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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

Nullflowerblush said:
The books also say that Chi-Chi is almost as powerful as Roshi and the average Saiyan, and that the Super Saiyan multiplier is 2.5x, and that Vegeta was there to witness Frieza destroying the planet.
Click to expand...
Take the screenshot and link it here (if you read the history part instead of the gameplay part).
 
Nullflowerblush said:
The books also say that Chi-Chi is almost as powerful as Roshi and the average Saiyan, and that the Super Saiyan multiplier is 2.5x, and that Vegeta was there to witness Frieza destroying the planet but obviously, you chose to ignore that.
Click to expand...
It's seems to be stuff lifted from the Daizenshuu with some guesswork added
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Here.

And also, why can't we use those sections? They're a part of the character bios as well.
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Those sections are only for the game, if you read correctly you would no there is no such a thing as HITS statistic in dragon ball, or evasion, or weapon but you decided to ignore that. If you think evasion, weapons, or HITs stats aren't anything other than for the game instead of reading what they explain about the actual anime, did you read what they say about the Saiyan saga or someone of the character's background at that time? nop You said they say chi-chi is more powerful than roshi, were is that stated? no were obviously.
 
It's very obvious they were attempting to implement actual Power Levels rather than just gameplay mechanics, giving Goku a Power Level of 8,000 during the Saiyan Saga, giving Raditz and the Saibamen Power Levels in the 1,200 range, giving the Saiyan Saga Z-Fighters Power Levels based on what the Daizenshuu stated.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
It's very obvious they were attempting to implement actual Power Levels rather than just gameplay mechanics, giving Goku a Power Level of 8,000 during the Saiyan Saga, giving Raditz and the Saibamen Power Levels in the 1,200 range, giving the Saiyan Saga Z-Fighters Power Levels based on what the Daizenshuu stated.
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Answer my question, is HITS, EVASION, WEAPON, MENTAL are for the games mechanic or the actual anime? You decide to ignore what they say about the character's background and tried to discredit that by focusing on obvious things that are just an element of game techniques (didn't try to see if the backstory in detail is correct but decides to focus on the aspect that is only for the game itself, you didn't read the book). Those power levels are only for the games (for the Saiyan saga obviously), it's in the same section for HIT, EVASION, WEAPON, MENTAL stats which we know aren't part of anything else other than gameplay mechanic, not the lore or what they explain itself. They even tell you that............., how desperate you might be and not read those parts.
 
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Those scans that you sent simply state that they are adding extra information to the lore of the anime and expanding upon character backgrounds and lore, which actually supports my argument. They're simply expanding upon characters and their Power Levels.

Also, the stats are unrelated to the Power Levels. I initially thought that the Power Level would be the sum of the stats, but that isn't right. I thought if I multiplied all the stats, the product would be the Power Level, but that isn't right, either.

On top of that, despite some characters [X] having higher Power Levels than other characters [Y], like Raditz [X] having a slight advantage over the Saibamen [Y], their [X] PHYSICAL, COMBAT, and MOVEMENT stats could be equal to or even lower than the other characters [Y], despite their superior Power Level.

The Power Levels are expansions of the character's bio. The stats are game mechanics.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Those scans that you sent simply state that they are adding extra information to the lore of the anime and expanding upon character backgrounds and lore, which actually supports my argument. They're simply expanding upon characters and their Power Levels.

Also, the stats are unrelated to the Power Levels. I initially thought that the Power Level would be the sum of the stats, but that isn't right. I thought if I multiplied all the stats, the product would be the Power Level, but that isn't right, either.

On top of that, despite some characters [X] having higher Power Levels than other characters [Y], like Raditz [X] having a slight advantage over the Saibamen [Y], their [X] PHYSICAL, COMBAT, and MOVEMENT stats could be equal to or even lower than the other characters [Y], despite their superior Power Level.

