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Black Clover General Discussion thread

I've read through the newest chapter and none of which is provided proves any type of Acausality, it's just a general resistance or nullification to Precognition.

However, if more context is provided in the future chapters, I can see Asta getting some level of Fate Manipulation depending on the context of what "this world that Asta has shaped" actually means.
 
Deceived3596 said:
However, if more context is provided in the future chapters, I can see Asta getting some level of Fate Manipulation depending on the context of what "this world that Asta has shaped" actually means.
Click to expand...

pretty sure it’s just his social influencing that made others evolve at an abnormally fast rate and past their potential or should I say, surpassed their limit.
 
Deceived3596 said:
I've read through the newest chapter and none of which is provided proves any type of Acausality, it's just a general resistance or nullification to Precognition.

However, if more context is provided in the future chapters, I can see Asta getting some level of Fate Manipulation depending on the context of what "this world that Asta has shaped" actually means.
Click to expand...
Yeah big sad on the acausality but at least theres resistance to precog.
 
Quick question, we currently scale characters' AP and speed based on magical power increases that are accepted being gradual 1+1 , however shouldn't magic hax climb too? For example, megicula's curses were being contained by Charlotte's magic while megicula was at 2/3 of her power, However, when reaching 3/3 of its power, the strength of the curses increased, making Charlotte's magic no longer effective because of this.
 
WTF said:
Quick question, we currently scale characters' AP and speed based on magical power increases that are accepted being gradual 1+1 , however shouldn't magic hax climb too? For example, megicula's curses were being contained by Charlotte's magic while megicula was at 2/3 of her power, However, when reaching 3/3 of its power, the strength of the curses increased, making Charlotte's magic no longer effective because of this.
Click to expand...
This should grant some hax layers to multiple characters, and also layered resistance to multiple abilities.
 
WTF said:
Quick question, we currently scale characters' AP and speed based on magical power increases that are accepted being gradual 1+1 , however shouldn't magic hax climb too? For example, megicula's curses were being contained by Charlotte's magic while megicula was at 2/3 of her power, However, when reaching 3/3 of its power, the strength of the curses increased, making Charlotte's magic no longer effective because of this.
Click to expand...

Yeah I’ve brought this up already last year. @CloverDragon03 agreed back then.

Tho I only use it for BC vs NNT matches cuz **** NNT.
 
20221125_190136.png
 
WTF said:
One more thing, in this thread (https://vsbattles.com/threads/black-clover-cosmology-and-resistance.154200/) , Lucius' precogonion was accepted as 4D, but that wouldn't make mana 4D either, since his precogonion works when reading mana flow?

I also found this raw from chapter 11

That rough translation gave me something like "mana is a supernatural energy that inherently exists in the world and people" which would also be a rationale for mana being 4D
Click to expand...


So the thing is Julius' precog via manazone, at the minimum functions differenty from Luicus' foresight which actually shows other worlds and timelines.

All mages read (feel) the flow of mana in their mana mana zones and react to it. It was stated that mana is invisible, mages can't visually see it, they only feel it/sense it.

Mana zone allows you to have top detection since you're controlling the mana around you. Yami's Iai slash condenses the mana zone and alerts him when the mana zone barrier is crossed. Using ki, Yami can predict when that barrier is crossed. It'd almost like Vanessa's extension of their body.

Julius mana zone is nearly similar to Yami's since he can use his zone anticipate attacks by accelerating/aging the mana around him and reading(not visually)/feeling the aged mana to sense precise the disturbances that would happen, just like Yami does uses ki to anticipate future disturbances. In fact Yami compared his mana zone technique to Julius' function wise. So it's less that Julius is looking into the future, but moreso bringing the future to himself. Lucius's ability to foresee the future however appears to be different from the mana zone technique since you're actually looking into the future , rather than just aging the mana around you.

So in short, Julius uses time acceleration to fast forward the flow of mana in his manazone. He then reads (feels) that fast forwarded flow before the opponent even makes the attack. So it's like the mana skips ahead in real time or ages in real time. He's not actually looking ahead to the future in real-time but moreso bringing the future to himself in real time via manazone by sensing the changes in the flow of mana. It's like aging somebody, to see how they will look like when they're old, rather than looking into the future to see how they look without aging them. That's why Patry stated Julius uses a combination of manazone and time acceleration. Lucius however, is actually looking towards the future, and seeing it with his eyes.
 
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Xinsignia1 said:
So the thing is Julius' precog via manazone, at the minimum function differenty from Luicus' foresight which actually shows other worlds and timelines.

The thing is all mages read (feel) the flow of mana in their mana mana zones and react to it. It was stated that mana is invisible, mages can't visually see it, they only feel it/sense it.

Mana zone allows you to have top detection since you're controlling the mana around you. Yami's Iai slash condenses the mana zone and alerts him when the mana zone barrier is crossed. Using ki, Yami can predict when that barrier is crossed.

Julius mana zone is nearly similar since he can use his zone anticipate attacks by accelerating/aging the mana around him and reading(not visually)/feeling the aged mana to sense precise the disturbances that would happen, just like Yami does uses ki to anticipate future disturbances. In fact Yami compared his mana zone technique to Julius' function wise. So it's less that Julius is looking into the future, but moreso bringing the future to himself. Lucius's ability to foresee the future however appears to be different from the mana zone technique since you're actually looking into the future , rather than just aging the mana around you.

