The Didact(Halo) vs Caleb (Blood)

[KarmodF]

I mean their weaponry isnt that bizarre but when the Forerunners encounter them their tech. seem extrange and complex, even Chief who had weaponry the Didact knew it was a piece of shit got ripped out of his hands, kinda, but you get the point, even something like a Voodoo doll or a simple double barrle shotgun would get ripped out of Caleb's hand or get crushed by his TK, but if you insist i can go to the "deepest" in Halo lore ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°).

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Again, Didact knew that the weapons Chief possessed were such to begin with. And in the final encounter, one of the weapons Chief had explicitly wasn't a "piece of shit", as it was capable of harming him and its explosion straight-up weakened him to the point that he couldn't even prevent himself from falling from where he stood. (Why he tried to TK-crush Chief instead of making an attempt to pull the bomb off himself is beyond me...)

Meanwhile Caleb comes from a verse where magic and high-powered technology exist, so he'll have an idea of how dangerous Didact is just from looking at him, and will certainly be spurred into complete seriousness if the latter manages to pinball him all over the place with TK.

To say nothing of the possibility that Caleb will go for the Flayer or the Voodoo Dolls right away, since again, the Didact is an obvious threat in his eyes.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Yeah, magic doesn't exist in the Halo verse, so Didact isn't recognizing Voodoo doll as a weapon. Anyway, voting for Caleb for Mr King's reasons.

 

[Schnee_One]

Caleb for Kings reasons

 

[DMUA]

Caleb for the reasons above.

 

[KarmodF]

Meh, i will still go with the Didact, he can easily restrain with Telekinesis, most of his powers can BFR'd or OHK Caleb quite easily, not to mention that he can still comeback thanks to bodyhoping.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Didact ain't coming back once if his soul is destroyed, and Didact would only have bodies significantly weaker than his own to hop to.

 

[VersusJunkie54]

Meh, i will still go with the Didact, he can easily restrain with Telekinesis, most of his powers can BFR'd or OHK Caleb quite easily, not to mention that he can still comeback thanks to bodyhoping.

Didact would win if he was bloodlusted, but i'd be a massive curbstomp and wouldn't get added.

 

[Schnee_One]

In character is more interesting anyway

 

[KarmodF]

Didact would win if he was bloodlusted, but i'd be a massive curbstomp and wouldn't get added.

I know, all i wrote is in-character, bloodlusted would just open a Portal and slice him in half.

 

[Schnee_One]

Bump

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Bump

 

[Thatoneguy78]

Caleb fra

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

2 more to go

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Bump

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Caleb - 5 Didact - 1; just 2 more votes.

 

[Phoenix821]

Caleb FRA

 

[VersusJunkie54]

Nice, Caleb will be getting his first win.

 

[Theglassman12]

Caleb should take this for the reasons stated above.

 

[KarmodF]

I tought OP's cant vote or something like that.

 

[VersusJunkie54]

****, I somehow forgot I was the OP.... Derp! Now I feel and look like an idiot Anyways, I think this is concluded.

 

[KarmodF]

I think I am gonna give a little bit of debuk tomorrow, I have some problems with King's reasoning/vote/reply/message/comment/statement/quote.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Grace Period is still 22 more hours, and I'm pretty sure Mr King will have some counter arguments. Also, I forgot to mention that Caleb defeated Tchernobog; he has much of the same if not better hax than Didact and is stronger tier wise.

 

[VersusJunkie54]

The Composer would put Caleb down without a doubt. But Didact doesn't lead with that.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I noticed Caleb should have more hax resistances; Tchernobog has Reality Warping, which is arguably the best hax ability out there; it's on par with Plot Manipulation, Causality manipulation among other things.

 

[KarmodF]

Tchernobog's reality warping isn't reality warping, just some sort of Universal existance or some sorts, not to mention that fighting somebody with an especific abilitie doesnt automaticly give you resistance to that ability, that would be as stupid as giving resistances to a character because it can tank a beam composed of various abilities.

Its more among the lines of Spatial Manipulation instead of Reality Warping.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Not sure where you're getting that kind of information, but you should talk to Mr King about it since he's the Blood expert. And no, it's not simply because, "he has that ability," he actually tried to use it against Caleb and Caleb resisted it. Caleb even becomes the Tchernobog in Blood II, in which Caleb ends up becoming the one in control in the end.