The Power Levels are expansions of the character's bio. The stats are game mechanics.
Click to expand...
1) They specifically said, background, places, and people, the powers level doesn't matter when it's in the same case or place as other statistics that are only elements of gameplay, so no your argument is wrong. You are completely debunked. You should focus on the lore and description of the page THAT ARE SPECIFIC IN THE BACKGROUND/STORYTELLING OF THAT SECTION, ALL YOU DO IS READ THE PART THAT IS SEPERATED AND ONLY FOR GAME MECHANICS AND ARE IRRELEVANT. You focus on the power level which is completely irrelevant on my base premise that the cosmology itself is outerversal , you derailed by talking about irrelevant parts that have nothing to do with cosmology (power levels are COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT WHEN TALKING ABOUT WHAT'S THE makeup OF THE MACROVERSE WHICH IS OBVIOUS).

2) That's you not reading correctly, you rushed without reading what I just explained to you and the book itself. You are the one wrong, you interpret what you wanna see not how it's supposed to work.

3) I WILL ASK THIS QUESTION ONCE MORE, IS: PWP UP, MENTAL, HITS, DEFENSE, EVASION, PHYSICAL, DEFLECTION, WEAPON HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE DRAGON BALL ANIME OR BACKGROUND/STORY TELLING? (if yes, prove such statements in the actual anime) OR THE ACTUAL GAME MECHANICS? DO NOT DODGE THE QUESTION AND ANSWER IT.

4) They aren't, the only power level they talk about is in the bio background section all you gave me is the part that is specifically separated from the test talking about character bios. You will have to be blind to not see such a simple concept.
5) -Officially, licensed, by Shueisha, bird studios, Toei animation, and fun animation.
-Specifically talks about the background on the people, places, and more.
-Specify which part is background material and game concept or mechanics,

6) In this scan, (your own), IS THE SKILL PART TALKING ABOUT THE GAME MECHANICS OR BACKGROUND? YOU ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER. IN YOUR OWN SCAN IT EVEN GIVES YOU THE DIFFERENCE, THERE IS THE BACKGROUND SECTION AND OTHERS THAT AREN"T
 
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elhermanopadre said:
1) They specifically said, background, places, and people, the powers level doesn't matter when it's in the same case or place as other statistics that are only elements of gameplay, so no your argument is wrong.
Click to expand...
"Extensive background on the people..."
Are Power Levels not considered a part of a person's background?
elhermanopadre said:
3) I WILL ASK THIS QUESTION ONCE MORE, IS: PWP UP, MENTAL, HITS, DEFENSE, EVASION, PHYSICAL, DEFLECTION, WEAPON HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE DRAGON BALL ANIME (if yes, prove such statements in the actual anime) OR THE ACTUAL GAME MECHANICS? DO NOT DODGE THE QUESTION AND ANSWER.

6) In this scan, (your own), IS THE SKILL PART TALKING ABOUT THE GAME MECHANICS OR BACKGROUND? YOU ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER. IN YOUR OWN SCAN IT EVEN GIVES YOU THE DIFFERENCE, THERE IS THE BACKGROUND SECTION AND OTHERS THAT AREN"T
Click to expand...
Again,
Nullflowerblush said:
...the stats are unrelated to the Power Levels. I initially thought that the Power Level would be the sum of the stats, but that isn't right. I thought if I multiplied all the stats, the product would be the Power Level, but that isn't right, either.

On top of that, despite some characters [X] having higher Power Levels than other characters [Y], like Raditz [X] having a slight advantage over the Saibamen [Y], their [X] PHYSICAL, COMBAT, and MOVEMENT stats could be equal to or even lower than the other characters [Y], despite their superior Power Level.

The Power Levels are expansions of the character's bio. The stats are game mechanics.
Click to expand...
elhermanopadre said:
5) -Officially, licensed, by Shueisha, bird studios, Toei animation, and fun animation.
-Specifically talks about the background on the people, places, and more.
-Specify which part is background material and game concept or mechanics,
Click to expand...
Yeah, so is Xenoverse.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
"Extensive background on the people..."
Are Power Levels not considered a part of a person's background?

