Ainz Ooal Gown vs Kishin Asura

[FDrybob]

But why would he assume he's fighting a player? Furthermore, players did not get those resistances naturally. It's entirely possible for a level 100 character to lack a resistance to time or death manipulation if they didn't build their character right or didn't have the right gear. Why would Ainz automatically assume they wouldn't work against an unknown threat? It's not like he's lacking in MP; why wouldn't he try it?

 

[Apeironaxim]

When WoG states Instant Death and Time-Stop resistances are needed to fairly fight Ainz, that should tell you he's more than willing to try those spells, especially with his huge mana reserves

 

[FDrybob]

The bottom line is that Ainz has no reason not to at least try out his hax, especially since they work instantly and don't cost much to use, and he's not closeminded enough to just assume they won't work without a good reason.

 

[Paul_Frank]

The thing is there have been so many times he DIDN'T lead with time stop you can't say that it's his first move

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

I said think someone comparable to a player or a player, it just got turned into a discussion about whatever justification could come up to say he starts with that hax. And, agai, and I am starting to feel I am talking into a wall, Madness of Fear would affect him. What is Ainz supposed to think, if he can think quick enough while affected before Kishin comes bash on him, about someone breaking through his Mental Effects immunity? The moment he realized what was going on with Shalltear, he got scared as hell and fleed with Albedo in that instant, is he not gonna think it's not a powerful player or equivalent?

I never said he wouldn't, all I am saying is Ainz bases his knowledge on Yggdrasil where the powerful people rarely don't have resistances to these things. The statements of the author don't matter in this context because he's talking of the New World which doesn't have the Yggdrasil standards, and nothing is ever even likely going to overwhelm Ainz so quick that he won't try every move he has.

This is all if Ainz can gain his bearings and think of this all while Madness of Fear makes him go chicken legged.

 

[GilgaArcuied]

Ainz doesn't lead with timestop. That's just straight lying and wanking. He only used timestop to kill someone he wanted to die without pain. once. stop spreading lies.

 

[FDrybob]

Ainz doesn't lead with timestop. That's just straight lying and wanking. He only used timestop to kill someone he wanted to die without pain. once. stop spreading lies.

The problem is that this situation, where he's facing an unknown enemy that's actually a threat, has never actually happened in the novels, so it's hard to gauge what he'd try to do. Nobody's lying; everybody is simply stating what they think he'd do in that hypothetical situation.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

@FDrybob is right, at the end of the day is saying that Ainz would do in an actual danger situation.

I am just going off things like how Ainz won PvP battles with a lot of regularity, but that was mostly after forfeiting a first match to analyze his opponents, and that his chances of defeat with an opponent he does not know are very high. If Time Stop, True Death or some other combo was so easy to pull off, this is literally impossible to be the case. So no, I doubt the most optimal response is the once he's gonna go with if he faces a very powerful opponent and is being pressured since the first second.

 

[Akreious]

Ainz doesn't lead with timestop. That's just straight lying and wanking. He only used timestop to kill someone he wanted to die without pain. once. stop spreading lies.

Riddle me this. When has Ainz ever entered a serious battle against a comparable person besides Shalltear who flat resists Timestop?

If you can't answer that then don't call it lying and wanking. WoG supports the fact that he'd use these haxes more than willingly. Ainz himself said that to fight PvP fairly, you have to have resistance to it.

Also, no. He used timestop against the raiding Worker group. In the Anime he teleported but in the Manga, he stopped time and casually walked over behind her. If he's comfortable using Timestop against complete fodder then he's more than willing against any unknown entities.

"So no, I doubt the most optimal response is the once he's gonna go with if he faces a very powerful opponent and is being pressured since the first second."

Once he notices that his emotions and such are being tampered with (Something he'd notice VERY quickly since, assuming his natural emotion checker knocks in, should be firing like crazy), he'd teleport the hell OUT of there. Something that can supposedly break through complete emotional change immunity is World-Class level FYI. Ainz is going to spare no expense in killing Kishin since his literal existence is a potential threat to all of Nazarick.

 

[Schnee_One]

Ainz Won't notice his emotions are being tampered with because his resistance isn't up to par with the Mind Hax

So he doesn't notice are being tampered with before going "I feel rather happy and I don't feel like fighting"

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Eh... Not sure where Ainz could ever teleport that gets him out of MoF effect, if he can even think properly enough to try before he gets ****** up.

