TenSura LN Major Revision - Raphael is a Regeneration Device

[Astral_Trinity439]

Introduction​

Hello everyone, hope ya'll are doing good. This is the continuation to the previous threads regarding Light Novel Revisions, Part 3 to be exact. This thread will be focusing on bringing back Rimuru's Regeneration (High Godly) which was removed as accepted in this thread.

As always, please refrain from any toxic behavior and unnecessarily derailing the thread.

Table of Contents​

A detailed explanation of the proposals is here:

Astral Trinity439/Walkthrough

vsbattles.fandom.com

They key points of the proposals are:

• Rimuru's Infinite Regeneration is different from Shion's Infinite Regeneration in potency and working.
• Even if Infinite Regeneration is not High Godly Regeneration, Rimuru still has HGR (High Godly; Conceptual and Information) based on his Immortality Type 8 to Raphael.
• Only Rimuru's regeneration will be High Godly if its accepted via infinite regeneration. If its accepted via Raphael instead, it'll obviously only be for Rimuru.

Counter Arguments
Obviously, there would be arguments against the proposals, so here's counters and/or answers to some of the arguments that may arise:

Spoiler: Counters

• Raphael still resides in Rimuru's Soul; Even if it has a different heart, it should still be a part of Rimuru's aspects!

Answer: Not even close. Raphael is not only stated to be an entirely separate Heart Core from Rimuru's, it is also directly called "Soulless". Therefore, there's a clear distinction made and Raphael, albeit Rimuru's skill that resides IN his soul, is not a part of it and is independent of it entirely.

• How would Raphael not be erased as well if Rimuru were to experience a "direct hit" from Disintegration/Melt Slash?

Answer: There can be a few reasons to that. Either Raphael would separate itself from Rimuru's Soul before Disintegration erases it, or Raphael has a backup for itself in the Laws of the World, since Raphael is, ultimately, and so are all skills, part of the Set of Laws of the World (World System).

• Regarding the first assumption, how could it separate itself faster then Disintegration/Melt Slash hits it when Speed of Light is supposed to be the maximum Physical Speed as stated in-verse?

Answer: The Heart Core is made up of Information Particles (which travel at Immeasurable Speed when forced to move by a will/ego), or simply say, they can travel any spatial or temporal distance in 0 time. So its plausible.

• How can we say that Raphael can control Information particles when only Digital Lifeforms can?

Answer: Not only is Raphael specialized in manipulating the information particles to manipulate Skills, it's directly stated that the conversation Rimuru has with Raphael happens in an instant. Ciel also states later on (before Rimuru's evolution into a DLF) that she can still communicate with Rimuru "instantly".

• It's stated that Raphael cannot restore Data Particles, so how can it restore Rimuru's Heart Core?

Answer: In that scenario, the talk was about people from the Eastern Empire that were killed by the Demoness Trio. Raphael obviously hadn't analyzed their data particles beforehand, unlike it does for Rimuru. The latter is proven by the fact that Raphael had backed up Beelzebuth, an Ultimate Skill that should reside in Rimuru's Soul.

• In the scenario that Raphael had a backup for itself in the VoTW, why would it still serve Rimuru and help him?

Answer: Because Raphael has developed an Ego, independent from Rimuru, but that ego's main goal is to serve Rimuru.

• Why does Infinite Regeneration still matter here, then, if it's all based on Raphael?

Answer: Because there are two possible scenarios of how Rimuru could have survived:

1. Raphael would have regenerated Rimuru's Ego(questionable if it was destroyed to begin with), Heart Core and Soul itself, and then regenerate his Physical Body via Infinite Regeneration.
2. Raphael would have regenerated Infinite Regeneration alone, and afterwards, use Infinite Regeneration to regenerate everything, including the Heart Core, Soul, and Physical Body.

• How would Infinite Regeneration be able to regenerate the core when its explicitly stated in Shion's core that it cannot regenerate from Core destruction?

Answer: Because as stated in the sandbox, each skill, even if it shares the same name, is different in working and potency. Just because Shion's skill is limited to core destruction doesn't mean Rimuru's skill is so as well.

• Is there any example that supports that Skills can work after core destruction and can regenerate data particles?

Answer: Indeed, and very clearly so. You can see this post for an example. So yes, there are skills that still work even after having their Heart Core disintegrated.

• At this point, isn't Raphael just a robot that plans to take over the World, with the first step being its own master? (Fun Question)

Answer: Raphael already has the ability to forcefully takeover the Voice of the World/World System, so who knows

Counters to more arguments will be added as the thread progresses.

Vote​

Agree:

Disagree:

Neutral:

________________________________________________________________________________________________
Thanks for reading, folks!

 

[Robo432343]

you have to wait 3 months if you want to reverse an accepted CRT

 

[Velvian_can]

This seems plausible enough for High-Godly Regen, I think

 

[Incomprehensibleexistence]

Agree

 

[CelestialVortex01]

you have to wait 3 months if you want to reverse an accepted CRT

^

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

you have to wait 3 months if you want to reverse an accepted CRT

This rules only applies for failed CRTs, not for downgrades and upgrades... Also it would still be irrelevant since while it is the same ability, the reason is different.

 

[Sebas-S.P-san]

Agreed

 

[Robo432343]

This rules only applies for failed CRTs, not for downgrades and upgrades... Also it would still be irrelevant since while it is the same ability, the reason is different.

oh

i agree with the crt then

 

[PHANtomFELdway]

• How would Infinite Regeneration be able to regenerate the core when it’s explicitly stated in Shion's core that it cannot regenerate from Core destruction?

Regarding this. I don’t think it can’t regenerate from core destruction,more so the fact that the ability is erased so there is nothing it can regenerate since the ability is gone.

Anyway I agree

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

you have to wait 3 months if you want to reverse an accepted CRT

Incorrect:

When creating content revisions, it is essential to ensure that the topic has not been addressed previously. Rejected content revisions cannot be resubmitted within a short period of time (typically defined as within 3 to 4 months), except in cases where a staff member has a good reason to do so (e.g. important unconsidered information, violation of site standards, or flaws in a calculation). This only applies to threads that have received extensive debate or have been rejected due to a clear conflict with the wiki's rules or standards. If a thread passes or is rejected without significant opposition, then opposition should not be restricted from making a point.

 

[Robo432343]

Incorrect:

oh

i agree with the crt then

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

For reference purposes.

 

[Robo432343]

For reference purposes.

is there a link to it? that 3 month rule thing
so people can find it in the future

 

[CelestialVortex01]

I'll have a look at this later tonight

 

[ChoursDropoff]

This rules only applies for failed CRTs, not for downgrades and upgrades... Also it would still be irrelevant since while it is the same ability, the reason is different.

This rule only applies for water not h20 type comment.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

is there a link to it? that 3 month rule thing
so people can find it in the future

Discussion Rules

VS Battles Wiki is a site where the members attempt to index the statistics of characters across different fictional franchises. These efforts lead to much discussion about certain feats, statements and calculations regarding their validity, reliability, etc. However, certain topics keep popping...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

• How would Infinite Regeneration be able to regenerate the core when it’s explicitly stated in Shion's core that it cannot regenerate from Core destruction?

Regarding this. I don’t think it can’t regenerate from core destruction,more so the fact that the ability is erased so there is nothing it can regenerate since the ability is gone.

Anyway I agree

In my opinion it only erases the abilities that are in use to prevent Disintegration or Melt Slash from hitting them directly, like Prelix that Astral mentioned in the counterarguments didn't lose his abilities even when he was directly erased (A CRT was made that accepted the extra story as Canon), also the only ability destruction was Beelzebuth's that was cast to prevent him from being hit.

Prelix's Ultraspeed Regeneration which is inferior to Infinite Regeneration continued to function even after Prelix was completely erased.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Now, for the Regeneration upgrade:

@Planck69 @Dereck03 @Sir_Ovens you accepted the downgrade from High-godly to Mid-Godly in the previous thread, so your opinion here would be appreciated.

 

[Lycoris4812]

Hehe, agree.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

you have to wait 3 months if you want to reverse an accepted CRT

That's under the assumption that repeated arguments are brought up, which is not the case here.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

• How would Infinite Regeneration be able to regenerate the core when it’s explicitly stated in Shion's core that it cannot regenerate from Core destruction?

Regarding this. I don’t think it can’t regenerate from core destruction,more so the fact that the ability is erased so there is nothing it can regenerate since the ability is gone.

Anyway I agree

By default, that's the case, but in this case, we're assuming that Raphael will backup the ability, and then use that backed up ability to bring up Rimuru.

In my opinion it only erases the abilities that are in use to prevent Disintegration or Melt Slash from hitting them directly, like Prelix that Astral mentioned in the counterarguments didn't lose his abilities even when he was directly erased (A CRT was made that accepted the extra story as Canon), also the only ability destruction was Beelzebuth's that was cast to prevent him from being hit.

That's only under the assumption that those abilities were used to prevent Melt Slash. Additionally, that does not apply to all abilities, since Beelzebuth's working is clearly different from other abilities in how its activated; Even more so, the assumption Raphael made in which Rimuru would be fine was under two conditions:

1. He didn't use any ability to block Disintegration/Melt Slash, which means there's nothing preventing it from reaching the Core.
2. He would take on a "direct hit", meaning no dodging or the attack going out of trajectory.

That pretty much means it would destroy the whole of Rimuru himself, including his heart core.

Prelix's Ultraspeed Regeneration which is inferior to Infinite Regeneration continued to function even after Prelix was completely erased.

On a side note, is there a statement regarding this?

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

By default, that's the case, but in this case, we're assuming that Raphael will backup the ability, and then use that backed up ability to bring up Rimuru.


That's only under the assumption that those abilities were used to prevent Melt Slash. Additionally, that does not apply to all abilities, since Beelzebuth's working is clearly different from other abilities in how its activated; Even more so, the assumption Raphael made in which Rimuru would be fine was under two conditions:

1. He didn't use any ability to block Disintegration/Melt Slash, which means there's nothing preventing it from reaching the Core.
2. He would take on a "direct hit", meaning no dodging or the attack going out of trajectory.

That pretty much means it would destroy the whole of Rimuru himself, including his heart core.

On a side note, is there a statement regarding this?

Do we have a statement that erases all abilities? Because the only statement you use to erase abilities is when Beelzebuth was used to block Disintegration, I'm not saying that it doesn't erase the core but it only erases one's existence, but not the abilities, like Prelix if they are not used to block Disintegration or Melt Slash, even when it returns, the abilities remain intact, whether they are in the soul, body or core.

About the other thing I didn't understand you very well, are you talking about the statement being inferior to Infinite Regeneration?

Well there isn't, but in the main novel we know that Ultraspeed Regeneration only regenerates the physical body and has the weakness of not regenerating when attacked by spiritrons, not like Infinite Regeneration.

And if you're talking about whether it kept that ability, well here it is:

Countless rays pierced through Prelix.

Even a single ray of light held lethal power. Since it wasn't dissipated by the atmosphere, its temperature could reach hundreds of thousands of degrees.

No matter how much Prelix boasted about immortality, it should still be able to feel some pain - but...

"Gugya!? Ggggh, Guha! This level of pain is nothing! With my 'Absolute Immortality' and 'Ultraspeed Regeneration', it doesn't matter at all—!!"

Prelix boasted like that while glaring at me.

As the words suggested, there seemed to be no sign of dying from the "Divine Wrath Megid."

However, I didn't think this would be the end either.

"I was just going to lightly test if sunlight is a weakness, but it seems like that was definitely the right approach."

"What!?"

"Don't worry. That was just a simple experiment, and the real thing is about to start."

I said that and smiled at Prelix.

 

[The_golden_and_silver_house94]

This seems to back up your assumptions
So i agree
Also like eikichi said ,hinatas skills survived but her soul didn't

 

[Meli_Tempest]

Agree

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Do we have a statement that erases all abilities? Because the only statement you use to erase abilities is when Beelzebuth was used to block Disintegration, I'm not saying that it doesn't erase the core but it only erases one's existence, but not the abilities, like Prelix if they are not used to block Disintegration or Melt Slash, even when it returns, the abilities remain intact, whether they are in the soul, body or core.

The fact that it could erase Beelzebuth which resides in the heart is proof that it can erase information particles as well, that's the main thing.
After that, as long as Disintegration is directly hitting the target, there's no reason for the core not being erased along with the abilities stored in it.
In the alternate timeline too, he only survived death because Raphael kept him alive somehow, not due to infinite regeneration.

Perlix's regen is special and comes from a special ability, to begin with, that's why I used it as an example of "can regenerate the core" type of ability instead.

About the other thing I didn't understand you very well, are you talking about the statement being inferior to Infinite Regeneration?


Well there isn't, but in the main novel we know that Ultraspeed Regeneration only regenerates the physical body and has the weakness of not regenerating when attacked by spiritrons, not like Infinite Regeneration.

And if you're talking about whether it kept that ability, well here it is:

Well, no, while Ultraspeed Regeneration is inferior to Infinite Regeneration, nothing implies it holds true for Absolute Immortality as well. Perlix's regen is via the combination of two abilities, not just Ultraspeed regen alone.

 

[Tempestdragon6]

agree

 

[Berga14]

Agree

 

[Bernkastelll]

I agree

 

[Eisoks]

I agree

 

[CelestialVortex01]

YAP INCOMING

HG:High Godly
MG:Mid-Godly
LG:Low-Godly

Based on the arguments provided, it appears inconsistent with High-Godly Regeneration

- HGR: The ability to regenerate after the erasure of body, mind, soul, and at least one other fundamental aspect of a character's existence.

To begin with, infinite regeneration requires Magicules, Since infinite regeneration consumes magicules for physical regeneration, if the magicules themselves are erased, the regeneration process should theoretically be impossible. This dependency on magicules implies that it’s not an automatic recovery from complete erasure, as HGR would demand. You shouldn't depend on anything to get HGR; it must be your natural ability.

The Core Must Survive': Infinite Regeneration being a skill located in the Heart Core means the core needs to stay intact for the regeneration to work. This contradicts High-Godly standards because High-Godly Regeneration wants the character to recover even if the core (or any essence containing their skills and abilities) is erased.
"It grants the user ridiculously powerful regenerative properties, vastly superior to those afforded by Ultraspeed Regeneration. Any type and amount of damage that doesn't outright kill the user can be instantly regenerated." -Tensura Wiki.



The ability can't even regenerate you from absolute destruction, thus disqualifies for HGR instantly.

Raphael is actually inside Rimuru's core (or at least the soul); your own scan says that. "But deep down, in a heart he should never have had, in a corner of Rimuru’s soul—a will was born." Raphael resides inside the corner of Rimuru, so if Rimuru dies, then so does Raphael.

Now you got the soul resurrection part absolutely wrong and out of context. Raphael did not regenerate any souls because none of them were destroyed, and even if she regenerated, they were completely annihilated but more like damaged from being outside their bodies.
When Farmuth Kingdom destroyed the tempest federation, including Shion, and many others died, and their souls were about to vanish into the sky, but the barrier they created kept them residing around the federation. It's blatantly stated that without the barrier, the souls would vanish and no ability would keep them coming back.




So no soul destruction happened; Raphael just resurrected the souls and put them back in their bodies after Rimuru became Demon Lord. Raphael objectively does not bring souls back from like nothingness.



Raphael’s Backup Ability: While Raphael can make a "backup (as you call it)" for skills like Beelzebuth, this ability doesn’t necessarily imply that Raphael can regenerate Rimuru’s entire existence from total erasure. Simple as that. Rimuru =/= Beelzebuth, come on, bro. This at best qualifies for skill creation.
About Meltslash: To be fair, new arguments don't give anything new to Meltslash's ability. Rimuru can still outlast damage with infinite regen before getting erased, even if he takes the attack head-on. This can be why Raphael was confident it wasn't a threat to themselves.
Or Melt Slash is a fraud. Yes, it doesn't matter no matter how many times it states an existence erasure attack. This is clearly anti-feat for it; this simply shows that it never was an attack strong enough to erase someone and can be bypassed by outlasting it.
Another argument can be about it's inconsistency: Fuse forgot that Rimuru wasn't supposed to take an EE attack directly and not get erased at that time; this would also explain everything.


-Moreover, the blog is literally arguing that Rimuru can regenerate “infinitely” and thus qualifies for High-Godly. But there's a catch this “infinite” regeneration relies on magicules as a power source. High-Godly Regeneration is about restoring yourself from complete and absolute erasure, body, soul, concept n everything. Needing magicules clearly shows a limitation if Rimuru's source of magicules were cut off or totally erased, he wouldn't regenerate. HGR requires the ability to come back without relying on external resources or energy, so calling it HGR just doesn’t add up here.


- It’s also mentioned that Rimuru’s regeneration depends on his core surviving, which totally goes against what HG should be. If Rimuru’s core is destroyed or erased, then he can't regenerate. With true HG, there’s no “core” or specific point of survival it’s about coming back from absolutely nothing, no matter how thoroughly you’re erased. Needing this core actually shows a limit in his regeneration, not a strength.


Additionally, the blog seems to bring up that Rimuru can survive attacks like Meltslash, implying it’s enough to justify HG. But the problem is that Meltslash doesn’t fully EE someone’s existence on every possible LEVEL it’s an attack that can kill but isn’t a guaranteed form of “Absolute EE” that HG would cover. So even if Rimuru survives it, that’s more of a feat against a specific attack, not a qualification for regenerating from complete High-Godly-level erasure, also this argument brings up that Raphael can “backup” certain skills like Beelzebuth and other abilities, making it sound like Rimuru’s protected even if he's erased. But again, there’s a problem. Raphael is essentially backing up individual skills, not Rimuru’s entire existence. HG requires the ability to return completely, not just to restore certain abilities. If every part of Rimuru was erased, a skill backup wouldn’t rebuild his entire being ~~~Raphael isn’t a true “restore from scratch” mechanism.

So all of this shows that Rimuru’s regen isn’t really HG. He fits more into LG or MG because his whole existence depends on things like magicules and his core being intact. That’s not the kind of self-sufficiency or resilience you’d need to truly qualify for HGR




Btw fellas I'm going to sleep so please don't jump me while I'm offline

 

[Lycoris4812]

Btw fellas I'm going to sleep so please don't jump me while I'm offline

Jump em.

 

[CelestialVortex01]

Jump em.

 

[Siru_Kyosha]

I agree

 

[Dog3352]

I wasn't even going to comment on this CRT, but someone requested "politely".

Well, for starters, Infinite Regeneration is a skill that requires magicules to use, which should instantly mean that it would be impossible to use the skill after a complete erasure of the person.


This scan is not completely correct due to this:

It's not the same scene, but it totally has to do with the "regeneration of the soul" mentioned in the OP, after everything that happened with the monsters, Rimuru strengthened the barrier that would "probably" (which was the case) keep the monsters' souls inside.

And when he went to resurrect the monsters, he used "Secret Art of Resurrection" + "Secret Art of Revival" to put their souls back and revive the monsters.

The souls had not been completely erased, "regeneration" only refers to returning the soul to the body, and the souls, as shown in the scans, had not been erased.

There is an OBVIOUS problem with this scan:



For those who can't understand, the problem is very simple, Raphael declares CLEARLY and DIRECTLY that he would be able to regenerate from a direct hit, but says that he would regenerate the PHYSICAL BODY, Raphael makes it clear that the blow would destroy Rimuru's physical body, but it doesn't say anything about the soul or core, so assuming that the "direct blow" described by Rimuru is talking about destroying the soul, core and physical body is fallacious, since only the physical body is clearly pointed out.
In addition to Hinata's attack not targeting or trying to erase Rimuru's soul, as it was not her goal to kill Rimuru, she even tried to aim at a place that wouldn't kill him, so assuming that Hinata tried to erase the Rimuru's soul or something doesn't make any sense.

And if I'm not mistaken, the melt slash does not destroy the spiritrons instantly, I believe the downgrade OP already mentioned this, but, even if we consider that the attack would hit Rimuru's soul (something that is not stated/pointed out), survival of Rimuru may well be because he regenerates his soul before it is completely destroyed. In addition to nothing pointing out that Rimuru's soul would be destroyed, there is also nothing pointing out, declaring or showing that Infinite Regeneration would bring him back even if his soul were COMPLETELY erased.


Also this scan is an anti-feat:


The OP unfortunately didn't specify much about what soul energy is, so I decided to do my research, and according to what I researched, soul energy is an energy that exists in the soul, it can be used for things like casting spells, soul energy is part of the structure of the soul.



As shown in the OP scan itself, a character without a soul loses the ability to use such energy, as the energy is part of the structure of the soul itself, which means that no ability can be used with soul energy if the soul is destroyed or something, so obviously he doesn't support HGR at all, since if the character's existence is erased (including the soul), he would be unable to use such a thing.


Another problem I have with the OP is very simple, the OP stated that magicules are not necessary to regenerate the soul due to the existence of "soul energy", which has no evidence, the OP just shows that soul energy exists, and no statement/evidence that soul energy is stated to be used to reform/regenerate the soul in place of magicules or anything of the sort.

The real evidence about HGR was about the "fact" of Rimuru and Raphael pointing out that Rimuru would have been completely destroyed, body, soul, mind, his entire existence would be erased, but as Raphael not only does not declare such a thing, but directly states that what would be destroyed/erased would be the physical body, nothing says/evidences that the soul would be destroyed, or that Infinite Regeneration would bring him back if (after) his soul was completely erased, that's just NLF.

 

[PHANtomFELdway]

YAP INCOMING

HG:High Godly
MG:Mid-Godly
LG:Low-Godly

Based on the arguments provided, it appears inconsistent with High-Godly Regeneration

- HGR: The ability to regenerate after the erasure of body, mind, soul, and at least one other fundamental aspect of a character's existence.

To begin with, infinite regeneration requires Magicules, Since infinite regeneration consumes magicules for physical regeneration, if the magicules themselves are erased, the regeneration process should theoretically be impossible. This dependency on magicules implies that it’s not an automatic recovery from complete erasure, as HGR would demand. You shouldn't depend on anything to get HGR; it must be your natural ability.

The Core Must Survive': Infinite Regeneration being a skill located in the Heart Core means the core needs to stay intact for the regeneration to work. This contradicts High-Godly standards because High-Godly Regeneration wants the character to recover even if the core (or any essence containing their skills and abilities) is erased.
"It grants the user ridiculously powerful regenerative properties, vastly superior to those afforded by Ultraspeed Regeneration. Any type and amount of damage that doesn't outright kill the user can be instantly regenerated." -Tensura Wiki.



The ability can't even regenerate you from absolute destruction, thus disqualifies for HGR instantly.

Raphael is actually inside Rimuru's core (or at least the soul); your own scan says that. "But deep down, in a heart he should never have had, in a corner of Rimuru’s soul—a will was born." Raphael resides inside the corner of Rimuru, so if Rimuru dies, then so does Raphael.

Now you got the soul resurrection part absolutely wrong and out of context. Raphael did not regenerate any souls because none of them were destroyed, and even if she regenerated, they were completely annihilated but more like damaged from being outside their bodies.
When Farmuth Kingdom destroyed the tempest federation, including Shion, and many others died, and their souls were about to vanish into the sky, but the barrier they created kept them residing around the federation. It's blatantly stated that without the barrier, the souls would vanish and no ability would keep them coming back.




So no soul destruction happened; Raphael just resurrected the souls and put them back in their bodies after Rimuru became Demon Lord. Raphael objectively does not bring souls back from like nothingness.



Raphael’s Backup Ability: While Raphael can make a "backup (as you call it)" for skills like Beelzebuth, this ability doesn’t necessarily imply that Raphael can regenerate Rimuru’s entire existence from total erasure. Simple as that. Rimuru =/= Beelzebuth, come on, bro. This at best qualifies for skill creation.
About Meltslash: To be fair, new arguments don't give anything new to Meltslash's ability. Rimuru can still outlast damage with infinite regen before getting erased, even if he takes the attack head-on. This can be why Raphael was confident it wasn't a threat to themselves.
Or Melt Slash is a fraud. Yes, it doesn't matter no matter how many times it states an existence erasure attack. This is clearly anti-feat for it; this simply shows that it never was an attack strong enough to erase someone and can be bypassed by outlasting it.
Another argument can be about it's inconsistency: Fuse forgot that Rimuru wasn't supposed to take an EE attack directly and not get erased at that time; this would also explain everything.


-Moreover, the blog is literally arguing that Rimuru can regenerate “infinitely” and thus qualifies for High-Godly. But there's a catch this “infinite” regeneration relies on magicules as a power source. High-Godly Regeneration is about restoring yourself from complete and absolute erasure, body, soul, concept n everything. Needing magicules clearly shows a limitation if Rimuru's source of magicules were cut off or totally erased, he wouldn't regenerate. HGR requires the ability to come back without relying on external resources or energy, so calling it HGR just doesn’t add up here.


- It’s also mentioned that Rimuru’s regeneration depends on his core surviving, which totally goes against what HG should be. If Rimuru’s core is destroyed or erased, then he can't regenerate. With true HG, there’s no “core” or specific point of survival it’s about coming back from absolutely nothing, no matter how thoroughly you’re erased. Needing this core actually shows a limit in his regeneration, not a strength.


Additionally, the blog seems to bring up that Rimuru can survive attacks like Meltslash, implying it’s enough to justify HG. But the problem is that Meltslash doesn’t fully EE someone’s existence on every possible LEVEL it’s an attack that can kill but isn’t a guaranteed form of “Absolute EE” that HG would cover. So even if Rimuru survives it, that’s more of a feat against a specific attack, not a qualification for regenerating from complete High-Godly-level erasure, also this argument brings up that Raphael can “backup” certain skills like Beelzebuth and other abilities, making it sound like Rimuru’s protected even if he's erased. But again, there’s a problem. Raphael is essentially backing up individual skills, not Rimuru’s entire existence. HG requires the ability to return completely, not just to restore certain abilities. If every part of Rimuru was erased, a skill backup wouldn’t rebuild his entire being ~~~Raphael isn’t a true “restore from scratch” mechanism.

So all of this shows that Rimuru’s regen isn’t really HG. He fits more into LG or MG because his whole existence depends on things like magicules and his core being intact. That’s not the kind of self-sufficiency or resilience you’d need to truly qualify for HGR




Btw fellas I'm going to sleep so please don't jump me while I'm offline

Bro didn’t even read the sandbox. Those arguments were already addressed

 

[PHANtomFELdway]

YAP INCOMING

HG:High Godly
MG:Mid-Godly
LG:Low-Godly

Based on the arguments provided, it appears inconsistent with High-Godly Regeneration

- HGR: The ability to regenerate after the erasure of body, mind, soul, and at least one other fundamental aspect of a character's existence.

To begin with, infinite regeneration requires Magicules, Since infinite regeneration consumes magicules for physical regeneration, if the magicules themselves are erased, the regeneration process should theoretically be impossible. This dependency on magicules implies that it’s not an automatic recovery from complete erasure, as HGR would demand. You shouldn't depend on anything to get HGR; it must be your natural ability.

The Core Must Survive': Infinite Regeneration being a skill located in the Heart Core means the core needs to stay intact for the regeneration to work. This contradicts High-Godly standards because High-Godly Regeneration wants the character to recover even if the core (or any essence containing their skills and abilities) is erased.
"It grants the user ridiculously powerful regenerative properties, vastly superior to those afforded by Ultraspeed Regeneration. Any type and amount of damage that doesn't outright kill the user can be instantly regenerated." -Tensura Wiki.



The ability can't even regenerate you from absolute destruction, thus disqualifies for HGR instantly.

Raphael is actually inside Rimuru's core (or at least the soul); your own scan says that. "But deep down, in a heart he should never have had, in a corner of Rimuru’s soul—a will was born." Raphael resides inside the corner of Rimuru, so if Rimuru dies, then so does Raphael.

Now you got the soul resurrection part absolutely wrong and out of context. Raphael did not regenerate any souls because none of them were destroyed, and even if she regenerated, they were completely annihilated but more like damaged from being outside their bodies.
When Farmuth Kingdom destroyed the tempest federation, including Shion, and many others died, and their souls were about to vanish into the sky, but the barrier they created kept them residing around the federation. It's blatantly stated that without the barrier, the souls would vanish and no ability would keep them coming back.




So no soul destruction happened; Raphael just resurrected the souls and put them back in their bodies after Rimuru became Demon Lord. Raphael objectively does not bring souls back from like nothingness.

For this part. This isn’t even the same scene. This part is from when they faced the empire and killed 700k people

Raphael’s Backup Ability: While Raphael can make a "backup (as you call it)" for skills like Beelzebuth, this ability doesn’t necessarily imply that Raphael can regenerate Rimuru’s entire existence from total erasure. Simple as that. Rimuru =/= Beelzebuth, come on, bro. This at best qualifies for skill creation.
About Meltslash: To be fair, new arguments don't give anything new to Meltslash's ability. Rimuru can still outlast damage with infinite regen before getting erased, even if he takes the attack head-on. This can be why Raphael was confident it wasn't a threat to themselves.
Or Melt Slash is a fraud. Yes, it doesn't matter no matter how many times it states an existence erasure attack. This is clearly anti-feat for it; this simply shows that it never was an attack strong enough to erase someone and can be bypassed by outlasting it.
Another argument can be about it's inconsistency: Fuse forgot that Rimuru wasn't supposed to take an EE attack directly and not get erased at that time; this would also explain everything.


-Moreover, the blog is literally arguing that Rimuru can regenerate “infinitely” and thus qualifies for High-Godly. But there's a catch this “infinite” regeneration relies on magicules as a power source. High-Godly Regeneration is about restoring yourself from complete and absolute erasure, body, soul, concept n everything. Needing magicules clearly shows a limitation if Rimuru's source of magicules were cut off or totally erased, he wouldn't regenerate. HGR requires the ability to come back without relying on external resources or energy, so calling it HGR just doesn’t add up here.


- It’s also mentioned that Rimuru’s regeneration depends on his core surviving, which totally goes against what HG should be. If Rimuru’s core is destroyed or erased, then he can't regenerate. With true HG, there’s no “core” or specific point of survival it’s about coming back from absolutely nothing, no matter how thoroughly you’re erased. Needing this core actually shows a limit in his regeneration, not a strength.


Additionally, the blog seems to bring up that Rimuru can survive attacks like Meltslash, implying it’s enough to justify HG. But the problem is that Meltslash doesn’t fully EE someone’s existence on every possible LEVEL it’s an attack that can kill but isn’t a guaranteed form of “Absolute EE” that HG would cover. So even if Rimuru survives it, that’s more of a feat against a specific attack, not a qualification for regenerating from complete High-Godly-level erasure, also this argument brings up that Raphael can “backup” certain skills like Beelzebuth and other abilities, making it sound like Rimuru’s protected even if he's erased. But again, there’s a problem. Raphael is essentially backing up individual skills, not Rimuru’s entire existence. HG requires the ability to return completely, not just to restore certain abilities. If every part of Rimuru was erased, a skill backup wouldn’t rebuild his entire being ~~~Raphael isn’t a true “restore from scratch” mechanism.

So all of this shows that Rimuru’s regen isn’t really HG. He fits more into LG or MG because his whole existence depends on things like magicules and his core being intact. That’s not the kind of self-sufficiency or resilience you’d need to truly qualify for HGR




Btw fellas I'm going to sleep so please don't jump me while I'm offline

the rest is just yap that clearly ignored literally everything in the sand box and then made up some other nonsense

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

If the argument is that Raphael is regenerating Rimuru, then it's a resurrection or healing I guess, not regeneration.

It doesn’t matter if it's high-godly or whatever. I won’t be participating in this thread. But I just wanted to say that it's a resurrection or healing if he's being revived thanks to Raphael (an external factor). As you said, they are two different concepts altogether, despite sharing the same body, and even if you're arguing for type 8 immortality. Either way it doesn't suit for Regeneration.

I'll read the arguments when I have free time in the upcoming days, and I'll create a new thread if I find any faults in this one. Otherwise, I don't really have any issues if the arguments are solid.

 

[Dog3352]

For this part. This isn’t even the same scene. This part is from when they faced the empire and killed 700k people

It's not the same scene, but it totally has to do with the "regeneration of the soul" mentioned in the OP, after everything that happened with the monsters, Rimuru strengthened the barrier that would "probably" (which was the case) keep the monsters' souls inside. .

And when he went to resurrect the monsters, he used "Secret Art of Resurrection" + "Secret Art of Revival" to put their souls back and revive the monsters.

The souls had not been completely erased, "regeneration" only refers to returning the soul to the body, and the souls, as shown in the scans, had not been erased.

 

[PHANtomFELdway]

It's not the same scene, but it totally has to do with the "regeneration of the soul" mentioned in the OP, after everything that happened with the monsters, Rimuru strengthened the barrier that would "probably" (which was the case) keep the monsters' souls inside. .

And when he went to resurrect the monsters, he used "Secret Art of Resurrection" + "Secret Art of Revival" to put their souls back and revive the monsters.

The souls had not been completely erased, "regeneration" only refers to returning the soul to the body, and the souls, as shown in the scans, had not been erased.

Bro. It literally isn’t the same scene so I don’t know why you are using it like it is supposed to mean something. This has NOTHING to do with rimuru subordinates. This is from vol 13. While demon lord evolution was vol 6. Idk why you are using whole different circumstances and then think it is going to prove something. Even worse when you know they aren’t the same and are still trying to use it.

 

[Dog3352]

Bro. It literally isn’t the same scene so I don’t know why you are using it like it is supposed to mean something. This has NOTHING to do with rimuru subordinates. This is from vol 13. While demon lord evolution was vol 6. Idk why you are using whole different circumstances and then think it is going to prove something. Even worse when you know they aren’t the same and are still trying to use it.

First: Rimuru's evolution into demon lord was in volume 5, not 6.

Scond: All the scans are from volume 5, you are completely ignoring the scan literally talking about how Rimuru revived his subordinates and how he used magic to leave their souls within the barrier, Or even the fact that the last scan is literally the dialogue that is being used in the OP.