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Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken Discussion Thread 20

Doomrider7 said:
I'm honestly not sure if there even is one. I'll try and see if it's in any of the volumes I own.

Edit: Curse you Elizhaa!Elizabeth!

Edit 2: Actually LN1 Cover has his image.
Click to expand...
Bump for sending again.

Vol.3 of Veldora’s diary:

Veldora should have creation, as he created a shoji board out of willpower against Ifrit.

Ragna resists magic.

Veldora is stated to posses “infinite energy”.

The Kijin group is stated to have less magicules than Ifrit.
 
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Milly_Rocking_Bandit said:
Bump for sending again.

Vol.3 of Veldora’s diary:

Veldora should have creation, as he created a shoji board out of willpower against Ifrit.

Ragna resists magic.

Veldora is stated to posses “infinite energy”.

The Kijin group is stated to have less magicules than Ifrit.
Click to expand...
Well the stuff created in there seems to be due to the imaginary and metaphysical nature of the realm/stomach. So I don't know if he could do that outside.
 
I figured I'd post it before someone else. Take what you will from it. Volume 10: Adventure

20210131_155116.jpg
 
Why Ranga and Shion 2nd key are Rel+ while Benimaru, Souei, etc. Only got MHS? I mean they are more or less comparable each other or at least their speed.
 
The description was not up to the proper standard to be conceptual manipulation. Although, it was agreed that it could be under reality-warping but magic in vsbattke wiki is a type of reality-warping. Additionally, Magic, in Slime, is also stated to affect physical laws for instance so maybe a case like Elder Scroll where magic is agreed as reality warping can happen.
 
Nxdia00 said:
Why Ranga and Shion 2nd key are Rel+ while Benimaru, Souei, etc. Only got MHS? I mean they are more or less comparable each other or at least their speed.
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Because of the lack of feats and other, possible inconsistencies that would result, especially with Souei being Rel+. We are just waiting for future volumes to be translated by Tensura Fan so that we can get more speed feats/statements from them. It would be nice if somebody can give scans that supports them having Rel+ speed ratings though.

Ranga and Shion are rated as Rel+ because they were able to keep up with Razul who was superior to Granbell and could give Diablo trouble. Shion never stopped training so it makes sense for her to be stronger and faster, the same for Ranga who was trained by Milim herself who is a combat genius who made Rimuru and the Kijins stronger due to her training.
 
I’m starting to believe AP>hax in Tenslime.

Veldora says he regenerates magicules too fast for Hinata’s Holy/Anti-Magic Field to purify and nerf him, and Benimaru’s magicule count was larger than Charbydis, and so he could bypass its Magic Interference.
 
The former is, as it states, due to the speed at which his magicules regenerate, not their quantity. The latter would sooner indicate that magic interference simply can't stop attacks that are far more powerful than its user.
 
Well, Veldora's renegeration is kinda haxed too, since it's often described to be infinite. This doesn't really show AP>Hax necessarily. The more curious situation is Veldora apparently being capable of taking a Melt Slash, something that could destroy an Ultimate Skill and nearly kill Rimuru.

The magicule count stuff is the most common indicator when it comes to AP, but it's not absolute as Skills, Arts, and experience/technique/proficiency in controlling magic energy also affects AP. Usually, you need comparable amount of magicules in order to harm an opponent, but there are people like Hakuro who can harm people whose magicule count dwarfs his own.

As for Benimaru vs Charybdis, Magic Interference isn't absolute. Milim overpowered it as well. In Benimaru's case, it wasn't only due to magicule count, but also his proficiency in controlling magic particles that far exceeds Charybdis's, which means he can bypass Magic Interference without overpowering it.
 
WHYNAUT said:
The former is, as it states, due to the speed at which his magicules regenerate, not their quantity. The latter would sooner indicate that magic interference simply can't stop attacks that are far more powerful than its user.
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Would disagree, as Veldora actually needed to train his aura to prevent it from killing people, implying it’s quantity is quite large. The last one only proves my point.