Also, I very much love how my whole point seems to fly over heads like some bird. Ainz used timestop against Gazef in something closer to a Mercy Kill, a dude he knows is far beneath him. He uses them on the workers who are even further below Gazef, and the why not keep his Uber powerful overloed image by doing something cool like that? Spares him from walking either. And yes, the WoG statement leaves something clear, if you want a fair fight against Ainz, those are utterly necessary. Tell me how fair would it be to get anyone that could sneak up on him and use Downfall of Castle and Country? Not very, because that's more an ambush than an actual fight. Not to mention "fair fight" and "any chance of winning" are two very different extremes.

 

[Akreious]

"Ainz Won't notice his emotions are being tampered with because his resistance isn't up to par with the Mind Hax"

His resistance is literally "I don't have a brain" dude. Unlike Black☆Star, Ainz literally DOES NOT HAVE A BRAIN. The reason why his emotions even flare up is due to the fact that he used to be a human, which is why the green aura comes in to put him back into line going all "Dude you're not human anymore".

"So he doesn't notice are being tampered with before going "I feel rather happy and I don't feel like fighting"

I feel like you're completely ignoring the fact that Ainz lacks a brain to do this to. Also no, this would cause the emotion resistance aura effect to fire off like crazy to no avail since he's gaining emotions when he's not supposed to (assuming it can bypass the resistance) so yes. He would almost definitely notice he is being tampered with by the mass firing of green aura surrounding him.

"Eh... Not sure where Ainz could ever teleport that gets him out of MoF effect, if he can even think properly enough to try before he gets ****** up."

Again, no brain. Why the hell are you people repeatedly ignoring the fact that Ainz flat out doesn't have a brain? that's his resistance. Mindhaxing him is literally the equivalent of mindhaxing a pile of bones. That's why you require World Class Items to mind control an undead. Those things straight up say "Screw logic". It does not matter how potent Kishin's Mind Manipulation is because he'd need to show the ability to mindhax inanimate objects.

 

[Schnee_One]

Not having a brain isn't resistance, consciousness is what matters and Ainz has it

He's inanimate because he has a consciousness.

Him not having a brain, never has been qualified as a resistance.

 

[Akreious]

"Not having a brain isn't resistance, consciousness is what matters and Ainz has it"

Citation and... no.

Those are not equivalent. In Overlord, Ainz' resistance comes from the fact that as a Skeleton, they have no mind physical nor metaphysical. Even the most potent of Mind Spells wouldn't be able to do jack on a Skeleton. Again, a World Class Item is required because those things are basically just Reality Warping.

"Him not having a brain, never has been qualified as a resistance."

What? It's a basic Undead Skeletal Trait. Not only does he not have a brain, he has a ring that's flat out made to prevent behavioural changes.

Right now, you're arguing that Ainz has something that he flat out doesn't have in-verse. You can argue he has a Consciousness all you want but it's a flat out major plotpoint that Skeletons in Overlord does NOT have a mind to affect. Not physical, not metaphysical.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Aren't there dead characters that Kishin's aura has worked on?

 

[Akreious]

Not that I could see. The Black☆Star's resistance are enough to fight back Kishin's Madness and that's basically all the references that are on the profile. I assume Kishin's fought the protagonists too given that's one of the reasonings for his stats so Death the Kid and Co. resists as well.

 

[Schnee_One]

<Citation

I can't prove a negative, you were the one who said that not having a brain is resistance and that is not true. Ainz has his resistance as he resists mindhax from world class items, not by not having a brain. Which has never once been considered a resistance.

Mind is referred to by consciousness, not brain.

<He has a ring that's flat out made to prevent behavioral changes

Hold up

So he doesn't have a brain yet uses a ring to prevent his behavior from getting changed? Because that seems vehemently redundant

 

[Schnee_One]

Aren't there dead characters that Kishin's aura has worked on?

It does yes, it enslaves the souls of the undead

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Kishin's Madness literally mindhaxes the world around him warping into weird shit.

And his mind hax works on the soul, not having a brain is meaningless.

"In Overlord, Ainz' resistance comes from the fact that as a Skeleton, they have no mind physical nor metaphysical."

Ok I guess Kishin wins because Ainz literally just stands there completely braindead.

He has a metaphysical mind, don't make things up.

 

[Schnee_One]

Oh hey Monarch how's it going.

Merry Christmas

 

[The_Causality]

Pretty sure Kishin passive Stomp

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Merry Christams to you too, and Happy New Year

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Also, don't see how Heinz would beat type 8 relying on the concept of fear.

You underestimate the power of this condiment

 

[Schnee_One]

Kishin does indeed passively stomp.

King, permission to request erase?

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

On every account...