9-A World's Greatest Fighters Tournament: Brad Armstrong vs Johan Seong (Round 1)

[RandomGuy2345]

I mean, since this is his 9-A key, would he not be in UI off the bat?

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

I mean, since this is his 9-A key, would he not be in UI off the bat?

Walking dog rn

UI is a massive stat up will respond later

 

[DivineAura44]

I mean, since this is his 9-A key, would he not be in UI off the bat?

His base is 9-A.

 

[RandomGuy2345]

His base is 9-A.

Oh...

Well depending on how big the UI amp is, I may or may not allow it, though Johan kinda needs it.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Oh...

Well depending on how big the UI amp is, I may or may not allow it, though Johan kinda needs it.

Almost home sorry for typos.

It allowed Johan to stomp someone that was initially whooping his ass. Will show scans in a sec

 

[DivineAura44]

Oh...

Well depending on how big the UI amp is, I may or may not allow it, though Johan kinda needs it.

Core can correct me if I'm wrong here but UI Johan stomps base Johan in just about every category. The only drawback is that he isn't able to hold it long.
Edit: Ninja'd

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Core can correct me if I'm wrong here but UI Johan stomps base Johan in just about every category. The only drawback is that he isn't able to hold it long.

How long can he hold it for?

 

[DivineAura44]

How long can he hold it for?

I don't think there's a stated time or anything but I'll go searching.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

I'm not saying this isn't impressive but idk if it's really the type of skill that decides the match here, given that Brad is pretty skilled himself and way stronger and tougher

That's fair! Can I ask how skilled he would be? Edit - More so than just world class fighters I mean. Are they martial artists or have any special techniques or are they more item users?

To give examples on Johan, he's a copying genius that is rare in the world. Out of the people in PTJ-verse, he earned the respect of a one man army (Manager Kim) who infiltrated North Korea and fought most of their elite soldiers. His technique is praised by said person alongside his copying and forced him to be serious.

My primary reason for showing off him taking over that region is because it's actually a low level feat for many Lookism characters to take on multiple enemies at once. They aren't generally mooks either.

But more importantly, world class geniuses exist. Workers Third Affiliate had people from China's best alongside a Billionaire's top class assassin slash bodyguard and their skill level is lower than Johan (Who can take on multiple ones).

Looks like this

Definitely impressive and fast. There's still a bit of a delay to take advantage of though so I still think it's dodgeable.
https://vsbattles.com/threads/9-a-w...s-brad-armstrong-round-1.156912/#post-5949186

If Brad gets grappled he can use the fire so that's probably a really bad idea.

That's fair, he'll stick to disbalancing Brad so that he's on the ground then likely.

Does Brad take damage from his immolation? It seems like he doesn't from what I see.

He can do that with both his arms chopped off at the shoulder, so, IDK

I'd assume that headbutting would still require movement of the head, and his fire charge seems to involve running so Johan can still dodge. It's likely he'll keep moving to avoid it, and there's definitely enough of a delay for him to hit him with a sweep kick to trip him and take minimal or no fire damage. Johan will likely keep him on the ground.

I mean I feel like that's most people, nobody sees a guy pull out a molotov and just lets him light it. Still pretty handy to have.

Yeah that's fair lol

I really doubt this, it's not based on the speed of the attack. If a fire kamehameha came at me from say 10 feet away at punching speed, it'd be easily dodgeable no doubt. But I would likely be frozen in shock alone and that would have me get burnt to a crisp. And I don't think Johan's analytics is gonna allow him to predict a fire kamehameha no matter how good it is. I do think that if Johan dodges even just one of them, he has a good shot of winning because it doesn't take long for him to adapt.

I mean I agree especially irl. Though at this point PTJ verse isn't real life anymore lol. Also Johan saw UI Daniel and although he was struck with fear he didn't just go "Oh ****" but more composed himself and decide to fight him in order to at least earn something out of this fight. Basically overcame fight or flight instinct.

And yeah, it genuinely feels like with how some of Brad's moves require just the right amount of motion, Johan can react and dodge.

How long can he hold it for?

