The Fate of the World (Neo Metal Sonic vs Yhwach) [13-8-1]

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Since 3-A has no resistance to absorption hax then a 8-B would affect him.

what your going to say 8-B absorption can’t effect a 7-A with no resistance to absorption hax unless it’s proven

 

[Omegabronic]

The reason why the Sonic has the Acausality Type 4 seems to be insufficient.

it is sufficient from this thread:
In Sonic Mania, super forms are able to function in the Egg Reverie Zone, a dimension where time and space behave erratically. This is evidenced by the in-game timer constantly jumping back and forth, indicating that time here behaves in a non-linear fashion. Now looking the definition of Type 4 acausality:

“Irregular Causality: Characters with this type of Acausality operate on a different and irregular system of cause and effect than regular causality. This grants them resistance to abilities such as Causality Manipulation, Fate Manipulation, and Precognition, among others.”

 

[Hellscream]

That wasn't even my question. And I agree on you with that. But that's because there's a potency difference between tier 8 and 3. Not a range difference. Tho it's a different story if said Tier 8 was shown absorbing Tier 3's entirely

The difference between 8-B and 3-A is a finite amount, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is infinite, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is bigger than 8-B and 3-A just saying.

 

[Omegabronic]

The difference between 8-B and 3-A is a finite amount, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is infinite, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is bigger than 8-B and 3-A just saying.

which is irrelevant when talking about range, this is you talking about power, but for hax all that matters is the dimensionality and if the character has shown the ability to copy things on this dimensional level

 

[LaserPrecision]

The difference between 8-B and 3-A is a finite amount, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is infinite, the difference between low2-c and 2-A is bigger than 8-B and 3-A just saying.

This hasn't anything to do with my question. Let me quote it in case you didn't see it

It seems you're claiming range is a limitation of copying abilities. Do you believe a character who could copy 4D existence erasure with 10 meters of range could copy 3D Existence Erasure with Planetary range?

I want your answer to that question. It will help me understand your train of thought better and lead to better discourse

 

[Hellscream]

Range is indeed a limitation, when that said ability is fundamentally based on it's range??
Especially when it's infinitely above what that said character has been shown to copy?

"Do you believe a character who could copy 4D existence erasure with 10 meters of range could copy 3D Existence Erasure with Planetary range?"
This has nothing to do with what im saying. in this specific scenario, yes of course that's not an NLF, but asuming that a character who can copy 4-D existence erasure with a 10 meter distance, can automatically copy a 4-D existence erasure with infinite range is an NLF.

 

[CodeCCLL]

it is sufficient from this thread:
In Sonic Mania, super forms are able to function in the Egg Reverie Zone, a dimension where time and space behave erratically. This is evidenced by the in-game timer constantly jumping back and forth, indicating that time here behaves in a non-linear fashion. Now looking the definition of Type 4 acausality:

“Irregular Causality: Characters with this type of Acausality operate on a different and irregular system of cause and effect than regular causality. This grants them resistance to abilities such as Causality Manipulation, Fate Manipulation, and Precognition, among others.”

Then I think it's an incon. Yhwach uses sternritter schrifts. With The Visioner ability, Yhwach becomes an Abstract Existence (Type 1) . (İnformation Manipulation Type 2) So Sonic can't interact.

 

[BEASTHEART8800]

Metal for Bronic's reasons

 

[LaserPrecision]

Range is indeed a limitation, when that said ability is fundamentally based on it's range??
Especially when it's infinitely above what that said character has been shown to copy?

"Do you believe a character who could copy 4D existence erasure with 10 meters of range could copy 3D Existence Erasure with Planetary range?"
This has nothing to do with what im saying. in this specific scenario, yes of course that's not an NLF, but asuming that a character who can copy 4-D existance erasure with a 10 meter distance, can automatically copy a 4-D existance erasure with infinite range is an NLF.

To simplify it; You think a character who is shown to mimic 3D hax with planetary range couldn't at all copy the 3D hax of an ability with universal or high universal range? At absolute worst, wouldn't we just assume they copy the ability but have less range with it? Or do you also disagree with that?

