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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

If they were weaker than goten and trunks according to WoG that either means goten and trunks upscale or WoG is contradicted due to Z fighters showing better feats.

There is literally no other argument against 2-C krillin or bergamo besides incredulity and crying about outliers while in this situation clearly shouldn't be one.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
If they were weaker than goten and trunks according to WoG that either means goten and trunks upscale or WoG is contradicted due to Z fighters showing better feats.

There is literally no other argument against 2-C krillin or bergamo besides incredulity and crying about outliers while in this situation clearly shouldn't be one.
Click to expand...
And source material>WoG
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
If they were weaker than goten and trunks according to WoG that either means goten and trunks upscale or WoG is contradicted due to Z fighters showing better feats.

There is literally no other argument against 2-C krillin or bergamo besides incredulity and crying about outliers while in this situation clearly shouldn't be one.
Click to expand...


All arguments that want to make krillin 2-C are faulty to begin with

Goku held back against him

Gohan very blatantly never returned to his previous 4-B peak in the Buu saga until after his training with Piccolo, and only became 2-C during his fight with SSB Goku.

Majora has no clear scaling to anyone who is 2-C that couldn’t be assumed to have gotten much stronger later during the ToP as it progressed, hell 18 only hits him once to make him get away from krillin, majora hits her once while her guard wasnt fully up as she was surprised that Solar Flare x100 didn’t do shit.
 
TiltedFN said:
but krillin literally has feats for it bruh, idk about tien but didnt he take hits from a serious base gohan?
Click to expand...
Yup by also getting 1 shotted and was like “yup I’m useless” and yeah also Goten and Trunks didn’t enter because they are too childish and don’t have much experience. Like having them on the team would had done way better considering their powers even as kids
 
The_Unknown_Warrior1 said:
One arc later, Frieza fires a Ki blast to kill Bulma and the later is shown to be extremely terrified and unable to defend herself.



Like come on man, you can't just use comedic moments like this in a series that started off as a gag manga and seem to willingly ignore other moments which show the complete opposite reaction
Click to expand...

Yet she was able to react and even try to protect herself from the attack. That'd just mean:

RoF Base Frieza>RoF Base Bulma>BoG Post-Absorption Base Goku

Otherwise, since all times Bulma hurt Goku she was angry, we could just give her 2-C with Rage Power. Since there she wasn't angry, it's consistent she was scared
 
LephyrTheRevanchist said:
Outlier. That simple, really.
Click to expand...
main-qimg-4739cd7dbfb69c5503aa0c3d5e6f9fcc-pjlq

I mean Goku does look like he is truly in pain here.
 
Ok let me just address a few things here because I can tell the idea of Krillin being 2-C is, unnerving to say the least. First and foremost I do not believe Krillin should be 2-C personally it's absolutely insane for this dude getting punked by illusions of Tamborine to be able to theoretically square up against SSJG tier fighters. BUT THATS LITERALLY WHAT WE ARE SHOWN LMAO
We have no reason to not bump Krillin due to our own personal bias, under that same bias 18 should also be nowhere near a 2-C busting power yet there she is fighting alongside 17 constantly in the ToP and taking hits that are meant for a SSJG Goku in the fight against Anilaza. Krillin beat an opponent that bested Android 18 who had no reason to hold back against him. Krillin fought blow for blow against a Base and SSJ Goku who remember in the beginning of the show literally one shot him while holding back and outpaced him with a stupid heavy ninja turtle suit. He out skilled Gohan and was being compared to Basil (Who also should be 2-C) before they even knew how good he was post his hidden potential being unleashed.

Literally just suck it up at this point or downgrade 18 and all who scale but it makes no sense for characters to still have Tier 4 scaling to their justifications if all their justifications come from fighting Tier 2 level fighters. This is not my issue but the wiki's and actually more of Dragon Ball's writing
 
DBS needs a verse wide scaling revision , a lot of the currently scaled characters who are tier 2 use completely bs scaling to held back Goku.

Future Trunks is not tier 2 until he unlocks rage mode, SS2 Goku held back against him and it’s evident the instant he goes on to fight base black on equal terms, the same black that shitstomped trunks effortlessly.

