YouTube Profiles Quality Control Discussion (Staff Only)

[CrimsonStarFallen]

You sure about that?

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

I honestly don't care.

The page shouldn't exist for the same reason we wouldn't allow a PewDiePie profile from one of his many, many liscenced and unliscended games.

Your personal opinion does not matter here, no offense

Except that we do?

 

[Robot972]

Wilford Warfstache: AKA - "How do we make Markiplier vs. other popular youtubers while skirting around rules and regulations on the site". Delete it.

The Detective (Who Killed Markiplier?): See above. I mean, if we aren't allowing Markiplier the rest of the gang (who happen to be played by Markiplier) shouldn't be allowed because 'wuh-oh they have a different name and costume'.

Darkiplier: See other Markiplier rule-skirting shenanigans.

Sorry again for not being staff, but these are hardly fair judgments. Just because they're PLAYED by Markiplier means none of the characters from Who Killed Markiplier?, a big-production series (with over an hour and a half of content) that very much follows the set rules of the wiki, aren't allowed?

The wiki doesn't remove people based off who plays them. Just because Mark didn't hire a half-dozen people to play the different characters doesn't mean they're any less valid then anyone

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I refer you to the note on their pages

Ah, my mistake.

It wasn't "trying to allow fanfiction on the site by carefully editing out references to the work the fanfiction is based on," it was "trying to allow fanfiction on the site by claiming the references to the work the fanfiction is based on is a result of gag characters being cosmic overlords".

The wiki doesn't remove people based off who plays them. Just because Mark didn't hire a half-dozen people to play the different characters doesn't mean they're any less valid then anyone

If the profiles perpetuate the same exact issues that having a "Markiplier" profile would, why in the world do we maintain them, even if they aren't 'technically breaking the rules'.
And I'm not saying "ban characters based on who plays them", but a character played by Markiplier on a Markiplier show about Markiplier is different than, say, Chris Evans playing Captain America and Human Torch.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Ah, my mistake.

It wasn't "trying to allow fanfiction on the site by carefully editing out references to the work the fanfiction is based on," it was "trying to allow fanfiction on the site by claiming the references to the work the fanfiction is based on is a result of gag characters being cosmic overlords".

Nice straw man my dude. Unfortunately, that is not what the notes imply.

 

[Buttersamuri]

I'll say right now

Oishi Kawaii and Noodles is just a literal cartoon/Cartoon also animated IRL. There is 0 reason it should be deleted. It's just a cartoon/IRL you can watch on YouTube. It doesn't even really relate to Amish aside from a meet up in one video. Though that video can be excluded. Since most smosh videos are being denied

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Imo, i agree with most of what Dargoo said, except for AVGN and Nostalgia Critic stuff. Characters from other series appearing/being central in their videos shouldn't be a reason for deletion, especially when we don't scale them.

I mean, Ungalo's power is to summon other fictional characters.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Note: Despite the large number of fictional characters in the Awesomeverse that originate from separate works, these are almost always the result of applications of Toon Force, Reality Warping, Subjective Reality, Immersion, or Plot Manipulation that are in turn a result of character powers or cosmic events. Therefore, characters that appear should not be scaled to the original versions and are not indicative of being a Fan Work.


Cosmic events are a big part of that and have nothing to do with any particular character except the plot hole.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Oishi High School Battle is perfectly fine. No qualms there.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Imo, i agree with most of what Dargoo said, except for AVGN and Nostalgia Critic stuff. Characters from other series appearing/being central in their videos shouldn't be a reason for deletion, especially when we don't scale them.

I mean, Ungalo's power is to summon other fictional characters.

And we have that one game verse with Goku as the final boss, so...

 

[Robot972]

If the profiles perpetuate the same exact issues that having a "Markiplier" profile would, why in the world do we maintain them, even if they aren't 'technically breaking the rules'.

May I ask what these "same exact issues" are?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Nice straw man my dude. Unfortunately, that is not what the notes imply.

I'm trying to dose the site with a cold bucket of realizing the issues these profiles perpetuate. How you justify having a video game/movie reviewer as some kind of cosmic gag character on the site isn't really part of my argument except an example of how far we've gone down this rabbit hole.

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Also, you people need to chill. There's no need to be this agressive in a topic as stupid as this one.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I'm trying to dose the site with a cold bucket of realizing the issues these profiles perpetuate. How you justify having a video game/movie reviewer as some kind of cosmic gag character on the site isn't really part of my argument.

