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DC Rating Revamp Project (Why 4-B is wrong whether or not it's an upgrade or downgrade)

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I suppose so, but Amelia and Impress preferably need to save a link to Firestorm808's High 5-A Superman calculation in preparation for it.
 
Has there been any consensus on what Superman's low-end should be? 5-B, 5-A, or High 5-A?

5-A seems like he most consistently supported so far.
Again, isn’t High 4-C pretty consistent? Shazam black hole, 50 supernovas, John Stewart surviving Xanshi explosion, that Comic Ant mentioned where Green lanterns were literally put at large star in universe, Superman surviving 15 supernovas against the Elite. Also a few star feats, like Sun Eater:
 
Again, isn’t High 4-C pretty consistent? Shazam black hole, 50 supernovas, John Stewart surviving Xanshi explosion, that Comic Ant mentioned where Green lanterns were literally put at large star in universe, Superman surviving 15 supernovas against the Elite. Also a few star feats, like Sun Eater:
They’re talking about Superman’s low-end. High 4-C would be his high-end.
 
Also, it’s not like Superman’s power varies or anything. It’s just that he holds back a lot. Making a tier for someone holding back is really stupid, we never have done that even for characters who hold back a lot.
 
Again, isn’t High 4-C pretty consistent? Shazam black hole, 50 supernovas, John Stewart surviving Xanshi explosion, that Comic Ant mentioned where Green lanterns were literally put at large star in universe, Superman surviving 15 supernovas against the Elite. Also a few star feats, like Sun Eater:
Isn’t the 15 novas just from the movie
 
It is not due holding back, Hulk case is because his power varies due his angry, not sure about thor or silver surfer
Thor and Norrin explicitly get their lower ends from holding back

Large Planet level (Usually operates under a far lower power level in fear of killing his mortal opponents

Large Planet level (Refrains from using his full strength in most instances)
 
Also, it’s not like Superman’s power varies or anything. It’s just that he holds back a lot. Making a tier for someone holding back is really stupid, we never have done that even for characters who hold back a lot.
Holding back might influence his AP output depending on the threat, but I don't think that works with his durability and what hurts him.
 
Durability wise, those feats are everywhere, so it's not straight up 4B. Being knocked out by a moon busting, or being knocked out by other weaker characters and whatnot. We should probably find a decent tier for that.
 
So which of the High 4-C feats are reliable to use to scale from?
 
Just is anyone going to try to replicate / find the 4-B black hole feat by Shazam?

IIRC one attempt places him at around half 4-B and another at 97 FOE but I am too busy irl to attempt to find or replicate one feat calculation of such.

May be I will make a calc request. Or even do one myself once I have more free time. By more free time I mean extended hours with my desktop at home uninterrupted by work and family and life planning issues.
 
Being hit by 15 Supernova is from Superman vs. The Elite, no? In the story it adapts, What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way? (Action Comics 775), the blast isn't stated to be that strong and only really hurts Superman after he's been weakened due to Manchester's telepathy.

Also Billy's High 4-C feat is the black hole one, right? It relies on weird pseudoscience like "fabric of light" and shouldn't be treated as a real black hole. Unfourenaty I forgot the source of the feat, thogh.
 
Superman has admitted to rolling through punches against Batman, and you could probably make an argument using the aura thing Superman has, so he should probably have a varying durability as well imo.
 
BTW, the 50 kepler supernova thing is only High 4-C, since Superman only took the initial neutrino blast, which would be 1% that of the full yield, the actual full-power explosion would have incinerated him.

50 kepler supernova is 5e+45 J, 1% of that is 5e+43 J (Large Star level).
 
Just is anyone going to try to replicate / find the 4-B black hole feat by Shazam?

IIRC one attempt places him at around half 4-B and another at 97 FOE but I am too busy irl to attempt to find or replicate one feat calculation of such.

May be I will make a calc request. Or even do one myself once I have more free time. By more free time I mean extended hours with my desktop at home uninterrupted by work and family and life planning issues.
Please evaluate

Shazam!: Monster Society of Evil #4.
Being hit by 15 Supernova is from Superman vs. The Elite, no? In the story it adapts, What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way? (Action Comics 775), the blast isn't stated to be that strong and only really hurts Superman after he's been weakened due to Manchester's telepathy.

Also Billy's High 4-C feat is the black hole one, right? It relies on weird pseudoscience like "fabric of light" and shouldn't be treated as a real black hole. Unfourenaty I forgot the source of the feat, thogh.
Well... if the black hole actually behaves like a black hole by sucking things away... I think it is not far off.
 
This, if we give a tier via holding back, it shouldn't affect his Durability, since you cant hold back durability like you can with AP. I dunno why Marvel has it like that tbh but that's for another thread.
I mean, it does make sense only for Hulk to be honest, both Silver Surfer or Thor should have 4-B Durability.
 
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I mean, it does make sense only for Hulk to be honest, both Silver Surfer or Thor should be have 4-B Durability.
As has been stated earlier, Hulk is a slightly different case, since his power does change with anger too. So yes, Hulk would still have variable durability along with AP.
 
Superhero comics are not logical, and we had to do something to account for the wildly different displayed power levels depending on the settings.
 
Durability wise, those feats are everywhere, so it's not straight up 4B. Being knocked out by a moon busting, or being knocked out by other weaker characters and whatnot. We should probably find a decent tier for that.
The moon busting with an RMP could just be due to his own speed. Supergirl bust a moon with an RMP and almost tore a hole in space-time by her sheer speed. The weaker characters (Reverse Flash and Shazam for instance) are the ones with the feat, getting knocked out by people like that while holding back isn’t an anti-feat for tier 4.
 
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