Canon Star Wars: Revenge of the Downgrade

[ShadowWhoWalks]

Are there MHS+ speed calcs? Currently we are scaling reaction to combat speed, which results in 'outliers' and problems all over the place.

The widespread assumption is that hand-held blaster fire is subsonic; canon information is that starfighter cannon projectiles move at 2000 m/s. Arguments have been made to upgrade blasters (which anyone with training can dodge) to hypersonic, but that is no where close to MHS+. This means that any fight where Force Users consider people who shoot blasters a threat is an outlier.

---

Calling explosions from lasers that miss Tier 7 is an unjustified claim and an unneeded exaggeration. Pretty much claiming that Tier 7 is incapable of disintegrating this mount:

We can't say that R2-D2 survived a glancing blow, and then say that lasers that outright miss don't constitute glancing blows; MHS+ or Tier 7 animals would be ridiculous.. If I am not mistaken, the Tier 7 comes from the Clone Wars where a non-combat vessel tanks comets, so the power of most high-tier lasers could be in the penetrative power instead of AoE and environmental destruction.

Kylo struggled against Snoke royal guards who are not Force Sensative. The novelization of that movie said that Kylo can only take two or three Knights of Ren at the same time while training, and that the Knights of Ren are only capable of touching the Force in a small way (so nothing dramatic like a massive speed and durability boost). The Knights of Ren backed away to give Kylo breathing room during the battle in arrogance, indicating that they never respected his combat abilities.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

Because We need a Mandator Asserator Bellator Sovergian Viscount Malevolence MC95 MC 75 Superlaser siege cannon. All needed pages The Trade Federation Battleship also needs a page on it as well.

 

[Lorenzo.r.2nd]

hey, i just found out that this thread existed. could someone fill me in?

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

We are trying to Decide certain things in the StarWars Franchise

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

There seems to be a consensus that Darth Sidious was amped, so the top tiers get downgraded and don't scale to TRoS' lightning feat.
The tier 7 durability of Karbin and General Grievous is getting downgraded.
Lightsabers will be getting revised into At Least 8-C or Unknown.

The main contentions seem to be:
Whether the top feats are consistent with all canon media.
Whether the current 'force amplification' and combat speed ratings are consistent for Force users.

Normal durability might be upgraded to 9-A from 9-B.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

I like that a lot makes sense man

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Canon Star Wars in general will be getting downgraded but that's another thread

 

[Idazmi]

There seems to be a consensus that Darth Sidious was amped, so the top tiers get downgraded and don't scale to TRoS' lightning feat.
The tier 7 durability of Karbin and General Grievous is getting downgraded.
Lightsabers will be getting revised into At Least 8-C or Unknown.

The main contentions seem to be:
Whether the top feats are consistent with all canon media.
Whether the current 'force amplification' and combat speed ratings are consistent for Force users.

Normal durability might be upgraded to 9-A from 9-B.

My contention is that the difference in feats between the main films and the spinoff media (like comic books) is enough to justify making them separate keys. As Shadowbokunohero pointed out in comment #196:

> So you admit there's a discrepancy in power between the films and the other media.

No one argued otherwise, but we dont suddenly ignore Canon Material because the films are more conservative with their displays of power.

No one needs to ignore the canon material. However: if we recognize that the films are consistently more conservative with their feats than other Star Wars material, we shouldn't just ignore that discrepancy and treat them as being the same - especially when the difference is worth an entire tier or more.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

No one needs to ignore the canon material. However: if we recognize that the films are consistently more conservative with their feats than other Star Wars material, we shouldn't just ignore that discrepancy and treat them as being the same - especially when the difference is worth an entire tier or more.

No because we understand that not all Mediums allow the same flexibility to strain suspension of Disbelief.
Context matters.
It's the same reason why we scale most OT characters with PT characters or above despite Objectively the OT having the worst feats in the franchise because we understand the films had to be conservative because of technical limitaitions.

however, if you feel so strongly about having an entire key just for The Movies divorced from the TV Shows,comics,novels ect then make a CRT because thats not how we treat things on the wiki.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

