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Ultimate Kars VS Fall Maiden Cinder (JOJO VS RWBY FINALE!)

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Yes, it's Low 7-C vs High 7-C.

I don't think it's necessarily a stomp though:

- Kars resists most of the convential elemental manipulation that Cinder can throw at him, including electricity (thanks to the properties of an electric eel), ice manipulation (thanks to his hamon being comparable to the surface of the sun), and the other lesser things

- Kars's hamon can bypass her aura. Unless she can withstand the surface of the sun, she's going to be severely burnt by Kars upon contact, leaving her molten flesh.

- If he breaks through her aura, then he can instantly absorb her with his biological absorption.
 
Stop arguing for the character you want to win in threads you make. Fourth time im telling you this.
 
Its not fine, it makes you look very biased and Monarch didnt say it was fine, he said its frowned upon
 
Mkay then

-Cinder's fire attacks are hotter than the lava that nearly killed Kars when he fell into the volcano on top of being at least 72x stronger than Kars' durability

-Kars used Hamon all of one time, specifically because he wanted to kill Joseph using Hamon, and never used it ever again

-Cinder has a bubble forcefield on top of her aura protecting her, and smaller personal forcefields on top of that

-Cinder turns Kars to ash with Dust arrow like she did to Pyrrha which is beyond his capacity to regenerate

-Kars is suicidally overconfident
 
Well then source where exactly it is implied that her fire is hotter than traditional lava. Kars was only nearly killed by the volcano until he adapted to it. After that he was fine.

Kars used hamon once, he can use it again. He's a supergenius, if his boneblade isn't working because she's too durable, he'll instantly realize that hamon is the way to go.

Her aura does not protect her from his hamon.

Kars can distort his torso and body to such a degree that even if he is unable to run away in time, he can still actively avoid it an inch before the arrow touches him.
 
She melted granite just by touching it, i believe ive actually told you this before. And no, he was not fine, he even stated that even after adapting his armor if he had stayed in the lava too long he would have died.

He can but unfortunately he's too overconfident to try it. His supergenius is heavily overshadowed by overconfidence, he could have very, very easily killed Joseph in hundreds if not thousands of ways when he got his Ultimate Lifeform powers but due to his overconfidence he ended up a statue in space.

Her forcefields would though.

She can control her arrow's trajectory, even if he tries to dodge or intercept it it will still hit him.
 
Weekly him arguing is fine. People just get other people to make matches for them so they can vote anyways, and nobody gives a shit. This match is ostensibly fair, so long as he's not making spites there's no issue with him arguing for a series that he's knwoeledgable on and fond of. Should verses that are unpopular on this will just not have vs battles because their OPs are going to be most knowledgeable?
 
@Wok There's a difference between the Op explaining something about a character and the OP flt out stating why one character would beat the other in their own thread
 
Then her fire is comparable to lava, not hotter. I don't recall Kars saying that in regards to him developing his armor, only in regards to before he got the armor.

He has 400IQ. It's literally a logic puzzle, "hmm i cant hurt her with traditional attacks might as well attack her with my durability negating attack". Toying around with your enemy as they are about to die is not comparable to not using your only means of harming your enemy. How was he supposed to know that the volcano would send him to space had he not immediately killed Joseph?

What are her forcefields made out of?

It depends on how well she can manipulate it. If she can just guide it then Kars can wait last second then distort his torso well beyond its guiding properties.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
@Wok There's a difference between the Op explaining something about a character and the OP flt out stating why one character would beat the other in their own thread
Click to expand...
Again I don't mind being frowned upon. Please stop telling me this because I legit do not care, fourth time I'm telling you.
 
It is literally the same thing if he had asked me to make the thread or something so he could give a vote, a common practice that the staff also indulge on. He wants to do a series of matches between two verses. It's not a big deal.
 
The temperature of lava is 700 and 1,200 degrees ┬░C, the temperature to melt granite is 1215―1260 ┬░C, her fire is hotter than lava.

Mhmm, so i guess him letting joseph get a running start, turning his fathers that he embedded into joseph's plane into piranhas instead of something that would have instantly killed like whales or wolves or literally any large predator, falling for an obvious decoy on a parachute and then being hit by a plane, taking the time to gloat at your enemy as the two of you are being launched into space instead of flying to safety, and then trying to use water vapor in space to try to get back to earth are all part of that 400IQ.

>How was he supposed to know that the volcano would send him to space had he not immediately killed Joseph?

How is he supposed to know that his opponent can instantly oneshot him beyond his capacity to regenerate in this fight?

Her forcefields are made of magic.

She can break it apart and reform it at will and control it freely.
 
It's definitely higher end temperature then, because the lava he fell into was pure liquid, not with a half-rock surface like most volcanos. That being said, 1200 and 1260 seem comparable.

