0|0|2 - Racer vs Showgirl - Hercules (Fate) vs Cole (Infamous)

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Don't worry Schnee. I have decided for you!

Good Cole at his second strongest vs Hercules, or Heracles, or Alcides. Not the RFI mode (Edit)

7-A Tier, no Tier 6, speed equalized.

Someone who does a lot of labor work around the country vs Someone who does a lot of labor work around the country

SBA

The title is probably too ambiguous for the reference

 

[Schnee_One]

How can Cole beat God Hand?

EDIT: Just realized Herc has only Class 25 lifting strength

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Honestly just thought all of Cole's attacks could go at that level a la Beast.

But now that you said that, Arc Restraints are a thing now!

 

[Schnee_One]

I don't get that first part

The second might not work depending on servant Intangibility

 

[DMUA]

I'm pretty sure we've went over plenty of times how Cole would have enough mystery to say otherwise

 

[Schnee_One]

Otherwise to what?

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Judging by this- https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/2491971#10

I was assuming all of Cole's attacks was at his peak level. And if not well he's developing powers on the fly when he's amped up with overcharged electricity so he can always just back off and do that. And thought Cole's attacks are all distinct enough to be different so he can

(Cut him up, raw power, fry the brain with lightning, thunderstorm, ice attacks, ionic drain, ionic vortex, explosions, etc)

Oh yeah. Power Null won't work either on non-conduits right?

@DMUA posted something

Nvm, it would work then lol

Out of curiosity, what defines mystery?

 

[Schnee_One]

What defines mystery is weird

While Cole has enough mystery to harm Servants I don't believe this is enough to bypass conceptual defense. If that's even how it works.

 

[DMUA]

It's just kinda as the name implies

Mystery is something cultivated through age and a lack of knowledge, magic thrives off of that sort of thing. In inFAMOUS' case, people barely understand how these city ravaging, mind bending powers work and the Ray Sphere's science is only ever explored by a very select group of people, meanwhile the populace just sees a dude firing lightning bolts at a giant lava monster

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Conceptual defense merely works based on "rank". If Cole is comparable or above Herk in AP, by all means he should be comparable to an A Rank normal attack. Tesla's lightning is also considered normal attacks since it isn't made by magic.

Problem is, Cole's only wincon is restraints because he for sure doesn't have 12 different ways to kill him.

 

[Schnee_One]

He's most definitely comparable, Herc scales above 500 megatons while Cole scales massively above 340

That said, while it's true Cole doesn't have 12 different ways to kill him, I'm also not sure that his arc restraints can restrain Herc due to servant Intangibility.

That said, Herc has basically zero win con here, as Cole laughably outranges and flight means he's out of range if anything Herc can do.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Actually....

Gigawatt blades to cut him and make him bleed

Physical amp since conduits can definitely strengthen themselves

Draining all the electricity from Herc

Ice attacks

Tornado attacks

Explosive electric balls

Frying someone's brains off, aiming for the head like Thor

Melting someone's skin off through the sheer heat of lightning

Thunder storm that ignores elec resistances (Will be overcome by Herc but still counts)


That just accounts for 3 more ways, which can be overcome by Cole's development of powers

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Wait Herc doesn't have a win con? I'd assume he'd use shockwave of attacks or something or throwing buildings like he did with Artoria Alter before going after Cole.

So this is gonna be a tie then huh. Apologies for double post

 

[Schnee_One]

The majority of that stuff relies on electricity, the base of that is enough to allow Herc to grow resistant to that.

BTW some of those won't take his lives, he has Mid Regenerationn

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

I was assuming that was enough to differentiate since Herc was being heavily damaged by the same death process he had from Gilg of "attacked repeatedly by swords" and Alter Artoria via "Beams and attacks"

But ah well

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

I do believe they should be able to. Herk doesn't have the mental faculties to go intangile to get out of the arc restraint, kinda like how berserker Lancelot lacks the sanity to use his NP to look like other people.

And that's... actually true. I was about to say Herc COULD outlast but Cole has no issue just regenerating his reserves with stuff that is around.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Makes sense, thanks for the explanation btw Sir Lancelot

Yeah. Then the main issue of conduit growths and how Cole gets powers from overcharging himself, and well he's constantly doing that now.

 

[Schnee_One]

Beams bypass by being 6C, Herc is 7A possibly.

Cole is 7A so bypassing through AP like Saber won't work

Gilgamesh is fair though

IDK, get Anon and Monarch if he's even around

 

[PTSOXMONKEY99]

The title is probably too ambiguous for the reference

I... think I know what your referencing. And I hate you for making me remember that.


Anywho, one thing that I wanted to mention about Cole's "mystery" element. Would the fact that the Conduit gene, the basis for Cole's powers, is understood by his worlds scientists well enough to replicate and graft unto non-Conduits affect this match at all or not.

 

[Schnee_One]

No I think we've established long ago that it still has enough mystery

It's also understood by very few scientists at the time, only Kessler and his group

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

Fair nuff on beams. But if that's the case where Cole has to bypass by pure raw AP power....

Doesn't that just mean Cole who's already amping himself over time very quickly would quickly outshine Herc in AP?

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Also, some of those wouldn't work, like draining electricity. Servants are just a mass of mana made to resemble a humanoid form, so there's no neural electricity to succ.

 

[Schnee_One]

Neuro Succing is also out of character and a terrible idea given Cole is a range spammer and Herc is a tall swordfighyer

He's not drawing him.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

@PTS

Your welcome xD

@Sir Lancelot @Schnee

Gotcha, fair nuff. Though now wondering if this actually mean Herc can be fairly used against others a tier higher than him even without Nine Lives...

Feel like this is either a battle that ends in a tie or should be closed. What do you guys think?

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Perhaps if its considered a stomp since Herk is likely never getting close, but not sure. I'll trust Schnee's opinion.

And the issue with Herk is finding someone with enough options or with one or two really strong attacks that can shave off more than one life.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes]

I think the same, I'll wait on him before requesting closing of this. I mean I can swap to the previous Cole with no flight if that doesn't make it a stomp or have them fight underground.


Yeah, without making it a stomp either.

 

[Schnee_One]

If Arc restraints work Coke wins with ease.

If not, incon

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

They should be able to work, yes.

 

[Schnee_One]

I heard that Servants can go Intangible to escape that.

Not sure of the validity

 

[The_Wright_Way]

....Well I arrived way to late to actually contribute much to this, didn't I?

Voting Cole sense apparently Herc doesn't hsve the mental capacity to go intangible.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

As far as I am aware, he shouldn't have the mental capacity to. Normally he shouldn't even have the mental capacity to fight very effectively, only being able to because his Eye of the Mind (False) is nearly an instinct, so feints and the like don't work on him at all.

 

[Schnee_One]

I would get some more Fate people first

 

[PTSOXMONKEY99]

I am also kinda doubting that Herc is completely unable to phase out of Arc Restraints. Is he really that gone that unintelligent?

 

[Schnee_One]

I feel like I need to address again that Herc has basically no win con aside from hitting Cole with a big sword

 

[PTSOXMONKEY99]

So stomp then?

Btw, what does Her scale to? Is his AP too much for Base Cole?

 

[Schnee_One]

500 Megatons

 

[PTSOXMONKEY99]

Vs Cole's scaling chain of being above 340+ megatons and can amp himself and potentially evolve....


I think it could work. At least then Cole's unlimited flight and regen won't give him an unfair advantage.

 

[Schnee_One]

First I need to know if Cole has a win con.

Cole does have more stamina, so outlasting maybe? Or restraints if Herc can't do it.

 

[PTSOXMONKEY99]

Ionic Freeze could also potentially incap given that its main purpose is to freeze over people and leave them out of commission. It even works in Vermaak 88 guys who're pretty well adapted to sub zero temperatures.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

For his level of adaption to the same attacks, watch the Salter vs Herc fight. After taking his second life with MB, Salter tries it again but Herc no sells it (my favorite detail of the fight tbh) and it requires her to pump even more ludicrous amounts of mana into it to kill him that I dunno if it was MB or Excalibur but without a True Name release. After this she just gives up on fighting him and just goes for the Excaliblast. I believe there is also a statement somewhere that Herc could take a hit from Bellerophon rez and then be basically immune to another charge so if he gets scratched by the lightning, he can do diff pretty much everything from Cole.