Yeah because it is very clear that Rebels and Clone Wars have cannon depiction of technologies such as turbolasers and ion cannons all that time. And certain parts of them will be cannon because of the limitations based on the technology of the time. Star Wars was never meant to be a consistent well thought out the franchise at all. those movies were made 35 plus years ago technology filmmaking directing direction and the techniques will change over time and multiple times. And the Malevolence did not hyperspace ram the moon it nearly fell towards it like its gravity as acting on it. Regardless of what the people say about how the ship hyperspace ramming into the moon when it clearly did not look or act like hyperspace the radius's hyperspace ram looked like both. Hyperspace ramming does ruin space combat forever. The single mc 75-star cruiser the rebels had could have hyperspace rammed directly into the death star when it fired its superlaser than a New Hope never happens. Or Hyperspace ramming an old shuttle into a star destroyers' main reactor or command center. Plus if Star Wars ships are not material when they enter or exit hyperspace witch is no longer the case. Because of The Last Jedi Than every single ship witch enters hyperspace near any large body would be destroyed which is clearly not the case. We do need to make more pages On The Bellator Asserator Sovereign Trade Federation Battleship MC 95 and MC 75 Malevolence needs to happen sooner than later how did those pages are not made at this point is way beyond me. Because not only are they important but Star Wars could always need new pages on it. Rebels and Clone Wars Certainly have far more conservative technology demonstrations than the expanded universe even though they are both cannon because of Legends and clinging keep to thier own cannon. They are cannon because Lucas worked on them himself. But the power creep never existed it's extremely impressive you are missing that point because not all mediums can strain the same amount of suspension of disbelief. That is why the expended media looks like a massive power creep when it remains extremely consistent on the technology depictions of the universe it is trying to expand upon. Flims have budget marketing pre-production production and post-production things they need to and must cover in order to make profit and counting to be made. But the power creep thing is bullshit. And did not exist within the universe and is a total fantasy for Izdami and you.

 

[Catalyst75]

eah because it is very clear that Rebels and Clone Wars have a non-cannon depiction of technologies such as turbolasers and ion cannons all that time.

Non-canon? Clone Wars? Back before the Disney merger, Clone Wars alongside the movies was The Canon. Everything else from Licensing was not just a lower level of the canon but considered its own thing/"parallel universe" separate from the movies and the Clone Wars TV series.

In other words, I'd argue that Licensing/Legends has the non-canon depictions or statements about things when it comes to the films. It is completely separate, but don't say that the Clone Wars, which was part of the film canon and the highest level of canon, has "non-canon depictions".

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

Non-canon? Clone Wars? Back before the Disney merger, Clone Wars alongside the movies was The Canon. Everything else from Licensing was not just a lower level of the canon but considered its own thing/"parallel universe" separate from the movies and the Clone Wars TV series.

In other words, I'd argue that Licensing/Legends has the non-canon depictions or statements about things when it comes to the films. It is completely separate, but don't say that the Clone Wars, which was part of the film canon and the highest level of canon, has "non-canon depictions".

I meant to say compared to the comic books and other media the Clone Wars And Rebels have very conservative technology depictions compared to other cannon media. But the post was already getting way too long in the tooth compared to my other posts on this website before that one came along.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

At least legends star wars will be left untouched

 

[Hellbeast]

Nah there's Reivions for that coming

 

[LordTracer]

Which will be both downgrading and upgrading the verse.

 

[Idazmi]

No because we understand that not all Mediums allow the same flexibility to strain suspension of Disbelief.
Context matters.
It's the same reason why we scale most OT characters with PT characters or above despite Objectively the OT having the worst feats in the franchise because we understand the films had to be conservative because of technical limitaitions.

however, if you feel so strongly about having an entire key just for The Movies divorced from the TV Shows,comics,novels ect then make a CRT because thats not how we treat things on the wiki.

So the reason Jango Fett was able to fight effectively against Obi-Wan was due to technical limitations, and not in-universe limitation? I'd say otherwise - Jango Fett is not Force Sensitive. The feats Jedi accomplish in the comics would have us believe that this struggle of a fight happens:





in the exact same universe where THIS can be done by a person with similar powers with with near-contemptible ease:

So... all he had to do was lock up Jango's firing controls. Or toss the Seismic charge away. And don't go telling me that they didn't have the VFX technology to do this in 2002. Not after the Battle of Naboo in 1999:



They had the technology. They didn't do it anyway.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Idazmi You are derailing trolling arguing and fighting others that disagree with you in this thread for your head cannon that makes zero sense. It was for plot reasons that Jango could fight on par or even better than a Jedi. It was for plot reasons that the clone troopers could kill the Jedi despite being multiple orders of magnitudes weaker and not force sensitive. Please stop this right now. No one is denying any of those feats existed in the first place. We are denying they offer the most canonical explanation to the things that happen within the universe itself. It was for plot reasons anikin could win the battle for Naboo and win the pod race not in-universe ones. You are doing nothing but pissing people off every chance you get and fighting auguring trolling and derailing this thread. No one is taking you with even a grain of salt at this point please stop it. It likely was for the budget as CGI back then was likely far more expensive gram per gram than it is today 20-25 years later. Just stop it, please. It really should not take a leap of logical faith for you to think about what you are saying is fundamentally wrong and stupid. Just go to another thread. Please just stop with this one for now anyway.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

> So the reason Jango Fett was able to fight effectively against Obi-Wan was due to technical limitations, and not in-universe limitation?

Once again this isn't an Anti feat for Obi Wan, Jango has no other feats except for getting Killed by Mace Windu.

> So... all he had to do was lock up Jango's firing controls. Or toss the Seismic charge away. And don't go telling me that they didn't have the VFX technology to do this in 2002. Not after the Battle of Naboo in 1999:

why are you purposely misinterpreting my point, I never said it had anything to do with special effects or CGI. I was using the OT as an example to illustrate to you that limitations can exist outside of the universe that effect the story.

My main POINT was and I QUOTE "No because we understand that not all Mediums allow the same flexibility to strain suspension of Disbelief"

It's why even superheroes films are still far more grounded than their comic counterparts, or why it's entirely possible to adapt something Like dragonball Z with characters moving at high speeds, making afterimages ect, the reason why it's avoided because it doesnt work as well in the Medium of live action, it's also why Toon force something commonly associated with animation doesnt appear that often in Live Action either.

The closer something gets to "real life" the harder it is to convince your Audience that it's real which is why alot of times things are kept conservative to make sure you dont lose your Audience.

those limitations change and become either more strict or flexible depending on the Medium.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

At least legends star wars will be left untouched

there's actually some really good arguments that would debunk our current tier 5 scaling.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Shadowbokunohero You tell that little @Idazmi what is the truth and the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So what's currently been accepted as being added or removed?

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

I have zero idea what the hell is going on mate. someone is derailing and deflecting perfectly valid reasons to accept extremely common answers to things and spraying bat shit theories. And misquoting stupid has hell shit for zero reasons other than to derail and troll this thread into getting locked.

 

[Cropfist]

there's actually some really good arguments that would debunk our current tier 5 scaling.

Yeah, it should be replaced with tier 4 scaling.

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

Unshielded small to medium ships are likely getting downgraded from Tier 7 after ByAsura's CRT due to recalcs and anti feats, so even if we assume the explosion from the lasers that missed Obi Wan from Slave I are as powerful as the lasers (even though astromech droids can tank them) it would not be a reliable feat to justify the current passive durability tiering.

Feats from comics or novels are valid, but it is consistent that subsonic-hypersonic 9-A projectiles are dangerous for Jedi, even if they are in 'combat mode'.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

Yeah, it should be replaced with tier 4 scaling.

Depends though on who, but there are better Tier 5 feats IMO than The Poofy one.

 

[Idazmi]

> So the reason Jango Fett was able to fight effectively against Obi-Wan was due to technical limitations, and not in-universe limitation?

Once again this isn't an Anti feat for Obi Wan, Jango has no other feats except for getting Killed by Mace Windu.

Actually he has a feat where he shot a Jedi to death with a blaster:



And when he fought Mace Windu, he only got killed because he dropped one of his blasters and his jetpack malfunctioned, after he got run over by a reek, which seems very similar to a rhinoceros and gave both Obi-Wan and Mace Windu trouble:



Certainly they could have simply force-pushed the reek into Jango or something. After all, a Padawan can do it.

> So... all he had to do was lock up Jango's firing controls. Or toss the Seismic charge away. And don't go telling me that they didn't have the VFX technology to do this in 2002. Not after the Battle of Naboo in 1999:

why are you purposely misinterpreting my point, I never said it had anything to do with special effects or CGI. I was using the OT as an example to illustrate to you that limitations can exist outside of the universe that effect the story.

You said:

It's the same reason why we scale most OT characters with PT characters or above despite Objectively the OT having the worst feats in the franchise because we understand the films had to be conservative because of technical limitaitions.

