Bleach: Yhwach, The Soul King and "Can't Fear Your Own World"

[Xulrev]

You're denying the logic and facts that I brought in to validate your argument.
a world without sun is a frozen and dark world, hueco mundo is not

You brought no facts, you brought conjecture, is the problem.

Hueco Mundo is a vast wasteland that has perpetual night and perpetual moonlight. Something defying physics in fiction is pretty commonplace, if you were unaware, especially in a fictive universe wherein a strawberry blonde 16 year old gains the power of a minor deity to kill his genetic-ancestor who just consumed God and ****** his mom up too it turns out, only to have a bondage-fetishist's wet dream who used to be the kid's arch-nemesis turn up and put God into an illusion coma so the kid could kill God.

Re-read the sentence I just wrote, and tell me your objection to this world's realism is 'b-b-but moons need a sun to reflect!' please, because that's nonsense and would need proof to support your headcanon.

As to Matt's point:

I find it odd you accuse Sigurd of stonewalling when you're the one issuing ultimatums and outright, explicitly, refusing to budge stance? That's not very open-minded.

SK created the dimensions. The dimensions contain stars, a sun for two of them, and planets. I do not know what is difficult to grasp about this?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Of course you two immediately jumped to ridiculing the other. Gonna have to ask you to stop.

Again. At least Star level, likely Multi Star System level

 

[Zer00Negativo]

do not blame me if you do not know overlapping states.

Exemple: silent hill, there are 2 silent hills being the 2 same cities but in overlapping states

 

[KazuiK]

It was not just high level 4-A, now it went to 4-C, I did not understand.

 

[MachTwo]

do not blame me if you do not know overlapping states.
Exemple: silent hill, there are 2 silent hills being the 2 same cities but in overlapping states

Cool, this is bleach, not silent hill.

 

[Xulrev]

Gonna have to ask you to not stonewall, Matthew.

@Zer00

That's not even remotely applicable here since Silent Hill explicitly has an overlapping dimension that is accessible from the same timespace coordinate. You must specifically travel through dimensions via a dimensional highway of sorts to go from one world to the next in Bleach. The analogy falls short.

 

[MachTwo]

Garganta and Dangai didn't exist smh

 

[Sekkonds.]

What about SK speed?would he scale to either mimihagi (sub-rel+) or yhwach (rel)?

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

What about SK speed?would he scale to either mimihagi (sub-rel+) or yhwach (rel)?

This doesn't matter right now...

 

[Zer00Negativo]

In this scan on the dangai confirms what I said about the worlds being overlapping spaces.


µû¡þÁÂÒüùÒüƒþ®║ÚûôÒéÆÕ╣¥ÚçìÒü½ÒééÚçìÒü¬ÒüúÒüƒµÖéÚûôÒü«µ┐ǵÁüÒüîÕÅûÒéèÕø▓ÒéôÒüáþ®║ÚûôÒüá

"It is a space surrounded by a turbulent flow of time where layers of space were overlapping"

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Ignoring the condescending outbursts from both parties......

I am leaning towards disagreeing with that being a galaxy and moreso with it being a starcluster. The only real evidence we have for that being a galaxy is using the name of a move.

And no offense, but I really hope we're not going to be that desperate.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

I literally posted the translation of the Dangai above, you're misinformed:

Dangai is a disconnected space surrounded by layers of time.

The Dangai is a disconnected space surrounded by a torrent of layers and layers of time which causes it's time to be much faster than that of outside of it.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Ignoring the condescending outbursts from both parties......
I am leaning towards disagreeing with that being a galaxy and moreso with it being a starcluster. The only real evidence we have for that being a galaxy is using the name of a move.

And no offense, but I really hope we're not going to be that desperate.

I don't think anyone is desperate, I believe people are just tired that Matthew is denying the starry night sky.

Most people seem fine with "At least 4-A, possibly 3-C" or "At least 4-A, likely much higher".

While Matthew is still on "At least 4-C, possibly 4-A".

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Can we just go with what I suggested and most people including IMade were fine with? This thread started so we'll and relatively peaceful but now it's a shithole.

 

[Xulrev]

Even if it's just a starcluster, something I myself am leaning toward agreeing to:

That makes it an objective 4-A feat per wiki standards . Creating a dimension=destroying one per standards. The linked page shows that having a starry sky and creating it is 4-A at a minimum.

We have two starry skies; Soul Society and the Real World. One set of those stars had to have been either created or teleported/telekinetically moved to their current spot of residence, meaning that beyond a doubt the Prime SK is at least 4-A, likely higher

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

You know what I say

I'll tell you, okay

A solid 4-A

Hip hip hooray

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Can we just go with what I suggested and most people including IMade were fine with? This thread started so we'll and relatively peaceful but now it's a shithole.

I literally disagreed with your suggestion 5 comments after I agreed because Sigurd posted the color scans.

I even suggested "At least 4-A, possibly 3-C" or "At least 4-A, likely much higher".

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

People disagreeing with you doesn't make the thread bad. This thread is completely okay.

And we'd appreciate if u would stop trying to conclude this thread so quickly.

 

[SupersonicWarriorZ]

Can we just go with what I suggested and most people including IMade were fine with? This thread started so we'll and relatively peaceful but now it's a shithole.

Calling it a "shithole" is just going to cause it to become more of a shithole.

 

[Xulrev]

Can we just go with what I suggested and most people including IMade were fine with? This thread started so we'll and relatively peaceful but now it's a shithole.

The thread still is going well. It started to go south when people were obstinate and refused to accept evidence, but now users who rely upon evidence have continued to take up argumentation so it's getting gradually better.

