Demon King vs. Demon King (Anos Voldigoad vs. Dracula Tepes)

[Dereck03]

but if you change fate you not really change plot, because that can be just a part of the plot of the world.

Eques did so, forbade Anos to make any move and at the very least Anos would be destroyed because reality had been altered by a greater power in such a way that Anos was destined to lose no matter what he did, and since MEoCD governs and is unbound by logic that in turn governs reality in the same way that plot does.

 

[Dereck03]

Venuz & MEoCD >>> unbound >>>> Logic & Plot >>>>>>> Reality.

 

[Regidian]

How is it equating when you say that narrative is superior to logic? The way you wrote your santance you clearly equated them. Heck, Why would it be superior in the first place?

It's the plot and story that decide what is logic in a verse.

Eques did so, forbade Anos to make any move and at the very least Anos would be destroyed because reality had been altered by a greater power in such a way that Anos was destined to lose no matter what he did, and since MEoCD governs and is unbound by logic that in turn governs reality in the same way that plot does.

Doesn't have plot manip in the verse she just manipulated the fate, so now just make a crt to let it be accepted as equal to plot or stop.

Venuz & MEoCD >>> unbound >>>> Logic & Plot >>>>>>> Reality.

No to you to decid. Make a crt to make logic be equated to plot in mgk

 

[Orioreeem]

It's the plot and story that decide what is logic in a verse.

Why? Where is that stated?

 

[Regidian]

Why? Where is that stated?

It's the basic. You can't tell that it's logic that magic exist in one piece, If in the plot and story of the verse magic doesn't exist and that the author doesn't make it existant.

 

[Dereck03]

No to you to decid.

I'm not deciding anything. It's simple logic.... The plot governs reality and can do whatever it wants with it, the logic in MG governs reality as it pleases and can do whatever it wants with it. Both The Reason Destroying Sword <Venuzdonoa> Reason=Logic in the verse and MEoCD are beyond the logic and unboud of it, they can destroy the logic and manipulate it to their liking, which is the same thing that Plot and Logic does with reality, you have no basis and i prefer to argue with Glassman instead of you since you seem to ignore what was said (not by me, but by verse logic and equivalence).

 

[Regidian]

One more time it's quite simple if you guy are so sure that logic in mgk equal plot manipulation then just make it a crt to get accepted not that hard.

 

[Dereck03]

It's the basic. You can't tell that it's logic that magic exist in one piece, If in the plot and story of the verse magic doesn't exist and that the author doesn't make it existant.

Of course, the same logic that exists in MG is not the same logic that exists in any other verse. Logic in MG is above reality, concepts, laws and both Venuz and MEoCD are beyond and unbound the logic.

 

[Regidian]

I'm not deciding anything. It's simple logic.... The plot governs reality and can do whatever it wants with it, the logic in MG governs reality as it pleases and can do whatever it wants with it. Both The Reason Destroying Sword <Venuzdonoa> Reason=Logic in the verse and MEoCD are beyond the logic and unboud of it, they can destroy the logic and manipulate it to their liking, which is the same thing that Plot and Logic does with reality, you have no basis and i prefer to argue with Glassman instead of you since you seem to ignore what was said (not by me, but by verse logic and equivalence).

Glassman will surely tell the same thing .

Make a crt to get it accepted as for now it's not the case. Anyways DT tell it's more like Law manipulation

 

[Dereck03]

Glassman will surely tell the same thing .

Then it would be useless to discuss what is clear

Make a crt to get it accepted as for now it's not the case.

There is no need to rush (especially since there are already 2 CRTs for Anos in progress and adding another one will be heavy), I already explained clearly how the verse deals with the logic and that it is not the same logic as in other verses. Besides, what's the point of making a CRT? It is already known and accepted and used that MEoCD and Venuz are unbound and beyond the logic that in turn the logic governs the reality and can do with it what it wants in the same way that the plot does it without difference... What is there to accept here?

And you are simply ignoring the simple mechanics that exist in the verse.

The plot governs reality and can do whatever it wants with it, the logic in MG governs reality as it pleases and can do whatever it wants with it. Both The Reason Destroying Sword <Venuzdonoa> Reason=Logic in the verse and MEoCD are beyond the logic and unboud of it, they can destroy the logic and manipulate it to their liking, which is the same thing that Plot and Logic does with reality.