The strawman here is that I am even attempting to do that, so your point is moot.

 

[Ogbunabali]

HABIT comes from an ARG called EverymanHYBRID. It's a huge project spanning across platforms and it isn't even exclusively on Youtube (although it is the main medium they use) it's been going on for I think 8-9 years or so. It has it's own plot, narrative and story. It's no different than a Netflix show, or a book, or something they just happen to start it on Youtube because it was easily accessible and free (and the site had already picked up a notoriety for being the place for modern ARGs at the time in the community).

There is no reason for it to be deleted.

 

[GojiBoyForever]

Also last time I checked Filthy Frank was in IMDb.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Yeah, AVGN and Nostalgia Critic both have some rather serious narratives at times. And already mentioned extended merchandise for AVGN about a movie and 2 video games. And that neither verse actually originated from YouTube but rather their own websites no different than RWBY or RvB originating for RoosterTeeth. Also, crossover/cameo characters is also not at all another reason to delete it as South Park exists as well.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

The entire series revolves around "cameo" characters. They're review channels. Heck, one of the profiles on here mentions surviving blows from Bugs Bunny.

I can think of only one video on the NC channel (that's not that other series he worked on) that isn't related to an already existing product.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

The entire series revolves around "cameo" characters. They're review channels. Heck, one of the profiles on here mentions surviving blows from Bugs Bunny.

I can think of only one video on the NC channel (that's not that other series he worked on) that isn't related to an already existing product.

Yu-Gi-Oh! does it, Epic Battle Fantasy does it, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure does it, South Park does it, Marvel Comics does it

It's not part of every video for sure, and your only looking at it from his section of the verse anyway. Everywhere else, from Linkara's to Nostalgia Chick's don't do that.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

May I ask what these "same exact issues" are?

"Youtube persona fighting youtube persona" and the like.

There shouldn't be any justifiable scenario where we have a PewDiePie vs. Markiplier fight, for example.

It also makes the site come off as a joke when we have an alt-site for that, so there's that too.

Yeah, AVGN and Nostalgia Critic both have some rather serious narratives at times. And already mentioned extended merchandise for AVGN about a movie and 2 video games. And that neither verse actually originated from YouTube but rather their own websites no different than RWBY or RvB originating for RoosterTeeth. Also, crossover/cameo characters is also not at all another reason to delete it as South Park exists as well.

And a broken clock is right two times a day. Simply because the verse occasionally burps out a coherent plot doesn't validate any of the issues the verse presents in the first place.

For one, RWBY and RvB didn't start out as a movie/game reviewing series, so that comparison is naught.

South Park is a comedy show that occasionally has crossovers and cameos. AVGN and Nostalgia Critic are essentially entirely crossovers and cameos that is sometimes a comedy show. There's a difference.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

False analogy. Occasional references to another series and your series having nothing to do with it is faaaaar from the same as your entire thing is being a reviewer.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

@Dargoo

Again, looking at it in the void of those two sections of the verse is a bad idea. Besides, it's not nearly as prevalent as you claim, and this would result in major double standards.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

False analogy. Occasional references to another series and your series having nothing to do with it is faaaaar from the same as your entire thing is being a reviewer.

A reviewer of what is explicitly fiction that can be brought to life by various means, compared to a verse that does the same or even has those beings as a direct part of their verse without being fiction is only a false analogy if we assume the latter is worse because of the second part, otherwise it's not.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

They also have original characters who frequently fight against each other. No one is saying they scale from any of the verses referenced, but they do scale from feats and lore demonstrated within their own verses. NC has characters like Devil Boner, Evilina, and Santa Christ; as well as its own version of Satan. AVGN also has Gaming Glitch Gremlin as an original character, and Fred Fuchs, and Death Mwauthzyx. And there is definitely plot in a lot of their works; especially in AVGN Movie and AVGN Adventures 1+2.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

A reviewer of what is explicitly fiction that can be brought to life by various means, compared to a verse that does the same or even has those beings as a direct part of their verse without being fiction is only a false analogy if we assume the latter is worse because of the second part, otherwise it's not.

Ask yourself: "is the reviewer still using Fair Use and incorporating elements of established verses over and over again as the premise of their series", and then ask yourself, again "why is this not on FC/OC".

A fanfiction can also be brought to life through various means, and the characters in it can take on a life of their own. Sadly, the fact that it is fanfiction doesn't change in this transition.

