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Arguements for why movies scale to GT
Firstly I want to list the arguements that GT does scale from Movies.
1) Vegeta Knows and Suggests the Fusion Dance
2) The GT Perfect files show a Picture of SSJ Gogeta from the Fusion Reborn Movie.
3) Theres a Shot of Cooler in the Super 17 Arc.
4) Goku uses the Super Dragon First from Movie 13.
I will adress all arguements above after I define what Akira Toriyama thinks of the Dragonball Movies and the Dragonball GT Series.
What Toriyama thinks of DBZ Movies and GT
When Toriyama is asked in an Interview about the DBZ Movies, he states that they are STORIE(S) that take place in A different DIMENSION.
When asked about the Original series, he responds with comments in portains to Majin Buu.
Toriyama checks the plot and the story for movies that Toei sends him, so he is stil King of Dragonball.
"Stories, A, Dimension". Stories is Plural, while the words "A" and "Dimension" are SINGULAR.
This means that ALL DBZ Movies take place in the SAME Dimension/Timeline.
"It can be interpreted as..."
No. This a statement from the author. He's a simple man. You take the DIRECT OBJECTIVE definition of his statements. All movies take place in the same dimension.
Toriyama States that Dragonball GT is a Side story that is the continuation of the ORIGINAL Dragonball.
We OBJECTIVELY defined what Toriyama considers original. So that means GT is the continuation of the DBZ anime, NOT including the Movies, as they are not classified.
And don't give me your personal Interpretations.
Arguement 1
"Vegeta suggests the fusion dance, and does the dance perfectly on his first try, he has to have known it from Fusion Reborn from when Goku showed him the posses."
Very easy to debunk this. Vegeta states Inside of Buu that he knows about the fusion dance AND has seen it from the Afterlife. So Vegeta already has Fusion's concepts in his head, and already has witnessed it. So he knows the poses from then.
Now look at this.
After Fusing into Gogeta vs Omega Shenron, they defused right? Goku states to Vegeta that "You've already done it ONCE." Emphasis on the once part. Goku have fused Via a dance TWICE. Once in Fusion Reborn and Once in GT. Since they've fused Only once, this means Fusion Reborn did not happen.
This means Fusion Reborn does NOT scale to GT. And we showed earlier that via statements from the author that the DBZ movies are all in one dimension/timeline.
It should be noted that the man that Created the plot for Dragonball Movies is Takao Koyama. He created the all the DBZ movies from Movie 1-13. And he created the Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans MOVIE, that was cut down to and Ova Later on. It would make sense that the creator of all these movies, would have them take place in a single timeline. Evidence bellow.
Let me PROVE IT to you. In Dragonball Z Fusion Reborn Movie 12, its shown all movies are connected.
As you can see Villians from each movie are in the Fusion Reborn movie, and thus are connected im the same timeline.
Medamacha is connected to Lord Slug, who is connected to Broly, Cooler and Turles in Plan to eradicate the Saiyans Movie.
Cooler is obviously connected to all Cooler Movies, and the same can be said for all Broly Movies.
Movie 2 Worlds Strongest
Movie 3 Tree of might
Movie 4 Lord Slug
Movie 5 Cooler's Revenge
Movie 6 Super Android 13
Movie 7 Return of Cooler
Movie 8 Broly the Legendary Super Saiyan
Movie 9 Bojack Unbound
Movie 10 Broly Second Coming
Movie 11 Bio Broly
Litrally ALL movies apart from Movie 13 Wrath of the Dragon are connected to Fusion Reborn. The only reason Wrath of the dragon isn't referenced in Movie 12 is because it was released after it. The writer has made it ABUNDANTLY clear that Movies are all part of one timeline.
Even in the Poster for Fusion Reborn, there is a picture of Dr. Wheelo from The World's strongest Movie
But I don't want to make any assumptions, I will deal with Movie 13 in arguement 4.
Movie 12 Takes place between Fat Buu and Kid Buu. Yet Ultmate Gohan is shown on Earth with Humans Alive.
When Gohan was on Earth, ALL Humans were dead. And only wished back DURING the fight with Kid Buu. This is a complete contradiction to the canon.
Arguement 2
Theres a Picture of SSJ Gogeta from Fusion Reborn and it says that it made his first appearence there.
Actually the Guide says the Concept of Gogeta first made his Debut the Fusion Reborn MOVIE in 1995. It says NOTHING about SSJ4 Gogeta being from the Fusion Reborn movie.
"It can be interpreted as..."
I already told you. No. Look at the conext, look at the text, and then take it at face value. Because anything else is assumption and Headcanon.
It states Gogeta's CONCEPT made his debut in a the Movie. If Gogeta had made his Debut in Fusion rebornN then the guide would of simpily said, Gogeta made his debut in Fusion Reborn. But they specify Concept, i.e its just Gogeta, as a thing that was created and debuted in the Fusion Reborn Movie.
