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The Ultra Series Discussion Thread: Unleash! The Power of Imagination!

So the final episode of UGF2 is out

And yep Tartarus matched and defeated Ultimate Shining Zero in combat. Rather easily in fact. Tartarus literally overpowered Zero in a beam struggle very casually.

Zett fought Tri-Strium Taiga (Full Power) somewhat evenly for a while. But it seems like Base Z was able to hurt Zett Who was weakened by Taiga.

Belial and Tregear overwhelmed all the Ultras and Andro Melos there on the battlefield at once. So Belial and Tregear amped by Tartarus > Andro Melos, Joneus, Ribut, and etc.

So UGF2 pretty much ended with the Ultras losing the war against Tartarus. And yeah we have absolutely no idea why King appeared in episode 3.

Also Genegarg is mentioned. So yeah like people expected Celebro invaded Land of Light while they were fighting Tartarus.

Also new Ultra that looks like Seven shown captive in the golden realm Tartarus created guess that’s going to be Trigger.
 
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I think the proposed keys for Nexus is fine. But was it ever stated that Anphans could used the Meta Field as well? I mean there shouldn't be any doubts, but I'm just making sure. Again, the keys are otherwise fine.

And of course the final episode is not to be missed. Wonder if they'll update as to what the Narak space actually is given Tartarus' total command of it. Honestly, the possibility of what Narak is actually made up for the comparatively short scene with Ultimate Shining Zero.

"Trigger" looks weird but that's fine by me, and I'm guessing his arc is going to be tightly knitted into The Kingdom's. And it seems that the rumor posted before had some merits to it.

Also, I'm not gonna be back for real yet; connection problems abound where I am and I'm using whatever preferable alternate methods bit even that isn't yielding much for me. Of course, RL stuff does have involvement as well.
 
Oh yeah I don’t think Anphans is ever shown to use it. I’ll update it later.

For real really hope they explain it so that maybe one day somebody will destroy that space and become Low 2-C or something.

Yeah that Ultra at the end is probably gonna be Trigger but we aren’t sure just yet.

Ahh internet and real life problems so that’s why we haven’t seen you in so long. Nah it’s fine take your time. Since there’s no more new series coming out the discussion will probably slow down now.

True people have also pointed that out before. But I think that’s just a red herring.
 
The series has a lot of pocket space feats, but they're all very vague. Bullton's 4D pocket space, Shining Field, Reibatos' dimension, now Narak.

I wonder if that was just a placeholder suit, because he looks like a Sluggerless Zero.

Yeah, I will be taking it slow, unless the magazines finally come out. Speaking of which, in whose SCW was DarkKiller mentioned?

Now I'm wondering if the rumor of a defective Absolutian is also true to an extent.
 
True

I actually thought it looked similar to Seven rather than Zero

I think the R/B one. Not entirely sure though. Actually I don't even think I have seen much statements about Ultra Dark-Killer since the only statements I could find about him are the ones from the game which isn't canon to the UGF one.

Maybe who knows.

Also should Joneus still be considered Low 2-C? Cause I just heard that Base Zero apparently might have a strongest Base form in UGF2 statement and he's only Baseline Low 2-C. And in the final episode we see that Tartarus amped Belial and Tregear can overpower all the Ultras there themselves. Tregear even overpowered both Andro Melos and Joneus's shield.
 
Joneus is probably just gonna have a likely. Kinda sucks that Zero is still the only most powerful but it's fine.

Speaking of which, why do you think were the numerous attempts of jumping the STA Bomb into Low 2-C rejected?

Ones I remember: no indication of the space-time being destroyed, not all points of time are affected, lack of visual feats(?) and that the universe isn't completely destroyed?

Well thing is, there are numerous clues that checks out on every criteria. And the last point is especially moot. So what are we missing?
 
I think you mean a possibly since the current top tiers and god tiers are only At least 3-A likely Low 2-C.

Yeah I think those are the reasons. Also Low 2-C is getting way stricter and only those who are straight up stated or shown to affect past, present, and future all at once instantly and not overtime counts as Low 2-C. So personally I'm just kinda glad we even get to have a likely Low 2-C.
 
Ah, that's right. Likely for those in the upper echelons, and possibly for anyone qualified.