I just showed there's no technical reason why they don't have Jedi performing those feats in the Prequel Trilogy and Disney Trilogy films.

My main POINT was and I QUOTE "No because we understand that not all Mediums allow the same flexibility to strain suspension of Disbelief"

It's why even superheroes films are still far more grounded than their comic counterparts, or why it's entirely possible to adapt something Like dragonball Z with characters moving at high speeds, making afterimages ect, the reason why it's avoided because it doesnt work as well in the Medium of live action, it's also why Toon force something commonly associated with animation doesnt appear that often in Live Action either.

The closer something gets to "real life" the harder it is to convince your Audience that it's real which is why alot of times things are kept conservative to make sure you dont lose your Audience.

those limitations change and become either more strict or flexible depending on the Medium.

Ever seen Superman the Movie?





I suppose it's totally grounded for a 6 foot man in spandex to fly into outer space carrying an armed nuke, and just as grounded for that man to burrow into the Earth and stop a magnitude 10 earthquake by bench-pressing a tectonic plate back into place. And then flying faster than light to turn back time. In a movie made in 1978. I seem to recall Star Wars being from 1977.

They could show extreme feats like this in this exact medium of Hollywood film. Star Wars films deliberately avoid doing so, even in the age of CGI.

 

[GiverOfThePeace]

Superman movies are explicitly known for being campy movies tho, which Star Wars is trying to be taken seriously

 

[Catalyst75]

I meant to say compared to the comic books and other media the Clone Wars And Rebels have very conservative technology depictions compared to other cannon media.

It's impressive how much you miss the point. They're the canonical depictions of technology in the setting because they are the works which George Lucas himself worked on. Legends/Licensing only kept continuity within itself, not with the films, because Lucas didn't concern himself with what went on there. They're not "conservative"; it was Legends/Licensing that created its own power creep over time to the point what happens there is unrecognizable compared to things in the films and Clone Wars TV series.

 

[Idazmi]

It's impressive how much you miss the point. They're the canonical depictions of technology in the setting because they are the works which George Lucas himself worked on. Legends/Licensing only kept continuity within itself, not with the films, because Lucas didn't concern himself with what went on there. They're not "conservative"; it was Legends/Licensing that created its own power creep over time to the point what happens there is unrecognizable compared to things in the films and Clone Wars TV series.

Exactly.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Catalyst75 I am not missing the point. I fully understand the media. And the fact they are fully canonical too. Just more conservative than Legends and others. You are just over exaggerating my point. And yes they are still conservative despite the power creep from legends that still makes them conservative compared to legends. witch no longer exists anymore hence why are still conservative to the material of the legend. I understand that legends and cannons are positive entities in thier own right that still means the clone wars and rebels are still conservative compared to the extended media they are protrying. Then explain the recent source material backing up the legends content more than the older move and clone wars content. Because both rebels and clone wars were made on a smaller budget were spin-offs made for kids and aired on television where the rules are harsher than streaming services. Before they came to streaming services not afterward.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Catalyst75 does that mean they are cannon all the time no. But it means they are indeed canonical sources made for kids. The zero hour turbolaser bombardment is not cannon nor is grand admiral shotting down a tie defender with a pistol. Plus rebels can not make a lore accurate star destroyer model. We have blaster pistol feats in cannon higher than both of those feats combined. Plus clone wars are both canon and not cannon through season 6. They in fact do have very conservative technology depictions regardless of what you say and how you spin it @Shadowbokunohero debunked everything you said piece by piece 100 percent on target.@Idazmi did not concede his points after facts and evidence were presented to the side of the story Star destroyer getting its bridge blown off is non-canon unless you read the books. The executor falling because of a wing into the death is non-canon unless the other material can tell you why it happened. Those are all one-time events made for plot reasons and nonother. It is shocking impressive how you are not understanding that. Nore does that quote mean anything in. Both of you are contributing nothing and trolling this thread in hopes it will be locked. I am at least trying to do something to explain to both of you why you are wrong. It is also because of technology limitation of the OT era that the star destroyers bridge was blown up by an asteroid and how the executor died after a wing fly into it. How the hell is that so hard to understand. In fact, neither of you died despite the fact multiple people told both you otherwise. Derailing and trolling multiple times because it is that god dam hard for you to understand anything,

