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Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken Discussion Thread 20

Huh,i skipped the veldoras journal part in every vollume.Looks like it was pretty good.Is it worth reading?and will you guys create a new crt based on the official Translation of the journal?
 
Also, Megiddo might not be exactly Speed of Light in this wiki's standards and even in the manga, unfortunately. I'll try to recheck the novels if this is consistent, later since I'm quite busy at the moment. It will end up being Relativistic+.

Also, I'm not certain if the Otherworlders from Falmuth would scale to Hakurou or Ifrit. Kyoya got stomped when Hakurou wasn't weakened, Shogo got stomped by Geld even when he got buffed, and they seemed to be weaker than Folgen who is on Ifrit's level (granted this was the Ifrit who can beat the Sky Dragon). Razen was also described to be "a level stronger than Orc Disaster", so a consistent scaling for his profile.


good.Is it worth reading?
It absolutely is. It is very well written.

I might be too busy to make any CRT for the time being so I'm dropping the details I found in this thread. You might be able to find more interesting stuff and feats f you read it, I think most manga reading websites already have til the latest of the journals (mangasee/********** have them I think, ******** might too).
 
Also, Megiddo might not be exactly Speed of Light in this wiki's standards and even in the manga, unfortunately. I'll try to recheck the novels if this is consistent, later since I'm quite busy at the moment. It will end up being Relativistic+.
The description of it is legit SoL tho...i mean the fact alone it's formed from condensed natural light from the sun, etc. already confirmed it
 
I checked Yen Press's Volume 5, and it does explicitly state that it goes at the speed of light. I just remembered that it also mentions Megiddo taking 0.034 seconds reaching a target 6 thousand miles away, which is 284001882.353 m/s compared to the wiki's 299792458 m/s (a 15790575.647 m/s difference).
Although I suppose, you only need to add over 300 miles to make it actual light speed, so the novel might have meant six thousand miles as a rough estimate and not the exact number.
It still is a fact that Veldora referred to Megiddo as near light speed, though I suppose this time Yen Press haven't made any translation errors regarding Megiddo.

Well, another fun fact from Veldora's Journals is that it wasn't Raphael who came up with the counter to Benimaru's trap question regarding Shion's cooking. Raphael actually consulted Veldora, but it was Ifrit who provided the answer that Raphael then told to Rimuru (blaming Benimaru for the secret password). More than some great Veldora/Ifrit banter, this was one of the first indication of Raphael truly forming an ego and sense of self. Stuff like these is why everyone should read Veldora's Journals.
 
When will Rimuru &.co hit FTL again? Still waiting on that Chloe being faster than time feat, but just making sure.
If i remember correctly after Rimuru becomes a ultimate slime,he said that
"The speed of "Thinking Acceleration" has been increasing since I gave the name "Ciel" to the King of Wisdom. What was originally a million times faster, is now hundreds of millions of times more so.
Shockingly, this is the level at which even the speed of light can be perceived.
"

That means probably perception speed ftl and also he said that
"It is not necessary to say that the unleashing of magic is naturally faster, even the unleashing of 'Space Shift' has become nearly a thousand times faster. In other words, as long as I can keep a certain distance, I can escape even with light-speed attacks by "shifting"".
And that means he can somewhat react to light speed.But not physically faster.
But i guess he has space time manipulation after he got azathot.So,he can probably stop time and then accelerate himself by million times like the wn,if i remember.But you most likely need to wait for next vollumes to see it.
 
If i remember correctly after Rimuru becomes a ultimate slime,he said that
"The speed of "Thinking Acceleration" has been increasing since I gave the name "Ciel" to the King of Wisdom. What was originally a million times faster, is now hundreds of millions of times more so.
Shockingly, this is the level at which even the speed of light can be perceived.
"

That means probably perception speed ftl and also he said that
"It is not necessary to say that the unleashing of magic is naturally faster, even the unleashing of 'Space Shift' has become nearly a thousand times faster. In other words, as long as I can keep a certain distance, I can escape even with light-speed attacks by "shifting"".
And that means he can somewhat react to light speed.But not physically faster.
But i guess he has space time manipulation after he got azathot.So,he can probably stop time and then accelerate himself by million times like the wn,if i remember.But you most likely need to wait for next vollumes to see it.
They don't even need to be FTL in combat tbh
 
I checked Yen Press's Volume 5, and it does explicitly state that it goes at the speed of light. I just remembered that it also mentions Megiddo taking 0.034 seconds reaching a target 6 thousand miles away, which is 284001882.353 m/s compared to the wiki's 299792458 m/s (a 15790575.647 m/s difference).
Although I suppose, you only need to add over 300 miles to make it actual light speed, so the novel might have meant six thousand miles as a rough estimate and not the exact number.
It still is a fact that Veldora referred to Megiddo as near light speed, though I suppose this time Yen Press haven't made any translation errors regarding Megiddo.

Well, another fun fact from Veldora's Journals is that it wasn't Raphael who came up with the counter to Benimaru's trap question regarding Shion's cooking. Raphael actually consulted Veldora, but it was Ifrit who provided the answer that Raphael then told to Rimuru (blaming Benimaru for the secret password). More than some great Veldora/Ifrit banter, this was one of the first indication of Raphael truly forming an ego and sense of self. Stuff like these is why everyone should read Veldora's Journals.
Correct and Veldora Journals are wonderful, they also hint or imply that GS was developing or had an ego but simply wasn't aware of it. Whereas Raphael is consciously aware of its self and even recognizes the anomaly but tries to ignore it. Also, GS rewarding and tricking Veldora into working is hilarious. That all ultimately lead to Veldora getting Faust through GS's and Raphael's guidance. Oh it's also cool to know that Raphael's form is similar to Rimuru's just colder.
 
Another interesting things from Veldora's journals are spiritrons and infons.

Spiritrons rae building blocks of magicule and the basis of Disintegration. Essentially this is spirit particles from the novels.

Infons are the building blocks of the soul. Chances are this is information particles. Great Sage was unable to detect and analyze Infons without Veldora's Unique Skill Inquirer's help, when they were trying to analyze the souls of the dead within the barrier. The act of using Inquirer to the maximum level fried Veldora's brain and calories as he claims.

Veldora seem to be a far more nuanced and better written character in the manga.
That moreso happened because he tried detaching a part of his consciousness. Which is why he fell unconscious for the first time in his life. The other time being he was performing analysis tasks with multiple instances of his consciousness. Which basically lead to him gaining Parallel Operation. GS was just continuously sowing seeds for Veldora's revival and Irift to grow stronger. Though he still hasn't attained his unique skill as they wanted. But he'll hopefully get one later.
 
The Chinese translation said planet. I think someone checked the Japanese statement and planet was stated, also.
I guess someone should get the Japanese scan to get evaluate it here.
If a valid star is valid, the tier would be 4-C on the safe side. The average star is around the size of the sun which is 4-C. Destroying some (2 to 3) 4-C stars together is still 4-C since the gap from 4-C to High 4-C is around ~5.59x, at face value.

I know this point is another point but we got planet-level Carrera (Volume 15 Chapter 5). I guess there is more credence to 5-B true-dragons.
We would probably need to discuss more in the future.

A thing, though, I think thinking. Rimuru though food chain gets stronger relative to being at a worst relative to his subordinate. Assuming, for example, 5-B is valid and an outlier, then the end Demon Slime could be 5-B in volume 15; though, it could go into another key.

Though, the raws probably would need to be checked. I notice stars have been wrongly translated to a planet before like in the case of WN in the comparison of Veldora sword being comparable to a planet in some bad translations where raws said it was comparable to a star (Chapter 245).
 
Well, the factors that would affect their speed (or the relevance of it in battle) should be addressed in the profiles... eventually, when better translations are out for the Empire arc. I don't particularly care much anymore about vs debating but it's something that will be used by those who do. At least we see people make use of Space Time Domination in that arc.

It's interesting that Veldora's Unique Skill Inquirer just dramatically improved instead of outright evolving after receiving his Gift from Rimuru, and he had to train for about a week to make it into an Ultimate Skill.

I guess someone should get the Japanese scan to get evaluate it here.
I only have the official translations. I suppose this is another planet=star when it comes to Japanese words, then?
I'd be fine either way, it's just something that needs to be brought up since it's an official translation. It would be nice if someone can check the Raws.

I know this point is another point but we got planet-level Carrera (Volume 15 Chapter 5). I guess there is more credence to 5-B true-dragons.
We would probably need to discuss more in the future.
It would also destroy the Otherworld that I think Rudra/Michael created, although I suppose we don't know the size of it exactly.
Yeah, this is something to be discussed when better translations are out (so like, maybe 2 years from now).

A thing, though, I think thinking. Rimuru though food chain gets stronger relative to being at a worst relative to his subordinate. Assuming, for example, 5-B is valid and an outlier, then the end Demon Slime could be 5-B in volume 15; though, it could go into another key.
There are statements IIRC about Velgrynd's individual heat blast being able to vaporize asteroids and I think Rimuru defended against them. Not sure if Rimuru would be 5-B but Beelzebub should at least be at that level probably, even without integrating it to a clone.

Checking the raws is the best course of action, I think.
 
If i remember correctly after Rimuru becomes a ultimate slime,he said that
"The speed of "Thinking Acceleration" has been increasing since I gave the name "Ciel" to the King of Wisdom. What was originally a million times faster, is now hundreds of millions of times more so.
Shockingly, this is the level at which even the speed of light can be perceived.
"

That means probably perception speed ftl and also he said that
"It is not necessary to say that the unleashing of magic is naturally faster, even the unleashing of 'Space Shift' has become nearly a thousand times faster. In other words, as long as I can keep a certain distance, I can escape even with light-speed attacks by "shifting"".
And that means he can somewhat react to light speed.But not physically faster.
But i guess he has space time manipulation after he got azathot.So,he can probably stop time and then accelerate himself by million times like the wn,if i remember.But you most likely need to wait for next vollumes to see it.
So they won’t really hit it physically?
 
The Chinese translation said planet. I think someone checked the Japanese statement and planet was stated, also.
I guess someone should get the Japanese scan to get evaluate it here.
If a valid star is valid, the tier would be 4-C on the safe side. The average star is around the size of the sun which is 4-C. Destroying some (2 to 3) 4-C stars together is still 4-C since the gap from 4-C to High 4-C is around ~5.59x, at face value.

I know this point is another point but we got planet-level Carrera (Volume 15 Chapter 5). I guess there is more credence to 5-B true-dragons.
We would probably need to discuss more in the future.

A thing, though, I think thinking. Rimuru though food chain gets stronger relative to being at a worst relative to his subordinate. Assuming, for example, 5-B is valid and an outlier, then the end Demon Slime could be 5-B in volume 15; though, it could go into another key.

Though, the raws probably would need to be checked. I notice stars have been wrongly translated to a planet before like in the case of WN in the comparison of Veldora sword being comparable to a planet in some bad translations where raws said it was comparable to a star (Chapter 245).
Okay,i mainly google translated the page of the Japanese version of veldoras travel journal in vollume 12 where the confusion is,and it also says star
 
The part in Japanese version of journal says,
"目につく もの を 全て 喰らい 尽くし 、 やがて は 星 すら 呑み込む ほど に 成長 する ―― そんな 恐るべき 化け物"
And its translaton is,
"It eats up everything that is noticeable, and eventually grows to the point of swallowing even the stars --- such a terrifying monster"

You can check it out by translating the marked part
147298888_1078815322583113_3513336522418564399_o.jpg
 
"目につく もの を 全て 喰らい 尽くし 、 やがて は 星 すら 呑み込む ほど に 成長 する ―― そんな 恐るべき 化け物"
DeepL translates it with similar meaning.
But we still need somebody proficient in Japanese to translate this and whether the word/character being used is about planets or stars.
 
I think some changes for the Falmuth forces' justifications should be made. They're being scaled to Ifrit which I don't recall being stated in the novels (somebody correct me if I'm wrong). They were also not necessarily as fast as Hakurou was.
There isn't really any controversial changes aside from adding "Likely" to Shogo's and Kyoya's speed and "At least" to Folgen's and Razen's AP and durability, most are just fixes for their justification.

Also I added Rimuru's 4-C justification.
Shogo Taguchi
  • AP: Unknown, possibly Mountain level+ (Was able to fight Geld and one-shot his shield crafted from Charybdis's scales while amped with his Berserker. Fought Kijin Shion and overwhelmed her when she was weakened)
  • Speed: Unknown, likely Massively Hypersonic (Is not too slow compared to Geld)
  • Durability: Unknown, possibly Mountain level+ (Can take physical blows from Geld, can withstand the force of his own blows)
Kyoya Tachibana
  • AP: Unknown, possibly Mountain level+ (Defeated and critically wounded a weakened Kijin Hakurou. Should be comparable to Shogo)
  • Speed: Unknown, likely Massively Hypersonic (Defeated a weakened Hakurou, although Kyoya was easily blitzed when Hakurou was at full strength)
  • Durability: Unknown, likely Mountain level+
Folgen
  • AP: At least Mountain level+ (Superior to Shogo and Kyoya. Comparable to Ifrit whom at that time has grown strong enough to defeat the Sky Dragon)
  • Speed: Massively Hypersonic (Should be superior to Shogo and Kyoya)
  • Durability: At least Mountain level+
Razen
  • AP: At least Large Mountain level (Veldora estimated his strength to be a level above Orc Disaster Geld. Hakurou deduced that he, Geld or both of them would've died against his Nuclear Magic. Is the strongest champion in Farmus)
  • Speed: Massively Hypersonic (Should be superior to Folgen, Shogo and Kyoya)
  • Durability: At least Large Mountain level
Rimuru Tempest: Gluttony/Beelzebub will eventually become Star level (Beelzebub, Lord of Gluttony is a combination of Gluttony and Merciless. Rimuru should be able to integrate Beelzebub into one of his clone that can grow large enough to devour stars)

Let me know if a CRT is necessary for this, I'll just make one after Milly's is over.
 
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Yup, that's great
Can you extract the text with Hinata saying Gluttony is a threat to the world? There might be a comparison between the word "world" that Hinata uses that might differentiate planet and star, I guess.

Basically both planet/star seem to be valid, we still need other people's thoughts on it lol
The safest bet might be 5-B, possibly 4-C.
 
Can you extract the text with Hinata saying Gluttony is a threat to the world? There might be a comparison between the word "world" that Hinata uses that might differentiate planet and star, I guess.

Basically both planet/star seem to be valid, we still need other people's thoughts on it lol
The safest bet might be 5-B, possibly 4-C.
Okay,will it be okay if i try and extract the whole side page?
 
I think just Hinata's statement which was right after the Gluttony devouring stuff is fine. The rest of the page isn't really necessary, I think.
 
I think just Hinata's statement which was right after the Gluttony devouring stuff is fine. The rest of the page isn't really necessary, I think.
Okay
"ヒナタもそれを感じ取ったようだ。「..…完全に消滅させないと、世界の危機になりそうね」そう呟くなり、精霊を五体同時に召喚しおったのだ。"
I tried translating it via Deepl but it messed up the whole thing, meanwhile google translate says,
"Hinata seems to have felt it. "..... If it is not completely extinguished, it will be a crisis in the world." He muttered and summoned five spirits at the same time."
 
I see. I think Hinata uses 世界 which means Sekai/World.
Well at least we know that she uses a different word, using similar words to refer to the stars and world would've nulled the potential upgrade, I think.
We still gonna wait what Elizhaa and CP think about it.
 
I think some changes for the Falmuth forces' justifications should be made. They're being scaled to Ifrit which I don't recall being stated in the novels (somebody correct me if I'm wrong). They were also not necessarily as fast as Hakurou was.
There isn't really any controversial changes aside from adding "Likely" to Shogo's and Kyoya's speed and "At least" to Folgen's and Razen's AP and durability, most are just fixes for their justification.

Shogo Taguchi
  • AP: Mountain level+ (Comparable to Geld and was able to one-shot his shield crafted from Charybdis's scales. Implied to have killed a weakened Kijin Shion)
  • Speed: Likely Massively Hypersonic (Comparable to Geld who mostly just defended against his attacks)
  • Durability: Mountain level+ (Can take physical blows from Geld)
Kyoya Tachibana
  • AP: Mountain level+ (Defeated and critically wounded a weakened Kijin Hakurou)
  • Speed: Likely Massively Hypersonic (Defeated a weakened Hakurou, although was easily blitzed when the latter was at full strength)
  • Durability: Mountain level+
Folgen
  • AP: At least Mountain level+ (Superior to Shogo and Kyoya. Comparable to Ifrit whom at that time has grown strong enough to defeat the Sky Dragon)
  • Speed: Massively Hypersonic (Should be superior to Shogo and Kyoya)
  • Durability: At least Mountain level+
Razen
  • AP: At least Large Mountain level (Veldora estimated his strength to be a level above Orc Disaster Geld. Hakurou deduced that he, Geld or both of them would've died fighting against Razen)
  • Speed: Massively Hypersonic (Should be superior to Shogo and Kyoya)
  • Durability: At least Large Mountain level

Let me know if a CRT is necessary for this, I'll just make one after Milly's is over.
Shogo didn't kill Shion. A random solider did while she was protecting a child. How weak was Hakurou? I don't think we know. As for Razen, its more so he thought the nuclear magic that'd activate post-mortem would likely kill them.
 
High-Godly makes no sense btw. Information particles are physical....they aren't literal information. Besides that when has anyone regenerated from having their information particles erased? I don't me a part of them either because that just means you can regenerate lost particles not regen when you don't exist as one.

True Dragon and Primordials eventually return from having their nucleus destroyed but they do regenerate. Their energy disperses and restores itself somewhere else. Unlike normal spiritual beings, Primordials and demons already think with their soul (obviously) and so they retain memory. It takes hundreds of years for most demons (even Primordials) the exception being Diablo. He immediately returns to form, somehow.

True Dragons are the same way except their recollection of memories are difficult and their personality changes (likely due to the memories). This seems to occur somewhat faster than the demons likely due to not having to return scattered energy into a parallel spiritual dimension. Regardless neither are actively regenerating anyway.
 
Shogo didn't kill Shion. A random solider did while she was protecting a child. How weak was Hakurou? I don't think we know. As for Razen, its more so he thought the nuclear magic that'd activate post-mortem would likely kill them.
Was it ever shown or told who killed Shion? I don't really recall, so I'd assume the one who did her was the one she was fighting. Otherwise, we can just remove the Shion part if it's not what happened.

We don't know, but Kyoya who should be no weaker than Shogo, still beat a weakened Hakurou. I suppose we should just include

Razen was still capable of using Nuclear Magic besides his secret detonation after death, combined with Veldora's statement it's believable he could kill Geld and Hakurou without needing to die himself. We can still remove the post-mortem explosion part of the justification.

High-Godly makes no sense btw. Information particles are physical....they aren't literal information.
There was a CRT already made, I think. You can make your comment there.
I personally am neutral, leaning to disagree though. They are very clearly Mid-Godly however. I think somebody who is well-versed with Regeneration definition is needed.
 
I guess I am neutral on both cases in the 5-B and 4-C Gluttony.

Are you sure information particles are physical?
Information particles still make up intangible things like souls as discussed in one of the last threads. Volume 13 Chapter 7 expanded on this point.
I think there was a context that the Great Spirit of Space still makes the information in a past Tensei Discussion thread. I can't found it yet. I think it was from a guide like LN 8.5 and 13.5.

I kind of want to hear, what is the argument for Mid-Godly. If it around basically from regeneration from erasure and information being the smallest unit of exist is valid, then the regeneration would most likely be High-Goldy.
High-Godly: The ability to regenerate after the erasure of body, mind, and soul, along with at least one even more fundamental aspect of a character's existence, such as their place in the narrative, their entire history, or the underlying concept(s) or information needed for them to exist.
 
I guess I am neutral on both cases in the 5-B and 4-C Gluttony.

Are you sure information particles are physical?
Information particles still make up intangible things like souls as discussed in one of the last threads. Volume 13 Chapter 7 expanded on this point.
I think there was a context that the Great Spirit of Space still makes the information in a past Tensei Discussion thread. I can't found it yet. I think it was from a guide like LN 8.5 and 13.5.

I kind of want to hear, what is the argument for Mid-Godly. If it around basically from regeneration from erasure and information being the smallest unit of exist is valid, then the regeneration would most likely be High-Goldy.
High-Godly: The ability to regenerate after the erasure of body, mind, and soul, along with at least one even more fundamental aspect of a character's existence, such as their place in the narrative, their entire history, or the underlying concept(s) or information needed for them to exist.
Souls are information in Tenslime. Regenerating from that state should be High-Godly.
 
I guess I am neutral on both cases in the 5-B and 4-C Gluttony.
I suppose we'll wait for what CP thinks. If we trust the official translation, it'll be 4-C. If nothing else, it could be 5-B, likely 4-C.

I think the issue with High Godly is whether or not the information particles/pieces or infons can be qualified as information in the High Godly definition. Which is a separate fundamental aspect of their existence. Milly's CRT is also using both WN and LN sources, which I believe is supposed to be separate. Combined with my uncertainty of the topic, I'll remain neutral for now until I reread the novels, which might not be any time soon.

If Milly's CRT is referring to WN profiles, then that's my mistake. I'm not familiar with it so my comments would be invalid. I'm only referring to the LN.

The argument for Mid-Godly basically tackles the same feats for High Godly except information particles aren't considered as indication of High Godly.
Mid-Godly: The ability to regenerate from the complete erasure of body, mind, and soul.
True Dragons and Primordial Demons still survive even the complete destruction of their existence, which is the physical body, the spiritual body which is essentially the mind, and their cores/soul. Only that it takes longer time for some, except for Diablo or the True Dragons if I'm not mistaken.
 
I suppose we'll wait for what CP thinks. If we trust the official translation, it'll be 4-C. If nothing else, it could be 5-B, likely 4-C.

I think the issue with High Godly is whether or not the information particles/pieces or infons can be qualified as information in the High Godly definition. Which is a separate fundamental aspect of their existence. Milly's CRT is also using both WN and LN sources, which I believe is supposed to be separate. Combined with my uncertainty of the topic, I'll remain neutral for now until I reread the novels, which might not be any time soon.

If Milly's CRT is referring to WN profiles, then that's my mistake. I'm not familiar with it so my comments would be invalid. I'm only referring to the LN.

The argument for Mid-Godly basically tackles the same feats for High Godly except information particles aren't considered as indication of High Godly.

True Dragons and Primordial Demons still survive even the complete destruction of their existence, which is the physical body, the spiritual body which is essentially the mind, and their cores/soul. Only that it takes longer time for some, except for Diablo or the True Dragons if I'm not mistaken.
What? I’m referring to both, but not combining them. It just scales to both continuities.
 
What? I’m referring to both, but not combining them. It just scales to both continuities.
Upon reading the CRT, there isn't really any indication or labels that the scans you presented were from the LN or the WN, except for scans that have chapter numbers in them (which would be the WN). The first paragraph's scans about information particles seem to all come from the WN. The second paragraph of characters regeneration come from the LN. The third paragraph, a blog by CP, were about the WN. Correct me if I'm wrong.

As far as I know, scans from the WN can't be used as evidence for the LN, and vice-versa, since the two can have massive differences (Correct me if I'm wrong). Just because information from the WN indicates High Godly regen, doesn't mean the LN will have it as well.
 
Well, I don't really want to talk about updates and stuff but do you guys think the next episode of anime is Rimuru vs Hinata?
 
Probably. The title of the next episode is in reference to Hinata. "The Beauty Makes Her Move."
I would've preferred the title "Natural Enemy of Monsters" or "A Monster's Natural Enemy" though, since that was the manga/novel chapter title when Hinata vs Rimuru happened.
 
As far as I know, scans from the WN can't be used as evidence for the LN, and vice-versa, since the two can have massive differences (Correct me if I'm wrong). Just because information from the WN indicates High Godly regen, doesn't mean the LN will have it as well.
Dude, no, that’s not that point I’m making. The point is, both continuities are made from information in their smallest sense, LN & WN, including the soul. Regenerating from the soul, aka information, would be High-Godly.
 
Dude, no, that’s not that point I’m making. The point is, both continuities are made from information in their smallest sense, LN & WN, including the soul. Regenerating from the soul, aka information, would be High-Godly.
My point is that you should also provide scans from the LN talking about information particles, not just from the WN. In the same vein, also provide scans of Rimuru regenerating from Melt Slash from the WN, not just the LN. You can't mix the two and portray them as supporting each other.

Also note that I'm not saying that they don't share the same concept, and I already said that I'm neutral on the matter, I won't really have any problems if High Godly gets accepted or not.
 
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