UI Mode he can hold for (cinematic) more than 10 seconds, I'm betting 13. But it's enough to triumph most cases imo. Johan can still somewhat fight after that.


The one thing that can screw over Johan is his temporary blindness, but with UI Mode I don't think he has to worry about that one bit. It's also wonky since most fights it doesn't really trigger and we haven't seen him fight like that. He could still fight well too, but chances are at best he might already hit Brad enough times. It's not fatal enough that it can prevent him from fighting a big long fight.

 

[Armorchompy]

That's fair! Can I ask how skilled he would be?

Can fight over 20 armed foes at once or win an entire pro wrestling tournament with both his arms chopped off at the shoulder, fight some of the toughest people in the world here (many of which use weaponry, while he doesn't really, also again possibly with both arms chopped off), probably some other stuff too, been years since I played the game, other may be able to give you a better summation.

Definitely impressive and fast. There's still a bit of a delay to take advantage of though so I still think it's dodgeable.

Possibly, but I don't think it's too impossible to just not realize what he's doing and get blasted with it, especially if he pulls it out in close quarters.

That's fair, he'll stick to disbalancing Brad so that he's on the ground then likely.

I'd assume that headbutting would still require movement of the head, and his fire charge seems to involve running so Johan can still dodge. It's likely he'll keep moving to avoid it, and there's definitely enough of a delay for him to hit him with a sweep kick to trip him and take minimal or no fire damage. Johan will likely keep him on the ground.

I mean, a sweep kick isn't any harder to dodge than any other attack, if he gets up close he's himself at risk.

Does Brad take damage from his immolation? It seems like he doesn't from what I see.

If he used it while someone was literally hugging him some would probably bounce back at him but Johan would take most of it still. But in normal gameplay no.

The one thing that can screw over Johan is his temporary blindness, but with UI Mode I don't think he has to worry about that one bit. It's also wonky since most fights it doesn't really trigger and we haven't seen him fight like that. He could still fight well too, but chances are at best he might already hit Brad enough times. It's not fatal enough that it can prevent him from fighting a big long fight.

I dunno if trying to beat Brad in endurance is feasible, I'd direct you to the "Heavily Injured" pic on his profile for a good example of his endurance, and in addition to that he has Joy, which both heals and amps him.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Don't think John would be able to put down Brad in 13 seconds, considering his stamina and healing

Brad's inhuman stamina-wise. He can tank slices, gunshots and powerful strikes with little impediment to his fighting ability, can fight while being heavily debuffed by severe withdrawal and can still fight with efficacy even while on fire, poisoned and under other status effects.
As for this key specifically, becoming a porcupine of spears, arrows, bullet wounds and entire swords driven into his body and enduring strikes from the Rando that stabbed through his chest and targetted his heart didn't really impede his fighting ability.
This is without taking into account his healing items.

 

[DivineAura44]

and in addition to that he has Joy, which both heals and amps him.

He's not just gonna sit back as his opponent pops a perk though. Can he use his fire for flight? If so that'd definitely create enough space.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

General message. Was gonna double post this cause I forgot this. Also I take this as a sign for me to play Lisa since it's been waiting on my Steam library for awhile .

Double posting because I had to record how much of a destructive for UI is.

Yuseong / Autistic child (Literally) < Base Johan <<< Smiling Yuseong <<< Crying Yuseong <<< UI Johan

Smiling Yuseong's attacks could not be seen by Johan, yet the moment UI mode happened he kinda just kept kicking him around till he got KOed.

I also realize he has two full counters against the flaming headbutt.

One is to either handstand him and do this

Or just reflect all that force back to him.

All of these are easily doable with how much of a stat amp UI is.

Can fight over 20 armed foes at once or win an entire pro wrestling tournament with both his arms chopped off at the shoulder, fight some of the toughest people in the world here (many of which use weaponry, while he doesn't really, also again possibly with both arms chopped off), probably some other stuff too, been years since I played the game, other may be able to give you a better summation.

Nah that's fair. That's definitely skilled. Though I feel like Johan would essentially take in some of those feats he performs since he always learns from his enemies even if Brad is more about endurance.