Gohan is not tier 2 throught all of DBS until he unlocks Ultimate again, piccolo makes a explicit point of him getting his old power back, makes 0 ******* sense if he was several times stronger than his Buu saga peak at that point, only argument for him being 2-C prior to that is a friendly spar with Goku, piss poor as it can get.

Gohan only becomes tier 2 after his training with Piccolo to Reawaken ultimate form and sparring with SSB /KK Goku.

Piccolo is only a threat to frost because the latter had already gotten his shit kicked in by SS1 Goku and even then he needed to employ special tactics to even have a chance against him, he is also not tier 2 until the ToP starts.

Krillin doesn’t scale to tier 2 period.
 
AguilaR202 said:
DBS needs a verse wide scaling revision , a lot of the currently scaled characters who are tier 2 use completely bs scaling to held back Goku.

Future Trunks is not tier 2 until he unlocks rage mode, SS2 Goku held back against him and it’s evident the instant he goes on to fight base black on equal terms, the same black that shitstomped trunks effortlessly.

Gohan is not tier 2 throught all of DBS until he unlocks Ultimate again, piccolo makes a explicit point of him getting his old power back, makes 0 ******* sense if he was several times stronger than his Buu saga peak at that point, only argument for him being 2-C prior to that is a friendly spar with Goku, piss poor as it can get.

Gohan only becomes tier 2 after his training with Piccolo to Reawaken ultimate form and sparring with SSB /KK Goku.

Piccolo is only a threat to frost because the latter had already gotten his shit kicked in by SS1 Goku and even then he needed to employ special tactics to even have a chance against him, he is also not tier 2 until the ToP starts.

Krillin doesn’t scale to tier 2 period.
Click to expand...
Future Trunks is defintiely tier 2 and he can hold his own against Black but ultimately does lose to him

Gohan‘s 2-C does come from Piccolo training as that’s when he becomes 2-C

This is blatantly wrong Piccolo was holding his own against Frost and was doing good against him until Frost resorted to cheating

The only way you can argue Krillin doesn’t scale is arguing from incredibility he has 2-C feats consistently
 
AguilaR202 said:
He has 0 consistent feats.
Click to expand...
Who? All the characters you mentioned have Consistent 2-C feats Gohan, Trunks, Piccolo, Krillin there’s no anti feats that would suggest them being tier 4

Also do you have discord? I wouldn’t mind discussing this with you but saying someone is consistently tier 4 when nothing suggests so is wrong especially trunks being tier 4
 
Spinoirr said:
Why hasn't the verse page been updated and where are the new scaling blog with the new Multipliers
Click to expand...
On top of the to do list we just need to get SSJG accepted and then me and the lads can get on it

Better question is how do we interpret the World of Void now with it being outside the 18 2-C (6 Universe) macrocosms?
 
AguilaR202 said:
DBS needs a verse wide scaling revision , a lot of the currently scaled characters who are tier 2 use completely bs scaling to held back Goku.

Future Trunks is not tier 2 until he unlocks rage mode, SS2 Goku held back against him and it’s evident the instant he goes on to fight base black on equal terms, the same black that shitstomped trunks effortlessly.

Gohan is not tier 2 throught all of DBS until he unlocks Ultimate again, piccolo makes a explicit point of him getting his old power back, makes 0 ******* sense if he was several times stronger than his Buu saga peak at that point, only argument for him being 2-C prior to that is a friendly spar with Goku, piss poor as it can get.

Gohan only becomes tier 2 after his training with Piccolo to Reawaken ultimate form and sparring with SSB /KK Goku.

Piccolo is only a threat to frost because the latter had already gotten his shit kicked in by SS1 Goku and even then he needed to employ special tactics to even have a chance against him, he is also not tier 2 until the ToP starts.

Krillin doesn’t scale to tier 2 period.
Click to expand...
Bruh future trunks? The guy that fought goku black for a year and didn't die, the same guy who forced a post u6 v u7 goku to go ssj3? The same guy who fought alongside ssjb goku and was throwing hands with zamasu, the same person who had JUST knocked down ssjb goku, stop with the BS arguments.

We don't know how weak frost was, its unquantifiable, weakened final form frost is still stronger than base goku, which is implied piccolo would have beat if not for the poison, so yes, that also means gohan scales to that piccolo, even in his base form, and ESPECIALLY his base form after unlocking his potential, these characters are fine, so there was no reason of even bringing them up in the first place.