Sidenote: I sincerely do appreciate the effort at keeping the thread low-hostility, it's been fairly successful so far, so thank you for that Matthew.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

You know what I say
I'll tell you, okay

A solid 4-A

Hip hip hooray

I'm content with "4-A, likely/possibly much higher" even.

The 3-C is literally speculation on what the cluster in Gremmy's scan is.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

It's a galaxy because that's the name of an attack?

Guess we better upgrade Z Vegeta to 3-A because of "Big Bang attack."

 

[Zer00Negativo]

but I posted the official Japanese version, which as you can see does not say what you posted

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

No one disagreed with this being 4-A.

Its only 3-C thats very questionable because, as suggested, that can easily be nothng more than a star cluster which solifies 4-A more than it does suggest 3-C. Besides that, your only evidence of that being a galaxy is it being called "Galaxy Room".

And I really hope I dont have to explain why technique names are not remotely enough evidence to support such a high end tier.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

It's looks like a spiral galaxy, but you can also say it looks what is being suggested (although very specific).

It's not just a name, what do you think "possibly" is for? it's used when there can be two different interperations as far as I can tell.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Nobody is denying 4-A. I am denying the need to put an at least or possibly higher after that. It is his maximum shown, not a minimum.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

No one disagreed with this being 4-A.
Its only 3-C thats very questionable because, as suggested, that can easily be nothng more than a star cluster which solifies 4-A more than it does suggest 3-C. Besides that, your only evidence of that being a galaxy is it being called "Galaxy Room".

And I really hope I dont have to explain why technique names are not remotely enough evidence to support such a high end tier.

Kukui, everyone is still discussing because Matthew disagrees with "at least 4-A".

Everyone else is on board with "At least 4-A".

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

but I posted the official Japanese version, which as you can see does not say what you posted

It says the same thing, though.

It's talking about the Dangai, not the World of the Living, not Soul Society and not Hueco Mundo and it being surrounded by the torrents of time and layers of space which cause it have a denser time.

 

[The_mysterious_man]

You should also consider the size of the place that was created to put everything Garganta

 

[Sekkonds.]

"Likely 4-A" is bad and not the minimum as you imply that he is possibly 4-A

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

It's looks like a spiral galaxy, but you can also say it looks what is being suggested (although very specific).
It's not just a name, what do you think "possibly" is for? it's used when there can be two different interperations as far as I can tell.

I dont see anything out of this that looks like it has spiral arms. Even then, it also looks like a star-cluster. So there's more solifying 4-A than it does suggesting 3-C based on this.

The name doesnt change a thing unless we want a Low 2-C Gogeta for using a "Big Bang Kamehameha". And a countless number of other upgrades that we'd give based off move names.

 

[ShivaShakti]

This thread is making me want to commit Persona 3 and 28 stab wounds

 

[Zer00Negativo]

It says the same thing, though.

It's talking about the Dangai, not the World of the Living, not Soul Society and not Hueco Mundo and it being surrounded by the torrents of time and layers of space which cause it have a denser time.

the dangai connects the world of the living and the soul society, the same dangai that mentions that these worlds are overlapping.

Besides everything else I said, then bleach would be at maximum 5-A

 

[Zer00Negativo]

are the same stars in the sky, the same sun and even the same moon, the only thing that stays in different planes are the worlds.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Yeah nothing higher than 4-A should be added as there is nothing that reliably shows a galaxy.

 

[ShivaShakti]

Ichigo vs MCU Thanos when? >.>

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

What Did the Prime Soul King At Least Make?




The Soul King at least made a starry sky that is visible in Soul Society's sky.
We're directly shown the starry sky by Tosen in the Rukongai of Soul Society.

What About Galaxy Room?
It's not confirmed if what Gremmy revealed in his portal to space is in fact a galaxy, it could be a cluster of stars.

However, this still reveals that the Prime Soul King made a starry sky and even clusters of stars still.

So the Soul King is "At least 4-A, possibly 3-C or likely much higher".

What Proves the Soul King Made These?
The Soul King is the progenitor of all Reishi in the Bleachverse as he made Reishi by transmuting the body of a condensed Hollow into Reishi which is Reishi's introduction to the Bleachverse.

The Soul Society and Hueco Mundo are dimensions with stars, a moon and planet in the former and a planet and moon in the latter.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

I dont see anything out of this that looks like it has spiral arms. Even then, it also looks like a star-cluster. So there's more solifying 4-A than it does suggesting 3-C based on this.

The name doesnt change a thing unless we want a Low 2-C Gogeta for using a "Big Bang Kamehameha". And a countless number of other upgrades that we'd give based off move names.

Spiral is likely the wrong one I was thinking of, but it could be an irregular one which has no defining shape to it as far as I can tell.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

And yes im going to say this because I feel it needs to be said.

People should really not be pushing for higher and higher tiers every 5 seconds, no offense. Like seriously, we went from "At least 4-C, Possibly 4-A" to "At least 4-A, Possibly 3-C" very quickly and are now asking for 3-C based off one grain of a section on a manga scan that looks more like a star cluster and the name of a move.

Unless something explicitly concrete supports 3-C even being a possibility, people should be grateful that 4-A is where we have been able to reach.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

the dangai connects the world of the living and the soul society, the same dangai that mentions that these worlds are overlapping.

Besides everything else I said, then bleach would be at maximum 5-A

That's wrong, the Dangai does not mention the worlds are overlapping.

The only time any description or mention of the Danagi uses the word overlapping is when the Dangai is described as being surrounded with overlapping time which causes it to have condensed time.