 

[KarmodF]

Because using a certain ability and tanking said one doesnt automatically give you resistance to the same one, I think there are some exceptions, like EE, but Tchernobog isnt even Reality Warping, is more akind to 2-C or Spatial Manipulation since he keeps realities away from each other, even statements can lack the explanation of the ability.

If King explains it better perhaps it would be more proper to consider.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Except if a character is able to hax multiple characters simultaneously and very casually and the same ability coming from the same character using all their might is unable to do the same thing to character B, then Character B has some pretty solid resistance.

And nah, 2-C seems very high-balled. And actually, it's more like Space-Time manipulation; which can still lead to reality warping. He pretty much resurrects himself by resetting time and space. Though, he's also somewhat of an abstract being which is where his Non-Corporeal status comes from.

 

[KarmodF]

Thats the main problem, isnt even looks like Reality Warping and is more like some sort of Keeper to see if this collide, fusion or whatever, context is very important in this case, so it can be prove to bee hax or just some sort of status, "being the main force which binds and separates realities from each other" could just be missinterpretation.

And his reality warping looks Non-Combat applicable whatsoever.

With all of this I think I wouldnt have time to post my "debunkle", lol.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Okay, ignore the Reality Warping part, he still has Permanent Possession, Matter Manipulation (Complete destruction of those he possesses), Soul Manipulation, BFR, better version of Immortality Type 6 than Didact, Madness Manipulation (Which is arguably much more potent than Mind Manipulation), and Power Absorption. All things that Caleb dealt with, and most of it has far more priority of Didact's stuff. Well, BFR is a lower level than slipspace portals, but "Reality Warping/Space Manipulation" sounds a lot like it could counter that aspect if what you're saying is true, but everything else I just mention seems far more potent than the Composer.

 

[KarmodF]

The problem is that Didact only needs to restrain him with Tk and BFR him, wich is in character, coupled with the fact that MrKing's knowledge on the Didact is Halo 4 Cinematics wich are fulled with PIS.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Except Didact only does that to foes he considers a threat. He's just going to view Caleb as a drug addict with toys/dolls as mentioned above. Didact still leads with telekinesis, but he still mostly just throws opponents around. He rarely uses BFR unless there's like a big war going on. That's how he killed Spartan Black Team was by crushing them. Also forgot that Caleb had Precognition, so he's probably going to go for the kill via Soul Destruction, and Telekinesis isn't going to stop Caleb from using his VooDoo dolls.

 

[KarmodF]

TK is going to restrain Caleb from using his weapons since it applies to full body, he doesnt play around with his target like Halo 4, he actually suffocates them, not to mention that the whole "Doesnt consider him as a threath" is a very baseless statement considering that he is more likely to kill in-defensive civilians and animals, he straight up murdered civilizations without mercy, he is gonna OHK Caleb if he has the oportunity thanks to BFR or Portal Creation, he isnt gonna paly around, not to mention that using Retrain Fields and Slipstream Ruptures is something that every Forerunner does in a battle, he isnt just gonna play around with an enemie and let himself get himself in a big trouble, also not because he was able to survive a certain hax from an enemie it means he is gonna ignore the effects of others.

Also the fact that Voodoo dolls's description conflicts with his abilitie mention, since it just says that he pins a needle and causes damage on the target's limb not destroying souls, also Leech life (His most effective weapon in this match) deals Soul Damage, not destruction and it also damges Caleb's soul.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Except Caleb is still physically stronger and would still be able to move his arms and his legs. It's not just about lifting strength, but he can still punch or kick to break free from Telekinesis; that's how strong willpower works. Voodoo Doll has killed Intangible Souls that don't even have a body, so Voodoo Doll does still destroy souls. Also, Caleb has dealt with portal creators like Naga (Blood), and Tchernobog. And there are other enemies who make use of BFR whom Caleb deals with.

And yes, killing defenseless civilians, but not by using BFR. He did so just by crushing them.