"krillin doesn't scale tier 2 period." Is such a weak argument, this is your cope talking, not you using actual logic of feats that krillin literally has, like you can go watch him fight alongside 18 and win against an opponent that she lost against, you can watch him fight base gohan and win, you can watch him fight base goku and force him into super saiyan, he literally was able to kick back cell max, and take hits from him and be fine at the end of the movie.
 
AwkguyDB said:
Ok let me just address a few things here because I can tell the idea of Krillin being 2-C is, unnerving to say the least. First and foremost I do not believe Krillin should be 2-C personally it's absolutely insane for this dude getting punked by illusions of Tamborine to be able to theoretically square up against SSJG tier fighters. BUT THATS LITERALLY WHAT WE ARE SHOWN LMAO
We have no reason to not bump Krillin due to our own personal bias, under that same bias 18 should also be nowhere near a 2-C busting power yet there she is fighting alongside 17 constantly in the ToP and taking hits that are meant for a SSJG Goku in the fight against Anilaza. Krillin beat an opponent that bested Android 18 who had no reason to hold back against him. Krillin fought blow for blow against a Base and SSJ Goku who remember in the beginning of the show literally one shot him while holding back and outpaced him with a stupid heavy ninja turtle suit. He out skilled Gohan and was being compared to Basil (Who also should be 2-C) before they even knew how good he was post his hidden potential being unleashed.

Literally just suck it up at this point or downgrade 18 and all who scale but it makes no sense for characters to still have Tier 4 scaling to their justifications if all their justifications come from fighting Tier 2 level fighters. This is not my issue but the wiki's and actually more of Dragon Ball's writing.
Click to expand...
"Why the **** are they so strong. It Makes no sense."
Krillin 🤝 Boruto Five Kage
 
AwkguyDB said:
Ok let me just address a few things here because I can tell the idea of Krillin being 2-C is, unnerving to say the least. First and foremost I do not believe Krillin should be 2-C personally it's absolutely insane for this dude getting punked by illusions of Tamborine to be able to theoretically square up against SSJG tier fighters. BUT THATS LITERALLY WHAT WE ARE SHOWN LMAO
We have no reason to not bump Krillin due to our own personal bias, under that same bias 18 should also be nowhere near a 2-C busting power yet there she is fighting alongside 17 constantly in the ToP and taking hits that are meant for a SSJG Goku in the fight against Anilaza. Krillin beat an opponent that bested Android 18 who had no reason to hold back against him. Krillin fought blow for blow against a Base and SSJ Goku who remember in the beginning of the show literally one shot him while holding back and outpaced him with a stupid heavy ninja turtle suit. He out skilled Gohan and was being compared to Basil (Who also should be 2-C) before they even knew how good he was post his hidden potential being unleashed.

Literally just suck it up at this point or downgrade 18 and all who scale but it makes no sense for characters to still have Tier 4 scaling to their justifications if all their justifications come from fighting Tier 2 level fighters. This is not my issue but the wiki's and actually more of Dragon Ball's writing
Click to expand...
Okay, will master roshi be upgraded as well?

This is the important question here guys, he is the true bald chad in the series
 
AwkguyDB said:
On top of the to do list we just need to get SSJG accepted and then me and the lads can get on it

Better question is how do we interpret the World of Void now with it being outside the 18 2-C (6 Universe) macrocosms?
Click to expand...
It has no time or space, and we don't know the size, so nothing note worth really
 
Padaruyos said:
"Why the **** are they so strong. It Makes no sense."
Krillin 🤝 Boruto Five Kage
Click to expand...
Damage will fight against it the same he fought against the boruto upgrades, good luck for y'all, i will step out and watch the shit show that this change will make
 
AwkguyDB said:
On top of the to do list we just need to get SSJG accepted and then me and the lads can get on it

Better question is how do we interpret the World of Void now with it being outside the 18 2-C (6 Universe) macrocosms?
Click to expand...
I was talking about the whole new ssj grades and ssj2, ssj3 Multiplier thing for updating the profiles
 