Possibly, but I don't think it's too impossible to just not realize what he's doing and get blasted with it, especially if he pulls it out in close quarters.

I'd say so but instincts really help in this case. Johan's also not someone who'd stand and wait for an attack to commence. He's surprisingly the more pragmatic of his cast

I mean, a sweep kick isn't any harder to dodge than any other attack, if he gets up close he's himself at risk.

That's without the massive stat boost from UI.

If he used it while someone was literally hugging him some would probably bounce back at him but Johan would take most of it still. But in normal gameplay no.

I dunno if trying to beat Brad in endurance is feasible, I'd direct you to the "Heavily Injured" pic on his profile for a good example of his endurance, and in addition to that he has Joy, which both heals and amps him.

Fair enough.

Also just saw this. That's fair. But I don't see it as unrealistic for Johan to try and break his bones. How much of a healing and amp is that? It's very vague aside from being a stat amp.

Don't think John would be able to put down Brad in 13 seconds, considering his stamina and healing

Nah John is pretty strong.

I think he can even beat Johan and Brad combined.


Jokes aside, it's a two lane stomp. I feel like he would be able to wipe out Brad considering he upscales from someone who already upscales off of him. That's disregarding him using techniques like gouging someone's eyes and breaking their limbs

 

[DivineAura44]

Don't think John would be able to put down Brad in 13 seconds, considering his stamina and healing

Characters in this verse go through literally getting their arm broken and still continue fighting so putting down a character via making them physically incapable of moving wouldn't be foreign to Johan. Combining this with the massive stat gap he'd have? I think it'd be possible.

 

[DivineAura44]

Im NGL, Brad winning a professional wrestling tournament with no arms gets crazier ever time I look at it.

 

[Chariot190]

tbf, fire is going to be doing some extreme damage regardless of stats, ya need res for that.

And unless he whips UI out immediately, he's probably still gets hit by fire, and stat stomping wouldn't be an option at that point because he'd still be suffering from burns

 

[DivineAura44]

Bro how tf does Core type up arguments that fast

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Characters in this verse go through literally getting their arm broken and still continue fighting so putting down a character via making them physically incapable of moving wouldn't be foreign to Johan. Combining this with the massive stat gap he'd have? I think it'd be possible.

Xialong might be able to do that with his broken bones but he's never gonna be able to do that on his dick. Rip

But jokes aside yeah. Going for a full KO might be doable too. The only big concern I have is how somehow Brad can end up fighting on despite having his heart punctured and having an arrow through the brain. But that's less of for this matchup and more "Does everyone in the tourney have a way to take him down? Or does he kinda just outlast everyone"

tbf, fire is going to be doing some extreme damage regardless of stats, ya need res for that.

And unless he whips UI out immediately, he's probably still gets hit by fire, and stat stomping wouldn't be an option at that point because he'd still be suffering from burns

If the point of contact is as fast as possible due to you hitting them so fast, then I think it's doable. Not to mention it seems like Brad has to actually move in order to trigger those burn effects (headbutt, tackle). Something that might be limiting

 

[DivineAura44]

And unless he whips UI out immediately

Definitely not happening. You need to be pushed for UI to come out. (Come on, I know you've watched Dragon Ball before, why am I telling you this?)
On a serious note, I'd argue Johan would seriously wear down Brad before he even gets hit with the fire. If he does, it probably still would have a stat amp at that point. Johan would be more damaged no doubt, but not to the point of it not being an insane stat gap.

 

[Armorchompy]

He's not just gonna sit back as his opponent pops a perk though. Can he use his fire for flight? If so that'd definitely create enough space.

No, but in addition to Brad generally being pretty mobile Joy is really tiny and he can just like, put his guard up while he does it. It's not really that hard to not be punched for two seconds in a fight.

Yuseong / Autistic child (Literally) < Base Johan <<< Smiling Yuseong <<< Crying Yuseong <<< UI Johan

I mean sure, but Brad's own amps are permanent, he upscales from his own value even in base I think and he starts from a higher calc. I don't know if UI Johan is stronger at all but even if he is it's not by a massive amount, 10 seconds of that isn't enough to deal lethal damage. The fact that UI isn't just his leading move could mean that 1) Johan could be injured by the time he does it, reducing his effectiveness, 2) Brad might've used Joy already, amping himself and making it so Johan can deal less damage.