Metalballrun said:
Usually, you need comparable amount of magicules in order to harm an opponent, but there are people like Hakuro who can harm people whose magicule count dwarfs his own.
Click to expand...
Can you provide some examples? If you’re referring to Hakurou vs Orc Lord, I’m fairly certain it was stated the Kijin’s could fight them, but couldn’t get past his regeneration.
Metalballrun said:
As for Benimaru vs Charybdis, Magic Interference isn't absolute. Milim overpowered it as well. In Benimaru's case, it wasn't only due to magicule count, but also his proficiency in controlling magic particles that far exceeds Charybdis's, which means he can bypass Magic Interference without overpowering it.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah, that also kinda proves my point, Milim overpowering it. Proficiency in controlling magic is also good, I won’t deny that. Imo, it’s just good for thought.
 
Milly_Rocking_Bandit said:
Can you provide some examples? If you’re referring to Hakurou vs Orc Lord, I’m fairly certain it was stated the Kijin’s could fight them, but couldn’t get past his regeneration.
Click to expand...
I'm certain that Hakuro has always been used in-universe as an example of someone who has low magicule content but can hang with people with higher magicule content. Him being able to harm Rimuru and Orc Disaster are the biggest examples, since he doesn't really get into a lot of fights later on.

IIRC, Tatsuya Kondou and his friends back in his old universe don't have any impressive magicule content, but through pure mastery of Sword Arts, Velgrynd rated them as A rank.

I'm forgetting other examples though but I'm certain there's more.

Milly_Rocking_Bandit said:
Well, yeah, that also kinda proves my point, Milim overpowering it. Proficiency in controlling magic is also good, I won’t deny that. Imo, it’s just good for thought.
Click to expand...
While Milim can easily overpower it, I'm also fairly certain that Milim's attack had hax with it. It wasn't just a mindless brute force attack, it was calculated enough that it left the heart (Phobio) undamaged, while also atomizing Charybdis (hence "overpowering" Ultraspeed regeneration which heals on the molecular level only). It won't be surprising that Milim did the same thing as Benimaru and simply mastered her control of magic enough to bypass Magic Interference.

With that said, it's certainly a case-by-case basis. Some hax abilities in Slime are magic-based so anti-magic works on them, hence why Magic Interference, Holy Fields and Yuuki's Anti-Skill were/are relevant. But generally hax is still, well, hax. It bypasses conventional durability and AP.
 
Metalballrun said:
Because of the lack of feats and other, possible inconsistencies that would result, especially with Souei being Rel+. We are just waiting for future volumes to be translated by Tensura Fan so that we can get more speed feats/statements from them. It would be nice if somebody can give scans that supports them having Rel+ speed ratings though.

Ranga and Shion are rated as Rel+ because they were able to keep up with Razul who was superior to Granbell and could give Diablo trouble. Shion never stopped training so it makes sense for her to be stronger and faster, the same for Ranga who was trained by Milim herself who is a combat genius who made Rimuru and the Kijins stronger due to her training.
Click to expand...
Well, later stuff would just support everyone being MHS not even relativistic. But we'll get to it when we do. Only top tiers are possible rel in combat speed. Velgrynd is the fastest character so far and she's only rel+ to lightspeed at max speed. There's even a funny statement that "humans" (more so mortals or people) cannot go beyond faster than sound. And even spiritual lifeforms can only accelerate so much, they can't go faster than light.

There could be some diction or syntax error so MAYBE Fuse was trying to portray something else. But I find it incredibly unlikely given the supporting feats or lack thereof. Luckily, their combat speed doesn't matter. Since they have abilities like Thought Acceleration and Spatial Domination or Transfer (Rimuru and co specifically having Space-time manipulation) they can make up for their lack of raw combat speed. And SOME people have abilities that are immeasurable in speed or will be.
 
Community_Gamer said:
There could be some diction or syntax error so MAYBE Fuse was trying to portray something else.
Click to expand...
Probably, but I also doubt that all of those are just incorrectly translated. Nevertheless we just have to wait for Tensura Fan to translate them.

