Undertale & Durability Negation: Fact, or Fiction?

[Adem_Warlock69]

Stats are still unreliable. They aren't really consistent

We still use them

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Mad dummy has not negative 40 DEF, his DEF is "yes"

Go to the first vidéo of the Mad dummy fight

 

[Buttersamuri]

We still use them

Still use them vs Should use them

We used a lot of things in undertale we shouldn't have. Stats while can be relative to more clear things. Asgore > Everyone others stats.

 

[Lord_JJJ]

Go to the first vidéo of the Mad dummy fight

that is not what undertale wiki says : https://undertale.fandom.com/wiki/Mad_Dummy?mobile-app=false

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

There's explaining why the're right, I'll look for it.

 

[Agnaa]

8 or so hits from the Dummy can kill Frisk,which is the baseline Soul, but Mad Dummy took 80s of soul hits and wasn't killed,so Monsters have Soul Resistance

Mad Dummy has 4 attack but Negative 40 Def, he would have died if he didn't have soul resistance and had a normal soul like Frisk.

Blue Mode is not gravity manipulation and Green mode isn't paralysis inducement. It is soul manipulation which acts like gravity manipulation and Paralysis inducement.

But Def is meant to scale to soul resistance, are you saying that Mad Dummy has worse def than Frisk but higher soul resistance?

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Even if all those magic moves did 1 damage point,he would already need a soul above the norm (20 Hp points) to survive all those hits

 

[Moritzva]

Okay, Adem, your argument is strictly game mechanics at this point.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Okay, Adem, your argument is strictly game mechanics at this point.

How? Chara and That Bunny reference HP, so it is a thing in the verse and not just Gameplay mechanics

 

[Agnaa]

Even if all those magic moves did 1 damage point,he would already need a soul above the norm (20 Hp points) to survive all those hits

So he has defense above the norm because he has defense below the norm. And this is meant to prove durability negation?

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

The Def stat is physical,not spiritual, that's why we use it for Durability, or why Characters that have Def 1 or lower die in a single hit.

He has garbage physical defense, but he can survive lots of soul attacking moves, so Soul Resistance.

And this is for Soul manipulation Resistance not Durability negation.

 

[Lord_JJJ]

Aren't monsters has Soul manipulation Resistance because their bodies are made of magic that makes their bodies and their souls inseparable and for this the souls of monsters are destroyed with their bodies

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Well it isn't written in their justification

 

[DarkLordofShadows]

Came here just to drop this.

 

[Moritzva]

That's a small picture.

Not sure how it's relevant at all here.

 

[Buttersamuri]

Here it is bigger

 

[DarkLordofShadows]

That's a small picture.
Not sure how it's relevant at all here.

Try opening it.

 

[Agnaa]

Try opening it.

I have, still not seeing how it's relevant.

 

[Buttersamuri]

"See that heart. That is your SOUL, The very culmination of your being."

I assume cause flowey acknowledges it as your soul and being. Separate to their body. I would maybe think? Not sure.

 

[Moritzva]

It absolutely does not even remotely imply a degree of separation. If anything, "culmination of your being" more directly implies the soul being connected to your body, or 'being'.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

What is the photo supposed to prove?

 

[The_Calaca]

And seeing it's capitulated like LOVE it might not mean what it's supposed to mean.

 

[Buttersamuri]

That's just what i think they meant with that picture. Not certain.

Regardless, I currently think it's they do pull out your "SOUL" but can not harm it as well as they an harm your body. It would explain a few things.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Also, if they ever get NPI then it should be limited as they can't harm other non-corporeal's like ghosts.

 

[Buttersamuri]

Isn't their Non physical attacks kinda weird? Like I think they only get it cause attacks go through the soul

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Also, if they ever get NPI then it should be limited as they can't harm other non-corporeal's like ghosts.

Frisk can't hurt Ghost, monsters can

 

[Buttersamuri]

Frisk can't hurt Ghost, monsters can

What proves that? Did they ever actually injure a ghost?

 

[Lord_JJJ]

Mad Dummy said that magic affects ghosts and all monsters use magic

 

[The_Calaca]

Which would be NPI, not Soulhax.

 

[Buttersamuri]

Ahh. Ok. Well yea. NPI, not soul hacks really then

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

That is NPI, soulhax is Undyne and Papyrus limiting your soul.

 

[Lord_JJJ]

Undyne, Sans, Papyrus, Alphys, Mad Mew Mew and maybe Muffet must have soul manipulation via SOUL Modes

And maybe Mettaton because he controls his soul to use it in some attacks

 

[Buttersamuri]

That is NPI, soulhax is Undyne and Papyrus limiting your soul.

It's paralyzing then and manipulation of gravity. Not really soul hacks.

 

[The_Calaca]

And seeing it's capitulated like LOVE it might not mean what it's supposed to mean.

Press X for Doubt.

 

[Buttersamuri]

X

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Making a soul immobile and Making it incapable of flying is altering it, so Soul Hax.

 

[Agnaa]

Can all of you talking about things that aren't Durability Negation take it to another thread?

 

[Moritzva]

Agreed.

Can the changes be applied?

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Do we have a good amount of staff agreeing?

 

[Moritzva]

Seems to be so, plus an overwhelming amount of blues.