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Devil May Cry Upgrade Discussion Part 2

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@ThePerpetual

TBF that is a wiki page which sites the DMC3 manga as a source a source that describes the Human World as universal in scope not planatery generally they just call it the Human World with no specifics one way or the other.

It specifically states they were split into two meaning two halves of equal scope. And the feat of the merger happening in Devil May Cry 2 states the Demon World is what was moving remember

"This will generate a distortion that will bring the Demon World closer"

They dont bring the Human World to the Demon World but the Demon World itself to the Human World which is only ever defined as a seperate plane of reality/existance and not as a planet.

Its a replica with reversed physics because its a Mirror World and is its own dimension with a different space time then the actual Human World.

Yeah but its a fairly unquantifiable feat that can be anywhere from Universal+ -> City Level but if Mundus ability to manipulate space across realities is excepted then the feat can be quantified at far higher than the low end.
 
After looking through the very long thread i can agree on the suggested bump to planet level, possibly multi solar system explained on the thread
 
Hmmm...

While I do see the point you're making, I'm still not sure that we can prove that this is the case, necessarily. Can you find/link to the cutscene where this takes place? That'd probably help out quite a bit.

Also, two other questions: one, how would this affect Vergil? Last I checked he fought Mundus himself in the past, though I guess it's uncertain how that panned out other then he got corrupted? Two, wasn't there a Sub-Relativistic reactions/combat speed calc floating around somewhere? It looked fairly legit from what I remember.
 
ThePerpetual said:
Hmmm...
While I do see the point you're making, I'm still not sure that we can prove that this is the case, necessarily. Can you find/link to the cutscene where this takes place? That'd probably help out quite a bit.

Also, two other questions: one, how would this affect Vergil? Last I checked he fought Mundus himself in the past, though I guess it's uncertain how that panned out other then he got corrupted? Two, wasn't there a Sub-Relativistic reactions/combat speed calc floating around somewhere? It looked fairly legit from what I remember.
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i feel as though virgil should slightly below whatever dante is.
 
well planet seems fine as it is man didn't expect this to be that long :p
 
ThePerpetual said:
Hmmm...
While I do see the point you're making, I'm still not sure that we can prove that this is the case, necessarily. Can you find/link to the cutscene where this takes place? That'd probably help out quite a bit.

Also, two other questions: one, how would this affect Vergil? Last I checked he fought Mundus himself in the past, though I guess it's uncertain how that panned out other then he got corrupted? Two, wasn't there a Sub-Relativistic reactions/combat speed calc floating around somewhere? It looked fairly legit from what I remember.
Click to expand...
Ill try I know the Sacralege item is found in mission 16 but nothing much happens outside of the game itself and the items description stating that it moves the demon world closer and the area you are in becoming more demonic with each use.

Not much you could probably give him Planetary -> Universal potency because of Yamato (depending on what is desided in the end) or continue with the "Attacks ignore durability" thing he currently has on his page, as for the fight with Mundus we dont know how it went but Vergil most likley got curbstomped considering base DMC 1 Dante couldn't even hope to fight Mundus until he unlocked Sparda.

The one I suggested here (Mach 7,500 to 99,930) or one I dont know about? Is there a way to calc the rate that Quicksilver slows time and the fact that Vergil can still flash step during its effects? (This is in game though so maybe not)
 
Based on SpecN's and Mascotman's comments in the last thread, we are not going to upgrade them to Universe level, or even Multi-Solar System level. "Possibly up to Planet level" is fine however.

We even have a rule against attempting to upgrade them to this degree, so I would advise SaberLily015 to please immediately permanently drop this topic.
 
Ant i wanna ask something this is a sample (and wishful thinking lol but don't take this as actual arguement) because from what i remember there might be a dmc 5 and not from the reboot lets say mundus was the main villian and he stated he can easily destroy the human world and demon world with their space time-continium so would that be fine to make a thread about it or not (just asking don't want to get banned IF it happens lol)
 
Then it would be fine. That would be new information. Also, you are a staff member. We obviously don't ban staff members unless they are very extremely out of line.
 
