3-A to 2-C Kingdom Hearts / ReMind / Re:Coded AP CRT (SPOILERS for Re:Mind)

[Xehanort1307]

Oh i see

 

[Xehanort1307]

I was wondering, the Dive into the Heart, how big they are?

 

[Bobsican]

Well, there's really nothing beyond that... circle, so just that size as far I'm aware.

 

[Xehanort1307]

Well it is more of metaphysical stuff so it is difficult to understand, it was just a curiosty of mine, maybe i missed something

 

[Bobsican]

Hearts are surprisingly simple once you get what they are, just think of them as the "Abstract Existence" of its holder.

 

[Xehanort1307]

Yeah, i know that

They are made by the concepts of light and darkness and they differs from a soul

 

[Bobsican]

Yep.

I guess I'll go ahead and ask Sera to share her thoughts here.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Would the size of the worlds affect the speed ratings?

 

[Xehanort1307]

Would the size of the worlds affect the speed ratings?

I guess so, for now the profiles says that they traverse solar sistems in 130 seconds

If this 2B thing gets approved they should be much faster

 

[Nehz_XZX]

About how much faster would that be?

 

[Xehanort1307]

It would be a considerable jump in MFTL+ tier since they would be traversing universes in 130 seconds

Also regardless of the 2B stuff, Ventus traversed the Deep Space world which is a universe(confirmed by the Grand CouncilWoman description)

 

[Bobsican]

Oh no, they would remain as MFTL+, as the "worlds" are within a pocket reality, and because of that, travelling across multiple "worlds" at once isn't any different from just travelling across constellations (which currently is anyways), so no speed changes are happening.

 

[Xehanort1307]

But shouldn't they become more higher in the MFTL+ tier if the update is approved?

 

[Bobsican]

Well, the Deep Space calc could be recalculated for higher results, as it now could be based on the movie it originally comes from, now assuming a distance of multiple galaxies instead of some stars.

 

[Xehanort1307]

That is i what i meant

There is a huge difference between traversing some stars in 130 seconds and traversing multiple galaxies in 130 seconds

 

[Nehz_XZX]

According to Wikipedia the diameter of the observable universe is 93 billion light-years which would be the distance travelled in that instance since they would need to go beyond the edge of the observable universe and reach the target location from the edge of it's observable universe.

The current calculation is using 4.24 light-years. With the new distance that would be a speed boost of more than 20 billion times and with the current calculation giving a speed of around 1 million times the speed of light that would result in more than 20 quadrillion times the speed of light if I'm not wrong.

 

[Zorback32]

According to Wikipedia the diameter of the observable universe is 93 billion light-years which would be the distance travelled in that instance since they would need to go beyond the edge of the observable universe and reach the target location from the edge of it's observable universe.
The current calculation is using 4.24 light-years. With the new distance that would be a speed boost of more than 20 billion times and with the current calculation giving a speed of around 1 million time the speed of light that would result in more than 20 quadrillion times the speed of light if I'm not wrong.

it wouldint surprise me Terra-nort took out three guardians through speed alone and freaking goofy of all people was fast enough to block him

 

[Xehanort1307]

While Terranort is superior to most of the Guardians i think most of them took him lightly, expecially Sora

It seems to me that they underestimated him and were completely unprepared for his speed

Remind this: Terranort is on par with the Lingering Will, who is stronger than Final Xemnas(given the fact that in KH2 Final Mix is stated to be the strongest opponent ever encounter)

Tho it is probable that Terronort is too fast for a Guardian like Ventus

Axel reacted to him and blocked his attack

Also Terranort strenght makes sense since he is Terra's body and strenght+Xehanort's heart+Darkness amp

 

[Sera_EX]

3-A is flatout wrong. Xehanort is not just 3-A. He is supposed to be At least High 4-C, 3-A with Kingdom Hearts. His AP description as it stands now even clearly carries the context of "this isn't exactly scaleable". Furthermore, Xehanort used one 3-A attack during the final clash with Sora, in which he drew power directly from Kingdom Hearts and fired it at Sora, and he one-shot him with it.

 

[Antvasima]

I trust Sera's sense of judgement.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

The OP has presented a lot of different points that would scale characters to 3-A or above. You would have to address each one of these to prove 3-A wrong. I'd also like to tell you that I don't see how Xehanort's AP description carries the context about it not exactly being scalable. You would have to elaborate on that for me to understand that. Sora being one-shot by an attack from Xehanort is kinda invalidated as an argument against him scaling somewhat by him managing to repel the attack with the help from only two more people: Donald and Goofy.

 

[Sera_EX]

Xehanort was going to rewrite the conceptual nature of the universe. That's not exactly powerscaling-friendly.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

The description doesn't describe it as conceptual rewriting. There is also the fact that Sora managed to repel Xehanort's attack with Donald and Goofy's help so they would scale to some degree. This is the same attack from the final clash that initially one-shotted Sora.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I will say that Sora losing to said beam and only overpowering it at the end could actually be a textbook outlier.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

He overpowered it at the end with Donald's and Goofy's help and was visibly struggling before that. That doesn't seem to suggest an outlier to me. It only means that Donald and Goofy provided the strength that Sora needed at that moment and lacked on his own.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

So, did anyone read anything concerning the Re:Coded stuff which would upgrade them to 3-A even without KH3 ?

 

[Nehz_XZX]

I have read it and agree with the upgrade but I don't think that everyone did. Regarding KH3 and 3-A, I'd like to add that while Xehanort one-shotted Sora during the final clash Sora wasn't instantly overwhelmed. Take a look at this video at 10:43: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Nvp0vRWc0Q. Sora managed to hold his own for about 3 seconds. If he was immensely inferior he would have been overwhelmed instantly with no time delay once the beam reached Sora.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Now that I think about it, you can actually argue against Sora having been one-shotted by Xehanort. A One-Shot is defined as defeating an opponent with a single attack and the final clash happened at the end of the battle so you can't actually say that Xehanort one-shotted Sora since we, as far as I know, don't have any canon statement about how much damage Sora sustained in the battle prior to that or that he was healed back to full health at that point. Although that might be a moot point since the end of the battle remains the same even if you don't take any damage during it as the video I have linked shows.

 

[Antvasima]

I have to unsubscribe from this thread due to time constraints. You can notify me later via my message wall if you need my help after you have reached a conclusion.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Okay.

 

[Bobsican]

I will say that Sora losing to said beam and only overpowering it at the end could actually be a textbook outlier.

Are we going to ignore that it was thanks to Donald and Goofy helping? At worst they would just scale as 1/3rd of Xehanort's power, until you remember that together they were able to overpower it with the technique they did afterwards, which implies an higher rating than that.

 

[Xehanort1307]

No need to focus exclusively on KH3 tho

There is also the Re Coded stuff that puts then at 3A long before KH3

 

[Bobsican]

Good point, that also supports it not being an outlier while we are at that.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

If the Datascape is a universe, then destroying it should be Low 2-C. There is also the fact that the Realm of Darkness made an appearance in KH1 so that would actually make the Datascape contain two universe-sized realms. This would put them at 2-C.

 

[Xehanort1307]

There is also the fact that Sora's heartless was going to destroy the Datascape and affecting the RoL

 

[Zorback32]

There is also the fact that Sora's heartless was going to destroy the Datascape and affecting the RoL

And Sora's heartless was massivly stronger then the one he fought in the real world (RoL) because the bugs were super charging it

 

[Nehz_XZX]

And Sora's heartless was massivly stronger then the one he fought in the real world (RoL) because the bugs were super charging it

That doesn't make sense to me since the real world counterpart of Sora's Heartless was never an opponent.

 

[Zorback32]

And Sora's heartless was massivly stronger then the one he fought in the real world (RoL) because the bugs were super charging it

That doesn't make sense to me since the real world counterpart of Sora's Heartless was never an opponent.
its described as his shadow most of the time and only menifests in his heart/ station of awekining most of the time but its still Sora's heartless. lets assume for a moment that he never fought a version of his heartless in the ROL though. Giant Shadaw Heartless are still considered one of the strongest variations of heartless to the point they have boss amounts of hp bars. the heartless data sora fought was not only stronger then those normal giant heartless because of the bugs supercharging it, but it should also scale because it was in fact sora's heartless. Sora's heartless at worst should be as strong as his rage form/anti-form which is pretty damn high already. times that by the fact he was fighting his heartless and the fact it was supercharged by bugs, its probobly one of the strongest heartless in the series

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Isn't Sora's Heartless that one time when he got turned into a Heartless after stabbing himself willingly with the Keyblade of heart in order to release Kairi's heart?

 

[Zorback32]

Isn't Sora's Heartless that one time when he got turned into a Heartless after stabbing himself willingly with the Keyblade of heart in order to release Kairi's heart?

like sora himself there are technically 2 versions of his heartless. data sora isint really sora but he still has sora's heart. And they didnt inspect the journal until after the events of KH2, so i would assume as sora got stronger, so did his heartless. I would also assume roxas's streangth also directly affected sora's heartless streangth. Also btw Sora Data Sora beat roaxas and he was far weaker then his KH2 form and roxas would smash sora's heartless with ease