Again, looking at it in the void of those two sections of the verse is a bad idea. Besides, it's not nearly as prevalent as you claim, and this would result in major double standards.

You're speaking as if they're small parts of a large verse when the inverse is true: the plots you describe are offshots/small parts of those two sections.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

You seem to be starting with the conclusion of "this is all fanfiction and we need to get rid of it immediately" and then try to shame everyone else into agreeing with you rather than actually presenting viable reasons for what you believe.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

@Dargoo Than we have to figure out our definition of Fanficition, because otherwise the powers of Immersion and Subjective Reality are unimportant

Not really? Linkara has way more material, the only difference being those two are more popular. Popularity is a small variable.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

We shouldn't consider bringing characters that aren't real being brought to life being indicative of a Fanfiction.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

fiction written by a fan of, and featuring characters from, a particular TV series, movie, etc.

Going by the basic definition, even something like JoJo is a fanfic, so we obviously cannot use that, so I ask again, what is the definition of a fanfic here?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Nostalgia Critic shot Mary Poppins and fought alongside Katara and Sokka with no reasoning. Also that spiders dude form Lost in Space. And all those traumatized 80s movie protags like the guy from Black Cauldron. No subjective reality, no immersion. Even AVGN had his future counterpart ripped apart by the Bernstein Bears.

 

[DMB_1]

Tbf, we allow Light Novels like Jorge Joeaster, Shameless Purple Haze (and the novel Over Heaven would be allowed, if it introduced new characters), which are all basically glorified fanfictions.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

In fact, the main cornerstone of Awesomeverse lore, the three movies, all do not feature AVGN, are built around people besides NG, and explicitly establish all those verses as fiction and all inconsistencies as being cause by the cosmic plot hole.

 

[Paul_Frank]

Tbf, we allow Light Novels like Jorge Joeaster, Shameless Purple Haze (and the novel Over Heaven would be allowed, if it introduced new characters), which are all basically glorified fanfictions.

The Jojo novels were all supervised by Araki and in Jorge Joestar's case he even drew the art for it

 

[GojiBoyForever]

We going back to that other thread when we were repeatedly told what the purpose of this thread was.

 

[Robot972]

We shouldn't consider bringing characters that aren't real being brought to life being indicative of a Fanfiction.

Especially given just how many older characters can interact with and enter the real world...

Because that's one hell of a double standard then.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Nostalgia Critic shot Mary Poppins and fought alongside Katara and Sokka with no reasoning. Also that spiders dude form Lost in Space. And all those traumatized 80s movie protags like the guy from Black Cauldron. No subjective reality, no immersion. Even AVGN had his future counterpart ripped apart by the Bernstein Bears.

Again, those were caused by cosmic events that regularly happen in the Awesomeverse. It's common, for unknown reasons in universe, for characters that are explicitly fiction to come to life when a reviewer is reviewing their material. This is just the way reality works in that verse, and the mere act of reviewing it proves that it is indeed fiction.

 

[DMB_1]

The Jojo novels were all supervised by Araki and in Jorge Joestar's case he even drew the art for it

Yes, but not official material.

On the contrary, AVGN is a copyrighted character.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

IMO, copyright is a difficult thing to base this on in the first place, considering public domain verses, how often established verses ignore it, among many other things.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Honestly, all these people are complaining about blurred lines but forget that there aren't really any clear ones when dealing with fiction, a concept with millions of entries that fall under it and has existed for the majority of the existence of the human race.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

@Dargoo
Than we have to figure out our definition of Fanficition, because otherwise the powers of Immersion and Subjective Reality are unimportant

Not really? Linkara has way more material, the only difference being those two are more popular. Popularity is a small variable.

How they incorporate elements of other verses doesn't change the fact that they incorporate elements of other verses, frequently.

You seem to be starting with the conclusion of "this is all fanfiction and we need to get rid of it immediately" and then try to shame everyone else into agreeing with you rather than actually presenting viable reasons for what you believe.

Is it not fanfiction?

Namely because, historically, entertaining this argument only leads to people abusing loopholes in order to make the same exact situation that this thread presents happen again.

This shouldn't be an issue of "what's technically acceptable on the site", because that issue just makes people find reasons to make the popular profiles "technically acceptable".

I'm trying to prevent this. We don't want threads like that on the site, otherwise we would have just opened the floodgates to this, so obviously off-brand youtube personas shouldn't fit the bill either.

Speaking of, let's throw this on the OP and (hopefully) delete it.