Fusion Reborn Via statements from the Show disproves this Guide. Show statements>Guide.
Arguement 3
"Cooler in the Super 17 arc was shown returning from Hell, therefore GT has to scale from Movies."
Sorry but the Show is made by Toei. Toriyama states that he left it up Toei to do the Job. Cooler's appearence is mearly an accident.
If thats not a Good enough reason for you, then lets try this. Cooler is shown on a TV, for 1 Frame. 1 single Frame. This is something that Shows do, known as an Easter Egg. Cooler is the only movie Villian Shown and has no other participation to GT other than this ONE frame.
An example of an easter egg in Dragonball is this image tha was drawn by Toriyama.
"Thats R2D2. This must mean that STARWARS is connected to Dragonball, and therefore feats in Starwars Scale to movies."
See how rediculous that sounds? It's the same thing with Cooler in GT.
Star Wars takes place in a different Dimension that is not apart of Original Dragonball. Similarly The Cooler's Revenge Movie takes place in completely separate dimmension from Original Dragonball.
Arguement 4
"Goku used the Super Dragon Fist Twice. That means Movie 13 Wrath of the Dragon must of taken place."
It's a Technique. Just because he kniws Technique from a Movie, doesn't mean he scales from that Movie. Its rediculously weak arguement.
Let me show you another Comparision.
This is an Image from Dragonball. Toriyama has Shown R2D2, and he has shown that Light sabers can be used in DB. That means HE MUST scale from the Starwars Fanchise.
Again, it sounds rediculous, and is weak arguement. The concept of Movies scaling to GT is litrally a contradiction of the Authors intention/ statements fron the interview, so thats proof enough.
Cooler and The Dragon Fist, do not Make Movies canon to GT, just as R2D2 and the Lightsaber do not make Starwars Scale to Dragonball.
In other words Goku using Dragon Fist in GT doesn't directly prove that it's canon to Movie 13, it's just a technique that Toei created for him. There's no direct mention of anything movie related in the entirety of GT besides the single frame with Cooler's appearance
Conclusion.
From the the above analysis, we have deducted that :
• Movies Take place in a Seperate Dimension
• Toriyama States GT carries on from the OG Dragonball
• That Fusion Reborn Does Not scale or connect to GT
• That ALL movies are connected to Fusion Reborn.
• That Cooler is just an easter egg and/or a Mistake.
• That a technique from a movie doesn't mean you scale from it.
This means that Movies do not Scale to GT, and that GT is the continuation if TORIYAMA'S original Dragonball anime.
Firstly I want to list the arguements that GT does scale from Movies.
1) Vegeta Knows and Suggests the Fusion Dance
2) The GT Perfect files show a Picture of SSJ Gogeta from the Fusion Reborn Movie.
3) Theres a Shot of Cooler in the Super 17 Arc.
4) Goku uses the Super Dragon First from Movie 13.
I will adress all arguements above after I define what Akira Toriyama thinks of the Dragonball Movies and the Dragonball GT Series.
What Toriyama thinks of DBZ Movies and GT
When Toriyama is asked in an Interview about the DBZ Movies, he states that they are STORIE(S) that take place in A different DIMENSION.
When asked about the Original series, he responds with comments in portains to Majin Buu.
Toriyama checks the plot and the story for movies that Toei sends him, so he is stil King of Dragonball.
"Stories, A, Dimension". Stories is Plural, while the words "A" and "Dimension" are SINGULAR.
This means that ALL DBZ Movies take place in the SAME Dimension/Timeline.
"It can be interpreted as..."
No. This a statement from the author. He's a simple man. You take the DIRECT OBJECTIVE definition of his statements. All movies take place in the same dimension.
Toriyama States that Dragonball GT is a Side story that is the continuation of the ORIGINAL Dragonball.
We OBJECTIVELY defined what Toriyama considers original. So that means GT is the continuation of the DBZ anime, NOT including the Movies, as they are not classified.
And don't give me your personal Interpretations.
Arguement 1
"Vegeta suggests the fusion dance, and does the dance perfectly on his first try, he has to have known it from Fusion Reborn from when Goku showed him the posses."
Very easy to debunk this. Vegeta states Inside of Buu that he knows about the fusion dance AND has seen it from the Afterlife. So Vegeta already has Fusion's concepts in his head, and already has witnessed it. So he knows the poses from then.
Now look at this.
After Fusing into Gogeta vs Omega Shenron, they defused right? Goku states to Vegeta that "You've already done it ONCE." Emphasis on the once part. Goku have fused Via a dance TWICE. Once in Fusion Reborn and Once in GT. Since they've fused Only once, this means Fusion Reborn did not happen.
This means Fusion Reborn does NOT scale to GT. And we showed earlier that via statements from the author that the DBZ movies are all in one dimension/timeline.
It should be noted that the man that Created the plot for Dragonball Movies is Takao Koyama. He created the all the DBZ movies from Movie 1-13. And he created the Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans MOVIE, that was cut down to and Ova Later on. It would make sense that the creator of all these movies, would have them take place in a single timeline. Evidence bellow.