Again,


Yeah, so is Xenoverse.
Click to expand...
I WILL TRY TO MAKE THIS CLEAR AS POSSIBLE AND YOU BETTER ANSWER CLEAR CUT AND DRY:

IS READING SECTIONS THAT AREN'T TALKING ABOUT THE CHARACTERS STORY, RELEVANT? DID YOU READ POWER LEVELS FROM THE BACKGROUND/STORYTELLING PART OR FROM OBVIOUS PARTS THAT ARE ONLY GAMEPLAY MECHANICS? DID YOU READ MY PREMISE AND TALKED ABOUT STUFFS THAT ARE COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT TO ANY COSMOLOGY THAT I PRESENTED? ARE POWER LEVELS RELEVANT TO COSMOLOGY?



-It doesn't matter about xenoverse , the only thing that matters if it,s officially licensed or is it a fake guide. Meaning this guide is officially published and authorize, xenoverse as nothing to with this, this guide book specifically says that are talking about Saiyan saga characters and the cosmology, while xenoverse is not and it's inside to game rather than a simple guide book (and especially says about the amine while xenoverse as nothing to do with that).

-Do you see the backstory for ox king and chichi in xenoverse ? of freaking grasshoppers?.
 
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Except for the part where the Wiki requires said "Higher Dimensions" that the "Outer Dimensional" location is beyond to be clearly proven as beyond Infinitely greater than Lower Dimensions with actual statements and feats. Just calling them Higher Dimensions or Outer Dimensional is no actual evidence at all.

Before you say anything, if there is any Verse that you don't think have that proof then it is a case that they should be downgraded and not Dragon Ball should be Upgraded because of a wrong premise. Also, bringing up Dictionary definitions doesn't matter either, the Wiki has its definition of these things and it doesn't matter what a Dictionary says if they don't fit the Wiki's definition.
 
Everything12 said:
Except for the part where the Wiki requires said "Higher Dimensions" that the "Outer Dimensional" location is beyond to be clearly proven as beyond Infinitely greater than Lower Dimensions with actual statements and feats. Just calling them Higher Dimensions or Outer Dimensional is no actual evidence at all.

Before you say anything, if there is any Verse that you don't think have that proof then it is a case that they should be downgraded and not Dragon Ball should be Upgraded because of a wrong premise. Also, bringing up Dictionary definitions doesn't matter either, the Wiki has its definition of these things and it doesn't matter what a Dictionary says if they don't fit the Wiki's definition.
Click to expand...
-It is it transcends dimensionality itself and dimensionality can have infinite dimensions, 3d,4d,5d,6d into infinity. Literally outerversal. The only statement is that the other world has higher dimensions than the universe.
-Yes it matters, and the definition does feat the wiki definition, outer-dimensional, the tiering 1-A should have been called outer-dimensional since it transcends the concept of dimensions.
-The higher dimension thing is to specify talking about specialty, and this section of the other book is only about how space works, and stuff about traveling in space and the cosmology.
-And yes bringing up the dictionary is important for people who don't know what being outside of dimensionality means. Try to think a bit, what does being outside of dimensionality itself means?
-It,s impossible to physically travel there because of those outer dimensional barriers, and makes sense, it would have to outer dimensional if it's supposed to contain and an unknown amount of higher dimensions of the other world (only way to surpass them is to use high level of teleportations).
 
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If the dimensions don't have feats or statements that prove they fit the Wiki's definition then they could be called ∞×∞ Dimensions and they still wouldn't be even Low 1-C, and no just be called or being said to be Higher Dimensional, Outside Dimensions, or Transcends the Concept of Dimensions is not an actual feat or statement.

Just because the name is from an official book about the Verse's Cosmology or an in-verse scientist said to be an expert in Dimensions does not count as evidence without the feats or statements. Names are absolutely worthless as evidence when it comes to proving Higher-Dimensional or Outerversal, no matter how much you think they should count as evidence they aren't.

Dictionary definitions are worthless because no matter how many people use them to try to understand the Wiki terms it doesn't change that it doesn't match the Wiki's definition. Your opinion on this "Outer Dimensional Barriers" is absolutely not any evidence the Wiki would accept and simple three dimensional could also prevent said movement, and said "Higher Dimensions" aren't proven to be Higher Dimensions so theirs no proof theire either.
 
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Everything12 said:
If the dimensions don't have feats or statements that prove they fit the Wiki's definition then they could be called ∞×∞ Dimensions and they still wouldn't be even Low 1-C, and no just be called or being said to be Higher Dimensional, Outside Dimensions, or Transcends the Concept of Dimensions is not an actual feat or statement.