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I'm really confused on why you keep pointing out it's made for Kids. It's not like Kids are stupid or that Kids Shows can't be complex.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@XSOULOFCINDERX It explains the feats of the budget the difference in power level and more. The clone wars are shocking complex and adult and deal with child soldiers sex slavery war terrorism and mother topics made for adults and not kids. It is extremely deep and powerful in its own right but should not be considered the emperor of star wars cannon. Plus @Shadowbokunohero keeps debunking thier calms and they are refusing to concede. Even though they have been told by multiple others to stop that and to get back online they did not. Derailing and even outright trolling multiple times for Idazmi and refusing to consider for catalyst 75. Even when information is not comparable with their head cannon they instead doubled down. When and ignore the multiple others saying otherwise to thier head cannon. Even though neither I nor shadow is ignoring thier points and even admitted it. And then provided reasonable and rational answers to thier questions multiple times extremely loud and clear they did nothing but use head cannon and double down and the wired theories provided by the internet and not facts and logical deductive reasoning provided by them for free my multiple people multiple times. But I do fully understand where you are coming from and understand I should have made it easier to understand my points not harder. But is not just me saying that it is also multiple other people multiple other times again and again? Because of course, it would be that way. I cannot change things like that.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

> And when he fought Mace Windu, he only got killed because he dropped one of his blasters and his jetpack malfunctioned, after he got run over by a reek

Thanks for supporting my argument.

>which seems very similar to a rhinoceros and gave both Obi-Wan and Mace Windu trouble.

something looking similar doesn't = the same thing.

Shadowbokunohero said:


It's the same reason why we scale most OT characters with PT characters or above despite Objectively the OT having the worst feats in the franchise because we understand the films had to be conservative because of technical limitaitions.

I just showed there's no technical reason why they don't have Jedi performing those feats in the Prequel Trilogy and Disney Trilogy films.

I already addressed this argument before you made it, scroll back and read what I wrote.

> I suppose it's totally grounded for a 6 foot man in spandex to fly into outer space carrying an armed nuke, and just as grounded for that man to burrow into the Earth and stop a magnitude 10 earthquake by bench-pressing a tectonic plate back into place. And then flying faster than light to turn back time. In a movie made in 1978. I seem to recall Star Wars being from 1977.

False Equivalence, Superman is entirely meant to be a fantastical character that can essentially do anything the plot needs him to, so the Audience has far more lenient assumptions going in.

also, this still doesnt debunk my point, even the campy christopher lee Superman films are still more grounded than he is in most other media. also, this would be an extremely terrible example to use for your argument, Richard Donner the Director of Superman's main mantra during production was verisimilitude, which is the idea of something being real, in terms of filmmaking that is tied to Suspension of Disbelief, the reason why superman works is because nearly every element of the Film is done in service of making Superman as believable as possible.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Shadowbokunohero you are not wrong in the slightest. He is not but trolling and derailing this thread in hopes it will get locked.

 

[Idazmi]

> And when he fought Mace Windu, he only got killed because he dropped one of his blasters and his jetpack malfunctioned, after he got run over by a reek

Thanks for supporting my argument.

>which seems very similar to a rhinoceros and gave both Obi-Wan and Mace Windu trouble.

something looking similar doesn't = the same thing.



I just showed there's no technical reason why they don't have Jedi performing those feats in the Prequel Trilogy and Disney Trilogy films.

I already addressed this argument before you made it, scroll back and read what I wrote.

1. The Reek doesn't demonstrate anything in that scene that would make me think it's substantially stronger than a rhinoceros.

2. My point was the fact that the creators of Star Wars' films easily have the ability to match the feats seen in the comics on a technical level. Why? Because you DID say:

(...) It's the same reason why we scale most OT characters with PT characters or above despite Objectively the OT having the worst feats in the franchise because we understand the films had to be conservative because of technical limitaitions. (...)

Since you did say this, I replied to it. The fact remains: technical limitations had very little to do with the feats being smaller than what you see in the comics.

> I suppose it's totally grounded for a 6 foot man in spandex to fly into outer space carrying an armed nuke, and just as grounded for that man to burrow into the Earth and stop a magnitude 10 earthquake by bench-pressing a tectonic plate back into place. And then flying faster than light to turn back time. In a movie made in 1978. I seem to recall Star Wars being from 1977.