Also just saw this. That's fair. But I don't see it as unrealistic for Johan to try and break his bones. How much of a healing and amp is that? It's very vague aside from being a stat amp.

Amp is very significant, basically every attack starts critting which in gameplay is several times the damage, probably doesn't directly translate to tiering but it's very noteworthy. As for healing, again a bit nondescript but very potent.

Jokes aside, it's a two lane stomp. I feel like he would be able to wipe out Brad considering he upscales from someone who already upscales off of him. That's disregarding him using techniques like gouging someone's eyes and breaking their limbs

Attempting to cripple your opponent is quite literally just something Brad deals with in every single fight, literally everyone does that and there's plenty of opponents that just have one-hit permakill moves like ripping your head off or snapping your neck.

Also he can fight with both arms straight-up chopped off, a broken limb is basically nothing to him.

But jokes aside yeah. Going for a full KO might be doable too. The only big concern I have is how somehow Brad can end up fighting on despite having his heart punctured and having an arrow through the brain. But that's less of for this matchup and more "Does everyone in the tourney have a way to take him down? Or does he kinda just outlast everyone"

After the arrow in the skull he ends up morbing out and turning into a Joy Mutant, at which point he's a lot dumber and animalistic, and then Buddy just kills him with a sword.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Bro how tf does Core type up arguments that fast

I have preinitiative from Kengan. I already typed this the moment you're typing it lol

I wanted to add on -

I'm not saying Johan will survive being burnt alive. But I think the fact that Brad's enemies aren't instantly dying from the fire means you can somewhat tank it. Not to mention as Divine said, a lot of PTJ characters can fight with broken limbs.

Also yeah I don't think having a few burns is gonna stop UI Johan.

Kid Johan ripped through rope binding his hands and was punching down dozens of rocks just for the sake of protecting his mother. Kid Johan's got hands.

 

[DivineAura44]

I have preinitiative from Kengan. I already typed this the moment you're typing it lol

Gaolang enjoyer? That's peak!

 

[Armorchompy]

rope burns and flamethrower burns are a bit different

 

[Chariot190]

If the point of contact is as fast as possible due to you hitting them so fast, then I think it's doable. Not to mention it seems like Brad has to actually move in order to trigger those burn effects (headbutt, tackle). Something that might be limiting

The fire in question is apparently hotter than TNT, if Johan gets tagged once, he's going to be suffering from severe burns no mater what form he's in.

 

[DivineAura44]

The fire in question is apparently hotter than TNT, if Johan gets tagged once, he's going to be suffering from severe burns no mater what form he's in.

I did not know it was that strong

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

After the arrow in the skull he ends up morbing out and turning into a Joy Mutant, at which point he's a lot dumber and animalistic, and then Buddy just kills him with a sword.

I mean, Brad fought Rando after having multiple arrows through the skull and only after beating Rando and talking a bit with Buddy did he mutate
Also, only Mutant Buddy kills Mutant Brad by ripping his head off since Buzzo stops the first fight

 

[Chariot190]

I'm not saying Johan will survive being burnt alive. But I think the fact that Brad's enemies aren't instantly dying from the fire means you can somewhat tank it. Not to mention as Divine said, a lot of PTJ characters can fight with broken limbs.

Wouldn't that just be a feat for his enemies, not a feat for someone who doesn't have any notable fire or heat resistance?

I did not know it was that strong

Idk someone in the last thread mentioned that i havent played lisa, i watched some of it tho, as Armor said, minor heat and what is effectively a flamethrower ain't quite comparable.

 

[DivineAura44]

Now I gotta ask, how tf did Zangief beat this guy??? Who TF did Midas nominate? God???

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

No, but in addition to Brad generally being pretty mobile Joy is really tiny and he can just like, put his guard up while he does it. It's not really that hard to not be punched for two seconds in a fight.

