivalent.

 

[Kidkinsey]

They don't have to be complete 1 to 1s, he has a mind so he's susceptible to GJ, obito has able to GJ kurama when he was just existing as energy because he still had a consciousness

I see the shunsui scan, he implies it isn't a instant thing because he says the more you focus on the battle it begins to happen

 

[Arcker123]

They don't have to be complete 1 to 1s, he has a mind so he's susceptible to GJ, obito has able to GJ kurama when he was just existing as energy because he still had a consciousness

Yes they do lmao. You can't say he can genjutsu a soul because he genjutsu'd a physical body.

It's whatever about the Kurama thing. I only disagree with the argument you gave about Edo.

I see the shunsui scan, he implies it isn't a instant thing because he says the more you focus on the battle it begins to happen

Yes and Uryu's gonna focus on the battle.

Even if we grant there's some activation time, it's not long enough to matter. Shunsui could use the red light green game from the very beginning, which required Barro to not be using his eyesigt, which proves that it's a negligible time at best.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Genjutsu works on souls/the dead. Kabuto GJ'd itachi, sasuke GJ'd itachi to get him OUT of the Genjutsu and Itachi literally used kotoamatsukami on HIMSELF to break him out of kabutos control. The reason infinite tsukyomi didn't work is because the edo hokages bodies were already white zetsu and a few other reason

Uryu 6th sense MIGHT only help if it was just illusions in the enviorment sasuke would use, but I fail to see how being able to see reikaku is gonna help when sasuke leaves him Paralyzed or just puts him to sleep. Also unlike KS ( not tryna start a war I promise) genjutsu can take place IN the victims mind so idek how much being able to see reikaku would even matter here as the battle will be taking place in his mind. Lastly intense pain dosent break u out of occular genjutsu

Quincies resist paralysis with Ransotengai and sleep manipulatation is in High-Tier Soul resistance, so if Sasuke puts him in a Genjutsu (which I doubt) he will just use Ransotengai to bs out of the paralysis once he notices that he can't move.

Actually better point: Low-Tier Souls can resist Paralysis inducement due to being able to resist passive reiatsu effects, so Genjutsu won't do shit.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Bump

 

[Kidkinsey]

Yes they do lmao. You can't say he can genjutsu a soul because he genjutsu'd a physical body.

It's whatever about the Kurama thing. I only disagree with the argument you gave about Edo.

Yes and Uryu's gonna focus on the battle.

Even if we grant there's some activation time, it's not long enough to matter. Shunsui could use the red light green game from the very beginning, which required Barro to not be using his eyesigt, which proves that it's a negligible time at best.

I only bought up the edo thing because people think being dead is a counter to GJ. Even in boruto ino had to check somebody's mind and soul to see if they were genjutsu'd, it consistently works on souls

Eyesight semantics aside sasuke can physically inject chakra into you to use GJ (did it to that dinosaur who was immune to gj because his glass eye)

Quincies resist paralysis with Ransotengai and sleep manipulatation is in High-Tier Soul resistance, so if Sasuke puts him in a Genjutsu (which I doubt) he will just use Ransotengai to bs out of the paralysis once he notices that he can't move.

Actually better point: Low-Tier Souls can resist Paralysis inducement due to being able to resist passive reiatsu effects, so Genjutsu won't do shit.

Sasukes stuff is very layered I don't have the exact # but EOS sasukes GJ is only 1 layer below infinite tsukyomi (with the last and adult sasukes being above)

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

I only bought up the edo thing because people think being dead is a counter to GJ. Even in boruto ino had to check somebody's mind and soul to see if they were genjutsu'd, it consistently works on souls

I need scans for that

Eyesight semantics aside sasuke can physically inject chakra into you to use GJ (did it to that dinosaur who was immune to gj because his glass eye)

The problem would be that Uryu's body has a Reiroku network, not a Chakra Network, and the two can't be equalized (I don't even wanna try). So Sasuke would have to affect Uryu's Reiroku AND Reikaku to fully put him in a Genjutsu

Sasukes stuff is very layered I don't have the exact # but EOS sasukes GJ is only 1 layer below infinite tsukyomi (with the last and adult sasukes being above)

I know it's layered, but that's physical, what are the layers for it working on souls? Oh wait, there are none on this site

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

BUMP

 

[speedster352]

Uryu fra

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Uryu fra

Dubs + counted

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

We need some Nard supporters out here to make this interesting, somebody got a ping?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

bump

 

[Spectra_Schiffer]

Uryu fra

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Uryu fra

Counted

 

[That_moron2]

Ishida fra

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Ishida fra

Counted

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Bump

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Bump

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

BUMP

 

[Excellence616]

Uryu FRA

 

[karo_senpaii]

For all that will say "Soul Crush ggs" or anything that would make it a stomp in Uryu's favor, I'd like to remind you Quincies do not have Soul Crush (except Yhwach and Jugram) and Uryu does have Antithesis for hax, but it isn't on the level of Sternitter hax like Gremmy's Subjective Reality and death hax or Lille Barro's intangibility and immortality. Uryu's arrows may have EE, But Sasuke can also resist EE (although I'm uncertain if this counts for Soul-based EE). Uryu has wincons, but before I address both, I will get into why Sasuke doesn't stomp.