False Equivalence, Superman is entirely meant to be a fantastical character that can essentially do anything the plot needs him to, so the Audience has far more lenient assumptions going in.

also, this still doesnt debunk my point, even the campy christopher lee Superman films are still more grounded than he is in most other media. also, this would be an extremely terrible example to use for your argument, Richard Donner the Director of Superman's main mantra during production was verisimilitude, which is the idea of something being real, in terms of filmmaking that is tied to Suspension of Disbelief, the reason why superman works is because nearly every element of the Film is done in service of making Superman as believable as possible.

So your main point is that the comics are the more realistic and thematically accurate depiction of the Star Wars universe than the films, on the premise that the films need to work harder to suspend disbelief.

That idea evaporates the instant you remember that - unlike Superman - Star Wars began as a film franchise, not a comic book. Recall this comment by Catalyst75:

It's impressive how much you miss the point. They're the canonical depictions of technology in the setting because they are the works which George Lucas himself worked on. Legends/Licensing only kept continuity within itself, not with the films, because Lucas didn't concern himself with what went on there. They're not "conservative"; it was Legends/Licensing that created its own power creep over time to the point what happens there is unrecognizable compared to things in the films and Clone Wars TV series.

He's talking about the technology, yes, but his statement is entirely true for both technology and the Force. The Star Wars Films and The Clone Wars were the things that George Lucas - creator of Star Wars - worked on personally. He didn't write the comics, he didn't write the video games. That means Lucas Licensing basically did their own thing... and if the disparity between current Disney Canon feats are any indication, they are still doing their own thing.

That's why the Clone Army destroyed the Jedi Order - because the Jedi are canonically on a level low enough for the Clone Army to be able to destroy the Jedi Order. Nothing in the films shows us anything contradicting that. The comics and novels do show us feats contradicting that, and that discrepancy is a far bigger problem for suspension of disbelief than a feat seeming cartoonish. Star Wars, like Superman, is full of campy humor: that humor has zero bearing on the power of the feats in question.





In fact, both of those Superman scenes I posted aren't meant to be campy at all - people are dying there, and great pains were taken to make the visuals as realistic to an actual earthquake as possible. Yes, I know you pointed that out. Point being, Superman is powerful because he is meant to be powerful, not because he's meant to be funny. Same goes for Star Wars: feats are not equal to camp.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@ Idazmi that is not what vaporization means. And no, it did not the book was published in 1976, not 1978. Second because they would not be the Ot than if the Jedi were still around. The OT would not happen as the Galactic Empire would have fallen. Because alternative media like comic books allows us the explain shit the movies have zero or little time for. We have feats pointing all Jedi above multi-city block level for force. Once Again you are trolling and derailing this thread using debunked shit over and over again despite the fact and really because of it being directly told to you multiple times and multiple people. First of all-star wars did not begin as a film franchise but as a book has the book was written in 1976 not again in 1978. Yes, Superman is an all-powerful God than the plot demands and he is format a comic book movie-verse with roots in the late 1930s. Comic book movies are not meant to be taken seriously at all. Infinity War has humor in it and it is about the literal end of the world as we know it and we see people getting disintegrating in the medium itself it is also meant to be as powerful and realistic as it gets but in the end it is still a comic book movie. With batshit insane pseudoscience elements in the story itself. But you are trolling and derailing this thread again once more. Because of source you are doing that even though multiple people multiple times have debunked, you shit theories once and for all repeatedly. And that has not stoped you form doing it, again and again, multiple times in this very thread.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

> 1. The Reek doesn't demonstrate anything in that scene that would make me think it's substantially stronger than a rhinoceros.

Being able to damage Jango's armour would put it massively above anything IRL rhinos can do, ry again.

> entire point 2

I've already addressed this twice but you continue to ignore it and keep beating down that strawman, until yo actually tackle what I said then your entire point here is irrelevant.

your main point is that the comics are the more realistic and thematically accurate depiction of the Star Wars universe than the films.

It's easier to attack a strawman than it is to actually counter an argument isnt it.

> on the premise that the films need to work harder to suspend disbelief.

The films need to wrok harder because of the Medium

That idea evaporates the instant you remember that - unlike Superman - Star Wars began as a film franchise, not a comic book

Cool not relevant to our Discussion and changes nothing.

