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Top 10 Strongest Non-Smurfs for every tier continued

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DontTalkDT said:
To that comes that gods are immortal, so there is the question of whether it works on immortals.
Click to expand...
is it really depend on whether the target being immortal? I mean it is actually some fate/causality stuffs than death hax so the only immo type that seems to resist this is 5( plz correct me if im wrong). I've looked through Kidou pro5 and i think with type4 she may get around desperados hax, if she manages to comeback in time ofc

DontTalkDT said:
There is also the question whether the death aura has enough range
Click to expand...
i don't see large size or sth on her profile so i'm a bit curious why would range be needed here. Anyway, desperados aura range is about several kms scaling from kurono being able to sense and thus fear Edelweiss from cities away, there is another case where Stella sense XiaoLi from a mountainous-distance apart.
 
Let me say that the effect you describe appears to be classified as fate manip on the profile. Fate Manip in Godless planet is probably of the causality side, instead of the probability type, as manipulators can do stuff like this

He pulled Phlogiston Tanks from his black coat and attached them to the back of the weapon.

The first caused a 2-yard dark blade to burst out.

The second extended the dark blade to 4 yards where it severed the ceiling’s “destiny to fall”.

The shadowy blade sliced right through the ether fields decorating the falling ceiling, returning the ceiling to its original form.

He was about 20 yards from Schweitzer now.

He raised Gelegenheit and swung it down.

<Not even heaven can escape the threads of Destiny!!>

A lightning-like slash tore through the ceiling in a straight line, repairing it.

The mesh of bluish-white squares covering the ceiling were sliced through by the darkness and the falling ceiling instantly returned to its original position.

It had severed the thread of “destiny” created by Der Held to tell that area of space to collapse.
Click to expand...
So one could debate whether there is reason for equalization here.

Pain said:
is it really depend on whether the target being immortal? I mean it is actually some fate/causality stuffs than death hax so the only immo type that seems to resist this is 5( plz correct me if im wrong). I've looked through Kidou pro5 and i think with type4 she may get around desperados hax, if she manages to comeback in time ofc
Click to expand...
It depends on how it works. Godless Planet characters usually can't return in time after being destroyed, due to lacking the power to remanifest after getting destroyed. But if you kill them in a fashion that leaves their mold intact it might be a different story.

Pain said:
i don't see large size or sth on her profile so i'm a bit curious why would range be needed here. Anyway, desperados aura range is about several kms scaling from kurono being able to sense and thus fear Edelweiss from cities away, there is another case where Stella sense XiaoLi from a mountainous-distance apart.
Click to expand...
That's for sensing, but did those people just immediately die and does this scale to Tendou? What about people with less good sensing abilities?
The relevance is in the fact that the starting distance for this battle is 4km and Kidou can just petrify in several kilometers AoE.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Let me say that the effect you describe appears to be classified as fate manip on the profile. Fate Manip in Godless planet is probably of the causality side, instead of the probability type, as manipulators can do stuff like this

So one could debate whether there is reason for equalization here.
Click to expand...
ok the passive one( fated to die the moment they challenge a desperados) get resisted then, tho how many layers of resistance? The bloodlust showing is still likely going to work if it isn't atleast 2
DontTalkDT said:
But if you kill them in a fashion that leaves their mold intact it might be a different story.
Click to expand...
could you explain this in-depth pls( i don't get the gist)

DontTalkDT said:
That's for sensing, but did those people just immediately die and does this scale to Tendou?
Click to expand...
this is the fated to die(passive) one and it just works on ppl who try to challenge desperados( so normal people/spectators weren't affected, it would be a tragedy otherwise), and the thing is this doesn't negate resistance like the other one so even though nene and kurono did feel the aura, they just fear instead of dying because nene is a desperados(acausal 4) and kurono being on the same level.
I mean it has the consistency of showing the specific range of desperados aura, twice. So it is safe to assume such a feat is what desperados can do in common.
DontTalkDT said:
What about people with less good sensing abilities?
Click to expand...
it is not about sensing actually, it is more like having opposing intent to a desperado

DontTalkDT said:
The relevance is in the fact that the starting distance for this battle is 4km and Kidou can just petrify in several kilometers AoE.
Click to expand...
can that affect Incorporeal( soul in this case ) tho?
 