Well thing is, Ultraman seems to treat the universe as the timeline, or rather, it already encompasses that. I also recall something like bubble multiverses being qualified for 2-C, which implies a single bubble would mean that it is already its own timeline. And well, the Ultraman multiverse is already clarified as a bubble multiverse.

On the case of whether entire universes don't mean the entire space-time, I found 3 statements in the multiverse map saying that to cross into other universes, you would have to cross space-time. There's even an explicit statement in Origin Saga.

I should probably ask how differing portrayals of the universe can affect feats of that level.
 
I see. Well you could try and after the revisions are over and the profiles are fixed. Now that UGF2 is over we really should try and get the profiles updated. I'm gonna see if I could contact some staff for the multiplier thread later.
 
Aright, good luck with that.

One perk of keeping up with the tier 2 thread, I know who could possibly be contacted and give that a check.
 
I'm not sure myself. Should probably ask any active staff member or a suggestion for whoever is knowledgeable about it.
 
I took a look at the multiplier page and it seems like DontTalkDT was the one who made the page. I guess I’ll ask him to give input.
 
Wow that's weird, I was thinking of suggesting him and suspected he'd know a thing or two, but alright then.
 
I also decided to contact DemonGodMitchAubin since it seems like he participated in quite a lot of the multiplier threads in the past. Not to mention some of his verses also use double or several multipliers from databooks like we do.
 
I wonder just how broken Ultra has gotten thanks to this if it gets applied. I recall DBS' scaling chain being in the millions and that surprised me, but going as far as 6.5 billion times baseline was rather unprecedented for Ultra.

Also, when it comes to resistances, how many profiles have you seen are granted them for having a powet that counters and restores the effect of another character's ability? One example that comes to mind is Pops, who does just that. If that's all that's needed, then shouldn't Z have resistance to space-time manipulation of some level?

Another thing, thinking about it again after someone pointed it out, I don't think Tartarus necessarily overpowered USZero, just that he was able to outlast the form long enough. It sort of makes sense going by their dialogue; Tartarus should know about his opponent and hasn't bluffed in any extreme manner so far.
 
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Actually it’s 656.1 million for Ultimate Shining Zero and anybody’s stronger than him. You must've counted an extra 0. But yeah they get really high even with known multipliers. Cause like X alone has a several ten times multiplier stacked on his several times multiplier form. That‘s at least a 90x boost no matter what. And because all the new generation ultras are treated as comparable they would all scale to Exceed X w/ Beta Spark Armor with their strongest form. And then there’s Zero whose Base form alone scales above them and on top of that you stack on all of his multipliers. So yeah really high into 3-A. Also DBS was in the trillions if I remember correctly.

Also no staff replied to the multipliers thread even after I contacted two of them. So what do we do? Just go on with the changes anyway? Cause the tiers will still be the same the only problem is the AP which I guess we could just bring up the multipliers then whenever somebody questions how high they are into the tiers.

That I’m honestly not sure. I don’t think I have seen that many profiles like that though. Most just count fixing things as a form of Hax and not resistance if I remember correctly. Like fixing space would be spatial manipulation (I think).

To me it seemed like Ultimate Shining Zero only matched a less holding back but still not full power Tartarus (Kinda like Jiren holding back less against Post-2nd UIS SSB Goku but still not going full power). Cause when they were having a beam struggle if you look closely it seems like Tartarus was just using one hand to hold him back. After he used two hands he managed to completely overpower Ultimate Shining Zero in the beam struggle even before the form’s time limit was up.

Oh right also I was thinking of changing the 3-A scaling a bit. More specifically Ginga’s scaling. Like I think we probably shouldn’t treat Ginga defeating Zagi as something that he could do normally. Cause that fight seemed like something that Ginga could do only when his emotions were at his max. Cause he was originally evenly matched with Jean-Killer but in the theater special he was suddenly equal to Dark Zagi who was stomping Jean-Nine. Another example is his fight against the Dark Ultra Brothers. Originally they were equal in fact Dark Ultraman even had the upper hand but after he had a short flashback of the other students he started effortlessly stomping Dark Ultraseven who he was equal to. So rather than Ginga being over 3x baseline 3-A for defeating Dark Zagi, Ginga would be over 3x baseline 3-A instead for being on par with Jean-Killer who is stronger than Kaiser Belial.
 
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Ah, so I did. Exceed X was one of those that had 10x, right? But yeah, looks like even here multipliers are insane. Speaking of multipliers, there's DB. Trillions, huh? actually, I think I remember that as well.