 

[Hellscream]

To simplify it; You think a character who is shown to mimic 3D hax with planetary range couldn't at all copy the 3D hax of an ability with universal or high universal range? At absolute worst, wouldn't we just assume they copy the ability but have less range with it? Or do you also disagree with that?

Yes, that's correct.
Assuming he can copy the ability, but just with less range is also an NLF

 

[LaserPrecision]

Yes, that's correct.
Assuming he can copy the ability, but just with less range is also an NLF

Why would it be a nlf if the character is shown to copy the exact same hax with less range to copy an ability with the same potency but more range but only gain the ability without the range of the original?

 

[Undylan]

Then I think it's an incon. Yhwach uses sternritter schrifts. With The Visioner ability, Yhwach becomes an Abstract Existence (Type 1) . (İnformation Manipulation Type 2) So Sonic can't interact.

He doesn't use them in-character.

And I don't see why Metal can't copy them either.

 

[Hellscream]

Why would it be a nlf if the character is shown to copy the exact same hax with less range to copy an ability with the same potency but more range but only gain the ability without the range of the original?

Because the almighty works, by viewing, and manipulating an infinite amount of possibilities at once?
The almighty fundamentally works based on this.
If a character copies an ability that is capable of manipulating a single future / possibility why would you assume that he's capable of copying an ability that's capable of manipulating an infinite amount of them?

 

[LaserPrecision]

He doesn't use them in-character.

And I don't see why Metal can't copy them either.

Well he hasn't copied anything similar to abstract existence before. I don't think he'd be able to do so here. He can copy biological things tho such as the intellect and knowledge of whoever he copies, allowing him to be aware of how all their abilities work and what not.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Because the almighty works, by viewing, and manipulating an infinite amount of possibilities at once?
The almighty fundamentally works based on this.
If a character copies an ability that is capable of manipulating a single future / possibility why would you assume that he's capable of copying an ability that's capable of manipulating an infinite amount of them?

Simple enough to explain. If an ability grants you precognition of EVERYTHING within your range, and your range is 1 universe, you're limited to precognition in one universe. However, if someone who had far greater range (say infinite universes), they'd see into infinite universes due to the ability being limited by the users range. That's how I'd interpret it if you want my opinion

 

[Hellscream]

Yhwach doesn't view a linear future. that's not how the almighty works, saying that he can copy it means that he can copy yhwach's ability to view an infinite amount of future / possibilites. To say that he can, you need something on the same scale.
You need very concrete evidence for that, no interpretations, or assumptions.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Yhwach doesn't view a linear future. that's not how the almighty works, saying that he can copy it means that he can copy yhwach's ability to view an infinite amount of future / possibilites. To say that he can, you need something on the same scale.
You need very concrete evidence for that, no interpretations, or assumptions.

I mean you can fill in the example analogy with his ability. I simplified the ability for the sake of it being easier to word. But his ability to see infinite futures is because he has 2-A range, isn't it? If he had lesser range, it wouldn't be able to see into as many as infinite universes.

 

[Omegabronic]

He doesn't use them in-character.

And I don't see why Metal can't copy them either.

what is the current vote count?

 

[Undylan]

what is the current vote count?

It’s one vote but I suppose I can add myself to the vote count. So two.

 

[Hellscream]

Your votes need to actually have valid reasoning behind them.
Sonic can't copy the almighty.

 

[Omegabronic]

Your votes need to actually have valid reasoning behind them.
Sonic can't copy the almighty.

so? sonic resists it with acausality

 

[Omegabronic]

Metal for Bronic's reasons

It’s one vote but I suppose I can add myself to the vote count. So two.

3 actually

 

[Hellscream]

Does sonic resist his 4-D power absorption?
Yhwach absorbed the almighty from the soul king, so he can absorb any and all hax in the sonic verse, and sonic has no way to put yhwach down.

 

[Hellscream]

I will make a thread for the acausality, it does not seem like acausality to me the reasoning is very iffy.