Just because the name is from an official book about the Verse's Cosmology or an in-verse scientist said to be an expert in Dimensions does not count as evidence without the feats or statements. Names are absolutely worthless as evidence when it comes to proving Higher-Dimensional or Outerversal, no matter how much you think they should count as evidence they aren't.
Click to expand...
They do not have to. It's a description of how those barriers work (and their location), and that is more than enough for evidence and you wrong, it's a statement that describes how it works.
Yes, it does, it's officially licensed and is authorized to be used, your arguments only worked if I didn't have any evidence which is wrong because I have evidence.
-They are useful, literally, outer-dimensional is literally what the name outerversal means (unless you wanna say that a outerverse doesn't exist outside of any dimensionality) It's not about what I think, it's literally stated to be and I have evidence for that.
-If a structure is described and stated to be outside of dimensionally itself, this means it transcends that concept, and that concept can have infinite dimensions, like 3d, 4d to infinity that is literally in your face statement of outerversal.
 
I'm going to say it straight, argue with me, another user, or even staff as much as you want. This won't change the fact that your proof isn't actually proof by this Wiki's opinion. If you think the Wiki is wrong then make a CRT to change this, otherwise, you have no actual evidence no matter how official the source that gives the name is or what headcanon you create, because The Wiki Doesn't Care.
 
Everything12 said:
Except for the part where the Wiki requires said "Higher Dimensions" that the "Outer Dimensional" location is beyond to be clearly proven as beyond Infinitely greater than Lower Dimensions with actual statements and feats. Just calling them Higher Dimensions or Outer Dimensional is no actual evidence at all.

Before you say anything, if there is any Verse that you don't think have that proof then it is a case that they should be downgraded and not Dragon Ball should be Upgraded because of a wrong premise. Also, bringing up Dictionary definitions doesn't matter either, the Wiki has its definition of these things and it doesn't matter what a Dictionary says if they don't fit the Wiki's definition.
Click to expand...

It say that and half the 1-A don't meet said requirement. We even had multiple 1-A downgraded the second someone actualy looked at it.

The second part of your comment is literaly just a bunch of cope and very desperate argument against a joke. That alone should make you rethink this whole nonsense.

Lol, 't-t-t-the wiki overturn the english language', You really think it's not a laughable point?

'if there is any Verse that you don't think have that proof then it is a case that they should be downgraded and not Dragon Ball should be Upgraded because of a wrong premise.' Blah blah blah, cope cope cope. The usual song and dance to cope with dragon ball fitting every standards that was used to wank verse no one cared enough about to scrutinize on the wiki.

You ***** always say 'we'll downgrade them rather than upgrade DB!' and then when I provide exemple, suddenly you all shut up and never downgrade them.
 
Everything12 said:
I'm going to say it straight, argue with me, another user, or even staff as much as you want. This won't change the fact that your proof isn't actually proof by this Wiki's opinion. If you think the Wiki is wrong then make a CRT to change this, otherwise, you have no actual evidence no matter how official the source that gives the name is or what headcanon you create, because The Wiki Doesn't Care.
Click to expand...
'Official source aren't actual evidence!!!!'

'The wiki doesn't care about evidence, official source or argument!!!'

You're why people laugh at VSB wiki, you are aware of that, right? You are the kind of person who give this site a bad reputation.
 
Everything12 said:
I'm going to say it straight, argue with me, another user, or even staff as much as you want. This won't change the fact that your proof isn't actually proof by this Wiki's opinion. If you think the Wiki is wrong then make a CRT to change this, otherwise, you have no actual evidence no matter how official the source that gives the name is or what headcanon you create, because The Wiki Doesn't Care.
Click to expand...
-I do not care about what the wiki cares THAT'S IRRELEVANT, I only care about if SOMETHING is right or valid arguments, not what the wiki thinks.
-You calling it not proof is ignorance, it's stated to be, how is that not evidence, it's not like came I here with zero scans and no proof .
-There is nothing headcanon here about outerversal , OUTER-DIMENSIONAL, WHAT DOES THAT MEANS? SOMEONE THINK OUTSIDE OF DIMENSIONALITY ITSELF? WHAT COULD THAT BE??????, WAIT IT'S OUTERVERSAL SINCE OUTER-VERSES TRANSCENDS DIMENSIONALITY, IT'S NOT BOUND BY IT AND IT'S OUTSIDE OF IT OBVIOUSLY. You are the one using headcanon, I never argue without having evidence for my claims.
 