For those who say that Sasuke can just put Uryu in a Genjutsu, that will not work for a few reasons:

1. Soul Physiology covers Illusions via scaling from Kenpachi's Reiatsu and Uryu at this point is stronger than SS Kenpachi.

2. Genjutsu does not affect souls as the Infinite Tsukuyomi couldn't put Edos in a Genjutsu, although that would apply for when Uryu is a soul but for this case he is in a physical form, which brings in the second reason relevant for this fight:

2.5. Genjutsu cannot affect Reikaku. Bleach characters have a spiritual way that they see enemies called Reikaku, and Sasuke can't affect Reikaku and if he catches Uryu in a Genjutsu due to the last point, he will see him through Reikaku because the two are separate, but can occasionally intertwine in the heat of combat.

3. The Antithesis. If Uryu gets caught in a Genjutsu despite all of this, he can just reverse the events and put Sasuke in a Genjutsu by changing the cause and effect from Sasuke putting him in a Genjutsu to Uryu putting him in a Genjutsu instead.

4. Uryu is a genius. Kind of a weird point, but if Uryu gets Genjutsu'd, he'll figure out it's an illusion and find some way to break out such as forcing himself out via intense pain, which he would still be able to fight like how Byakuya cut his muscles against Zonmari.

So my take on wincons are this

1. Uryu can use his Seele Schnider to dura neg Sasuke and can combine that with Hirenkyaku to perception-blitz him and potentially one shot.

2. He can catch him in a trap which he can set by baiting Sasuke into CQC and use Sprenger either by catching him in Gritz to set it up, or by using Hirenkyaku and using his arrows to distract him.

3. He can outlast Sasuke at range and make him reach his limit of using Susanoo and hit him with a couple of Quincy arrows, which although Sasuke resists EE, Quincy arrows will target his soul and Sasuke (if he can resist) can only do so much against a high-tier Quincy. Also since Uryu is much more skilled in LRC than Sasuke is and has Danmaku that can potentially home in on his target.

4. He can use Quincy matter manip and peel away at Sasuke's Susanoo along with his body.

5. If Sasuke tries Amaterasu, he can just reverse it onto him and force Sasuke to get rid of it himself.

6. If he can survive any attack he throws at him such as Katon (which he typically starts with) he can use Antithesis to reverse it on Sasuke and dura neg that way.

Sasuke's wincons are:

1. Get him into CQC which he will have the advantage of Analytical Prediction and better CQC skill.

2. Abuse HHP and switch positions between the two in certain situations.

3. Force him into CQC with Universal Pull and hit him with Flame Control.

However, not everything Sasuke has will work, for example:

1. Preta Path. The Preta Path won't work because Uryu has a different energy system that can't be equalized (trust me, this site has tried), and Soul Ripping won't work because Uryu's Body and Soul are intertwined, so separating them will just make Uryu turn into a spiritual being, which would actually hurt Sauske more than help him since now he can't directly touch his soul. Not to mention Soul Manip Resistance in Bleach is much higher than Naruto, so Sasuke might not even be able to pull it out.

2. Amaterasu. It was never shown to just insta kill someone, it typically takes time to deal damage and Uryu hard counters it with The Antithesis.

3. Genjutsu. Already had a whole section explaining why it won't work.

4. Chidori. If Sasuke hits Uryu's organs, it won't utterly annihilate him. Weaker Bleach characters have been shown surviving with severed body parts, organs ripped out, and full on holes blown through them. So Uryu would reverse the damage on Sasuke.

5. Sharingan Copying. Sasuke's Physiology will not allow him to copy Uryu's stuff.

So I'll say Uryu FRA (yes the OP can vote)

Do you know what genjustu is?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Do you know what genjustu is?

Do you know what Reikaku is?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Uryu FRA

Counted

 

[Arcker123]

I only bought up the edo thing because people think being dead is a counter to GJ. Even in boruto ino had to check somebody's mind and soul to see if they were genjutsu'd, it consistently works on souls

Eyesight semantics aside sasuke can physically inject chakra into you to use GJ (did it to that dinosaur who was immune to gj because his glass eye)

It working on dead bodies doesn't mean it can affect souls.

It's not semantics. It's just the mechanics of both abilities means it can't work.

How does he inject Chakra? Why can't Uryu manipulate the Reishi in that chakra and deconstruct it?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

It working on dead bodies doesn't mean it can affect souls.

Not to mention the fact that Kurama is just made of Chakra, so saying since the Tailed Beasts are Incorporeal they count as souls isn't valid because they are pure Chakra and not equal to souls in Bleach due to the fact that they are made of 4 different systems.

How does he inject Chakra? Why can't Uryu manipulate the Reishi in that chakra and deconstruct it?

Yet another point

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Oh boy, one more vote to grace.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Bump

 

[Lynieryz]

NoUryu FRA

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

NoUryu FRA

Counted

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

We have now reached grace

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Alright, grace has concluded.