 

[Omegabronic]

Does sonic resist his 4-D power absorption?
Yhwach absorbed the almighty from the soul king, so he can absorb any and all hax in the sonic verse, and sonic has no way to put yhwach down.

absortion requires touch, the boost gives an forcefield making it impossible for him to touch metal direactly, and since it gives and 8x boost and metal can one shot, then it is more likely for metal to one tap him

 

[Omegabronic]

I will make a thread for the acausality, it does not seem like acausality to me the reasoning is very iffy.

it fits the description

 

[Hellscream]

Absorption doesn't require touch, there's sankt altar. a ranged power absorbing ability that yhwach possesses, it just appears around his opponent and absorbs anything that's inside. Yhwach has multiple types of absorption just saying.
The forcefield gets absorbed, doesn't matter. metal one shots yhwach, yhwach resurrects himself through fate hax, proceeds to absorbs any ability he has.

 

[Undylan]

Absorption doesn't require touch, there's sankt altar. a ranged power absorbing ability that yhwach possesses, it just appears around his opponent and absorbs anything that's inside. Yhwach has multiple types of absorption just saying.
The forcefield gets absorbed, doesn't matter. metal one shots yhwach, yhwach resurrects himself through fate hax, proceeds to absorbs any ability he has.

Metal Sonic can seal and/or BFR with Chaos Control and Master Emerald.

 

[Omegabronic]

Absorption doesn't require touch, there's sankt altar. a ranged power absorbing ability that yhwach possesses, it just appears around his opponent and absorbs anything that's inside.

chaos control to go outside of it

 

[Hellscream]

Yhwach can see himself being sealed in the future, and nulls it, BFR is not working against characters with interdimensional travel and 2-A range.

 

[Omegabronic]

Yhwach can see himself being sealed in the future, and nulls it, BFR is not working against characters with interdimensional travel and 2-A range.

acausality type 4, he would not see it, does he 2-A dimensional travel?

 

[Hellscream]

He can see the effects of being sealed... just like he can see the effect of death. Yhwach can still see and manipulate his own fate.
acausality doesn't change that.

 

[Omegabronic]

He can see the effects of being sealed... just like he can see the effect of death.

acausality type 4 grants resistance to precognition, he would not see metal's actions

Yhwach can still see and manipulate his own fate.
acausality doesn't change that.

yeah, but he couldn't see that fate since it would require him to see the results of metal's actions, which he can't due to acausality type 4

 

[Hellscream]

he would see the effects of the actions that sonic made on himself, that's how manipulating your own fate works, if sonic blows yhwach up, yhwach can see himself blowing up in the future and undo that said future.

 

[Omegabronic]

he would see the effects of the actions that sonic made on himself, that's how manipulating your own fate works, if sonic blows yhwach up, yhwach can see himself blowing up in the future and undo that said future.

again, to see the effects he needs to see the actions, due to the acausality the effects, that are tied to the actions, are not possible to be seen

 

[Hellscream]

yet again, he can see the effects on his own body taking place, yhwach simply does not see the actions that sonic makes through his precognition.
sonic has acausality type 4, not yhwach, yhwach's body can still get affected and manipulated by fate hax.

If he gets killed, he can see it and undo it.

Prove that he can't see his own death, despite being able to manipulate the entirety of his own fate.

 

[Omegabronic]

yet again, he can see the effects on his own body taking place, yhwach simply does not see the actions that sonic makes through his precognition.
sonic has acausality type 4, not yhwach, yhwach's body can still get affected and manipulated by fate hax.

If he gets killed, he can see it and undo it.

how would he see the effect if he can't see metal at all?

 

[ShakeResounding]

I have never seen such wacky statements from this forum. If a 5-B character doesn't resist absorption, an 8-B can absorb them. If a 9-B has durability negation tied to hax that a 2-A doesn't resist, the 2-A gets negated. That's the end of it.

 

[Hellscream]

I have never seen such wacky statements from this forum. If a 5-B character doesn't resist absorption, an 8-B can absorb them. If a 9-B has durability negation tied to hax that a 2-A doesn't resist, the 2-A gets negated. That's the end of it.

 

[ShakeResounding]

Homie thinks he can change the forum's history.

YES, that is exactly how it works because that is always how its worked here.