How much Joy does he usually have? I see that he suffers from withdrawal of that. If Johan sees him ingest that once or even mid ingest and see him recover, I don't see Johan letting him do it a second time. Especially with the abundance of grapple -> leads to attack sort of deal that JOhan has.

I mean sure, but Brad's own amps are permanent, he upscales from his own value even in base I think and he starts from a higher calc. I don't know if UI Johan is stronger at all but even if he is it's not by a massive amount, 10 seconds of that isn't enough to deal lethal damage.

I literally showed images of him above.

Also goes beyond 10 seconds, it's not unclear but I'm betting 13. Considering how much of a stomp it was to Yuseong (A two way stomp) it's certainly doable.

It's basically

160 megajoules < Base Johan <<< Yuseong <<< UI Yuseong

Amp is very significant, basically every attack starts critting which in gameplay is several times the damage, probably doesn't directly translate to tiering but it's very noteworthy. As for healing, again a bit nondescript but very potent.

Gotcha ty ty. I feel like with how Johan's playstyle involves avoiding hits and coutnering it might not be too much.

That seems very vague...

Attempting to cripple your opponent is quite literally just something Brad deals with in every single fight, literally everyone does that and there's plenty of opponents that just have one-hit permakill moves like ripping your head off or snapping your neck.

And yet he keeps surviving that??? Is Brad reasonable to include in this tourney???

Also he can fight with both arms straight-up chopped off, a broken limb is basically nothing to him.

Fair

After the arrow in the skull he ends up morbing out and turning into a Joy Mutant, at which point he's a lot dumber and animalistic, and then Buddy just kills him with a sword.

Not the morb ;;

And I see that's fair. But considering the stat gap then I think it's genuinely doable for Johan to pull off the win by repeatedly just hit hit hitting. Because it sounds like Brad can survive a lot but there's a limit to it. Genuinely impressive stuff.

No, but in addition to Brad generally being pretty mobile Joy is really tiny and he can just like, put his guard up while he does it. It's not really that hard to not be punched for two seconds in a fight.

How much Joy does he usually have? I see that he suffers from withdrawal of that. If Johan sees him ingest that once or even mid ingest and see him recover, I don't see Johan letting him do it a second time. Especially with the abundance of grapple -> leads to attack sort of deal that JOhan has.

I mean sure, but Brad's own amps are permanent, he upscales from his own value even in base I think and he starts from a higher calc. I don't know if UI Johan is stronger at all but even if he is it's not by a massive amount, 10 seconds of that isn't enough to deal lethal damage.

I literally showed images of him above.

Also goes beyond 10 seconds, it's not unclear but I'm betting 13. Considering how much of a stomp it was to Yuseong (A two way stomp) it's certainly doable.

It's basically

160 megajoules < Base Johan <<< Yuseong <<< UI Yuseong

Amp is very significant, basically every attack starts critting which in gameplay is several times the damage, probably doesn't directly translate to tiering but it's very noteworthy. As for healing, again a bit nondescript but very potent.

Gotcha ty ty. I feel like with how Johan's playstyle involves avoiding hits and coutnering it might not be too much.

That seems very vague...

Attempting to cripple your opponent is quite literally just something Brad deals with in every single fight, literally everyone does that and there's plenty of opponents that just have one-hit permakill moves like ripping your head off or snapping your neck.

And yet he keeps surviving that??? Is Brad reasonable to include in this tourney???

Also he can fight with both arms straight-up chopped off, a broken limb is basically nothing to him.

Fair

After the arrow in the skull he ends up morbing out and turning into a Joy Mutant, at which point he's a lot dumber and animalistic, and then Buddy just kills him with a sword.

Not the morb ;;

Hm.. I see that. But I kinda need more specifics

rope burns and flamethrower burns are a bit different

My friend, my point is that Johan would just push through the pain. He'll still take damage mind you, and it's gonna hurt like hell. But you're not PTJ character if you aren't subjecting yourself to daily abuse from teenagers that look like adults.