People laugh at the site because of these Higher Dimensions you are aiming for and how they perceive us giving these Higher Dimensions out for no actual feats or statements. Simple names and headcanons constructed from no actual feats or statements are not evidence no matter how official the source is, they are as worthless as making a character Tier 0 because the Author calls them Omnipotent.
 
Everything12 said:
People laugh at the site because of these Higher Dimensions you are aiming for and how they perceive us giving these Higher Dimensions out for no actual feats or statements. Simple names and headcanons constructed from no actual feats or statements are not evidence no matter how official the source is, they are as worthless as making a character Tier 0 because the Author calls them Omnipotent.
Click to expand...
No, they don't, they laugh at the wiki for having everyone and their mother at multiversal for the flimsiest reason and for people like you screaming about how words having meanings doesn't matter and the wiki's arbitrary definition is the only one that matters.

Are you hearing yourself ? 'Official source aren't actual statement or feats or anything!!! Official source are headcanon!!!!' That's a laughable point and that's because of people like you that this wiki get laughed at.

We got tier 0 characters who literaly are never even shown in the franchise they come from.

The fact that standards are randomly either super lax or stupidly strict (down to the very wording) is my whole point.
 
Everything12 said:
People laugh at the site because of these Higher Dimensions you are aiming for and how they perceive us giving these Higher Dimensions out for no actual feats or statements. Simple names and headcanons constructed from no actual feats or statements are not evidence no matter how official the source is, they are as worthless as making a character Tier 0 because the Author calls them Omnipotent.
Click to expand...
  • Ok, explain to me, what do higher dimensions mean when it's specifically talking about space ? or when the barriers started to be outside of any dimensionality? How is that headcanon? the definition is so clear and in your face you cannot just say it's wrong.
  • The omnipotent stuff is not relevant, since we know (I Gave scans) , showing and telling that the other worlds that has higher dimension compair to the living universe is contained in a gigantic barrier like stuff, that is described to be outer-dimensional, how is that headcanon?
 
There is really no way to progress from here, you know the Wiki doesn't accept your "evidence" but you also think you are still absolutely correct. So all that will happen is you won't make a CRT, Dragon Ball's Tier won't change, while you still go on in this Thread about how Dragon Ball's "Higher Dimensions" are more accurate them the rest of the Wiki's actually accepted Higher Dimensions and how the Wiki's opinion is wrong. This is a complete impasse, nothing no one will say will change this and will instead just waste time.
 
Everything12 said:
There is really no way to progress from here, you know the Wiki doesn't accept your "evidence" but you also think you are still absolutely correct. So all that will happen is you won't make a CRT, Dragon Ball's Tier won't change, while you still go on in this Thread about how Dragon Ball's "Higher Dimensions" are more accurate them the rest of the Wiki's actually accepted Higher Dimensions and how the Wiki's opinion is wrong. This is a complete impasse, nothing no one will say will change this and will instead just waste time.
Click to expand...
''''''''evidence'''''''' Cope. Still official. Still better than whatever verse you're desperatly trying to defend here.

You're so angry, it's hilarious.

It's not an impass, it's very clear where we go from there but the wiki won't accept to downgrade it's wanked verse no one cares about and you'll stay very angry because you know what I said was true.

Having a clear way forward but a bunch of people refuse to go on isn't an impasse.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Never know until you try.
Click to expand...

It's been tried before, thread was closed after they said 'Doesn't fit our standard' and when me and others pointed out exemple where stuff like that was accepted, we got 'We'll downgrade them' and then they were never dowgraded.

Maybe I should make a thread to downgrade them If I can find back the thread and the exemples on it.
 
How is that angry? That is a pretty clear impass. You ain’t bringing it up anywhere but here. Nothing changes.
 
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