> He's talking about the technology, yes, but his statement is entirely true for both technology and the Force. The Star Wars Films and The Clone Wars were the things that George Lucas - creator of Star Wars - worked on personally.

The Clone Wars is consistent with the comic book depictions of Jedi, we have character tanking tier 8 explosions, using the force to stop ships from moving, dodging High hypersonic blasters ect

He didn't write the comics, he didn't write the video games. That means Lucas Licensing basically did their own thing... and if the disparity between current Disney Canon feats are any indication, they are still doing their own thing

.

Yeah Lucas not writing any of them means absolutely nothing as the new Canon doesnt just rely on George Lucas anymore and per the head of Lucasfilm and the storygroup, everything is canon unless otherwise stated, hell there's an entire new CANON era being created thats solely a comic and book medium.

this argument would hold more water if we were arguing the Original six films vs the old expanded Universe but no more, The comics,novels and videos are OBJECTIVELY Canon end of story, I dont care how much you whine about it, thats never changing.

 

[Idazmi]

Being able to damage Jango's armour would put it massively above anything IRL rhinos can do, ry again.

Jango Fett vs Reek - jetpack is damaged when he's run over.



Boba Fett vs Han - jetpack is damaged by Han's blind swing with a vibroaxe.

No, I don't see anything requiring the reek to be far beyond a rhinoceros.

> entire point 2


I've already addressed this twice but you continue to ignore it and keep beating down that strawman, until yo actually tackle what I said then your entire point here is irrelevant.

It's not a strawman when you literally said it.

It's easier to attack a strawman than it is to actually counter an argument isnt it.

> on the premise that the films need to work harder to suspend disbelief.

The films need to wrok harder because of the Medium

That didn't seem to bother Superman when he bench-lifted a tectonic plate. If Lucas wanted it, there no reason Luke couldn't take out a platoon of soldiers with just telekinesis. He didn't want that, which is why we're here, discussing discrepancies.

Cool not relevant to our Discussion and changes nothing.

Yes it is. If film was incapable of supporting feats like that - either technically or by suspension of disbelief - that movie would not exist. It's the definitive article as to why your argument doesn't work.

> He's talking about the technology, yes, but his statement is entirely true for both technology and the Force. The Star Wars Films and The Clone Wars were the things that George Lucas - creator of Star Wars - worked on personally.

The Clone Wars is consistent with the comic book depictions of Jedi, we have character tanking tier 8 explosions, using the force to stop ships from moving, dodging High hypersonic blasters ect

In The Clone Wars, did we ever see Anakin stop the controls of an entire squadron of fighters with the Force? Nope. We never see a Force User do anything like that. Also, it's telling that most attempted rebuttals I'm seeing are citations from comic books and assumptions based on current AP listings, while I'm the only one listing feats from the films. Most film rebuttal I've seen so far is ByAshura, when he posted a literal half-second of The Phantom Menace.

Yeah Lucas not writing any of them means absolutely nothing as the new Canon doesnt just rely on George Lucas anymore and per the head of Lucasfilm and the storygroup, everything is canon unless otherwise stated, hell there's an entire new CANON era being created thats solely a comic and book medium.

this argument would hold more water if we were arguing the Original six films vs the old expanded Universe but no more, The comics,novels and videos are OBJECTIVELY Canon end of story, I dont care how much you whine about it, thats never changing.

I never said they aren't canon. They are on a different tier than the films are - even long after the films could easily demonstrate those feats if they wanted to. That deserves a separate key.

 

[CSO_Class_Supercarrier]

@Idazmi Just stop it that is not how this wiki works that this not how this life works. No, they do not need another page because they are both canon but because of the medium comic books and others are able to store those kinds of feats. Movies have a budget cast marketing pre-production production post-production editing and more. A star wars movie with we are never getting Rian Johson rilogy because Disney lost 20 percent of thier employees. Because of the Pandemic losing billions of dollars every single month. The Mando is down from season one. Because Chapter 10 was a complete shitsow that lead to nothing. I am thinking Idazmi has a fetish for asking the question he already knows the answer to no. because that is not how is wiki works get that into your head. Or I am taking shit from my ass hole again we should block him he is very clearly trolling and derailing this thread. Because of course, it was if it was a star trek thread he might be arguing for wanking enterprise to multi-continent and moon level. Jesus level feats for that ship that should always be ignored.Will also augering for building level Jedi and street-level turbolasers.