Joseph surprised him with a running start, he quickly started chasing him. He only got away further because he got into a warplane, lol. He hasn't demonstrate the ability to turn his feathers into something much larger than the feather, and as such I am inclined to believe he can only turn them into small animals and predators, since that's all he demonstrated. Joseph is also a supergenius so not really surprising that he fell for a decoy and got hit by a plane. Again, he did not know he was going to be launched in space by the volcano, only just really high. None of this adresses why he wouldn't use hamon against Cinder, seeing as how this literally proves he pulled all the stops out on an opponent far weaker than he is.

Because he knows she's much stronger than him by virtue of his intelligence. He can either deduce it physically, or he's smart enough to not get hit by weird looking arrows.

Can I see her forcefields and her arrow in action? These seem important to have visuals to work with.
 
The difference between 1200 and 1260 Celsius is 60 Celsius, thats 140 Fahrenheit, it doesnt seem like a big number but that difference means theyre by no means comparable.

Joseph did not surprise him, Kars literally watched him go. And yeah, a warplane of that make and model would not have helped him escape the Hypersonic Kars if Kars were being serious. Even still for a supposedly smart guy the thing he decided to use as an attack with his feathers was a creature that cant survive without water. Joseph is by no means a supergenius, quick witted and intelligent yes but nowhere near a supergenius. He wouldnt use hamon against Cinder because he has no real reason to want to due to his overconfidence as the ultimate lifeform. He only wanted to use Hamon once to kill joseph with his own ability and to mock him for having trained so hard to get where he was only for Kars to instantly surpass him as the ultimate lifeform. Kars didnt pull out any stops, with the massive amount of stuff he has at his disposal he used not even a fraction of a fraction of 1% of his arsenal.

Physically Cinder looks like an injured looking woman with half her face missing and an arm that looks like burnt bones and he doesnt have some supernatural ability to deduce how strong someone is with senses.

Arrows dispersing around attacks, arrows turning people to ash, bubble forcefield, personal forcefields and no, theyre not contact based, she gets them from this
 
>The difference between 1200 and 1260 Celsius is 60 Celsius, thats 140 Fahrenheit, it doesnt seem like a big number but that difference means theyre by no means comparable.

I am inclined to say that if his makeshift armor can survive 1200 celcius, it can survive 1260 celcius. The mechanics behind it have nothing to do with the armor withstanding the temperature anyway, it's the air underneath it that he ejects from his body that provides a layer of insulation. I'm pretty sure it is called the Leidenfrost effect.

>And yeah, a warplane of that make and model would not have helped him escape the Hypersonic Kars if Kars were being serious

He's definitely hypersonic on foot, I do not know about the air. It seems hard to be hypersonic speeds when you have to actively flap your wings. Either way, he hasn't demonstrated it in the air.

>Joseph is by no means a supergenius, quick witted and intelligent yes but nowhere near a supergenius.

I guess the official term is Extraordinary Genius. He is listed as one on thegenius intelligence page on the grounds that he has outsmarted every single Pillar Men, who have centuries of combat experience and insanely high IQ's.

>He wouldnt use hamon against Cinder because he has no real reason to want to due to his overconfidence as the ultimate lifeform.

That's PART of being the ultimate lifeform; the ability to replicate any ability an animal can do and do it BETTER. Hamon is an ability humans can use. He replicated it as part of him being the ultimate lifeform, not so much as to mock Joseph.

Either way seeing as how he's extremely intelligent, he will no doubt come to the conclusion that his boneblade and maybe other biological attacks will stand little chance on their own. He will realize that he is the ultimate lifeform, and as such replicate the greatest ability humans have created; hamon. From there he can bypass her durability.
 
Arrows dispersing around attacks =/= homing arrows or even guided arrows. Kars should easily be able to distort his body around that fairly easily, and should be able to do it again and again if it continues to follow him. It also looks like her forcefields need to be activated and can be deactivated based on the clips.
 
Can we get a few things straight:

- If Kars manages to touch her with his hamon, she will either succumb to the various hax that is associated with or will be burned up alive.

- Cinder hitting him with the arrow will not instantly KO him. It hit Pyrrah in the ankle and she was not immediately haxed out of existance. I think she needs to hit them in the chest with the arrow, rather than just the body in general.
 
-This is true but it will be extremely hard as using hamon is out of character and she has two forcefields he has to get past before he can make contact with her aura

-Yes it will, she didnt instakill pyrrha because she was toying with her the entire fight as she was fully aware of the gap in their power
 
ProfessorLord said:
Arrows dispersing around attacks =/= homing arrows or even guided arrows. Kars should easily be able to distort his body around that fairly easily, and should be able to do it again and again if it continues to follow him. It also looks like her forcefields need to be activated and can be deactivated based on the clips.
Click to expand...
She can control their trajectory as well

No they dont need to be activated, i literally posted the third clip of the forcefields being passive specifically because i knew you'd say that
 
ProfessorLord said:
snip
Click to expand...
No, first off thats not how we treat resistances here, he'd have to actually show that he can resist that level of heat for you to argue that he can, and secondly he was only able to resist that temperature for a short time and he admitted that if he didnt get out of the lava the armor would have failed and he would have died. Also Kars doesnt start out in his anti lava armor here.