Pain said:
ok the passive one( fated to die the moment they challenge a desperados) get resisted then, tho how many layers of resistance? The bloodlust showing is still likely going to work if it isn't atleast 2
Click to expand...
She has several layers of resistance.

The verse uses a ranking system for resistance strength (well, for the divine rank that gives the resistance) which is (from highest to lowest) World > Space > Heaven > Planet > Realm > Region > Country > Metropolis > City > Town > Village > House > Room > Hidden > Empty. Kidou is at the Country rank.

Pain said:
could you explain this in-depth pls( i don't get the gist)
Click to expand...
The world in godless planet works so that everything is fundamentally Ether. A flame for example is simply Ether in the shape of a flame. However, if Ether flows freely that would mean it doesn't maintain its form, so nothing would remain what it is. Hence there are molds. A mold is basically a container for Ether, that keeps the Ether in place. So a flame is actually nothing but Ether contained in a "flame-shaped" mold. A mold can also exist without Ether in it, as a blueprint which a god could then inject Ether into to create the thing corresponding to the mold. That's basically also how god powers work in the series.

Now, if gods die they do not truly die. They become a virtual manifestation, an entity without physical existence in the world. To resurrect they would need to restore their mold and inject Ether to recreate their physical body. However, what if you kill them without destroying their mold via a technique outside the Ether system? Well, they could potentially just inject Ether into it again to physically manifest once more.

Whether that works depends on how the causality manip instant death interacts with Ether stuff.

Pain said:
this is the fated to die(passive) one and it just works on ppl who try to challenge desperados( so normal people/spectators weren't affected, it would be a tragedy otherwise), and the thing is this doesn't negate resistance like the other one so even though nene and kurono did feel the aura, they just fear instead of dying because nene is a desperados(acausal 4) and kurono being on the same level.
I mean it has the consistency of showing the specific range of desperados aura, twice. So it is safe to assume such a feat is what desperados can do in common.

it is not about sensing actually, it is more like having opposing intent to a desperado
Click to expand...
So are there examples of people without sensing and without acausality just instantly dying? Due to the intersection with fate manip, I just wonder whether it is instant or not.

Pain said:
can that affect Incorporeal( soul in this case ) tho?
Click to expand...
Is the incorporeality linked to the elemental intangibility? She should be able to affect the flames and lightning he turns his body in, but if that doesn't do anything then no.
 
DontTalkDT said:
The verse uses a ranking system for resistance strength (well, for the divine rank that gives the resistance) which is (from highest to lowest) World > Space > Heaven > Planet > Realm > Region > Country > Metropolis > City > Town > Village > House > Room > Hidden > Empty. Kidou is at the Country
Click to expand...
At what level does resistance to space and time begin?
 
DontTalkDT said:
The world in godless planet works so that everything is fundamentally Ether. A flame for example is simply Ether in the shape of a flame. However, if Ether flows freely that would mean it doesn't maintain its form, so nothing would remain what it is. Hence there are molds. A mold is basically a container for Ether, that keeps the Ether in place. So a flame is actually nothing but Ether contained in a "flame-shaped" mold. A mold can also exist without Ether in it, as a blueprint which a god could then inject Ether into to create the thing corresponding to the mold. That's basically also how god powers work in the series.

Now, if gods die they do not truly die. They become a virtual manifestation, an entity without physical existence in the world. To resurrect they would need to restore their mold and inject Ether to recreate their physical body. However, what if you kill them without destroying their mold via a technique outside the Ether system? Well, they could potentially just inject Ether into it again to physically manifest once more.

Whether that works depends on how the causality manip instant death interacts with Ether stuff.
Click to expand...
so... if i get this right, we will need to somehow get rid of these mold thingy so that they don't have a mold to inject Ether to resurrect? Welp i'm gonna go in details of what the desperados causality death was capable of doing

DontTalkDT said:
So are there examples of people without sensing and without acausality just instantly dying? Due to the intersection with fate manip, I just wonder whether it is instant or not.
Click to expand...
And yes, there were peole without sensing and acausality died(fated to die) instantly when they tried to challenge a desperado. This is back to the Vermillion arc when an army of soliders( ''normal'' people with no enhanced sense or acausal, i said ''normal'' cuz they actually can use magic at a pretty professional level tho it's not the point anyway) tried to step in the battle between Stella and Or-gaule( a desperado), they got ''cut'' by some invisible force immediately.