Wow, I'm not sure in that case. Try other staff members? Or just keep bumping again for now.

Yeah, gonna keep it as just ST manip. Speaking of which, it's weird how both Destrudos and Z have ST type attacks, D4 and Deathcium Slash. I jist find it interesting since usually you'd get some level of disjointedness between the power Ultras and their final enemies, bar Ginga and Geed, I suppose.

He does. Guess that can still go then, where Tartarus is in the scaling. Also, do you or the Chinese forum happen to have or save the pictures that details the cast of UGF and their forms' powers? Like the one with USZero where it's stated that he can control both time and space. It's a bit dubious despite being WoG, but it should still be kept in mind.
 
Exceed X is a several times (3x) multiplier. It scales above Greeza Dark Thunder which makes monsters go EX which is stated multiple times to be several times Base on top of the fact that Exceed X is also stated to be several times stronger than Base X.

I might just change the name of the title saying something like (Any staff just please come take a look and give some input).

True.

You could actually find the encyclopedia stuff on the official Tsuburaya Twitter. The final episode released the one for Tri-Strium Taiga which explains how Taiga could still turn into Tri-Strium and use the different techniques without Hiroyuki due to their bonds. Although it also said they can’t use Quattro Squad Buster as Hiroyuki isn’t here.
 
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Well, look at that stack.

Do what you think is appropriate, because this has never quite happened before.

Okay, that's nice, it even has its own tag so that's nifty. I found the Alien Bat one and now that I think about it again, he really could be Low 2-C as well. I have always believed that TsuPro has very specific wording when it comes to differing methods of destruction.
 
Yeah the multipliers are also rather consistent with each other. So X’s strongest form would be Exceed X (>3x) x Beta Spark Armor (>30x) = Exceed X w/ Beta Spark Armor (>90x).

Yeah I’ll probably bump tomorrow. Gonna need to sleep and wake up early to finish up some homework.

Yeah it’s really nice how they give encyclopedia and other information on the official twitter with a specific tag to go along with it. Huh cool so possibly Low 2-C Hyper Zetton. Inb4 Zett is stated in the super complete works to be the strongest Zetton which would mean it’s superior to the Hyper Zetton from Ultraman Saga since it is also created by the same Alien Bat. And than that would make Tri-Strium Taiga (Full Power) Low 2-C which would than scale to quite a few other characters as Zett would be above baseline Low 2-C.
 
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And they also have on-screen showings so it'd be easy to determine to what extent the consistency goes.

Alright then.

Honestly a lot of Ultraman feats get presented like that. They destroy the universe and the only visual showings imply a slow process but actual intentions pretty much throw that notion out the window. The only complete universal destruction we've ever seen is by Darklops Zero. Also, that's very likely given the context of TAC. But the one I'm truly curious about are Bullton, Greeza, Baraba and Destrudos (by extension D4).

Edit: You can get to this later; Does Geed's SCW say anything about Zegan?
 
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Yep. Also kinda sucks how because Zero has the strongest Base form among all ultras, Shining doesn’t have a known multiplier. Like in the Ginga S movie if Zero was comparable to or weaker than Corona Cosmos than Shining form could’ve scaled to Future Mode which is stated in the databooks to be several times Eclipse Mode which is several ten times Corona which would be consistent with Ultimate being greater than Armored Darkness which is also a several times multiplier. But sadly since Zero > Taro > Ginga = Chaos Ultraman = Corona Cosmos that isn’t happening. So Shining will only be considered 3x Ultimate only that one time for being superior to Future Cosmos.

Yeah that happens in a lot of series and not just Ultraman. We’re gonna have to wait for the SCW if we want more info for Bullton, Greeza, Baraba, and D4.

Also GOOD NEWS. Mitch replied and said he will take a look at the thread tomorrow.
 
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Oof, bummer.

I'm aware, was just making the closest example.

That is good news, hopefully it gets accepted now that it'll get looked at.
 
Mitch replied and he said there's a lot of evidence so pretty much all of them are usable. Only one that he's iffy about is Ultimate Shining since it's so big. Though I argued that it should be accepted as it's just two accepted multipliers stacked on top of each other just like SSBKKx20. Now I'm just waiting for him to respond.
 