Fezzih_007 said:
2-C krillin don't make much sense, but i think only tier 4 for him is also weird, so i guess a CRT to adress that could go.
Click to expand...
2-C’s more consistent than tier 4
omegabronic said:
Damage will fight against it the same he fought against the boruto upgrades, good luck for y'all, i will step out and watch the shit show that this change will make
Click to expand...
Eh I can only see arguments from incredibility Krillin has the 2-C feats unless someone can name some things that would contradict 2-C and make tier 4 better
CryoTheMayo said:
Will people be able to accept 2-C Roshi easier than 2-C Krillin or harder?
Click to expand...
Ngl does Roshi have any 2-C feats? Only thing I can think of is when he fought base Goku and Goku was surprised at how strong Roshi was
 
CryoTheMayo said:
Will people be able to accept 2-C Roshi easier than 2-C Krillin or harder?
Click to expand...
Roshi vs Ganos is probably the closes he gets to 2-C. I believe Dercori should be 2-C for no selling a combined attack from Piccolo and Gohan but Roshi admitted she was naturally stronger. Ganos boxed with a Base Goku that was eager to get to Toppo or Jiren I forgot which.
 
Since Super 18 is 2-C now most of the tier 4s have literally no one to scale to for their justifications. That is the issue we are facing here and with 18 getting bumped up so should everyone else that get their tier 4 ratings from her like Majora, and the Pride Troopers
 
TimmyTurnero said:
And the other argument literally makes this assumption? I said this is possible, we don’t know if Piccolo could see Goku or not, but to assume he could or couldn’t is nothing but an assumption.
Click to expand...
Mr.Cinos15 said:
And it's also highly unlikely Goku was only moving in his line of sight since every time Goku has ever tried to surprise attack his enemy in og Dragon Ball, he goes all around the opponent, including behind them. So why would he this time now only move in front of the enemies line of sight when he's trying to surprise attack Piccolo (unless we're also saying that Goku is purposefully baiting Piccolo to hit him, which is also unfounded).
Click to expand...
Mr.Cinos15 said:
Idk man, for me at least, I just don't see the point of Goku using the technique if Piccolo was simply capable of reacting to him. Goku is aware that Piccolo can keep up with him and has comparable speeds to his own even when moving at high speeds, so there would be little to no point in Goku using that technique unless a) he's baiting Piccolo, but then that means he's letting himself get hit for the bait, or B) Goku for some reason is only moving around in Piccolos line of sight instead of going in all directions (which would be very stupid on Goku's part, and while he isn't smart usually, he's not an idiot in battle). A is possible but there's little to nothing that hints at that, and b is just stupid.
Click to expand...
I will give you that Piccolo was caught off guard when Goku counterattacks, so I won't use that

If we go by reaction feat, then Goku is an idiot that decided to use a technique on an enemy that he knows is relative to him in speed and can see his movements and decided to only move in his line of sight (even though in every other fight Goku has shown to move in every area in the arena to surprise his opponent, including behind them), that basically amounted to nothing except him getting hit and only hitting Piccolo since he got distracted, or Goku was purposefully baiting Piccolo and uses the distraction to counter attack (the only way to make the reaction scenario make sense).

Where as if we go by the narrative of Analytical Prediction, Goku utilized the vanish in mind that Piccolo wouldn't be able to detect his movements, Piccolo decides to focus and predict where Goku will attack from, guesses correctly and lands a hit (and gets over confident) before Goku retaliates while Piccolo is surprised that Goku wasn't there.

Besides, Piccolo struck Goku when he was in an area that was practically past the edge of a persons sight if they only look straight ahead (which is what Piccolo is doing). Piccolo would've had to guess no matter what Goku's location since he cannot hear, feel, or sense Goku. And on top of all that Goku body when he is struck implies that he was coming from the area behind Piccolo, which would be a complete blind spot for Piccolo (since he can't hear, feel, or sense, only see him by the reaction feat logic), so even if Piccolo could perceive Goku's movements, he would still be forced to predict where Goku was gonna go when he was in his behind him and out of sight.
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Kinda? His fight with both Goku and Gohan that are holding back don't make much of a conving argument, but heim being 4 tier is super stupid, so atleast bumping to Tier high 3-A makes sense.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, doesn't work like that. There's no High 3-A feat.

At best, if scaling to solid 2-C is deemed unreliable, he would get a "possibly higher/far higher".
 
^ Universe also isn't infinite anymore, and infinite sized WoV is a sham so High 3-A DB is impossible lol.
 
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