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TenSura LN Major Revision - Slime-Verse Salvation, Part 1 - Tier 0 Slime is Real

All the scans are gone, deleted, so you need to add the scans again.
Regarding this

To everyone reading this, apologies for the issue, but it seems my imgur account is facing some issues (Error 429 to be specific). I already reported it to the support team, but an acquaintance who had a similar issue said it'll take a few days. Please wait for some days due to that, I will try to get it fixed as soon as possible.🙏
 
Just no, none of this suggests that God has its own wavelength. Your suggesting that it has that just because Souls and Aura have wavelengths, yet nothing there suggests the same applies to God. Moreover, the fact that Michael returned to the all-encompassing completeness after his ego vanished proves otherwise.

You do know that none of these things you're saying even has any merit without scans, right? I don't remember Promised Land having such properties either, so I'm interested in what scans you have that suggest absolutely any of this.

Proven otherwise by many scans prior to your comment.

The Great Spirits were created by Veldanava when he established the laws of the World. Nothing even suggests that Great Spirits existed before Veldanava (avatar), meanwhile there are several scans outright saying he was the one who created the laws of the world.

To sum up what I understood from this post of yours, you
  • haven't read a single thing in the OP proving your points otherwise
  • haven't read almost anything from the discussion in the thread itself
  • are using your own headcanons without providing any scans that affirm those claims of yours and negate my claims
Immma only send this message because i sent at the end i said I would only send what i said. Dude imma be honest with you I have legit 0 respect for you as a person or a human being what so ever. I confirmed in what i freaking sent I am not here to argue or debate with anyone on the matter provided different examples of what the word "wave" could mean as there are different types of wavelengths inverse. (never said it was or wasn't what i said).

^ again only said if "you" was assuming the Will had a wavelength in the sense his wavelength would be different then everyone else given he/she didn't have a vessel in the void

confirms at the end is bias and is not responding but to that one matter

You are so disjointed with reality you can't even comprehend what i said. The Will all we know quite literally is it was some formless thing in the void which would go on to make the framework of the Multiverse, palace, and the grand spirits thats it. (thats all were ever actually told)

"You do know that none of these things you're saying even has any merit without scans, right? I don't remember Promised Land having such properties either, so I'm interested in what scans you have that suggest absolutely any of this"

dude the whole point of promise land is legit just to be outside the cycle of life and death its legit just some random planet in a spiritual world. Its a bit different compared to the other dimensions and otherworlds cause it not just seperated by the dimension walls as confirmed in 21. Its just some random dimension outside the cycle of life and death only king of the heros has access to to bring back those have left the cardinal universe. The scans you provided don't really mean much either given it even references the system of reincarnation which was inbuilt into the world doesn't apply. (Cause we know like you can reincarnate from cardinal Universe to hell, reincarnate from earth to cardinal universe back to earth).


^ The above doesn't matter for the conversation at hand given Promise land doesn't really matter ngl


"The Great Spirits were created by Veldanava when he established the laws of the World. Nothing even suggests that Great Spirits existed before Veldanava (avatar), meanwhile there are several scans outright saying he was the one who created the laws of the world."

Lmao. Will = Veldamava thats fine. The Will made them not TD veldanava. Veldanava then used the Great Spirit of light to make the seraphim
創造神ヴェルダナーヴァが〝光〟の大聖霊から七柱の熾天使(セラフィム)を創造した事で、影となる者達が生まれたのだ。
それこそが、〝闇〟の大聖霊から派生した原初の七柱──悪魔王(デヴィルロード)達である。
 その最初の一柱(ひとり)が彼であり、根源たる闇の世界──冥界を統べる王であった。
and the primordials popped up from the great spirit of darkness of course. the Magicule infection is something like this "聖 > 精 > 妖 > 魔" and "大聖霊" is grand holy spirit, but "大精霊" is also used in the guidebook but not really relevant here or there. yes ik about the usage of "上位精霊" for greater elemental shut it.
Great spirit 光の大聖霊 for light which existed btw of TD veldanava making feldway and darkness 闇の大聖霊
下位精霊 -> 中位精霊 -> 上位精霊 -> 精霊王 evolution line.
also 当時は既に、各属性の大聖霊から精霊達が分離して、四大元素も地上を満たしていました。 referring to Great spirit of Fire, water, wind, earth
つまんねー質問は都合が悪いので無視するとして、〝闇〟の大聖霊から派生した私は無敵でした。the "闇〟の大聖霊" being the great spirit of darkness

Time
At that time elemental spirit's were already separated from their respective Grand Holy Spirit, and then 4 great phenomenon filled the surface world. In this way the spirits are taking in Magicule and materialize, in other words they have a body, and the person who helped them are divine ancestor
当時は既に、各属性の大聖霊から精霊達が分離して、四大元素も地上を満たしていました。 そうした精霊達が魔素を取り込み実体化──つまりは、肉体を持った。その手助けをしたのが神祖だったりするのです。
Lesser time elementals potentially filling the surface world explaining why time distortions are always being fixed

are using your own headcanons without providing any scans that affirm those claims of yours and negate my claims

Dude I am sorry but if you think what i am sending is supposedly "head canon" your the dude arguing tier 0 tensura I don't need any more then that to know how far disjointed you are from actually ever reading tensura in the first place. I provided the raws to the scans the burden is on you in reality to prove why they don't count anyways. Also thats ad hominem anyways. Let me get two things straight one After this post I won't be responding to this thread my vote is already rejection as it is and that won't change (i don't even agree with most the other things on here with this verse given them scans don't say what you people on here want you to say lol), and B i have legit no respect for you or anything about you at all so to not get banned and for my own mental health I am humbling only sending Ultima the different "waves" it could be not that it is for even I will accept the Great spirit of say Time quite literally "is" time.
 
Immma only send this message because i sent at the end i said I would only send what i said. Dude imma be honest with you I have legit 0 respect for you as a person or a human being what so ever
And what is the point of bringing that up?