Nothing more to say, only that I have not seen a good counterargument.

 

[Orioreeem]

It's the basic. You can't tell that it's logic that magic exist in one piece, If in the plot and story of the verse magic doesn't exist and that the author doesn't make it existant.

How is that any different then someone creating a concept of magic for example? Also again where is that stated?
Also few threads about how plot manipulation ain't anything special:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/what-is-your-least-favorite-power-and-abilities.132801/#post-4555212

https://vsbattles.com/threads/plot-manipulation-limits.126157/

https://vsbattles.com/threads/4th-wall-breaking-tries-to-annex-plot-manip-plot-manipulation-demystification-and-removal.132149/

https://vsbattles.com/threads/plot-manipulation-resistance.116783/

 

[Rikimarox2]

Ignoring the whole plot vs fate manip fuckery (As that needs it own thread), can anyone tell me how good Dracula's plot manip is? The scans just show me some talk about books and stuff, but not something that affect the entire reality, making Dracula win always.

 

[Arkenis]

Does Dracula use the plot hax in character?

 

[Rikimarox2]

It's apparently passive.

 

[Fixxed]

doesn’t really matter cause the plot itself is already written for him to lose, he needs to get through that first which I don’t see him having any feats of doing whatsoever.

Him plot manip can effect NEP 2???

he evolves his resistance to be capable of resisting Anos’ hax and copies his powers perfectly

Can resisting 99 above bassline concept???

 

[Reploidnoridomix]

wtf,now you guy discuss about if fate manip = plot manip ???,dude

 

[Dereck03]

wtf,now you guy discuss about if fate manip = plot manip ???,dude

Let me be clear that I am not saying that plot=Fate, I am simply saying that the same reason why Dracula has Plot is the same reason for Eques, but the latter has fate instead of plot.

 

[Pepsiman25th]

https://tenor.com/view/logic-thrown-out-of-the-window-melon-pult-gif-21513906

 

[Dereck03]

https://tenor.com/view/logic-thrown-out-of-the-window-melon-pult-gif-21513906

Comment completely irrelevant to the thread.

 

[Dereck03]

Anyway, Anos currently has significant CRTs upgrades ongoing rn that may affect his cosmology, overall power and most likely more upgrades will come after the current ones are finished, so I will ask that this be closed until Anos is completely free, if @Theglassman12 wants to say something, he can comment and close the thread until Anos CRTs are finished. And tbh, I don't see a good counter-argument to the above unless they just keep repeating the same thing in loop which they will do.

 

[Colonel_Krukov]

I have been told that Anon is currently being revised so I will lock this thread for the time being. Please feel free to ping me when the changes have been made, and I will unlock the thread if the match is still viable.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Orioreeem Ok? Anos still lacks resistance to plot hax and it's shown to affect beings in combat so why are you saying it's not that special?

Also did you remotely bother reading any of those 4 threads or did you just randomly search the term plot hax and picked anything that suits your argument? Because one is an "overrated ability" thread where someone just said the power is overrated, 2 QnA threads that just says resisting plot hax doesn't grant other resistance, and you need feats (something castlevania doesn't lack here), and a CRT that got unanimously rejected by staff across the board and explained how manipulating the plot is not the same as manipulating fate itself. Try and actually read the threads next time instead of throwing claims left and right.

@Dereck03 Do you understand anything about the basic concept of a NLF? Because what I argued is not a NLF for Dracula. Anos lacks the resistance to power mimicry, especially on the level that Dracula himself has. Anos is not a smurf character with higher dimensional hax, they both have 4-D powers, both reactive evolution and power mimicry works here because they're still in the same dimensional level of power. Especially with the Power of Dominance which not only grants Dracula the abilities of those he fights but also their resistances as a result What IS a NLF is claiming that MeoCD will automatically nullify any and all powers that it has no feats of nulling in the first place, especially plot manipulation of all abilities that destabilizes his magic to make it not work like it's supposed to.

Let me be clear that I am not saying that plot=Fate, I am simply saying that the same reason why Dracula has Plot is the same reason for Eques, but the latter has fate instead of plot.

That's not remotely comparable as the Plot hax controls the entire story that you're a part of, controlling one's Fate has nothing to do with controlling the plot as fate can be dictated by the plot itself. Hell erasing reality doesn't mean jack shit when the plot still goes on in a story, look at any story that has the end of everything, the plot still goes on.