Let me PROVE IT to you. In Dragonball Z Fusion Reborn Movie 12, its shown all movies are connected.
As you can see Villians from each movie are in the Fusion Reborn movie, and thus are connected im the same timeline.
Medamacha is connected to Lord Slug, who is connected to Broly, Cooler and Turles in Plan to eradicate the Saiyans Movie.
Cooler is obviously connected to all Cooler Movies, and the same can be said for all Broly Movies.
Movie 2 Worlds Strongest
Movie 3 Tree of might
Movie 4 Lord Slug
Movie 5 Cooler's Revenge
Movie 6 Super Android 13
Movie 7 Return of Cooler
Movie 8 Broly the Legendary Super Saiyan
Movie 9 Bojack Unbound
Movie 10 Broly Second Coming
Movie 11 Bio Broly
Litrally ALL movies apart from Movie 13 Wrath of the Dragon are connected to Fusion Reborn. The only reason Wrath of the dragon isn't referenced in Movie 12 is because it was released after it. The writer has made it ABUNDANTLY clear that Movies are all part of one timeline.
Even in the Poster for Fusion Reborn, there is a picture of Dr. Wheelo from The World's strongest Movie
But I don't want to make any assumptions, I will deal with Movie 13 in arguement 4.
Movie 12 Takes place between Fat Buu and Kid Buu. Yet Ultmate Gohan is shown on Earth with Humans Alive.
When Gohan was on Earth, ALL Humans were dead. And only wished back DURING the fight with Kid Buu. This is a complete contradiction to the canon.
Arguement 2
Theres a Picture of SSJ Gogeta from Fusion Reborn and it says that it made his first appearence there.
Actually the Guide says the Concept of Gogeta first made his Debut the Fusion Reborn MOVIE in 1995. It says NOTHING about SSJ4 Gogeta being from the Fusion Reborn movie.
"It can be interpreted as..."
I already told you. No. Look at the conext, look at the text, and then take it at face value. Because anything else is assumption and Headcanon.
It states Gogeta's CONCEPT made his debut in a the Movie. If Gogeta had made his Debut in Fusion rebornN then the guide would of simpily said, Gogeta made his debut in Fusion Reborn. But they specify Concept, i.e its just Gogeta, as a thing that was created and debuted in the Fusion Reborn Movie.
Fusion Reborn Via statements from the Show disproves this Guide. Show statements>Guide.
Arguement 3
"Cooler in the Super 17 arc was shown returning from Hell, therefore GT has to scale from Movies."
Sorry but the Show is made by Toei. Toriyama states that he left it up Toei to do the Job. Cooler's appearence is mearly an accident.
If thats not a Good enough reason for you, then lets try this. Cooler is shown on a TV, for 1 Frame. 1 single Frame. This is something that Shows do, known as an Easter Egg. Cooler is the only movie Villian Shown and has no other participation to GT other than this ONE frame.
An example of an easter egg in Dragonball is this image tha was drawn by Toriyama.
"Thats R2D2. This must mean that STARWARS is connected to Dragonball, and therefore feats in Starwars Scale to movies."
See how rediculous that sounds? It's the same thing with Cooler in GT.
Star Wars takes place in a different Dimension that is not apart of Original Dragonball. Similarly The Cooler's Revenge Movie takes place in completely separate dimmension from Original Dragonball.
Arguement 4
"Goku used the Super Dragon Fist Twice. That means Movie 13 Wrath of the Dragon must of taken place."
It's a Technique. Just because he kniws Technique from a Movie, doesn't mean he scales from that Movie. Its rediculously weak arguement.
Let me show you another Comparision.
This is an Image from Dragonball. Toriyama has Shown R2D2, and he has shown that Light sabers can be used in DB. That means HE MUST scale from the Starwars Fanchise.
Again, it sounds rediculous, and is weak arguement. The concept of Movies scaling to GT is litrally a contradiction of the Authors intention/ statements fron the interview, so thats proof enough.
Cooler and The Dragon Fist, do not Make Movies canon to GT, just as R2D2 and the Lightsaber do not make Starwars Scale to Dragonball.
In other words Goku using Dragon Fist in GT doesn't directly prove that it's canon to Movie 13, it's just a technique that Toei created for him. There's no direct mention of anything movie related in the entirety of GT besides the single frame with Cooler's appearance
Conclusion.
From the the above analysis, we have deducted that :
• Movies Take place in a Seperate Dimension
• Toriyama States GT carries on from the OG Dragonball
• That Fusion Reborn Does Not scale or connect to GT
• That ALL movies are connected to Fusion Reborn.
• That Cooler is just an easter egg and/or a Mistake.
• That a technique from a movie doesn't mean you scale from it.
This means that Movies do not Scale to GT, and that GT is the continuation if TORIYAMA'S original Dragonball anime.
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