Iirc, there was a quite long thread regarding this feat and someone said that this can be bypassed by ppl with Mid regen or sth and Earl explained how that wase not the case considering the context(+ Edelweiss explaination about desperados's fate/causality dominant nature), those soliders were actually ''lead by fate to die'' the moment they decided to oppose a desperado, the method isn't crucial and it is the result that they've ded that is the important key of this whole death hax thing.

will that enough to destroy ''mold'' ish or whatever it is, idk
DontTalkDT said:
The verse uses a ranking system for resistance strength (well, for the divine rank that gives the resistance) which is (from highest to lowest) World > Space > Heaven > Planet > Realm > Region > Country > Metropolis > City > Town > Village > House > Room > Hidden > Empty. Kidou is at the Country rank.
Click to expand...
is there fate/causality hax resistance even from the lower ranks like room or house? If that's the case then, just forget about the whole desperados death things lol


DontTalkDT said:
Is the incorporeality linked to the elemental intangibility? She should be able to affect the flames and lightning he turns his body in, but if that doesn't do anything then no
Click to expand...
The form of incorporeality initially was in the form of his Spirit/Soul( Excessive Awakening is basically so that desperados bodies can become the same nature as their soul). he can turn into elements(such as lightning) tho it is optional
 
From how it sounded before, all kinds of magic existed on all levels it's just a difference of the level/layers. If that's not true, then I'd definitely have a lot to work with in the Yomoji battle for future reference.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
At what level does resistance to space and time begin?
Click to expand...
In principle the lowest. All have the same scope of resistances (namely against everything other gods can do). However, since those with higher or equal divine rank can ignore the Divine rank based resistances of those with lower or equal divine rank, you would never see that happen in-verse. Well, I suppose it's debatable whether someone without a divine rank whatsoever would count as Empty or as an even lower classification of None. So, worst case, they in practice start at Hidden... although I personally think it's more likely to start at Empty, as even Empty ranked gods are still Ether beings, contrary to regular humans.

Pain said:
so... if i get this right, we will need to somehow get rid of these mold thingy so that they don't have a mold to inject Ether to resurrect? Welp i'm gonna go in details of what the desperados causality death was capable of doing


And yes, there were peole without sensing and acausality died(fated to die) instantly when they tried to challenge a desperado. This is back to the Vermillion arc when an army of soliders( ''normal'' people with no enhanced sense or acausal, i said ''normal'' cuz they actually can use magic at a pretty professional level tho it's not the point anyway) tried to step in the battle between Stella and Or-gaule( a desperado), they got ''cut'' by some invisible force immediately.

Iirc, there was a quite long thread regarding this feat and someone said that this can be bypassed by ppl with Mid regen or sth and Earl explained how that wase not the case considering the context(+ Edelweiss explaination about desperados's fate/causality dominant nature), those soliders were actually ''lead by fate to die'' the moment they decided to oppose a desperado, the method isn't crucial and it is the result that they've ded that is the important key of this whole death hax thing.

will that enough to destroy ''mold'' ish or whatever it is, idk
Click to expand...
That it is via cutting is good... and bad. If she is cut that would "destroy" the mold. (or technically transform it) So physical destruction is good. But then again, if it manifests a physical force I am quite sceptical about it instantly killing her without a chance to retaliate... or it in general really circumventing durability.

Pain said:
The form of incorporeality initially was in the form of his Spirit/Soul( Excessive Awakening is basically so that desperados bodies can become the same nature as their soul). he can turn into elements(such as lightning) tho it is optional
Click to expand...
So even if the elements would be erased he would survive as soul and just restore himself? If so, I guess there's nothing Kidou can do. She would have to settle for the 4th spot in that case... unless Grandblue Fantasy characters can beat her. I don't know who they are.
 
DontTalkDT said:
That it is via cutting is good... and bad. If she is cut that would "destroy" the mold. (or technically transform it) So physical destruction is good. But then again, if it manifests a physical force I am quite sceptical about it instantly killing her without a chance to retaliate... or it in general really circumventing durability.
Click to expand...
welp, i mean it is fate/causality itself that instantly cut them into peace, the method is just a way of performing the result which is ''you die'' .Like, it couldn't really show if the soliders were dead at ''fate level''( since they just exist at material level) so the feat at best can only go as far as physical destruction. Tho it is of course more than that, considering how that is causality/fate manip and desperados aura could affect souls directly.

