1-C and 1-B are the tiers for higher infinities and cardinals. 1-A is the tier for metaphysical transcendences; Tier 0 is just a catchall category for anything metaphysical that's too big to be defined in 1-A.
Tier 1-A according to the currently tiering system, says nothing about metaphysicality, but directly mentions cardinals. Ultima's new tier is metaphysical in nature and therefore would be a great fit for the existing tier 0, with some modifications
The whole point of Ultima's new revision is to knock anything cardinal-related to High 1-B+ because the number of characters in 1-A because of cardinals is so small compared to the number there for metaphysical transcendences that there's no point in having a distinct 1-X tier for them.
In short:
What exactly does this mean when metaphysical jumps are inherently illogical.
tier 0 i s an end point because it exceeds all possible logical frameworks of the tiers below , which ultimas new proposed tier 1-A and H1-A do. You cant have a tier that exceeds all possible frameworks be in the same level as a tier within them
probably aleph1 - infinite amount of jumps?
They are inherently illogical in the same way that something being beyond dimensions entirely is illogical. It makes no sense in the real world, but fiction doesn't recognize that, so we have to accommodate for it as a fictional indexing site.
Sure, but I wouldn't describe that as being beyond any possible extensions of a conventional metaphysical jump.
No, it would not. This runs contrary to fundamental principles on this site about how transcending infinite hierarchies works.
Transcending infinite hierarchies was paired with dimensionality. What Ultima proposes throws the fundamental principles away and has to make new ones.
That a set of layers is qualitative doesn't mean one "cannot compare layers in anyway other than higher, equal, or lower" in the slightest. Some qualitative layers provide bigger jumps than others.
Can you give an example?
Just look at the marvel cosmology page. It ends in a way that the entire cosmology explained in the blog until the last topic is just a small part of a higher version of the same cosmological tree, with the highest realm of the first tree being just the very basis of the second tree.
And how do you quantify how many jumps each of those “layers” are?
Goku solos fiction
Low 1-A may just be this new "High 1-B+" he mentioned or somethingIs Ultima even going to have a Low 1-A tier? Even now, I find that to be quite the pointless tier. But in that system, it'd be even more pointless.
Pretty massive W by Ultima on the thread just now, by the way.
By looking at how the verse portrays them.
Okay but all verses are going to portray qualitive superiority in a unique and unquantifiable way that cannot he quantitively compared to other fictions. All these jumps are just going to equalized to +1.
Just like there's no objective way to compare magic systems between verses. If that's your complaint, you have a problem with fundamental Verse Equalization site standards.
This isn’t a fair comparison because we don’t give tiers based on the quality of the magic system.
By default, all qualitative jumps are assumed to be the same. If a verse portrays certain qualitative jumps as superior to others, they scale above the baseline for qualitative jumps.
Probably still 1-A, as the degree of power is irrelevant from what I understand. Like, higher beings who literally cannot even interact with a R>F below them would still be 1-A.
Spittin as always
How many verses actually do that? It sounds like we will just be deciding which qualitive jump is superior which is going to be arbitrary because there is nothing quantitative or logical about qualitative jumps.
One, a lot. Two, there's nothing logical about them, but fiction doesn't understand that, so we have to accommodate.
higher infinities do exist in fiction, the problem is equating them to dimensions with no other context ( im pretty sure the wiki has rules against that anyway)
This doesn't appear to address what I said.
e.g: the wiki already addresses the problem with dimensional tiering in some form, you cant just name drop the 69th dimension and be 1-B without context to support it