Well, he's accepted a good portion of it, and that's honestly pretty surprising since it basically means that we'll be able to move on soon enough.

Also, would what we've been told be enough to even land Chaos Manip on Grimdo to any level? He has been mentioned to be that primordial nothingness before the universe, so there's some level of possibility. There are several statements of it, and given how knowledgeable Tregear is, I don't see why he'd lie about the fundamental nature of Grimdo.

Of course, that could also potentially lead to an even stronger supporting feat for Low 2-C given that it is the every nature of Grimdo itself. Or the other statement could be used which is that Grimdo is the conglomeration of ancient souls that lived in the darkness from lomg before the universe's creation which could possibly mean that for it to exist in the universe it was sealed in, it would have to have survived the birth of that universe, seeing as the souls are still needed to be sealed afterwards.
 
Hm, that's weird. I recall reading somewhere in the wiki that being a primordial mass of chaos before the birth of the universe could qualify for Low 2-C. But now I can't find it so my post is now iffy.
 
Yeah I was also kinda surprised about that.

And honestly I don’t think existing before the universe is enough for Grimdo to qualify as Low 2-C.
 
My proposition was more that it's because Grimdo was the coalition of beings that encompass the emptiness before the universe, but yeah, a lot of it gets weak once you check deeper into things. That sucks.
 
Guys it’s over. The AP revisions are now complete. We can now update the profiles with the new tiers


Also is there anything else I need to change on Zero’s profile? Like is there any ability that I need to add or remove? I know we have to remove the Shining having the powers of Ultimate Aegis due to the new retcon. But what else is there that needs to be changed?

vsbattles.fandom.com

Peter1129/Sandbox3

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

I’m probably gonna post everything at once tomorrow. The revised main page, Zero’s updated profile, my blog on the scaling of the series. And I’m also gonna ask Ant to change the names of the verse page and some of the profiles. I’m probably also gonna make Zero vs Goku tomorrow.

Oh right also we should probably make a Ultra Physiology page as well. Also do you guys think I should replace the Tieba image links with Imgur just to be safe?
 
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This is one of the best news I've gotten here in a while.

Everything mentioning atomic scale beams can go. Also that plan on whether we should split Zero into 2 pages, one for his specific era and the other for things during New Gen and onwards? Everything from Ginga S to Orb movie can be 1 key, while Geed era Zero is its own. Mentions of full power Zero can probably go in Taiga series key.

Oo, that's a lot so yeah, good luck. Heh, reminds me of the old Goku vs Zero. Yes, it exists and it didn't have much traction. Surprise.

Ultra Physiology us a definite yes, but it'd also need to explain things like tge Inner Lights and such, considering how sorta broken light and darkness actually is in the series.
 
Alright so atomic stuff needs to go. And potential Zero profile split. Personally I think for now Zero’s profile is fine with just one. But if the next era starts and Zero gets another wildly different lvl of power than yeah we’re gonna need to split his profile in two. Personally I would split his profile into Before Crisis and After Crisis. As those are the direct words used in the Super Complete Works to separate between Early and Late New Generation. And that’s also when Zero got the biggest change in power (Achieving Low 2-C with Ultimate and Shining).

Yep and thanks.

You should probably start a sandbox of the inner light stuff first so people won’t question the immortalities and stuff. Kinda feel bad that I can’t help that much as I’m not expert about the inner light stuff though.
 
I don't see anything wrong with one profile dealing with pre Crisis Impact and the other after it.

I'll start sometime soon then. It'll be rough, but at the same time, someone's gotta do it. By the way, is there any scans about it in databooks and the likes? I'd need everything I can get my hands on.
 
True. I guess it wouldn’t hurt to split the profile into two. I guess I’ll see what I could do. Gonna take a while though as the profile is also still missing the techniques of many forms.

I’ll try and see if I could find any on Ultraman physiology. Though it’s probably gonna take me a long time as I have no idea what ultra physiology or inner light is called in chinese. So it’s gonna take a while to search for those stuff.
 
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Ah so we are still missing some techniques. Alright, thanks in advance for expanding on those.

Take your time, I'll likely be writing the draft still by the time any info is found.
 
@Peter1129 Any Michael Bay level vids I could watch of UltraDudes?

Weirdly, Ultra is that series that made me question the outfits wven though i watched Powers Rangers a long time ago and the style is similar.
 
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