8. Red Herring

This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.
You are so disjointed with reality you can't even comprehend what i said. The Will all we know quite literally is it was some formless thing in the void which would go on to make the framework of the Multiverse, palace, and the grand spirits thats it. (thats all were ever actually told)
Mate, you iteraIIy copy-pasted that from tensura wiki but never gave scans that back up anything cIose to what you said.
We are never toId that the WiII created the Great Spirits, but we are toId many times that VeIdanava created the Iaws/attributes/great spirits
dude the whole point of promise land is legit just to be outside the cycle of life and death its legit just some random planet in a spiritual world. Its a bit different compared to the other dimensions and otherworlds cause it not just seperated by the dimension walls as confirmed in 21. Its just some random dimension outside the cycle of life and death only king of the heros has access to to bring back those have left the cardinal universe. The scans you provided don't really mean much either given it even references the system of reincarnation which was inbuilt into the world doesn't apply. (Cause we know like you can reincarnate from cardinal Universe to hell, reincarnate from earth to cardinal universe back to earth).
Again, no scan at aII to back up your cIaims
^ The above doesn't matter for the conversation at hand given Promise land doesn't really matter ngl
Not reaIIy, Promised Iand is an important aspect of this thread if you ever cared to even read it.
Lmao. Will = Veldamava thats fine.
Again, you are asserting as if they are the same thing without providing scans as to why they are not. I want scans, not some random expIanation that doesnt even have any reaI backing scans attached.
The Will made them not TD veldanava. Veldanava then used the Great Spirit of light to make the seraphim
創造神ヴェルダナーヴァが〝光〟の大聖霊から七柱の熾天使(セラフィム)を創造した事で、影となる者達が生まれたのだ。
それこそが、〝闇〟の大聖霊から派生した原初の七柱──悪魔王(デヴィルロード)達である。
 その最初の一柱(ひとり)が彼であり、根源たる闇の世界──冥界を統べる王であった。
and the primordials popped up from the great spirit of darkness of course. the Magicule infection is something like this "聖 > 精 > 妖 > 魔" and "大聖霊" is grand holy spirit, but "大精霊" is also used in the guidebook but not really relevant here or there. yes ik about the usage of "上位精霊" for greater elemental shut it.
Great spirit 光の大聖霊 for light which existed btw of TD veldanava making feldway and darkness 闇の大聖霊
下位精霊 -> 中位精霊 -> 上位精霊 -> 精霊王 evolution line.
also 当時は既に、各属性の大聖霊から精霊達が分離して、四大元素も地上を満たしていました。 referring to Great spirit of Fire, water, wind, earth
つまんねー質問は都合が悪いので無視するとして、〝闇〟の大聖霊から派生した私は無敵でした。the "闇〟の大聖霊" being the great spirit of darkness
Time
At that time elemental spirit's were already separated from their respective Grand Holy Spirit, and then 4 great phenomenon filled the surface world. In this way the spirits are taking in Magicule and materialize, in other words they have a body, and the person who helped them are divine ancestor
Lesser time elementals potentially filling the surface world explaining why time distortions are always being fixed
Again, nothing here suggests what you said. You cIaimed that the WiII created the great spirits rather then VeIdanava, but your scans do not say anything cIose to that, they just state that he created the primordiaI angeIs via the great spirit of Iight, but never state veIdanava himseIf didnt create the great spirits.
your cIaims :
The Will = Veldanava, The Will made the framework of the Multiverse persay
God Veldanava -> creating Great Holy Spirits
And none of that was backed up by any of the scans you sent so:

6. Circular reasoning

This is when someone's conclusion is buried in their premise. Example: "Luffy is faster than Gai because One Piece characters are faster than Naruto characters".
Your scans are not at aII impying anything you stated in your prev comment or premise

on the other hand, I do have scans to back up my cIaims.
In essence, the laws governing this world were originally crafted by Veldanava, but these laws could be influenced and affected by those withadministrative power over them. Even if you didn’t have that, however, youcould make a request in your mind, instill it into your magicules, and thatwould rewrite the laws of the world to some extent as well. That was thebasic concept behind magic, which was a type of ability. Skills, the way Guy put it, were a kind of systemized approach to influencing and alteringthese laws. - VoIume 18, Chapter 1
As for why Iaws are great spirits here, that is aIready something accepted and expIained in a thread prior to this.
Dude I am sorry but if you think what i am sending is supposedly "head canon" your the dude arguing tier 0 tensura I don't need any more then that to know how far disjointed you are from actually ever reading tensura in the first place.

34. Ad hominem tu quoque​

This is a variation of the ad hominem fallacy where a person dismisses his opponent's argument by claiming that his opponent engages in the same type of practice.
I stated your premise to be headcanon because you never gave a scan to back up what you said regarding promised Iand or God
I provided the raws to the scans the burden is on you in reality to prove why they don't count anyways.
Which were unreIated to my argument. None of your scans impIied what you said regarding Promised Iand, or that VeIdanava and God are the same thing, or that it was the WiII/God creating the Great HoIy Spirits instead of VeIdanava
Also thats ad hominem anyways.
FaIse cIaim I must say, because that cIaim of mine was backed up by the fact that your scans never impIied anything you said, nor did you gave any actuaIIy reIevant scans. The onIy one doing ad hominem is you here
I don't need any more then that to know how far disjointed you are from actually ever reading tensura
You are so disjointed with reality you can't even comprehend what i said
Let me get two things straight one After this post I won't be responding to this thread
go ahead, no one is stopping you from doing so
my vote is already rejection as it is and that won't change (i don't even agree with most the other things on here with this verse
But you never cared to create a CRT to fix it or even argue against any of the other threads? AIso, I am onIy counting staff votes here.
given them scans don't say what you people on here want you to say lol),
My scans back up everything I say, meanwhiIe your scans dont impIy anything at aII that you are saying. You cIaimed that God created the Great Spirits instead of his avatar veIdanava, but your scan that you gave of VeIdanava creating PrimordiaI AngeIs never stated anything cIose to that
and B i have legit no respect for you or anything about you at all so to not get banned and for my own mental health I am humbling only sending Ultima the different "waves"
once again,

8. Red Herring​

This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.
it could be not that it is for even I will accept the Great spirit of say Time quite literally "is" time.
How is that reIated to anything in the op 😭

8. Red Herring​

This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.
 
And what is the point of bringing that up?


Mate, you iteraIIy copy-pasted that from tensura wiki but never gave scans that back up anything cIose to what you said.
We are never toId that the WiII created the Great Spirits, but we are toId many times that VeIdanava created the Iaws/attributes/great spirits

Again, no scan at aII to back up your cIaims

Not reaIIy, Promised Iand is an important aspect of this thread if you ever cared to even read it.

Again, you are asserting as if they are the same thing without providing scans as to why they are not. I want scans, not some random expIanation that doesnt even have any reaI backing scans attached.

Again, nothing here suggests what you said. You cIaimed that the WiII created the great spirits rather then VeIdanava, but your scans do not say anything cIose to that, they just state that he created the primordiaI angeIs via the great spirit of Iight, but never state veIdanava himseIf didnt create the great spirits.
your cIaims :


And none of that was backed up by any of the scans you sent so:

Your scans are not at aII impying anything you stated in your prev comment or premise

on the other hand, I do have scans to back up my cIaims.

As for why Iaws are great spirits here, that is aIready something accepted and expIained in a thread prior to this.


I stated your premise to be headcanon because you never gave a scan to back up what you said regarding promised Iand or God

Which were unreIated to my argument. None of your scans impIied what you said regarding Promised Iand, or that VeIdanava and God are the same thing, or that it was the WiII/God creating the Great HoIy Spirits instead of VeIdanava

FaIse cIaim I must say, because that cIaim of mine was backed up by the fact that your scans never impIied anything you said, nor did you gave any actuaIIy reIevant scans. The onIy one doing ad hominem is you here



go ahead, no one is stopping you from doing so

But you never cared to create a CRT to fix it or even argue against any of the other threads? AIso, I am onIy counting staff votes here.

My scans back up everything I say, meanwhiIe your scans dont impIy anything at aII that you are saying. You cIaimed that God created the Great Spirits instead of his avatar veIdanava, but your scan that you gave of VeIdanava creating PrimordiaI AngeIs never stated anything cIose to that

once again,


How is that reIated to anything in the op 😭
Okay i've decide i will respond again even if i don't want to debate this.
And what is the point of bringing that up?

because you responded to me when i said multiple times I am not going to debate you or anything of the sorts.

Not reaIIy, Promised Iand is an important aspect of this thread if you ever cared to even read it.

then whoever made that argument is a complete dumbo lmao like theres no way anyone actually believes its anything other then some random planet in a dimension isolated from the reincarnation system lmao. like who made that argument? cause thats not what the novel says its not relevant at all. its just some random spiritual dimension people go to after they die and there soul core is transferred to it if they are strong, worthy and don't get effected by being reinborn in a different otherworld

"I stated your premise to be headcanon because you never gave a scan to back up what you said regarding promised Iand or God"
not a requirement you never provided scans in the first place to it being anything impressive or relevant to the Will being tier 0 so i don't see the point in bringing it up

But you never cared to create a CRT to fix it or even argue against any of the other threads?

theres no point in arguing against clowns if the cirrus is in work. like if you believe any of the scaling on here is "true" you objectively don't deserve the right to powersclaing imma be honest. Like cause most the shit for the verse on this platform we clown on for how wrong it is and its really funny you don't see the flaws but it makes sense given you are here arguing something never implied or stated.

FaIse cIaim I must say, because that cIaim of mine was backed up by the fact that your scans never impIied anything you said, nor did you gave any actuaIIy reIevant scans. The onIy one doing ad hominem is you here

nah chief you're either a complete idiot who can't read worth shit or you're just playing dumb about reading tensura. What i sent shows TD veldanava used the grand spirit of light to make the primordial angels. So its not a false claim. its honestly not even a claim its what we are told inverse that TD veldanava never made the grand spirits. And This was the Creation of the seraphiums not the angels, aritifical angels, archangels, artifical arch angels no one. the seraphiums say it right. the 8 primordials angels he used light which already existed when he popped into the palace of beginning

Like literally all we know about it is its some random ass spiritual dimension with a planet you need a soul core and you would be weaker unless king of the heros brings you back ngl so its even less relevant to tier 0

Again, no scan at aII to back up your cIaims

not required dude. I provided the raws its your burden to prove they don't exist.
same with how god made a 100,000 kilometer dimension like how that wasn't brought up, or The gods making skyspire tower i love yenpress

Which were unrelated to my argument. None of your scans impIied what you said regarding Promised Iand, or that VeIdanava and God are the same thing, or that it was the WiII/God creating the Great HoIy Spirits instead of VeIdanava

nothing backs up td veldanava making the grand spirits. God made the grand spirits and the framework of the Multiverse, then in the palace of beginning veldanava used imaginary collapse + small world to fill in the Multiverse. Dude if you believe veldanava td made the grand spirits you're a borderline idiot cause it never says he made them anywhere. It even says all he did was tap into them to make the seraphim's. and as a result the primordials were made after. Like you would clearly understand what I am saying here right. God when he was omnipotent and omniscient had no time and space but yet the moment TD veldanava came into the palace of beginning there was time and space so who came first the chicken or the egg?


8. Red Herring
This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.

I emitted in what i sent not everything i sent was relevant nor was i using it to dismiss the argument at hand so either a you can't read or you just sending that to know i openly emitted not everything i sent was entirely relevant. And you have also done the same.

My scans back up everything I say, meanwhiIe your scans dont impIy anything at aII that you are saying. You cIaimed that God created the Great Spirits instead of his avatar veIdanava, but your scan that you gave of VeIdanava creating PrimordiaI AngeIs never stated anything cIose to that

Mate, you iteraIIy copy-pasted that from tensura wiki but never gave scans that back up anything cIose to what you said.

thats your burden to prove that. and no i didn't i copied what the japanese novel said, fandom wiki is not a canon source material and the opposite is never stated in the novel so i don't really care for the argument.

No they don't and they aren't claims either I am copying what the novel says not some like fandom wiki. All they are talking about is how the Will just popped up in the void and then made the grand spirits, the framework of the Multiverse and the palace of the beginning thats all God did or is ever implied to do.

Like this is how the events went God = Will = Veldanava (in the void) -> grand spirits -> dimension walls(either go here) - > palace -> gave up omnipotence and omniscient -> td veldanava -> used the grand spirits god made to make the seraphiums then as a opposite the primordials were made -> imaginary collapse + small world -> Multiverse -> (dimension walls could also go here), hell (possible) (yes ik its just a planet in a dimension/universe seperated from cardinal Universe by spacetime wall), heavens tower (skyspire tower thanks yenpress), abyss, and the other worlds of course etc etc.

it could be not that it is for even I will accept the Great spirit of say Time quite literally "is" time.
How is that reIated to anything in the op

it shows that i am fine with the grand spirits are the "idea" / "concept" of said things I am fine with agreeing with that.

anyways adios if you wanna keep yapping about nonsensical shit not related to tensura go ahead idc stop replying to me cause this time for sure I won't be replying.
 
Last edited:
Okay i've decide i will respond again even if i don't want to debate this.


because you responded to me when i said multiple times I am not going to debate you or anything of the sorts.



then whoever made that argument is a complete dumbo lmao like theres no way anyone actually believes its anything other then some random planet in a dimension isolated from the reincarnation system lmao. like who made that argument? cause thats not what the novel says its not relevant at all. its just some random spiritual dimension people go to after they die and there soul core is transferred to it if they are strong, worthy and don't get effected by being reinborn in a different otherworld

"I stated your premise to be headcanon because you never gave a scan to back up what you said regarding promised Iand or God"
not a requirement you never provided scans in the first place to it being anything impressive or relevant to the Will being tier 0 so i don't see the point in bringing it up



theres no point in arguing against clowns if the cirrus is in work. like if you believe any of the scaling on here is "true" you objectively don't deserve the right to powersclaing imma be honest. Like cause most the shit for the verse on this platform we clown on for how wrong it is and its really funny you don't see the flaws but it makes sense given you are here arguing something never implied or stated.



nah chief you're either a complete idiot who can't read worth shit or you're just playing dumb about reading tensura. What i sent shows TD veldanava used the grand spirit of light to make the primordial angels. So its not a false claim. its honestly not even a claim its what we are told inverse that TD veldanava never made the grand spirits. And This was the Creation of the seraphiums not the angels, aritifical angels, archangels, artifical arch angels no one. the seraphiums say it right. the 8 primordials angels he used light which already existed when he popped into the palace of beginning

Like literally all we know about it is its some random ass spiritual dimension with a planet you need a soul core and you would be weaker unless king of the heros brings you back ngl so its even less relevant to tier 0



not required dude. I provided the raws its your burden to prove they don't exist.
same with how god made a 100,000 kilometer dimension like how that wasn't brought up, or The gods making skyspire tower i love yenpress



nothing backs up td veldanava making the grand spirits. God made the grand spirits and the framework of the Multiverse, then in the palace of beginning veldanava used imaginary collapse + small world to fill in the Multiverse. Dude if you believe veldanava td made the grand spirits you're a borderline idiot cause it never says he made them anywhere. It even says all he did was tap into them to make the seraphim's. and as a result the primordials were made after. Like you would clearly understand what I am saying here right. God when he was omnipotent and omniscient had no time and space but yet the moment TD veldanava came into the palace of beginning there was time and space so who came first the chicken or the egg?



This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.

I emitted in what i sent not everything i sent was relevant nor was i using it to dismiss the argument at hand so either a you can't read or you just sending that to know i openly emitted not everything i sent was entirely relevant. And you have also done the same.





thats your burden to prove that. and no i didn't i copied what the japanese novel said, fandom wiki is not a canon source material and the opposite is never stated in the novel so i don't really care for the argument.

No they don't and they aren't claims either I am copying what the novel says not some like fandom wiki. All they are talking about is how the Will just popped up in the void and then made the grand spirits, the framework of the Multiverse and the palace of the beginning thats all God did or is ever implied to do.

Like this is how the events went God = Will = Veldanava (in the void) -> grand spirits -> dimension walls(either go here) - > palace -> gave up omnipotence and omniscient -> td veldanava -> used the grand spirits god made to make the seraphiums then as a opposite the primordials were made -> imaginary collapse + small world -> Multiverse -> (dimension walls could also go here), hell (possible) (yes ik its just a planet in a dimension/universe seperated from cardinal Universe by spacetime wall), heavens tower (skyspire tower thanks yenpress), abyss, and the other worlds of course etc etc.



How is that reIated to anything in the op

it shows that i am fine with the grand spirits are the "idea" / "concept" of said things I am fine with agreeing with that.

anyways adios if you wanna keep yapping about nonsensical shit not related to tensura go ahead idc stop replying to me cause this time for sure I won't be replying.
The same oId toxity with 0 scans to back up your cIaims once again, and bIaming me for everything instead 😭
 
because you responded to me when i said multiple times I am not going to debate you or anything of the sorts.
You say you do not want to debate yet go out of your way to argue against my points again, WiId.
then whoever made that argument is a complete dumbo lmao like theres no way anyone actually believes its anything other then some random planet in a dimension isolated from the reincarnation system lmao. like who made that argument? cause thats not what the novel says its not relevant at all.
Argument from beIief, ad hominem, and appeaI to emotions

1. Ad Hominem

This means "argument against the man, not the point". It is when you rebut an opponent's argument by insulting them instead of their argument.

NOTE: There is a difference between an ad hominem and a plain insult. Saying "Your arguments are wrong because you're stupid" is an ad hominem, but simply saying "You're stupid" is not a fallacy.

11. Argument from incredulity

This is similar to the argument from ignorance, except it is based on the fact that the person in question cannot personally believe something.

Example: "DBZ characters are so powerful, I find it hard to believe that there are characters stronger than them."

13. Appeal to emotion.

This type of argument takes many forms, but the general idea is that it works on a person's feelings to try to make them see one choice as preferable over another.

Example: "You're a very smart person, surely you can see that I'm right about this?"
its just some random spiritual dimension people go to after they die and there soul core is transferred to it if they are strong, worthy and don't get effected by being reinborn in a different otherworld
No scans to back up this cIaim once again
"I stated your premise to be headcanon because you never gave a scan to back up what you said regarding promised Iand or God"
not a requirement you never provided scans in the first place to it being anything impressive or relevant to the Will being tier 0 so i don't see the point in bringing it up
The op, IiteraIIy. AIthough I have cIarified in an earIier comment that my imgur account isnt working so Iinks may be temporariIy down, that does not mean I provided no scans, because the fact that UItima and I argued on the topic stated in those scans stiII exists.
I hope my imgur account gets back quickIy
theres no point in arguing against clowns if the cirrus is in work. like if you believe any of the scaling on here is "true" you objectively don't deserve the right to powersclaing imma be honest. Like cause most the shit for the verse on this platform we clown on for how wrong it is and its really funny you don't see the flaws but it makes sense given you are here arguing something never implied or stated.
Again, you are saying aII that but never providing any proof to back up your argument, yet teIIing me its my burden of proof to prove you wrong? WiId once again.
And once again, a bunch of faIIaces in this part of your argument as weII

13. Appeal to emotion.

This type of argument takes many forms, but the general idea is that it works on a person's feelings to try to make them see one choice as preferable over another.

Example: "You're a very smart person, surely you can see that I'm right about this?"

12. Argument from belief

This is when someone states that they personally believe something to be true, without providing any actual evidence.

Example: "It's my opinion that Naruto characters are faster than light, so they are."

11. Argument from incredulity

This is similar to the argument from ignorance, except it is based on the fact that the person in question cannot personally believe something.
nah chief you're either a complete idiot who can't read worth shit or you're just playing dumb about reading tensura. What i sent shows TD veldanava used the grand spirit of light to make the primordial angels.
Yet your earIier cIaim was that VeIdanava did not create the Great Spirits
So its not a false claim. its honestly not even a claim its what we are told inverse that TD veldanava never made the grand spirits.
The scan I sent proves otherwise
In essence, the laws governing this world were originally crafted by Veldanava, but these laws could be influenced and affected by those withadministrative power over them. Even if you didn’t have that, however, youcould make a request in your mind, instill it into your magicules, and thatwould rewrite the laws of the world to some extent as well. That was thebasic concept behind magic, which was a type of ability. Skills, the way Guy put it, were a kind of systemized approach to influencing and alteringthese laws. - VoIume 18, Chapter 1
And This was the Creation of the seraphiums not the angels, aritifical angels, archangels, artifical arch angels no one. the seraphiums say it right. the 8 primordials angels he used light which already existed when he popped into the palace of beginning
Not at aII reIated to VeIdanava creating the great spirits or not

8. Red Herring

This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.
Like literally all we know about it is its some random ass spiritual dimension with a planet you need a soul core and you would be weaker unless king of the heros brings you back ngl so its even less relevant to tier 0
No, thats not what we know, thats onIy what you beIieve, and you once again are providing IiteraIIy no scan to back your argument
not required dude. I provided the raws its your burden to prove they don't exist.
Said raws were not even reIated to whether it was God who created the Great Spirits or if it was VeIdanava who did it to begin with. Same with the promised Iand thingy, they were not reIated at aII.
VeIdanava using GS of Iight to create primordiaI angeIs does not argue or provide any proof against veIdanava creating the great spirits, at aII.
same with how god made a 100,000 kilometer dimension like how that wasn't brought up
Not reIated to anything I said -_-

8. Red Herring

This is when someone attempts to rebut an argument by bringing up a completely unrelated point, a "Red herring", to lure his opponent away from the real point of the argument.
Idk if you are doing this intentionaIIy or genuinIy have no scans to Iink or paste in your messages rather then aII this irreIevant text waIIs that, again, have no scans to back them up.
nothing backs up td veldanava making the grand spirits. God made the grand spirits and the framework of the Multiverse, then in the palace of beginning veldanava used imaginary collapse + small world to fill in the Multiverse.
Again, no scans
Dude if you believe veldanava td made the grand spirits you're a borderline idiot
same behavior once again

1. Ad Hominem

This means "argument against the man, not the point". It is when you rebut an opponent's argument by insulting them instead of their argument.

NOTE: There is a difference between an ad hominem and a plain insult. Saying "Your arguments are wrong because you're stupid" is an ad hominem, but simply saying "You're stupid" is not a fallacy.
cause it never says he made them anywhere.
Scan I sent prior to you saying that, yet I dont even see any section of your repIy arguing anything against that, so thats pure ignorance from your side
It even says all he did was tap into them to make the seraphim's. and as a result the primordials were made after.
once again,
VeIdanava using GS of Iight to create primordiaI angeIs does not argue or provide any proof against veIdanava creating the great spirits, at aII.
Like you would clearly understand what I am saying here right.
There is nothing for me to understand about something never proven to be right.
God when he was omnipotent and omniscient had no time and space but yet the moment TD veldanava came into the palace of beginning there was time and space so who came first the chicken or the egg?
once again, nothing reIevant against VeIdanava and God being different or VeIdanava creating the HoIy Spirits. We in our standards aIready make it cIear that just Iacking space-time does not mean you Iack it on aII IeveIs of reaIity, and neither does space-time existing makes it the baseIine IeveI of reaIity, because every reaIity IeveI has its own notion of dimensionaIity and space-time.

That, my man, is aIready made cIear by the standards of the tiering system set in pIace.
I emitted in what i sent not everything i sent was relevant
You IiteraIIy admitted it yourseIf here that it was not reIevant to what I said.....
nor was i using it to dismiss the argument at hand so either a you can't read or you just sending that to know i openly emitted not everything i sent was entirely relevant. And you have also done the same.
If its not reIevant to my argument or the op, then its simpIy deraiIing the thread. So no point in bringing those scans anyways.
thats your burden to prove that. and no i didn't
i copied what the japanese novel said, fandom wiki is not a canon source material and the opposite is never stated in the novel so i don't really care for the argument.
Which you never proved you did. You are the one making the point that God created the GHS instead of VeIdanava, so its your burden to prove that, even more so cuz of the fact that I aIready provided a scan to oppose what you said, yet it seems you ignored that scan compIeteIy
it shows that i am fine with the grand spirits are the "idea" / "concept" of said things I am fine with agreeing with that.
Which was never a part of the op, so again, Red Herring.
 
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There's still nothing below the RAWS, this isn't Imgur.
Screenshot_20240920_074953_Chrome.jpg
 
D
For starters, I'm requesting the context for this scan. Preferably the full scene that it is part of, because not much is clear from this alone.

In any case, I'll point out the obvious: This "All-in-One" entity is explicitly described as having been born/created, in all three translations provided, so that's already a pretty huge dent on the proposal for Tier 0. The fact that this is explicitly referring to Veldanava's true form, going by what the scans are saying, makes that pretty indefensible in my eyes.

But I'm still only putting forward a negative case for this. There's still the matter of whether, if the aforementioned issue is put the aside, the positive case for Tier 0 fits the bill. Overall: No, I wouldn't say it does at all. All the evidence seems to hinge on:


Ontop of the first scan that I asked for the context of, up there. After that, the OP shows some distinctions that the verse makes between things (Truth/Falsehood, Illusion/Substance, Holy/Evil, etc) and reasons that God is thus "All-in-One" with respect to them all, thus Tier 0.

Yeah, so, that's not really sufficient, generally speaking. "All-in-One"ness doesn't really fit the bill for Tier 0 on its own because, well, Tier 0 transcends oneness no less than it transcends manyness (Transcends the opposition between one and many, in fact), so you're going to need more specific descriptions than that. Being a qualitatively simple essence doesn't really cut it because the notion of "simplicity" that's relevant at that scale is neither qualitative nor quantitative.
In my opinion, it would not be enough to address such a thing, and as far as I know, it would be good to have cosmological support as mentioned above.
 
D

In my opinion, it would not be enough to address such a thing, and as far as I know, it would be good to have cosmological support as mentioned above.
Tier 0 has not a single thing related to cosmology; a verse with a tier 0 cosmology has equal chances of having a solid tier 0 compared to one with a tier 1 cosmology. Bringing cosmology itself in front of a tier 0 is illogical since a tier 0 is supposed to transcend all extensions of "Cosmology" possible
 
tier zero does not need any cosmological support what is bro talking about
I didn't say to use it in tier 0, I said to apply cosmology to the topic before even presenting level 0, tensura doesn't even have something outer, will there be a level 0 ontology how? Veldanava being a true dragon his ontology is not that different from the others, apply this and then explain the creator.
 
Tier 0 has not a single thing related to cosmology; a verse with a tier 0 cosmology has equal chances of having a solid tier 0 compared to one with a tier 1 cosmology. Bringing cosmology itself in front of a tier 0 is illogical since a tier 0 is supposed to transcend all extensions of "Cosmology" possible
Exactly, I suppose veldanava transcends the cosmology that has X dimensionality, let's suppose it is 7D, according to that it would be either 8D or just 1-A if it is a qualitative difference.

To upgrade it to level 0, there would have to be a cosmology that supports a unique existence in space that is already high in the system, someone who is a unique existence in a 3D multiverse is nothing.
 
Exactly, I suppose veldanava transcends the cosmology that has X dimensionality, let's suppose it is 7D, according to that it would be either 8D or just 1-A if it is a qualitative difference.

To upgrade it to level 0, there would have to be a cosmology that supports a unique existence in space that is already high in the system, someone who is a unique existence in a 3D multiverse is nothing.
Read the FAQ brother. You do not need a 1A cosmology to argue for tier 0 🤦‍♂️
 
Cosmology is irrelevant so it not having something 1-A (yet) doesn’t really matter.tho I do agree that scaling veldanava above a 1-A cosmology would make this easier.
No, it is not, not in all cases, Tensura has no ontological basis for hyper law, how can there be an existence that encompasses this and has the requirements for level 0 if it encompasses a 3D world?

Using yog for example, the gates represent the three-dimensional world, it is said to encompass the world, it is everything, without the other requirements that apply to it in cosmology as verse, Being something that encompasses this as an ineffable existence makes no difference precisely because it is a 3D space, the last one already spoke about the qualitative difference about 2D being invalid for example.
 
Read the FAQ brother. You do not need a 1A cosmology to argue for tier 0 🤦‍♂️
Again, requirements 1-A are qualitative, you did not apply any that proves it here, that is, what is left is the quote he used as being unique, based on the verse encompassing everything, It doesn't upgrade anything.
 
Cosmology is irrelevant, Ultima is dipping from the wiki so just abandon it atm

We have Hoyoverse that only scales to 1-A in terms of cosmology, yet it has Yog-Sothoth being Tier 0
As a rule it is, but that doesn't fit into the context you put, there are no citations of "qualities" in the veldanava to apply at least 1-A there, and when applying the ontology, They simply ignored that the exact quote they used for level 0 has the basis of being linked to cosmology.
 
Again, requirements 1-A are qualitative, you did not apply any that proves it here, that is, what is left is the quote he used as being unique, based on the verse encompassing everything, It doesn't upgrade anything.
I take it that you are derailing at this point. How many times do I have to tell you that cosmology is not important ?
 
I take it that you are derailing at this point. How many times do I have to tell you that cosmology is not important ?
It is not important in general terms, go back to the beginning of the topic and look at the scans they provided, you will see that they support the connection with cosmology, they do not apply it outside of that.
 
As a rule it is, but that doesn't fit into the context you put, there are no citations of "qualities" in the veldanava to apply at least 1-A there, and when applying the ontology, They simply ignored that the exact quote they used for level 0 has the basis of being linked to cosmology.
Let me quote staff talking about Tier 0 for you, since it seems you didn't understood a single thing, and most likely didn't read anything in the tiering system revision either

There you have it. I think I can prolly find many more instances of Ultima explaining that, but this much should be self-sufficient
 
Let me quote staff talking about Tier 0 for you, since it seems you didn't understood a single thing, and most likely didn't read anything in the tiering system revision either





There you have it. I think I can prolly find many more instances of Ultima explaining that, but this much should be self-sufficient
What I'm asking for is the quality that proves 1-A, not the highest cosmology, I cited the cosmology from his scan about "being unique".
 
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What I'm asking for is the quality that proves 1-A,
I don't really get how that has any relation to God being tier 0 in any case, nor do I get why you're asking that.
Edit : because a Tier 0 is ultimately independent of cosmology, it does not matter whatsoever if the cosmology has something that is "1-A" or "High 1-A" or any of that. It all boils down to the Tier 0 itself and what nature it has, rather then some specific non tier 0 quality
not the highest cosmology, I cited the cosmology from his scan about "being unique".
Rephrase that in better terms
 
@Mizuki67 @Boy.Line @PHANtomFELdway @Voidnether
Edit: @Karabach-barabach you as well please

20 message were writted just to answer a simple question (question that should have been done in Q&A...).
THIS IS A TIER 0 CRT, don't clog it, can you all delete all the comments leaving only the original question and @Astral_Trinity439 answer ... please?

(And can you all put a like in this message here? In this way i will know when to delete it as well)
 
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The problem for the scans are that they are vague. There some interpretation that makes the will of God not tier 0.

Just vague.

I expected Chinamen level of exposition to reach tier 0, like literally copying Tao Te Ching and modify it into your novel.
 
The problem for the scans are that they are vague. There some interpretation that makes the will of God not tier 0.

Just vague.

I expected Chinamen level of exposition to reach tier 0, like literally copying Tao Te Ching and modify it into your novel.
Tao Te Ching is literally irrelevant on Yog-Sothoth's case lmao, Ultima even told him to delete that because it just doesn't mean anything but it does confirm something so yeah.. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
Tao Te Ching is literally irrelevant on Yog-Sothoth's case lmao, Ultima even told him to delete that because it just doesn't mean anything but it does confirm something so yeah.. 🤷🏻‍♂️
I didn't mean literally copying the entire short book of Tao Te Ching, what I mean is for the exposition to be on that level. To be clear in its description of ultimate reality (Will of God in Tensura case).

Like this passage from Xianxia novel.
Tai Yi is a unity that creates all things.

Hun Yuan is chaos as one, the beginning of primordial energy.

Within Tai Yi Hun Yuan, there is no concept of time or space.

In Tai Yi Hun Yuan, there are no sizes, as everything is one and infinite.

Within Tai Yi Hun Yuan, there is no up or down, no high or low. Everything is an infinite part and an extension of boundlessness.

Whether it is insects, flowers, houses, crowds, cities, nations, civilizations, planets, suns, galaxies; whether it is planes, worlds, universes, or even all integrated spatiotemporal entities, they are fundamentally the same.

All are derived from Tai Yi Hun Yuan, just as the Taiji of boundlessness generates all things from the division of yin and yang. The black and white colors generate endless things, and the essence of all things is the divine power flowing from Tai Yi Hun Yuan. Thus, all things are with Tai Yi Hun Yuan. Apart from Tai Yi Hun Yuan, everything else is 'meaningless void.'

And now, Su Zhou, swallowed by Tai Yi Hun Yuan, is in this 'meaningless void.'

Inside Tai Yi Hun Yuan, there are endless landscapes; its interior is almost like a multiverse. Su Zhou gazes into the distance and always feels like he’s reaching an end, only to see new things continually emerging. This encompasses everything that exists, the joys and sorrows of countless worlds and beings, their lives, their stories…
-Monster Die When Killed
 
I didn't mean literally copying the entire short book of Tao Te Ching, what I mean is for the exposition to be on that level. To be clear in its description of ultimate reality (Will of God in Tensura case).

Like this passage from Xianxia novel.

-Monster Die When Killed
Least confusing chinese fiction
 
The problem for the scans are that they are vague. There some interpretation that makes the will of God not tier 0.

Just vague.
It is simple enough if one gives it a thought. That's why I wrote an entire explanation in one of my earlier posts to simplify it to the extreme
I expected Chinamen level of exposition to reach tier 0, like literally copying Tao Te Ching and modify it into your novel.
That wouldn't be so easy to find in non-Chinese verses. After all, TenSura is japanese, I would be more surprised if he added those things instead.

But again, we're not looking for fulfillment of an entire philosophy, as long as the underlying working is the same, its fine.
Least confusing chinese fiction
Like this passage from Xianxia novel.
Keep this discussiom somewhere else, this is a tensura thread, not some thread to discuss other fiction
 
It is simple enough if one gives it a thought. That's why I wrote an entire explanation in one of my earlier posts to simplify it to the extreme
I think that are just your interpretations of those scans to make it tier 0. I honestly see them as not enough.
That wouldn't be so easy to find in non-Chinese verses. After all, TenSura is japanese, I would be more surprised if he added those things instead.

But again, we're not looking for fulfillment of an entire philosophy, as long as the underlying working is the same, its fine.
What I'm looking for is the not vagueness in the novel itself, I personally need a detailed exposition for each aspect of the will of God for it to reach tier 0. Like how God omnipotency actually work, how his immanency works, etc; because all of that are important in the context of tier 0. Just a short paragraph or passage similar to that, and this isn't really exclusive to Chinese fiction really. As details are important for an extraordinary tier like tier 0.

This is just my opinion though, Ultima hold the last decision here. But for me personally, this is vague.
 
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I think that are just your interpretations of those scans to make it tier 0. I honestly see them as not enough.
That isn't an argument against anything I explained in my earlier post, here as well. I didn't just say its a tier 0 because I believe it, I gave multiple analogies and reasons while explaining it. So far, it doesn't seem like any of them have actually been addressed.
Ultima addressed one point here, but they only counted "Oneness" and "All-encompassing nature", but that was already countered later because they didn't count the "lack of all qualities" aspect.
What I'm looking for is the not vagueness in the novel itself, I personally need a detailed exposition for each aspect of the will of God for it to reach tier 0. Like how God omnipotency actually work, how his immanency works, etc; because all of that are important in the context of tier 0. Just a short paragraph or passage similar to that, and this isn't really exclusive to Chinese fiction really. As details are important for an extraordinary tier like tier 0.
I think I explained that extremely clearly here, and not short at all.

Finally done. Here's the explanation [I focused on explaining stuff only, so there won't be many scans, they're already in the OP or other prior messages; however, I will try my best to link already used scans from the thread to where they belong in the explanation, specifically the conclusions].
 
All-Encompassing-ness
The context I get from this is that he basically immanent and omniscient before giving up his omnipotence and omniscience? He know the outcomes of all-things and get bored because of that (The notion of all encompassing can be bored is absurd, but I digress), so after that act of giving up omnipotency and omniscient- not everything is him then? Because that what I seen from the scan and my own causal reasoning.

That's because I am not Omniscient and Omnipotent. When I was created, all that existed was my will. At that time, I was complete and lacked absolutely nothing. I was the absolute perfection, the “All-encompassing One” - in other words, I was all there is in the world. Wouldn't that be boring?

I see, Guy thought.
Because he was Guy, he understood.
In other words, Veldanava had willingly abandoned his Omniscience and Omnipotence.
So there was time when he is everything and then there the time "after" he didn't became everything?

Sound sus for me.
Absolute One-ness
But if it's Veldanava - a madman who sought imperfection from the “absolute oneness” - then it's also possible, Guy thought.
So Veldanava want to attain imperfection from "absolute oneness"? Which in this case his own original self?

This scans doesn't really explain what is the absolute oneness either (this is why I need detailed exposition), it just used as one use word in my opinion.


It is freed from the Wheel of Reincarnation and released from all restrictions as it travels to the Promised Land. That is, Dissolution.

Translator Note : The Kanji used for Dissolution at the end is 解脱, which means Moksha in Japanese. Moksha as in the Hinduism sense, or the Buddhism sense as well, uniting with God and attaining Nirvana, both beliefs overlap.
As a chinaman myself, we can't really use Taoist and Buddhist terminology unless it was explained thoroughly in the verse itself (in my opinion). Nirvana being a state where soul being freed from restriction and arriving to the promised land sound viable. But previous passage makes it look like it was used in combat than in metaphysical purpose, doesn't really reduce the validity though.

Also slight correction, Moksha doesn't really exist in Buddhism, it exist in Jainism and Hinduism.
Kondo's “soul” was also passed on to Carrera through the pistol. However, the heart of Kondo's soul was not included.

Carrera knew.

The heart core of a person who has attained the true nirvana and become a sinless person cannot be bound even if the soul is bound.
But I digress.

“ Stop laughing. It is a wave that cancels out another wave. Then all you have to do is wrap it around yourself. Know that the Truth of the World is to unify with the flow, not to go against it. Since illusions are reduced to the ethereal, it is easy for me to see through your waves”.
This is Taoism 101, just change flow with qi and truth of the world with Heavenly Dao. And I don't really think this is very evident since one qi can be ones and harmonious with the universe while still not tier 0. Unless flow are thoroughly explained in verse, I don't really see this. I don't really see the state without quality in this one, as they still have their own distinct waves.


Michael scan can mean that the original "All Encompassing" still exist and that Veldanava is just a farce, a good scan but one can assimilate with other will without being tier 0; but I digress.

Interesting that most angels want to unite all the powers to resurrect an Omnipotent and Omniscient being (which should be impossible in any way) but since Feldway say that just a logical theory and never brought up again I would ignore that. It was mentioned many times in the scan that Velda giving up his Omnipotency many times.

But the main point of this scan that he caused the first cause, as he was the one who started cycle of causality and it doesn't exist before he created it. Good scan for aca type 5 on his previous self.

Veldanava was a Dreamer (Romantic), but he was also a Perfectionist. But he also had a cool head, and he could separate the impossible from the realizable. As a result of Veldanava's abandonment of his omniscience and all-encompassing nature in order to seek change, it was impossible for him to realize the ideal society he envisioned. For Veldanava, however, it was the right thing to do. He sees nothing interesting in a world dictated strictly according to his own desires.

Translator Note : Veldanava was a means to experience change, implying that God was changeless, as otherwise he would not have to create an Avatar like Veldanava
God in his absolute, eternal and infinite existence should already encompassed the very 'Change' itself without even needed to send an avatar to the world. I really thought that the Author doesn't really understand the immutability of omnipotence and use that word freely, he make Velda giving up his omnipotency as one of the main plot of the novel. Also bold claim for Veldanava as a mere avatar without concrete and clear scans to support this, as this is one of the main point for Will of God tier 0.

Anyways, that it. I would wait for Ultima.
 
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