A lot of characters can go much faster than hypersonic in flight even while flapping their wings, but even still he'd have the speed of a peregrine falcon which is more than fast enough to outspeed the type of plane Joseph was flying.

Thing is the Pillar Men are cocky and overconfident towards humans, making it much easier to outsmart them on top of not really having anything to support them being nearly that smart.

No he explicitly did it to mock Joseph, he even said so as he was about to kill him with hamon.

You act like as soon as he decides to use hamon he wins despite the fact that he will never get close enough t cinder to use it and has to get past her forcefields all while trying to not instantly get oneshot. Cinder's AP advantage is more than enough to destroy him beyond his capacity to regenerate even without the ash arrow.
 
>This is true but it will be extremely hard as using hamon is out of character and she has two forcefields he has to get past before he can make contact with her aura

You can't say it's out of character if it's a specific trait about humans. They use hamon to make themselves stronger and it bypasses conventional durability. If Kars is struggling to hurt her, there is no reason for him not to amp himself with hamon. He's used it before, he can definitely use it again. This whole "he only did it to spite JoJo!!" isn't a good argument, beacuse it argues that's the only situation he would ever use it in.

Her forcefields are not passive, they must be activated and de-activated. This is her de-activating it so she can prepare an attack. If it was passive, she would not need to do that. This is a way for Kars to exploit her.

>Yes it will, she didnt instakill pyrrha because she was toying with her the entire fight as she was fully aware of the gap in their power

How does an arrow that instant-kills on contact... not instakill Pyrrah when she gets hit? It's a special property from the arrow, not Cinder. That specific hax is associated with the bow, not her. She can't control whether or not the bow kills an opponent with it's inate properties. If this was true though, why would she instakill Kars? The gap between their power is very large as well. That was High 8-C vs High 8-C, this is Low 7-C vs High 7-C. Of course she's not going to resort to using it then.
 
>She can control their trajectory as well

I need source for this. Difusing it around an attack is not controlling trajectory, or at least not enough to matter against Kars's flexibility and mobility.

>No, first off thats not how we treat resistances here, he'd have to actually show that he can resist that level of heat for you to argue that he can, and secondly he was only able to resist that temperature for a short time and he admitted that if he didnt get out of the lava the armor would have failed and he would have died. Also Kars doesnt start out in his anti lava armor here.

That's how they treat resistances in JoJo. Everything about Kars was explained in science. His armor isn't what is protecting him, it would have melted otherwise. It's the air coming out from him and cushoning him from the heat. He never said that after a few more seconds he'd be in trouble by the way, I checked and I can't find that in the manga or anime. Bottom line is if he can resist 1200c with ease, arguing that he can't withstand 1215-1260c is just... irresponsible.

>A lot of characters can go much faster than hypersonic in flight even while flapping their wings, but even still he'd have the speed of a peregrine falcon which is more than fast enough to outspeed the type of plane Joseph was flying.

Not Kars, apparently. No character in JoJo can go hypersonic speeds while flying, except for maybe DIO. Even then I am not quite sure. He definitely can dash and sprint at those speeds, but flying is out of the question.

>Thing is the Pillar Men are cocky and overconfident towards humans, making it much easier to outsmart them on top of not really having anything to support them being nearly that smart.

He has his hamon which can one-shot Cinder. He's got the mobility and skill to avoid her attacks for a good amount of time. It's whether or not he can outsmart her and get her when she drops her forcefield.
 
Yobobojojo said:
Then isn't this a AP stomp?
Click to expand...
It is a big gap in AP, but Kars can bypass her aura with his hamon. It should be able to either hax her out, or melt her face off. (It's comparable to the surface of the sun, which is 5550c. Way past any temperature she has tanked.)
 
As the Ultimate Lifeform, could Kars activate his own aura if he saw Cinder's in action? Is that a possibility? I mean as the Ultimate Lifeform he can replicate abilites from any other lifeform.

I'm only asking this out of curiosity. It sounds interesting.
 
I see no reason why not with verse equalization. He's smart enough to realize she's using it too.

Her forcefields as well, unless she needs magic to use it.
 
She needs magic to make her forcefields yes, he would not be able to bypass them like aura

I will respond with a full rebuttal in in a few minutes
 
What magic? Is it something everyone can learn in theory? Unless it's a power bestowed upon her from someone, he should be able to replicate it with ease. He mastered hamon with a single glance, despite having no first-hand experience.
 
No it cant be learned, it was bestowed upon the maidens by Ozpin, who in turn had it bestowed upon him by the God Brothers
 
As if Kars cant switch his gender on the fly...

But I agree of him not learning the magic for now. He should still be able to copy her forcefields and such.
 
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