So in short, Julius uses time acceleration to fast forward the flow of mana in his manazone. He then reads (feels) that fast forwarded flow before the opponent even makes the attack. So it's like the mana skips ahead in real time or ages in real time. He's not actually looking ahead to the future in real-time but moreso bringing the future to him in real time. By sensing the changes in the glow of mana, while Lucius is actually looking towards the future, and seeing it with his eyes.
Click to expand...
In fact the 2 abilities are the same within BC both are considered a "reading of the future", however the Wiki treats both in different ways but within the verse it has the same foundation And yes, Lucius' prediction is formed through him "aging" the mana around, But he can do much more than just that as he has complete control over the flow of time, he can restrict, speed up and rewind the flow of time, his foresight of many worlds should work the same way however instead of just predicting the future by aging the mana he can just rewind the mana to see the past as well
 
WTF said:
In fact the 2 abilities are the same within BC both are considered a "reading of the future", however the Wiki treats both in different ways but within the verse it has the same foundation And yes, Lucius' prediction is formed through him "aging" the mana around, But he can do much more than just that as he has complete control over the flow of time, he can restrict, speed up and rewind the flow of time, his foresight of many worlds should work the same way however instead of just predicting the future by aging the mana he can just rewind the mana to see the past as well
Click to expand...

They're not the same ability. Lucius can most likely do what Julius does, but you're conflating his foresight his with the mana zone ability. If Lucius was aging mana to see otherworlds, that would mean he would be interacting with the others, which he is not. You would need to prove that. Are there scans of him affecting the other worlds rather than viewing them? And scans of him rewinding mana to see the past? These are very two different applications of foresight, and Lucius has never shown recognition on panel from what I know. He used time reversal on Patry's spell, but thats it. If he has shown recognition, then there should be a scan or statement, which doesn't seem to be the case from what I recall. In short, Lucius's foresight sight, is far superior, and not as limited as Julius's mana zone ability.
 
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Xinsignia1 said:
They're not the same ability. Lucius can do what Julius does, but you're conflating his foresight his with the mana zone ability. If Lucius was aging mana to see otherworlds, that would mean he would be interacting with the others, which he is not. You would need to prove that, are there scans of him affecting the other worlds rather than viewing them? And scans of him rewinding mana to see the past? These are very two different applications of foresight, and Lucius has never shown recognition, not even once. He used time reversal on Patry's spell, but it has never been implied he can peer into the past. If he has, then there should be a scan or statement, which there aren't from what I recall.
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Both are abilities to see the future and this specific ability has only one foundation, and it wouldn't be necessary for him to interact with other worlds if he saw the past when he turned mana back , he doesn't do that when he ages time to predict the future, what I'm trying to say here matches the raw I posted, the world is one big flow of mana, Lucius's ability is to read this flow of mana, so he can see the future, other worlds must be different streams of mana that Lucius has the ability to read
 
WTF said:
In fact the 2 abilities are the same within BC both are considered a "reading of the future", however the Wiki treats both in different ways but within the verse it has the same foundation And yes, Lucius' prediction is formed through him "aging" the mana around, But he can do much more than just that as he has complete control over the flow of time, he can restrict, speed up and rewind the flow of time, his foresight of many worlds should work the same way however instead of just predicting the future by aging the mana he can just rewind the mana to see the past as well
Click to expand...

No they’re different abilities, and different mages. This is a generalization fallacy. You can’t see worlds by reading pure energy flow such as mana flow. You can’t compare the abilities of mages of different souls (example, Patry can’t use William’s spells).
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
No they’re different abilities, and different mages. This is a generalization fallacy. You can’t see worlds by reading pure energy flow such as mana flow. You can’t compare the abilities of mages of different souls (example, Patry can’t use William’s spells).
Click to expand...
It would be the case if they both weren't using time magic, I know different souls have different abilities, but Lucius has access to Julius' grimoire, which means he has access to Julius' abilities



In terms of mana flow, it has these properties thanks to existing inherently in the world, and being the source of all magic which, as I've mentioned other times here, is everything in the world, and this is said numerous times during the work, of Dante, queen of the witches, Lucius, Claus, the narrator himself and even the synopsis of the work mentions that magic is everything in the world



If we stop to notice, the actual things that we consider "non-magical" within the verse are magical.



even people



The only thing that changes is the complexity, or rather the instructions/orders/information each spell carries



This information is present in mana, and it is necessary to understand and gain knowledge about mana to pass it on an array



When adding magic power to this "pomm " array the magic appears following the information written inside the array
 
Kazuma_kuwabara said:
I am watching the film right now and in the first 5 minutes I am seeing Kaiser when he was not the captain at the time so what gives
Click to expand...
yeh i was wondering that too, but honestly id rather just not see the other purple orca guy at all, that guy sucked ass

edit: at least kaisers actually compotent
 
Kazuma_kuwabara said:
I am watching the film right now and in the first 5 minutes I am seeing Kaiser when he was not the captain at the time so what gives
Click to expand...

Iirc it was stated Kaiser was retired captain, and only came back at the request of Julius after Gueldere was arrested. The fight you're witnessing happened 10 years in the past hence why we even see Theresa Rupaul, who is now a retired MK, that is now a nun.
 
Xinsignia1 said:
Iirc it was stated Kaiser was retired captain, and only came back at the request of Julius after Gueldere was arrested. The fight you're witnessing happened 10 years in the past hence why we even see Theresa Rupaul, who is now a retired MK, that is now a nun.
Click to expand...
Yeah I remember reading that but don’t remember where.
 
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