Antvasima said:
Then it would be fine. That would be new information. Also, you are a staff member. We obviously don't ban staff members unless they are very extremely out of line.
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kk just to make sure thx for clarifying Ant
 
No problem. However, staff members should obviously also do their best to stick to the rules.
 
Antvasima said:
No problem. However, staff members should obviously also do their best to stick to the rules.
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yeah gotcha anyway are people mostly agreeing about planet level dmc or wait for more input personally i want to hear more from others
 
Aight, so what I've gathered based on this discussion and the discussion held here:

Dante is at least Country level, and this is likely to be higher once the cloud dispersal/portal creation is calced. This much is set in stone.

Planetary levels of power are also likely, as well, we've decided on?

And it could possibly be higher, but only just possibly. We're not going to place a maximum value on it, either, as that would lead to confusion, people arguing for it in debates, and really just wouldn't do anyone any good.

Mundus might be Universal, but if we are going to count that then it would only be in hax/reality warping that isn't applicable to direct combat, similar to what Antvasima had suggested here. Are we going to go with that, or no?

And we've agreed that we are going to count the Sub-Relativistic feat, but it would only apply to combat speed/reactions and not travel speed, as no one outpaced the lightning for an extended period of time.

Finally, there's little point in having the 6-C entry on his profile, as more impressive feats exist within a very short timeframe of that one occuring, making it's presence redundant and illogical.
 
Country level for Dante in base form seems feasible, since he managed to defeat the Despair Embodied in base form in DMC2, a being who is very likely on the same level as Abigail. Continent level for the Devil Trigger form also seems appropriate from his feat of tearing open a North America sized dimensional portal after destroying Abigail's body.

Planet level, possibly higher is also a good estimate for Dante's Majin form, Sparda and for Mundus
 
Devil Trigger is a big boost, sure, but I don't think it's entire tiers above what he normally does. Remember when Mundus hit Dante out of his Devil Trigger form halfway through the bossfight, and he continued the battle on the ground below in Base Form?
 
One more thing of note, in the manga Dante demonstrated the ability to induce terror and mental incapacitation in opponents via a sort of black void ability last I checked. Is the manga canon? If so, I should probably make note of that.

Edit: Wait, are we counting the creation of a continent-sized portal as Continental AP until we get a calc for the event?
 
No. It's already been established that this will not be considered. There's even a rule about it. A continent sized portal would be referred to as hax and range, not AP (unless it was destroying something?). It can be calced though if the portal was physically destroyed.
 
As I mentioned earlier, if I have undestood SpecN and Mascotman correctly in the last thread, we are not going to upgrade them to Universe level, or even Multi-Solar System level.

Opening a portal between planets is not remotely the same thing as being proven as capable of merging universes.

"At least 6-C. Possibly 5-B or higher via hax unusable for practical combat purposes" should be fine however. I am uncertain whether we should use "At least 6-A" instead?
 
TheMightyRegulator said:
No. It's already been established that this will not be considered. There's even a rule about it. A continent sized portal would be referred to as hax and range, not AP (unless it was destroying something?). It can be calced though if the portal was physically destroyed.
Click to expand...
The portal did destroy something, it caused all the clouds over the continent to dissipate.
 
@Yojimnbo That's in the progress of being calculated but opening a portal itself isn't scalable to AP. @Antvasima we'll have to wait for a calc on that. Also, the canonicity pages were seemingly not linked?
 
sorry to sound a bit impatient but can someone check the link i gave right up there also ignore the SMT part just wanting to know if there is anything that can influence this thread
 
now i am wondering if this needs to remain open or anyone wanna pitch in more input?
 
I don't know. Are all of the updates done? If so, somebody can probably close this thread.
 
It seems that Dante and Mundus have already been upgraded accordingly to what was accepted so i guess it's safe to close this then...
 
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