Though disregard most of this since Johan will be dodging and also I concede on Chariot there

The fire in question is apparently hotter than TNT, if Johan gets tagged once, he's going to be suffering from severe burns no mater what form he's in.

Goddamn then yeah. Even if Johan can take a few of it I'm not too keen on his chances for just tanking it. Especially with the durability sponge that is Brad.

I'm still voting Johan, but yeah it's not an easy fight and he's going to be pushing himself to the limit. The whole damage reflection think definitely still thinks.

 

[Armorchompy]

I mean, Brad fought Rando after having multiple arrows through the skull and only after beating Rando and talking a bit with Buddy did he mutate
Also, only Mutant Buddy kills Mutant Brad by ripping his head off since Buzzo stops the first fight

oh yeah i forgor

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Wouldn't that just be a feat for his enemies, not a feat for someone who doesn't have any notable fire or heat resistance?

Idk someone in the last thread mentioned that i havent played lisa, i watched some of it tho, as Armor said, minor heat and what is effectively a flamethrower ain't quite comparable.

I mean I don't think we do that for most gameplay mechanics in all rpgs? Otherwise get to this whole convuluted scaling of so many levels that it just seems too much of a bother to deal with.

Rip, you guys understated how dangerous the fire is.

In any case I'm gonna pull back my recent vote on Johan. Tbh the easiest way to counter Johan is having no amazing martial arts to copy and also being well hot.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Gaolang enjoyer? That's peak!

Also yus. Been a Kengan fan since they haven't translated past Rihito vs Beard. Lookism is almost reaching Kengan levels. We're gonna get some fights between em soon

 

[Chariot190]

My friend, my point is that Johan would just push through the pain.

I burned my hand once, like, 15 years ago, but still that shit is not the same as a broken bone. Large patches of 2nd-degree burns would be crippling, I'd rather have a broken arm and a few ribs than have half my body torched ngl.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

I burned my hand once, like, 15 years ago, but still that shit is not the same as a broken bone. Large patches of 2nd-degree burns would be crippling, I'd rather have a broken arm and a few ribs than have half my body torched ngl.

Yeah I'll clarify that I did not expect fire on the level past Anti Spider Spray over here.

That said yikes, sorry to hear about that. But hey you got fire resistance now so I'm proud of you.


I'll tldr everything - I feel like Brad hard counters Johan with sheer durability and also flames. Divine you should've used Manager Kim lol. Or Jincheol Park, those two would be much better.

 

[DivineAura44]

I burned my hand once, like, 15 years ago, but still that shit is not the same as a broken bone. Large patches of 2nd-degree burns would be crippling, I'd rather have a broken arm and a few ribs than have half my body torched ngl.

Anecdotal evidence

 

[Chariot190]

That said yikes, sorry to hear about that. But hey you got fire resistance now so I'm proud of you.

Lava lamps were a ******* MISTAKE especially when they decide to explode

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Lava lamps were a ******* MISTAKE especially when they decide to explode

Bro wtf did you do lob it like a grenade or were you trying to do a Brad cosplay

Must be a crappy quality one. I remember having one. They're still cool to keep but damn

 

[Chariot190]

Anecdotal evidence

Correct. My opinion >>>

Bro wtf did you do lob it like a grenade or were you trying to do a Brad cosplay

Must be a crappy quality one. I remember having one. They're still cool to keep but damn

It was an older one and iirc we were moving and some dumbass put it on a vent next to a couch? Something like that idk it ain't exactly 2001 anymore, most memorable part of that beyond the incident was the fact I think Beast Wars was on TV.

 

[DivineAura44]

I'll tldr everything - I feel like Brad hard counters Johan with sheer durability and also flames. Divine you should've used Manager Kim lol. Or Jincheol Park, those two would be much better.

I didn't wanna go to crazy. I didn't know he was gonna be facing God's favorite ******* creation in the first round. Not to mention if the gap between me and you in Lookism is this
You >>>> Me
the gap in Manager Kim would be You >>>>>...>>>>> Me

 

[Chariot190]

I didn't know he was gonna be facing God's favorite ******* creation in the first round.

Pretty sure God ******* hates Brad, in particular.