- 3,684
- 2,320
Hey. This isn't a discussion to change Kale's 3-A rating or anything. I just wanted to discuss her profile and her main justification, which is that she was capable of withstanding a Kamehameha from SSB Goku. There are several things that I do not like about this, and I believe that this justification for her 3-A tier should be changed.
First of all, SSB Goku has been known to hold back against his opponents. Because of the form's incredible ki control, it allows him to stay at a higher level of power while regulating how much energy he utilizes. It's why we don't have Krillin at 3-A for matching a Kamehameha from SSB Goku, because we all know Goku was holding back significantly. I believe that Goku was holding back heavily against Legendary Super Saiyan Kale: he took the form as insurance to make sure Kale didn't increase in power and hurt him, but so he could regulate how much power he was releasing. Even though Kale managed to withstand the Kamehameha and walk through it, there was visible steam coming off of her body and she was shown to be panting heavily, so I believe that the attack did do some damage. And while Kale did place Goku in a chokehold, I think he could've easily gotten out of it as well, and was just shocked by how Kale walked through his Kamehameha. The fight between LSSJ Kale and SSB Goku never happened because she threw him across the ring and started going out of control as well.
Despite having been pounded by Kale, Goku showed absolutely no signs of fatigue or pain, which kind of indicates that Kale couldn't really do much against him. This is in stark contrast to SSG Goku vs Wrathful Broly: we could clearly see that Goku was having a tough time against Broly. He was on the ground, writing in pain and expressing shock at how strong Broly was while communicating with Piccolo. Such conversations never happened here. I believe that LSSJ Kale was indeed stronger than SSJ and SSJ2 Goku given how his blows couldn't do much against her, but that's as far as I'm willing to go.
More evidence of LSSJ Kale not being on Goku's level was when she and Caulifla later fought against Goku. During the battle, she and Caulifla were strong enough to force SSJ2 Goku on the defensive, and when she harnessed and controlled the full power of her LSSJ form, her power was noted to have increased substanially from before. But even in this state, she was only able to fight on par with Super Saiyan God Goku, and was quickly being overwhelmed by him. One might argue that Goku had gotten stronger from when he fought Kale earlier. That's a possibility, although SSJ2 Goku fought evenly against SSJ2 Caulifla, which was the same as when they fought earlier in the tournament, and Caulifla was never shown to have substantially increased in power during the tournament, or at least it was never proven. During the Tournament of Power, Frieza was prepared to fight Kale and Caulifla in just his final form without having to change into Golden Frieza, in spite of the fact that Kale had become more powerful than her initial transformation in the ToP, which implies he believed he'd be capable of fighting them without having to use Golden Frieza.
With all of this having been said, I'd like to change Kale's justification. I believe that the uncontrolled LLSJ Kale should be at a level higher than regular SSJ2's, because that's the most consistent scaling. SSJ2 Caulifla was capable of deflecting an energy blast from LSSJ Kale, and SSJ2 Goku momentarily fought against LLSJ Kale and a weaker SSJ Kale. It's only in her controlled LSSJ2 state that she should be comparable to SSG Goku, since that's where the more extended battle was shown and where they actually fought, instead of just the short fight that occurred between SSB Goku and LSSJ Kale before.
First of all, SSB Goku has been known to hold back against his opponents. Because of the form's incredible ki control, it allows him to stay at a higher level of power while regulating how much energy he utilizes. It's why we don't have Krillin at 3-A for matching a Kamehameha from SSB Goku, because we all know Goku was holding back significantly. I believe that Goku was holding back heavily against Legendary Super Saiyan Kale: he took the form as insurance to make sure Kale didn't increase in power and hurt him, but so he could regulate how much power he was releasing. Even though Kale managed to withstand the Kamehameha and walk through it, there was visible steam coming off of her body and she was shown to be panting heavily, so I believe that the attack did do some damage. And while Kale did place Goku in a chokehold, I think he could've easily gotten out of it as well, and was just shocked by how Kale walked through his Kamehameha. The fight between LSSJ Kale and SSB Goku never happened because she threw him across the ring and started going out of control as well.
Despite having been pounded by Kale, Goku showed absolutely no signs of fatigue or pain, which kind of indicates that Kale couldn't really do much against him. This is in stark contrast to SSG Goku vs Wrathful Broly: we could clearly see that Goku was having a tough time against Broly. He was on the ground, writing in pain and expressing shock at how strong Broly was while communicating with Piccolo. Such conversations never happened here. I believe that LSSJ Kale was indeed stronger than SSJ and SSJ2 Goku given how his blows couldn't do much against her, but that's as far as I'm willing to go.
More evidence of LSSJ Kale not being on Goku's level was when she and Caulifla later fought against Goku. During the battle, she and Caulifla were strong enough to force SSJ2 Goku on the defensive, and when she harnessed and controlled the full power of her LSSJ form, her power was noted to have increased substanially from before. But even in this state, she was only able to fight on par with Super Saiyan God Goku, and was quickly being overwhelmed by him. One might argue that Goku had gotten stronger from when he fought Kale earlier. That's a possibility, although SSJ2 Goku fought evenly against SSJ2 Caulifla, which was the same as when they fought earlier in the tournament, and Caulifla was never shown to have substantially increased in power during the tournament, or at least it was never proven. During the Tournament of Power, Frieza was prepared to fight Kale and Caulifla in just his final form without having to change into Golden Frieza, in spite of the fact that Kale had become more powerful than her initial transformation in the ToP, which implies he believed he'd be capable of fighting them without having to use Golden Frieza.
With all of this having been said, I'd like to change Kale's justification. I believe that the uncontrolled LLSJ Kale should be at a level higher than regular SSJ2's, because that's the most consistent scaling. SSJ2 Caulifla was capable of deflecting an energy blast from LSSJ Kale, and SSJ2 Goku momentarily fought against LLSJ Kale and a weaker SSJ Kale. It's only in her controlled LSSJ2 state that she should be comparable to SSG Goku, since that's where the more extended battle was shown and where they actually fought, instead of just the short fight that occurred between SSB Goku and LSSJ Kale before.
Last edited:
