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Undertale Yellow Discussion Thread

So would Martlet and El Bailador fighting against Geno Clover warrant 9-A for them and Starlo, or would they just be “at least 9-B” like Dalv?
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
So would Martlet and El Bailador fighting against Geno Clover warrant 9-A for them and Starlo, or would they just be “at least 9-B” like Dalv?
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Not 100% sure but I think El Bailador's durability might scale but not his AP. He deals like 1HP to Clover during Geno.

Martlet does stop holding back in geno but I'm not sure if that's enough for a tier change.

Maybe Clover goes from 9-B to 9-A when they get the wild revolver?
 
Blunt_Claw said:
Not 100% sure but I think El Bailador's durability might scale but not his AP. He deals like 1HP to Clover during Geno.
Click to expand...
True actually, especially since the whole tragedy of the fight is how Clover doesn’t play along with him.

Blunt_Claw said:
Maybe Clover goes from 9-B to 9-A when they get the wild revolver?
Click to expand...
Tbh I actually like this idea. Clover’s DT amps already don’t work the same way as Frisk’s based on their Shooter mode, and even if they did work the same way it wouldn’t make much sense for Clover to get any passive amps on the same level.
 
So do all of us agree on how the tiers are going to be?

Clover: LV1+ At least 9-B,9-A with Wild Revolver | Shooter Form At least 9-A | LV19+ At least 9-A possibly higher
Martlet: Base 9-B | Zenith At least 9-A possibly higher
Ceroba: Base 9-A | Masked At least 9-A
AXIS: 9-A higher with trash can
North Star: 9-A
All normal encounter monsters: 9-B
Pre-Wild East Bosses: At least 9-B
All Steamworks robots: 9-A

Are there any problems with these ratings?
 
Blunt_Claw said:
LV19+ At least 9-A possibly higher
Click to expand...
Blunt_Claw said:
Zenith At least 9-A possibly higher
Click to expand...
I feel like “likely higher” would be more accurate for LV19+ Clover and Zenith Martlet, based how Clover’s Soul was so tough that Asgore’s trident instantly broke from contact whereas Martlet can tank dozens of charged shots from them. Functionally they basically do the same thing though so I’m mostly arguing semantics here.

Blunt_Claw said:
Ceroba: Base 9-A
Click to expand...
I don’t think we all decided whether or not base Ceroba was scaling to Asgore yet. While Ceroba’s AP and Durability would scale to the same value regardless, her Speed rating would be different. Also Ceroba’s speed would carry over to Axis and the Steamworks bots as well, so yeah I think the distinction is fairly important.

Aside from that the ratings look good to me.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Why would he be that though? Stat scaling?
Click to expand...
Clover with the Wild Revolver and Nice Hat would be 9-A since they shouldn’t have the same kind of passive DT boosts that Frisk does, so everyone who fights them after they get those items would scale to Axis.

StrymULTRA said:
Also the monsters in Yellow definitely don't suffer from murder intent unlike the canon ones, that's to be noted
Click to expand...
Are we sure? Starlo gets one-shot and Axis can significantly damage a Clover who beat an all-out Ceroba. I think the boost just isn’t as significant at first since Clover isn’t killing for the sake of it, and maybe also because of a lack of DT.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
I don’t think we all decided whether or not base Ceroba was scaling to Asgore yet. While Ceroba’s AP and Durability would scale to the same value regardless, her Speed rating would be different. Also Ceroba’s speed would carry over to Axis and the Steamworks bots as well, so yeah I think the distinction is fairly important.
Click to expand...
Yeah Base Ceroba should get an at least on her rating if I'm gonna put steamwork fodders at 9-A. Uncertain about Asgore scaling.
 
Clover also goes from only attacking enemies to threatening anyone that crosses their path, so Martlet and Dalv surviving their attacks earlier on makes sense.
 
Blunt_Claw said:
Yeah Base Ceroba should get an at least on her rating if I'm gonna put steamwork fodders at 9-A. Uncertain about Asgore scaling.
Click to expand...
True actually, even if Ceroba doesn’t scale fully to Asgore she’s still clearly way above the Steamworks bots. Plus she fights evenly with a super violent human and is much stronger than a pacifistic one.
 
Btw if Axis was created as a Human Eradication Robot and Mettaton EX doesn’t have access to any of his intentionally anti-human weaponry, doesn’t that imply that Axis is at least as powerful as Mettaton EX? All Mettaton’s anti-human weaponry is exclusive to NEO, meaning Mettaton EX is intentionally less powerful than he could be. Not to mention Chujin was confident that something like an army of Axis’ was what Asgore needed, implying that he’s at least on the level of the strongest non-Boss Monsters. Of course this doesn’t change any AP, but it does give Axis and Ceroba (and Starlo now that I think about it) another reason to be Hypersonic beyond just Asgore scaling.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Are we sure? Starlo gets one-shot and Axis can significantly damage a Clover who beat an all-out Ceroba. I think the boost just isn’t as significant at first since Clover isn’t killing for the sake of it, and maybe also because of a lack of DT.
Click to expand...
Dalv and Martlet take normal damage, Ceroba same.

Starlog seems to be an inconsistency if anything.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Dalv and Martlet take normal damage, Ceroba same.

Starlog seems to be an inconsistency if anything.
Click to expand...
Ghengiroo115 said:
Clover also goes from only attacking enemies to threatening anyone that crosses their path, so Martlet and Dalv surviving their attacks earlier on makes sense.
Click to expand...
Ceroba is also portrayed as way stronger than Pacifist Clover and iirc is completely immune to their attacks. Normally a character in Undertale is only immune to another character’s attacks when they have a massively higher Defence stat compared to the other character’s Attack stat, as only having a somewhat higher Defence would cause the character to just deal 1 damage instead. LV on its own isn’t that significant of a boost, so Geno Clover being able to significantly hurt Ceroba can only really be explained through high kill intent.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Ceroba is also portrayed as way stronger than Pacifist Clover and iirc is completely immune to their attacks.
Click to expand...
I didn't try to attack her in pacifist so I don't know.
Ghengiroo115 said:
Normally a character in Undertale is only immune to another character’s attacks when they have a massively higher Defence stat compared to the other character’s Attack stat, as only having a somewhat higher Defence would cause the character to just deal 1 damage instead. LV on its own isn’t that significant of a boost, so Geno Clover being able to significantly hurt Ceroba can only really be explained through high kill intent.
Click to expand...
You'd explain ONLY Ceroba. Martlet is just a novice Royal Guard and Dalv is the most depressed thing in the game, explain those.
 
StrymULTRA said:
I was talking about murder intent tbh. They take the exact same damage from Clover, no way Undyne gets still one shotted but Martlet doesn't even notice that Clover is an enemy until being hit over 5 times.
Click to expand...
I guess Clover's killing intent in the beginning of the Genocide Route was more in-line of a Violent Neutral Route Frisk or something
 
StrymULTRA said:
Martlet is just a novice Royal Guard and Dalv is the most depressed thing in the game, explain those.
Click to expand...
Already explained Dalv:
Ghengiroo115 said:
Clover also goes from only attacking enemies to threatening anyone that crosses their path
Click to expand...

I forgot that Clover does try to attack Martlet, but that’s only because she’s a Royal Guard member. Clover has no issue with Mo or the miners while exploring the Dunes, so they’re still only going after what they can verify as an enemy of humanity. By the Steamworks they’re extremely trigger happy towards everything they see and even threaten someone completely harmless like Mo, showing a noticeable change in attitude between the Mines and the Steamworks. Since this change happens before their first battle in the Steamworks, it would’ve had to have happened during their Dunes grinding.
 
StrymULTRA said:
That's not an explanation tbh.
Click to expand...
Is it not? Clover is objectively less bloodthirsty prior to them getting the Wild Revolver. In the Mines they spend a good minute in an elevator with a guy who’s not a threat to them, whereas they kill Starlo even if he’s allowed to shoot first and they also threaten to kill Mo.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Is it not? Clover is objectively less bloodthirsty prior to them getting the Wild Revolver. In the Mines they spend a good minute in an elevator with a guy who’s not a threat to them, whereas they kill Starlo even if he’s allowed to shoot first and they also threaten to kill Mo.
Click to expand...
I mean, they're still real damn angry, no way Dalv wouldn't have got extra damage.
 
StrymULTRA said:
I mean, they're still real damn angry, no way Dalv wouldn't have got extra damage.
Click to expand...
Is this "real damn angry" in the room with us right now?

On a serious note the only instances of Clover getting really damn angry are when they fought AXIS (who admitted to killing a human),Asgore (who killed a handfull of humans) and Flowey (who was gonna betray Clover) and also Moe I guess. Any other moment in the game Clover isn't explicitly angry.

In general Clover seem like a person that needs to justify their killing intent even to the point of searching Martlet's memories to find anything to justify killing her. All of this would explain why they aren't one-shotting every boss so willy nilly like Frisk.
 
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Updated tier ratings (Once the 8-C calc gets evaluated and accepted that is):

Clover: LV1+ At least 9-B,9-A with Wild Revolver | Shooter Form At least 9-A | LV19+ 8-C
Martlet: Base Form At least 9-B | Zenith 8-C
Ceroba: Base Form At least 9-A | Masked At least 9-A
AXIS: 9-A higher with trash can
North Star: 9-A
All normal encounter monsters: 9-B
Pre-Wild East Bosses: At least 9-B
Steamworks encounter robots: At most 9-A
Steamworks mini bosses (aka. just the Guardner): 9-A

Any objections?
 
Last edited:
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