The Darkest Knight vs Bill Cipher

[ShionAH]

That just means he won't know shit that isn't in his verse, the whole seeing the multiverse, seeing the future all at once and all this other funny stuff still applies.

Acasuality 4?

 

[Chariot190]

He can see what happens to himself to circumvent that.

 

[StrymULTRA]

He can see what happens to himself to circumvent that.

Acausality 4 kinda of says that precognition just does not work though? I don't think he would be able to comprehend what areally happens to him, as any action Bill takes is not readable from it.

 

[ShionAH]

He can see what happens to himself to circumvent that.

Thats not how Aca 4 affects Precognition

Batman would not be able to see the effects Bill caused because he does not obey cause and effect

 

[Chariot190]

He doesn't need to see what Bill does, he just needs to know what happens to himself. The actions still occur after all.

And if this is actually what you're both about to argue, all that would do is set him off and use everything anyway if he there's a dude he can't even perceive properly given his whole schtick is to always be prepared.

 

[ShionAH]

He doesn't need to see what Bill does, he just needs to know what happens to himself. The actions still occur after all.

They wont occur, because Bil does not give a fck about causality nor about logic

I thought the same but after looking around learned Aca 4 basically nullifies Precog in fights

all that would do is set him off and use everything anyway

but what will he use first? I think he fought Wonder Woman so what did he do to her first?

 

[Chariot190]

They wont occur, because Bil does not give a fck about causality nor about logic

I thought the same but after looking around learned Aca 4 basically nullifies Precog in fights

I would say that shouldn't matter given the exorbitant amount of wacky aca mfs in DC who like, obviously aren't exempt from his but eh

but what will he use first? I think he fought Wonder Woman so what did he do to her first?

Everything? And WW resists like all his hax, they ended up just throwing hands while he gaslit her or used his hax on others instead to distract her, like the powerull.
Also he's Batman, bro would unironically just use whatever's best for the situation, and he'd figure it out instantly because Batman. So probably Powernull, EE or absorption, whatever he concludes is the safest option with highest probability.

 

[ShionAH]

I would say that shouldn't matter given the exorbitant amount of wacky aca mfs in DC who like, obviously aren't exempt from his but eh

I mean if there is any scans where he uses future stuff on a character with Aca 4 then it would also work on Bill

Everything?

He uses everything at the same time?

And WW resists like all his hax,

I dont see any

 

[Chariot190]

I mean if there is any scans where he uses future stuff on a character with Aca 4 then it would also work on Bill

the actual issue is the notable ones that do have shit like that, dont have it listed because profiles stinky, like even just The Flash ffs, so i cant do shit here, it's why im not arguing that

He uses everything at the same time?

No reason why he wouldn't, he uses everything at his disposal to always win. He says this time and time again. Now he's up against a foe he doesn't have a contingency for, doesn't know anything about, and can't even see for some reason.

Absolutely everything he has is being dropped, he isn't taking any chances. Like I can not stress enough how "IC" is not a thing The Batman who Laughs, it's entirely dependent on what's happening.

I dont see any

Ain't my fault the profile is dog

 

[ShionAH]

the actual issue is the notable ones that do have shit like that, dont have it listed because profiles stinky, like even just The Flash ffs, so i cant do shit here, it's why im not arguing that

Ain't my fault the profile is dog

We have to follow the profiles though

Anyways so Batman can EE and Powernull, Bill can Transmutate, Petrification, Mind Manipulation and etc.

Who are you guys voting? I think its fair since Batmans future sight is useless so he wont know he has to pull out EE right away

@StrymULTRA opinions?

 

[Chariot190]

We have to follow the profiles though

I am, it's why I ain't arguing it working on Type 4.
But WW's profile being dog doesn't change why he did what he did in context for the latter, like, for example, if Jotaro's profile lacked time stop res, and you asked me why Dio was super cautious, wouldn't get close to him, and so on even in his time stop, I'd still say it's because Jotaro could move for a moment in time stop due to res and punch Dio's head off if he wasn't careful.

Who are you guys voting? I think its fair since Batmans future sight is useless so he wont know he has to pull out ER right away

He would though precisely because it's useless, it goes both ways. Reminder we're talking about Batman.

 

[ShionAH]

But WW's profile being dog doesn't change why he did what he did in context for the latter, like, for example, if Jotaro's profile lacked time stop res, and you asked me why Dio was super cautious, wouldn't get close to him, and so on even in his time stop, I'd still say it's because Jotaro could move for a moment in time stop due to res and punch Dio's head off if he wasn't careful.

Yeah I know you are right but we still cannot use stuff that are not listed on the profiles for vs debates

Reminder we're talking about Batman.

Which is why its actually fair, even if Bill negates his future sight Batman is still smart enough to pull his wincons

Thats why its a fair battle

 

[Chariot190]

Yeah I know you are right but we still cannot use stuff that are not listed on the profiles for vs debates

We aren't tho

Which is why its actually fair, even if Bill negates his future sight Batman is still smart enough to pull his wincons

This is probably the smartest version of Batman btw, dude is probably gonna look at Bill and figure out his whole schtick, goal and what is he based on the fact he looks like a dorito or some shit.

 

[ShionAH]

We aren't tho

Didn't you say Batman didnt use his haxes because WW resists them just a second ago.

This is probably the smartest version of Batman btw, dude is probably gonna look at Bill and figure out his whole schtick, goal and what is he based on the fact he looks like a dorito or some shit.

I mean I believe you but Batman doesn't even have Information Analysis on his page and both their Intelligence is actually close to eachother lol

 

[Chariot190]

Didn't you say Batman didnt use his haxes because WW resists them just a second ago.

Yeah? That has **** all do with profiles though, you're asking a character mentality question and context to the fight?
What WW does or does not have, does not change the context.

I mean I believe you but Batman doesn't even have Information Analysis on his page

There ain't no way, I will drop IA scans if you want.

and both their Intelligence is actually close to eachother lol

Yeah, BEFORE he's TDK

 

[ShionAH]

What WW does or does not have, does not change the context.

It kinda does, you said TDK didn't use his EE and stuff because WW has a resistance to them

Which she does not have

There ain't no way, I will drop IA scans if you want.

Look at the page, there is none

Who made it lmao

Yeah, BEFORE he's TDK

Nigh-Omniscience only works in-verse even if we assume they worked outside of the verse Bill is also capable of seeing infinite multiverses each containing infinite universes with infinite versions of himself inside them casually so their knowledge is quite similar with bill having a better feat actually because 52 universes is lower than GF cosmology

 

[Chariot190]

It kinda does, you said TDK didn't use his EE and stuff because WW has a resistance to them

Which she does not have

It doesn't. That isn't how we do things. You asked a context based question, you got an answer. Her profile being bad does not change that.
This isn't a matter of what WE accept, but rather what's written.

For example, Character A does thing, because Character B wouldn't be effected. We treat that as an outlier though for them, so they don't get it. Des that mean Character A is stupid now? No, in context that's the reason why, that's what happened. Would you still say even then? Obviously not I'd hope.

WW profile is ass, that doesn't change why said thing did not happen or why he fought the way he did.

Look at the page, there is none

Wouldn't change the fact Batman is Batman and can, in fact, figure things out, like he has that intel for damn good reason and PC Batman actually does have info based precog, and that Batman is a comp beween PC, N52, PFP.

Nigh-Omniscience only works in-verse even if we assume they worked outside of the verse Bill is also capable of seeing infinite multiverses each containing infinite universes with infinite versions of himself inside them casually so their knowledge is quite similar

What? He's smarter because he doesn't have a bunch of the same organic limits now, has way higher processing capabilities, and a bunch of other stuff, I didn't mention nigh-omni

 

[StrymULTRA]

This isn't a matter of what WE accept, but rather what's written.

Then why you don't accept Zeno's history erasure?

 

[ShionAH]

What? He's smarter because he doesn't have a bunch of the same organic limits now, has way higher processing capabilities, and a bunch of other stuff, I didn't mention nigh-omni

I mean tbh Bills processing is insane, infinite multiverses, infinite universes with infinite Bill actions. Thats like Infinite^Infinite^^Infinite information in an instant lmao

Though I dont want to argue anymore since if I keep arguing it will make me feel biased

 

[StrymULTRA]

I mean tbh Bills processing is insane, infinite multiverses, infinite universes with infinite Bill actions. Thats like Infinite^Infinite^^Infinite information in an instant lmao

That'd be Low 1-C, also scans for the multiverse being this big?

 

[Robo432343]

Read my comment again

bro if tdk nukes the entire cosmology that means bills history is also gone unless im missing something

 

[Chariot190]

I mean tbh Bills processing is insane, infinite multiverses, infinite universes with infinite Bill actions. Thats like Infinite^Infinite^^Infinite information in an instant lmao

Though I dont want to argue anymore since if I keep arguing it will make me feel biased

i mean technically same if you use the low 1-C key

Then why you don't accept Zeno's history erasure?

False equilavence, you know that wasn't what happened, and why are you actively instigating fights? That's RVR-worthy

 

[ShionAH]

bro if tdk nukes the entire cosmology that means bills history is also gone unless im missing something

Correct. Read it again.

That'd be Low 1-C, also scans for the multiverse being this big?

There is infinite Bills. There is only one Bill in each Multiverse. Only one in Nightmare Realm. Only one in Second Dimension since he is the last of his kind.

For there to be Infinite Bills the cosmology needs Infinite Multiverses

 

[Chariot190]

actually hol up that's a good point. DK's main goal is to nuke the cosmology, if he isn't busy dealing with ten fucktillion dudes stopping him at any given moment, he might just do that now that he has a chance too

 

[StrymULTRA]

There is infinite Bills. There is only one Bill in each Multiverse. Only one in Nightmare Realm. Only one in Second Dimension since he is the last of his kind.

That'd be Infinite x Infinite at best tho.

And besides, that's not above baseline anyway.

 

[ShionAH]

That'd be Infinite x Infinite at best tho.

Infinite Multiverse
Infinite Universes
Infinite Bill Actions

actually hol up that's a good point. DK's main goal is to nuke the cosmology, if he isn't busy dealing with ten fucktillion dudes stopping him at any given moment, he might just do that now that he has a chance too

Can DK deal with Causality Manipulation? Because if they will both just go for their goal then Bill would turn the universe into Nightmare Realm

 

[StrymULTRA]

Infinite Multiverse
Infinite Universes
Infinite Bill Actions

So infinite x infinite. Fodder.

 

[ShionAH]

So infinite x infinite. Fodder.

Infinite^Infinite.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Infinite^Infinite.

Now you've skipped math too? There are infinite universes per multiverse, and there are infinite multiverses, so is infinite x infinite.

Infinite^Infinite would be if there are infinite chains of multiverses, with each multiverse having its own infinite chain of multiverses and so on.

Aka get a math book instead of wanking, thanks.

 

[DanTheEyeMan01]

Is this even about DK vs BC anymore

 

[Chariot190]

Can DK deal with Causality Manipulation? Because if they will both just go for their goal then Bill would turn the universe into Nightmare Realm

Does he not have acausality?
Also what, I was just saying nothing is stopping him from nuking everything and he would too probably.
Also tbh, Batkek is 100% stopping him from doing that, his funny meme senses are passive, Bill's don't seem to be otherwise he's kind of stupid

Is this even about DK vs BC anymore

I think? I mean we're talking about them ig.

 

[ShionAH]

Does he not have acausality?

What

Also what, I was just saying nothing is stopping him from nuking everything and he would too probably.

Yeah but nothing is stopping Bill from transmutating everything into NR

 

[Chariot190]

eah but nothing is stopping Bill from transmutating everything into NR

Would he though? No offense, but the situation isn't even the same, TDK's senses are passive. Bill's precog evidently, isn't. And as such why even bother? Bill definitely is more likely to **** around, even if only a little.

TDK is going to be quicker on the draw whipping out his wincon because he knows right off the bat that whatever the **** bill is, he's an unknown wild card he can not perceive, and as such, make sure he's gone immediately.

 

[ShionAH]

Would he though? No offense, but the situation isn't even the same, TDK's senses are passive. Bill's precog evidently, isn't. And as such why even bother? Bill definitely is more likely to **** around, even if only a little.

It was literally Bills only goal. He was trying to turn the Multiverse into the Nightmare Realm so he can have a big chaotic party for eternity, just like how DK wants to end the multiverse Bill wants to free it from causality

TDK here has no information on Bill and has no definite starting move while Bill nearly always start with Transmutation and can actually learn TDKs danger if he wanted to with precognition. Feels like you are saying TDK will instantly whip out his only 2 abilities that can do shit to Bill instantly because "its batman" like tf

Btw for Bills cockiness it only works on humanoid creatures that he sees beneath him, not cosmic entities such as The Darkest Knight