I'm well aware of the possible inconsistencies that might appear. Hell there are already inconsistent low-end feats in the previous volumes (Rimuru's sword slash only being "near the speed of sound" during his fight with Hinata, Shion launching supersonic projectiles are considered impressive by Reynald Jesta, and Rimuru not being able to travel at hypersonic speeds in Volume 10). We just consider them as outliers because MHS and Relativistic+ are more consistent throughout the fights and it wouldn't make sense for them to be even supersonic, let alone subsonic. Edit: I'd also add that Rimuru's attack speed being subsonic came from Yen Press, which makes the entire thing dubious.

I'm convinced that FUSE is trying to nerf them but has no idea how to keep their speed ratings consistent. Hell, if the manga ever reaches Volume 11, we might even get FTL results if we decide to calculate Hinata intercepting Melt Slash from a distance (though personally, this would also be an outlier/inconsistency and I'd rather stick to Relativistic+ for Hinata). I have no idea how reactions are measured, but I'm certain that Rimuru's Thought Acceleration with Ciel exceeds the speed of light by a huge margin even just based off the fact that Raphael's can perceive attacks that are almost light speed and Ciel's is 100x that speed.

Tl;dr we just find a middle ground where the ratings make the most sense, eventually. And fill the profiles with necessary details.
 
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I'm just dropping this here in case some haven't seen it yet. This is probably gonna be most of the characters' peak forms.
Volume 12 has been 84% finished for a while now, hopefully we get it this month.
 
Elizhaa said:
They have to be able to come back with complete erasure first to have High-Godly, in the verse.
Click to expand...
Yeah, their soul is information. Mind=Soul=Information in Tenslime, coming back from erasure of the “soul”, which is made of information (destruction), that’s High-Godly.
 
Metalballrun said:
Probably, but I also doubt that all of those are just incorrectly translated. Nevertheless we just have to wait for Tensura Fan to translate them.

I'm well aware of the possible inconsistencies that might appear. Hell there are already inconsistent low-end feats in the previous volumes (Rimuru's sword slash only being "near the speed of sound" during his fight with Hinata, Shion launching supersonic projectiles are considered impressive by Reynald Jesta, and Rimuru not being able to travel at hypersonic speeds in Volume 10). We just consider them as outliers because MHS and Relativistic+ are more consistent throughout the fights and it wouldn't make sense for them to be even supersonic, let alone subsonic. Edit: I'd also add that Rimuru's attack speed being subsonic came from Yen Press, which makes the entire thing dubious.

I'm convinced that FUSE is trying to nerf them but has no idea how to keep their speed ratings consistent. Hell, if the manga ever reaches Volume 11, we might even get FTL results if we decide to calculate Hinata intercepting Melt Slash from a distance (though personally, this would also be an outlier/inconsistency and I'd rather stick to Relativistic+ for Hinata). I have no idea how reactions are measured, but I'm certain that Rimuru's Thought Acceleration with Ciel exceeds the speed of light by a huge margin even just based off the fact that Raphael's can perceive attacks that are almost light speed and Ciel's is 100x that speed.

Tl;dr we just find a middle ground where the ratings make the most sense, eventually. And fill the profiles with necessary details.
Click to expand...
They were only to perceive light after amplifying their perception by 100,000,000 times. But yeah pretty much
 
Community_Gamer said:
They were only to perceive light after amplifying their perception by 100,000,000 times. But yeah pretty much
Click to expand...
Yeah and it's ******* annoying considering it's also described as "shockingly" lol.
There are also speed descriptions that ranges from Mach 10, to Mach 100, to Mach 1000+. Which are all so damned inconsistent. I don't think Fuse realizes the massive speed difference between Mach 100, Mach 1000, and near light speed, to the point that Velgrynd's speed fluctuates between these numbers which are all described as impressive.

Fuse also seems to have forgotten Volume 11 where people were already fighting at near light speeds, enough that Rimuru calls it a "light speed battle".

I'm really hoping all of these are translation errors, but Charvander didn't just plug these to a machine translator. She used multiple ones and spent a good amount of time making them readable.

And I'm not even mad or concerned about potential downgrades, as we already did downgrade their speed. I just want it to be as consistent and accurate as possible lol
 
Metalballrun said:
Yeah and it's ******* annoying considering it's also described as "shockingly" lol.
There are also speed descriptions that ranges from Mach 10, to Mach 100, to Mach 1000+. Which are all so damned inconsistent. I don't think Fuse realizes the massive speed difference between Mach 100, Mach 1000, and near light speed, to the point that Velgrynd's speed fluctuates between these numbers which are all described as impressive.

Fuse also seems to have forgotten Volume 11 where people were already fighting at near light speeds, enough that Rimuru calls it a "light speed battle".

I'm really hoping all of these are translation errors, but Charvander didn't just plug these to a machine translator. She used multiple ones and spent a good amount of time making them readable.

And I'm not even mad or concerned about potential downgrades, as we already did downgrade their speed. I just want it to be as consistent and accurate as possible lol
Click to expand...
V17 was done in collaboration with Voxel and using the terms sheets, but that was the first volume to be done that way. And from my own translations of the raws it hasn't really changed. So I wouldn't expect major changes in V14 - V16 translation in terms of wording accuracy. The syntax is the only major change I see. It's unfortunate but we'll have better feats and speed doesn't mean very much at this point.
 
I discovered a potential upgrade or downgrade for Rimuru again, now that Kodansha's version of Veldora's Journals are now available up to the 15th volume of the manga.

We are currently using this fan translation to justify Gluttony's 5-B rating, but the official version has a different translation.

But even more fearsome than his countenance is the effect of the Gluttony skill he unleashed. He showed the ability to devour everything in sight, until he gobbled up the very stars in the sky — suggesting a monstrous potential, indeed.
Click to expand...

Which brings us the issues:
  1. In the first place, Gluttony seems to be a hax ability rather than force. I might be mistaken since I'm not entirely well versed with how the AP system works, so I'm just asking (just be sure) whether we should put Gluttony's capability to eat things in Rimuru's AP in the first place, or instead just place it in Range.
  2. If we are gonna keep it in AP, then in my opinion, we should go by the official translations (as even Tensura Fan considers them to be completely legit IIRC, hence why they don't even translate that part of the manga). The question is: does the official quote merits an AP rating? If not, do we remove rating Gluttony entirely due to lack of context?
  3. If it does merit a rating, what would it get? Low 4-C or 4-C?
 
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Gluttony should be physical + hax, as absorption is hax (Rimuru absorbing a structure that even the current 6-A Veldora couldn’t destroy at 6-C). Also, yeah, I would agree with this upgrade. I personally think it’s High 4-C, as he implies more than one star, but I’m happy to go with a lowball.
 
I just wanted to hear the other's thoughts on it, though the WN treats Beelzebub as AP so Gluttony should work the same.
I also just want to know if the others think until he gobbled up the very stars in the sky is a valid AP statement, and what tier would it be since it's not instant and would be done over time. I personally don't mind a Tier 4 rating but would prefer the lowball, especially since it's just one statement.
 
Metalballrun said:
I also just want to know if the others think until he gobbled up the very stars in the sky is a valid AP statement, and what tier would it be since it's not instant and would be done over time. I personally don't mind a Tier 4 rating but would prefer the lowball, especially since it's just one statement.
Click to expand...
It would still be 4-C, just overtime.
 
Another interesting things from Veldora's journals are spiritrons and infons.

Spiritrons rae building blocks of magicule and the basis of Disintegration. Essentially this is spirit particles from the novels.

Infons are the building blocks of the soul. Chances are this is information particles. Great Sage was unable to detect and analyze Infons without Veldora's Unique Skill Inquirer's help, when they were trying to analyze the souls of the dead within the barrier. The act of using Inquirer to the maximum level fried Veldora's brain and calories as he claims.

Veldora seem to be a far more nuanced and better written character in the manga.
 
Metalballrun said:
Infons are the building blocks of the soul. Chances are this is information particles. Great Sage was unable to detect and analyze Infons without Veldora's Unique Skill Inquirer's help, when they were trying to analyze the souls of the dead within the barrier. The act of using Inquirer to the maximum level fried Veldora's brain and calories as he claims.

Veldora seem to be a far more nuanced and better written character in the manga.
Click to expand...
Further evidence of destroying “souls” being High-Godly destruction. Also, yes, Veldora in the manga is an S-Tier character.
 
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