But as i've said, if the rank system actually contains fate/causality resistance even at low levels then Desperados stuffs will become almost useless.

DontTalkDT said:
So even if the elements would be erased he would survive as soul and just restore himself?
Click to expand...
Yes. Tho this match will depend mostly on whether Kidou's resistance to causality manip is good enough. Tendou's final option would possibly be incap via thought-base paralyze otherwise
 
Looks like Mamoru's match is a stomp, so unless someone has something to say on that he should get 3rd place 10-B.
 
AE doesn`t mean much if their offense is lacking. Whats their offense? Li qiye can summon 3B guys with hax and has 4A weapons
 
Smurf is only if it's higher-d. So technically a tier 10 can still work around here with High 3-A abilities, and so could a Low 2-C with 2-A abilities, so while it's kinda cheating, it's not an smurf and thus allowed : V
Sure makes one wonder how much would the list change if "smurf" was defined as anything above the physical tier someone's at.
 
Li Qiye also has 3-B soul/mind resist and attack if anyone tries to mess with these aspects of him as he has a high number of such protections from Immortals placed to protect him.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
For 5th 9-B, Is Toda Mikoku's powers passive? If not Sayonara Pussycat should defeat her through passive Empathic Manipulation. I don't see any resistance to it on her page.
Click to expand...
Most are not passive, but the cat has no way to kill her and Toda is under the passive effect of a self-evolution concept, so the effect won't last for long. To that comes that with Toda's range the cat is probably not in sight as the battle starts, meaning she can activate concepts that deny the power.
And Toda should keep the spot due to beating vastly more third parties anyway.

Edit: Speaking about that spot, can we change it form Toda to "Owari no Chronicle Characters"? Sayama (with optional equip) and especially Jord should also be included IMO.



Edit 2: Btw. unrelated, but shouldn't the first two spots of 10-B be put together as they're from the same verse?
 
Last edited:
DontTalkDT said:
Most are not passive, but the cat has no way to kill her and Toda is under the passive effect of a self-evolution concept, so the effect won't last for long. To that comes that with Toda's range the cat is probably not in sight as the battle starts, meaning she can activate concepts that deny the power.
And Toda should keep the spot due to beating vastly more third parties anyway.
Click to expand...
They would start at a Dozen meters since that is Toda's range, and it doesn't state she gains resistances, it just says she improves. You'd half to provide evidence that it grants her resistance to such things.
Things like Possession will merge Sayonara into Toda and take her over so she doesn't half to kill Toda because she'll be incapacitated.
 
Not a dozen meters, but dozens of meters. Plural. It's enough range to get her going. She uses the no mutual understanding concept and with that it's over.

All the evolution concept would have to do here is to activate the Betrayed Expectations concept (or one of a few other concepts) for Toda. Maybe make it passive like it is for Jord. Toda has the concept, we know the evolution concept can improve on conceptual powers, we know making it passive/activating it is possible. This is no stretch at all.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Not a dozen meters, but dozens of meters. Plural. It's enough range to get her going. She uses the no mutual understanding concept and with that it's over.
Click to expand...
My mistake.
DontTalkDT said:
All the evolution concept would have to do here is to activate the Betrayed Expectations concept (or one of a few other concepts) for Toda. Maybe make it passive like it is for Jord. Toda has the concept, we know the evolution concept can improve on conceptual powers, we know making it passive/activating it is possible. This is no stretch at all.
Click to expand...
Fair enough. I'll concede. (Waves white flag)
 
DontTalkDT said:
Edit 2: Btw. unrelated, but shouldn't the first two spots of 10-B be put together as they're from the same verse?
Click to expand...
I would say no, there's a rather large difference between the two and I think they are the only ones in that verse that can compete for the spot.
 
Road stomped Mordekaiser within this thread here so Road Kamelot for 1st placement of Low 6-B.

Honestly all the Noah within D.Gray-Man have the same win-con and resistances of Road which allowed her to stomp Mordekaiser so i'm requesting instead of putting just Road, name it "Characters from D.Gray-Man (Road Kamelot, Tyki Mikk and The Millennium Earl)".

Also Mordekaiser probably needs to be removed from Low 6-B entirely given he's in the process of being massively revised given how out of date his current profile is.
 
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