 

[KarmodF]

They are kinda equal due to Didact's possibly Low 7-C, he would break out of TK by just Willpower is kinda baseless considering the efect that Restraining Fields have, like sealing a enemie or ship to Space, Voodoo Dolls and Leech are stated to be soul damage, not destruction, if the Didact gets his "Essence" damaged he would 100% go for the kill, Naga has portals, but not in the same way Didact does, he can create ruptures with sheer tought, he can create one below Caleb in an instant, not to mention Summoning wich can summon Low 7-C warriors, better Regen if Caleb uses Voodoo Dolls on one of his limbs and the fact that Caleb has his various weakness, like bad tactics and others.

No, he didnt just "crush them" its just mention various times in the novels that he commited massive murder in his crusade in the Milky Way.

 

[VersusJunkie54]

Don't forget that a bloodlusted Didact stomps hard. But Caleb still takes in character match.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

But his 8-A key is what's being used; and the 8-A feat still scales to a less impressive feat. Caleb also scales due to being superior to Naga; Naga is one of the easiest bosses in Blood II and that's where the Casual Magnitude 5 earthquake came from. Also, restraining fields is under the assumption that there's hardlight nearby. Standard Battle Assumptions places their location on Earth with no outside help. Didact shouldn't be having access to his "Ships" in that case, so the restraining part and composer really shouldn't be hear unless stated by the OP. Caleb still dealt with people who can summon portals from below Caleb even while trying to possess him, so it's not that much different from what Caleb faced before.

Commited massive murder, yes, but that could mean telekinesis, or using guns and explosives. That doesn't imply he just BFR's civilians. Also, I'm not actually sure if the Composer would actually work on Caleb even if he had it. It's never been shown to work on undead beings; it's only been shown to work on humans and mortal aliens who aren't that much different from humans. Doesn't work on robots, since it basically turns people into robots or computer AI's. It doesn't work on mindless or parasitic creatures such as the Flood. But there's really no proof if it works on Zombies and it certainly doesn't work on intangible or non-corporeal beings. Which Caleb arguably becomes in the second game.

 

[VersusJunkie54]

I don't know where the Didact's constraint fields needing hardlight comes from. They are clearly emitted by his armor. The Didact's equipment, like his ship, and the Composer are his standard equipment. And he has that here. There's been a new rule put in place that matches restricting one character's ability cannot be added. And I'd rather Caleb get his first legit win.

Caleb being undead doesn't affect anything. The Composer is best against sentient organic beings. Caleb is obviously sentient, and organic. And not really a Zombie, since he obviously thinks. The Flood are a parasitic lifeform with a decentralized consciousness. He's not like Alex Mercer who is immune to the Composer by virtue of having a similarish biology to the Flood.

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Just for the record, Caleb doesn't resist Tchernobog's matter manipulation. He's as victim to Tchernobog's matter hax as anyone else. They only reason Tcher didn't vaporize him down to his boots was (presumably) because he needed him whole as a contingency in case he was defeated. Hard to possess someone when there's nothing left of them.

Caleb doesn't "become" Tchernobog, either. He simply absorbs his essence and reality-binding powers after the latter fails to possess him. It's not even made clear whether or not he knew he gained Tcher's powers prior to Blood II; part of the reason weird shit happens to reality in that game is because Caleb explicitly hasn't been using the latter's powers and has been letting the fabric of existence decay as a result, and he has to actively use said powers at the end of the game in order to rebind and restore things. (Though we don't see much except for a shitty animation of him raising his hands and floating into the air moments before the game's credits start rolling. Christ, I hate what they did with that game...)

That said, 2-C Tchernobog is a ridiculous highball. We don't know anything about how large the other realities are in comparison to Earth and the main universe, or how many of them even exist besides Caleb's reality and the Ancient One's reality. Tcher's plan was also far too limited to assume he was capable of affecting entire universes; his goal was to take over the planet ("I shall throw open the door between worlds and inherit the Earth"), and he needed Caleb's accumulated power in order to properly do that. Caleb got said power from killing three 8-A beings, eating the heart of one of his fellow Chosen, and eviscerating a ton of fodder Cabal members, all of which (even through ridiculous amounts of calc-stacking) doesn't equate to Tier 2 at all.

Voodoo Dolls and Leech are stated to be soul damage, not Destruction

That doesn't change what this does: