• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

The commoners thread: Discussing Ultima's "On the Many, Many Incoherences of the Tiering System"

Status
Not open for further replies.
In general, is High 1-A (+) also a thing? I thought [+] modifier could only be added in Tier 1-A. But maybe that’s just my misunderstanding.
 
Could you elaborate on why? Also, some guy claimed Eua isn't Featherine. Any thoughts on that regard?
Cause she's beyond the extension of r>f layers of the witch domain, to the point that for her there's no difference between it and the human domain.

Also, Eua very likely is Featherine at some point in the past. Higu Mei pretty much aludes to this based on calling her the strongest witch or the closest to omnipotence and stuff.
 
Cause she's beyond the extension of r>f layers of the witch domain, to the point that for her there's no difference between it and the human domain.

Also, Eua very likely is Featherine at some point in the past. Higu Mei pretty much aludes to this based on calling her the strongest witch or the closest to omnipotence and stuff.
Seems good.
 
I kinda want to make a case for Tier 0 Creator, just for the old times sake seeing as the old Tier 0 is back.
 
is it a R>F anti feat if : Beings from lower levels of existence interacts with higher levels of existence via advanced technology?
Hope everyone having a good day!
 
Based on my understanding, any interaction between the fiction and real character without outside help is are anti feats

I would personally assume things like sensing their presence or analyzing them is also impossible
 
what about going to a real world,where it sees your world has a videogame
Anti-feat unless it's got some very specific context. In general, a being from the "fictional" world shouldn't be able to exert any effect on the higher world using other fictional things, and that includes their power. (Unless that power is sourced from a higher world, or is in a higher world, or something)
 
Any "Reality-Fiction relationship" where the "fiction" interacts with the "reality" by itself or with technology, powers, or forces from their "fictional" world; whether it be travelling to it, ascending to it, viewing it, manipulating it, threatening to destroy, using it to rewrite your "fictional world", or anything else, is a massive anti-feat that almost definitely guarantees it won't be considered a true Reality-Fiction relationship.

Reality can interact with fiction, fiction can't interact with reality. This is a bedrock of the Reality-Fiction relationship.
 
Btw are we just waiting for DT right now (even though he already said he disagrees with Ultima)?

Because I am not looking forward to them just vetoing the entire thread or flat-out stalling.
 
Any "Reality-Fiction relationship" where the "fiction" interacts with the "reality" by itself or with technology, powers, or forces from their "fictional" world; whether it be travelling to it, ascending to it, manipulating it, threatening to destroy, using it to rewrite your "fictional world", or anything else, is a massive anti-feat that almost definitely guarantees it won't be considered a true Reality-Fiction relationship.
Wouldn't this downgrade the Elder Scrolls then, since the highest level of the verse is transcending the dream and taking control of it?
 
Wouldn't this downgrade the Elder Scrolls then, since the highest level of the verse is transcending the dream and taking control of it?
Attaining Amaranth is moreso dissolving yourself back into the Godhead, so, less "accessing" a higher level through your own physicality (Which is the problematic part) and moreso shedding all your attributes to realize what you always were at the core.
 
Anti-feat unless it's got some very specific context. In general, a being from the "fictional" world shouldn't be able to exert any effect on the higher world using other fictional things, and that includes their power. (Unless that power is sourced from a higher world, or is in a higher world, or something)
how specific?because it is not like a fictional world on itself,it is just a world that was created by the ''real world''in the cosmology of the verse,worlds are created using a trascendental programming that allows all possible things to happen according to the programming,even if they sound contradictory.
so this real world,created the ''videogame''using that trascendental programming
 
Ultima do you count this and this as R>F?
The first: No. The second: That album is 404'd.

how specific?because it is not like a fictional world on itself,it is just a world that was created by the ''real world''in the cosmology of the verse,worlds are created using a trascendental programming that allows all possible things to happen according to the programming,even if they sound contradictory.
so this real world,created the ''videogame''using that trascendental programming
Would need to see specific scans, but if the thing from the fictional world somehow breaks through into the real world on its own, that is in fact an anti-feat.

Hello ultima I needed to ask this from you
is interaction with higher levels of existence via advanced technology considered anti feat for R>F?
Yeah. Unless there's in-verse factors remediating that. I've already talked a bit here about how ascending to higher and lower layers can be coherent depending on how the verse's cosmology works.
 
You can only interact with reality as fiction if A) a resident of that reality or a higher reality helps, or B) the body and world is fictional but their soul/heart/true self/whatever originates from a higher reality and that is what is used. Otherwise it's an anti-feat.

Basically, fiction can't interact with reality, only reality acting under the guise of fiction can interact with reality.
 
You can only interact with reality as fiction if A) a resident of that reality or a higher reality helps, or B) the body and world is fictional but their soul/heart/true self/whatever originates from a higher reality and that is what is used. Otherwise it's an anti-feat.

Basically, fiction can't interact with reality, only reality acting under the guise of fiction can interact with reality.
There's also more esoteric stuff, like the first two cases here, for instance.

The first one probably won't but I'll add some extra insight with: this, this, and this.

The second one was this.
The first is just Scoria talking about how Yahweh doesn't seem to care about anyone or anything other than Lucifer and Michael. Second is just Lucifer using "author/character" poetically to distinguish between "Creator/Ruler" and "Creation/Subject." Third is... nothing, really.

The fourth is just saying the Silver City is outside creation and can observe the universe from that vantage point, which likewise is pretty bad evidence.
 
The first is just Scoria talking about how Yahweh doesn't seem to care about anyone or anything other than Lucifer and Michael. Second is just Lucifer using "author/character" poetically to distinguish between "Creator/Ruler" and "Creation/Subject." Third is... nothing, really.
That's the point. Creation is like a game/book/fiction that God(position) plays with. None of it matters, affects, or changes him unless he wants to interact with them directly which can't work as he can only with aspects or lower emanations.
The fourth is just saying the Silver City is outside creation and can observe the universe from that vantage point, which likewise is pretty bad evidence.
Would it still be 1-A due to superiority over Creation thus time, space, causality, and dimensions? Strictly talking about the City and not the residents other than the Primum Mobile, Lucifer, and Michael.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top