Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken Discussion Thread 20

[Bernkastelll]

thanks

 

[Elizhaa]

In my opinion, Space-time continuous is more treated as Immortality Type 6 and 9 pseudo-negation; it will attack the character's true-self regardless of distance as long as the substituent is hit.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

In my opinion, Space-time continuous is more treated as Immortality Type 6 and 9 pseudo-negation; it will attack the character's true-self regardless of distance as long as the substituent is hit.

Attacking beyond space-time is why Anos is getting immeasurable right now.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Pretty much what Elizhaa said, Veldora's memories transcend space-time so he can't truly be harmed, Velgrynd attacks the Veldora clone, and his true self gets hit too despite transcending space-time.

More a range feat than speed, as it's been treated for years now, with multiple discussions on it from what i remember.

The LN might be different, but in the WN at least i don't think it's immeasurable speed.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Pretty much what Elizhaa said, Veldora's memories transcend space-time so he can't truly be harmed, Velgrynd attacks the Veldora clone, and his true self gets hit too despite transcending space-time.

More a range feat than speed, as it's been treated for years now, with multiple discussions on it from what i remember.

The LN might be different, but in the WN at least i don't think it's immeasurable speed.

But it’s also in Rimuru’s imaginary space, outside of time and space, so shouldn’t it be Immeasurable?

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Attacking beyond space-time is why Anos is getting immeasurable right now.

Its more because the spear flies across space and time via sheer speed. The transcendence bit is just supporting it.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Its more because the spear flies across space and time via sheer speed. The transcendence bit is just supporting it.

Is this not the same? It’s stated to be beyond space and time.

 

[Helestias]

But regardless of that,if vollume 17 translaton is somewhat correct than atleast infinite speed is a must cuz it is directly said in ln that,"Even ‘Instantaneous Movement’ was possible because it could travel over any distance without regard to time" and also "Velgrynd can now find pieces of her beloved Rudra’s soul, no matter how remote or far away they are, even beyond time and space."
so,lets just wait for fantl.
Btw do any of you know,when will the fantl for vollume 12 come out?

 

[Community_Gamer]

あの時、Rimuru と別れて飛んだ先は、時間すらも超えた異世界であった。Feldway に飛ばされた‘Parallel Existence ’と無事に再統合したのは、どことも知れぬ異界の狭間（はざま）だったのだ。

大気どころか大地すらないその場所で、Velgrynd は時間の感覚もなく漂流するはめになったのである。

Velgrynd が“True Dragon ”でなかったら、その場所で野垂れ死んでいたかも知れない。けれど彼女には、‘Spatial Domination ’と無限の寿命があった。

寄る辺となる場所に辿り着くまでの間、考える時間だけは豊富にあった。Velgrynd は、自身の身に起きた信じがたい出来事に、思考が停止しかけていたのである。

After leaving Rimuru, Velgrynd flew to a world beyond time, where he was safely reunited with 'Parallel Existence', which had been sent to Feldway, in an unknown space between worlds.

In that place, where there is no atmosphere or even earth, Velgrynd was forced to drift without any sense of time.

If Velgrynd had not been a "True Dragon," she might have died in that place. However, she had 'Spatial Domination' and an infinite lifespan.

She had plenty of time to think before she reached a place of refuge, and Velgrynd's thoughts were nearly stopped by the unbelievable events that had happened to her.

 

[Helestias]

あの時、Rimuru と別れて飛んだ先は、時間すらも超えた異世界であった。Feldway に飛ばされた‘Parallel Existence ’と無事に再統合したのは、どことも知れぬ異界の狭間（はざま）だったのだ。

大気どころか大地すらないその場所で、Velgrynd は時間の感覚もなく漂流するはめになったのである。

Velgrynd が“True Dragon ”でなかったら、その場所で野垂れ死んでいたかも知れない。けれど彼女には、‘Spatial Domination ’と無限の寿命があった。

寄る辺となる場所に辿り着くまでの間、考える時間だけは豊富にあった。Velgrynd は、自身の身に起きた信じがたい出来事に、思考が停止しかけていたのである。

Full Japanese?

 

[Metalballrun]

More a range feat than speed, as it's been treated for years now, with multiple discussions on it from what i remember.

What kind of Range is it, though? The profile states that it's Universal+ but being "beyond space-time" and how Veldora's stuff is described makes it sound like it should be Interdimensional range, if I'm not mistaken.

Also, what's your opinion about 4-C Gluttony/Beelzebub?

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

It's an attack that deals damage beyond space-time, yea inter-dimensional sounds right.

As for immeasurable speed, statements about being beyond/transcend/outside time isn't enough for it, our standards got stricter. That just serves as supporting evidence, you need an actual feat which shows something like attacking in the past or something together with those beyond time statements, which i don't think WN Velgrynd has.

From what i saw apparently it could also be translated to mean either destroying the planet or stars?

 

[Helestias]

It's an attack that deals damage beyond space-time, yea inter-dimensional sounds right.

As for immeasurable speed, statements about being beyond/transcend/outside time isn't enough for it, our standards got stricter. That just serves as supporting evidence, you need an actual feat which shows something like attacking in the past or something together with those beyond time statements, which i don't think WN Velgrynd has.

From what i saw apparently it could also be translated to mean either destroying the planet or stars?

Its outright stated star in official Translation.And even both Google and fan Translation (translated by someone in vsb) of the Japanese official veldoras journal says star

 

[Metalballrun]

From what i saw apparently it could also be translated to mean either destroying the planet or stars?

Yes. But the official translation says it's a star so I don't think that could be ignored. Qlipoth says it could go either way depending on the context. It uses the word "hoshi" which can mean star/planet/celestial bodies.
In the same page Hinata says Gluttony will become a threat to the world, using the word sekai instead of hoshi so there's at least a distinction.

I initially proposed that Gluttony/Beelzebub be rated as "Will eventually become 5-B, possibly 4-C".

 

[Nxdia00]

Yes. But the official translation says it's a star so I don't think that could be ignored. Qlipoth says it could go either way depending on the context. It uses the word "hoshi" which can mean star/planet/celestial bodies.
In the same page Hinata says Gluttony will become a threat to the world, using the word sekai instead of hoshi so there's at least a distinction.

I initially proposed that Gluttony/Beelzebub be rated as "Will eventually become 5-B, possibly 4-C".

Yeah...5-B, possibly 4-C is the safest in this case

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

TBF you guys, I'm pretty sure I said something about getting real uneasy any time I see kanji like that since you could use any of its multiple meanings (provided that said kanji have multiple meanings, like 世界/せかい/Sekai meaning world and universe or a more explicit one of universe that is 宇宙/うちゅう/Uchū can also mean cosmos or space as in outer space).

How things are said in the official translations don't really concern me, since those that do them most likely just use one of the meanings of the kanji in question. Which in this case is hoshi which can mean exactly as I explained to @Metalballrun that time.

For me, I just say these things because I don't know what to really put other than giving out possible options for you guys to pick your poisons with. It's really up to everyone who sends these out to the TL thread and ask to check the original raws. That's as far as my concerns go in relation to any official translation of any series.

 

[Helestias]

Yeah...5-B, possibly 4-C is the safest in this case

Yup,rather than direct 4-C.5-B and possibly 4-C is a way better option

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

"Will eventually become 5-B, possibly 4-C " is fine with me.

 

[Bernkastelll]

Yeah, 5-B, possibly 4-C sounds better

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

"Gluttony Threat to the World"

Ah. Then in that case, that's one way to compromise statements/feats like this.

My case regarding any feats that use kanji's like hoshi or sekai is also in regards not only to the context of what's use but also anything of major events (feats) that happened prior to that point an attack/ability has said statements made like that. There's also ofc having to account whether it's an outlier or not as well. All of this not taking what the official translation of a given feat says, that is.

Could be me being cautious but I do take careful looks at everything to make sure that people send is given and explained, right down to explaining what a kanji can mean because learning these things are good for future references. ^^

 

[Metalballrun]

Could be me being cautious but I do take careful looks at everything to make sure that people send is given and explained, right down to explaining what a kanji can mean because learning these things are good for future references. ^^

It's fine, we understand that it's just in-universe context at this point in regards to which interpretation of the world is likely the most accurate.

In regards to Gluttony, by this time there actually aren't any planetary feats at all as most characters are at 6-C at this point. However, there are no contradictions, anti-feats, or any of the sort either.
Simply put, Gluttony, as it is used normally, takes form of a dark aura which consumes any and every target and ignores durability to a certain extent if I'm not mistaken (it has consumed attacks from 6-C characters and has casually eaten High 7-A beings).
Meanwhile, Awakened Gluttony is a special ability wherein Rimuru's clone that is controlled by Gluttony would continue to grow over time until it gets big enough to eat either planets or stars.

Rimuru's or anyone's physicals doesn't really scale from Awakened Gluttony so it doesn't cause any inconsistency. Although in the latest novels, it would seem that most physical AP feats peak at 5-B, so "possibly 4-C" is the safest choice if it is actually accepted.

 

[Community_Gamer]

For those who are debating about Velgyrnd's Space-time attack AND the statements around the "world beyond time". I have translated several different ways, looked at the specific kanji and potential meanings, isolated ruby text, and had other educated individuals and translators look at it.

After leaving Rimuru, Velgrynd flew to a world beyond time, where he was safely reunited with 'Parallel Existence', which had been sent to Feldway, in an unknown space between worlds.

Don't forget the context here. Feldway BFR'd Velgyrnd's Parallel Existence outside of that space-time and Rimuru sent Velgyrnd off after she arrived at another "world" (sekai is used here specifically in reference to another world or dimension). This another is beyond "time", now this world is simply the endless space between universes in Tensura. Its the world between worlds which would make it "beyond" the space-time of the Cardinal World.

In that place, where there is no atmosphere or even earth, Velgrynd was forced to drift without any sense of time.

If Velgrynd had not been a "True Dragon," she might have died in that place. However, she had 'Spatial Domination' and an infinite lifespan.

She had plenty of time to think before she reached a place of refuge, and Velgrynd's thoughts were nearly stopped by the unbelievable events that had happened to her.

So she pretty much says it's empty and endless. She clarifies that if she weren't immortal and can travel space via teleportation she would die there because there is no destination to arrive at.

But the world I was in means that I know how to get out of here and back to the other side.

　I'm dead, so what's the point of going back... wait, I'm dead?

　The Velgrynd seems to have jumped not only in dimensions, but also in time. If we parse this, then maybe...

To at more context to Velgrynd’s Dimension Leap ability (which is the only reason she could leave that world as well know from V17) is not only allowing her move through dimensions but even time.

<<The effect of 'Dimension Leap' in Velgrynd's power, which is an ability that Velgrynd himself can only leap towards the landmark of Rudra's soul shard, but to unleash the move towards the landmark, what I guess there's no problem>>.

　I see....

　So the Velgrynd traced the connection between Cornu's 'Split Body' and the main body, and even destroyed the main body?

<<That's right. This 'Spacetime Continuous Attack' that can transcend time and space to attack, even if it is 'Parallel Existence' There is no way of escaping it, sir.>>

Before I address this Space-time attack. Its funny how obvious this because Velgyrnd after V15 she left went to look for Rudra many worlds and times. In V17 she destorys all of Cornu's subordinates and severely damaged him. She mentions to one of Phantoms that if they were connected to the Cardinal World they should just perform "timeline synchronization". Which just leads them to deduce she's from the future. She even talks about running into her past self. The in V16 she arrives only like minutes after she left for several 100 years at least. She utilizes her Dimension Leap to attack Cornu in every dimension even in the Otherworld/Spirit World. Hence the transcending time and space.

Meaning if she wants to hit with this attack it'll trace you regardless of your position in time or space. If don't want to say Immeasurable that's fine its not necessary.

 

[Elizhaa]

5-B, possible 4-C probably might not be an outlier; Carrera has a spell that could blow up the planet (Volume 15 Chapter 5).

I think Velgrynd has some planet statements that I want to check, in Volume 17.

There is a statement in Volume 17 Chapter 4 that could be High 6-A or 5-B, or higher depending on the context.

Side notes, there is a statement about Sky Dragon being able to destroy a country (Volume 17 chapter 1); it could be 6-B going from Blummund which is considered small.
Edit: There is another statement for around Volume 12-14 that I want to check about Special Rank A or Catatrosphe; Catatrosphe as a name seems to be wrong since it is only for Special Rank S (Volume 12 Chapter 3). There is another around Volume 3-4; I try will to post them later: (Volume 3 Chapter 3), (Volume 4 Chapter 3)

I kind of want to check on my spare time if country-level is doable in the future for Special A rank as weirdly it makes sense based on demon slime 10x multiplier, in my spare time.
Edit: I did a mock calculation using Blummund as the country of destruction for instance and approximated it to around the size of Madagascar. Based on the results, I had around 40 Teratons (6-B) for destruction from the explosion method.

 

[Community_Gamer]

Some people forget or misunderstood this line too. Here's it again bodying Cornu from others dimensions separate of the Cardinal/Axis World.

 

[Bernkastelll]

After all these statements of blowing/destroying planets, I don't think that 5-B, possibly 4-C is a outlier, since, it looks consistent to the current characters strenght

 

[Metalballrun]

Disregarding Immeasurable Speed, LN Velgrynd's Space-Time Continuous Attack has an outright Low Multiversal Range at the very least as she was able to hit poor Cornu who was in an entirely separate 4D space.

 

[Community_Gamer]

5-B, possible 4-C probably might not be an outlier; Carrera has a spell that could blow up the planet (Volume 15 Chapter 5).

I think Velgrynd has some planet statements in I want to check, in Volume 17.

There is a statement in Volume 17 Chapter 4 that could be High 6-A or 5-B, or higher depending on the context.

The

5-B, possible 4-C probably might not be an outlier; Carrera has a spell that could blow up the planet (Volume 15 Chapter 5).

I think Velgrynd has some planet statements in I want to check, in Volume 17.

There is a statement in Volume 17 Chapter 4 that could be High 6-A or 5-B, or higher depending on the context.

That's probably not planets, iirc she was referring to different worlds not necessarily planets. It'd also be a bit strange if it took True Dragons releasing all their Haki to destroy "weak planets".

 

[Community_Gamer]

Disregarding Immeasurable Speed, LN Velgrynd's Space-Time Continuous Attack has an outright Low Multiversal Range at the very least as she was able to hit poor Cornu who was in an entirely separate 4D space.

He was really being bullied. He had PSTD (unironically) and the moment he recovers and tries his vest he gets erased.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

I still believe that it’s immeasurable, at least in the LN, since it has more info.

 

[Community_Gamer]

I still believe that it’s immeasurable, at least in the LN, since it has more info.

I'm fine either way, and yeah there's even more context in V17.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

I'm fine either way, and yeah there's even more context in V17.

Is all the FanTL for Vol 17 out?

 

[Bernkastelll]

So, who exactly agree with immeasurable and who disagree with it? (Just to me have a idea)

 

[Helestias]

Well vollume 17 outright says that instanous movement is possible cuz she can move to any distance without regards of time.And also when she does that she beyond space and time.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

So, who exactly agree with immeasurable and who disagree with it? (Just to me have a idea)

I agree with it.

 

[Helestias]

Is all the FanTL for Vol 17 out?

Its machine Translation but its a better one.Cuz the Translators who works for fantl also helped in machine Translation of vollume 17

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Disregarding Immeasurable Speed, LN Velgrynd's Space-Time Continuous Attack has an outright Low Multiversal Range at the very least as she was able to hit poor Cornu who was in an entirely separate 4D space.

Actually with the range revisions a while back, just attacking someone in another universe is just interdimensional now, to get low multiversal, you would have be able to like affect the entirety of multiple universes at the same time.

As for the LN immeasurable discussion, not gonna touch that till the translations get there, but it looks very plausible.

 

[Elizhaa]

Actually with the range revisions a while back, just attacking someone in another universe is just interdimensional now, to get low multiversal, you would have be able to like affect the entirety of multiple universes at the same time.

• It was revised that the Interdimensional range is limited to things like pocket realms; Low-multiversal just becomes affecting two universes later in that thread. Affecting the entire spacetimes is no longer a requirement for Low Multiversal to Multiversal+ range.

 

[Elizhaa]

That's probably not planets, iirc she was referring to different worlds not necessarily planets. It'd also be a bit strange if it took True Dragons releasing all their Haki to destroy "weak planets".

• I read the LN. Worlds, in the contexts, look associated with the universe that Veldanava created and the worlds traveled by Veldryng (Volume 17 Chapter 2). I am a bit busy so I will post the scan later.
• The context is more on full powers rather than aura to me. From what I know, when even Velzardo releases her full/leak aura, it causes the surrounding area she was to be frozen (Volume 17 Chapter 3). The aura's effect is more so deadly than explosive, from what I read.

 

[Metalballrun]

IIRC, Velzard does not need to release her full aura. In Volume 16, it was described that she takes a slightly younger form so that her aura would leak, and that causes the entire Frozen Continent to be perpetually frozen.

Spoiler

Guy's castle had instead become more beautiful due to the fallout from this battle, which was covered in ice.
"It's good. As a memento, let's keep it that way.”
"Then I'll take care of it. I'll help you with that little matter.”
It was easy to assist. Because of the demon qi leaking from Velzado, the temperature around the area dropped to the limit, and from then on, the castle became too frigid for it to be invaded by the weak.
Since she has to live in the castle, Velzado's dragon form is an inconvenience.
When Guy pointed this out, Velzado assumed a human appearance.
If Velzado had maintained an adult form, she would have controlled her demon aura perfectly, but instead she chose to maintain a slightly younger form. This way, the leaking demon qi would turn cold and the castle's defense would be perfect.

Her fight with Guy was kinda badly translated, but from my understanding, they changed the planet's axis and Velzard's aura froze the entire planet (which Guy reverted). The latter part could be wrong though. Their fight also happened in three days and three nights.

Spoiler

That was how Guy and Velzado met.
After three days and three nights of fighting, even the earth’s axis had changed.
But this time, Guy had done a wonderful job, and the permafrost, which had been uninhabited until now, had been turned into evergreen earth. In its place, the continent designated as a stronghold by Guy had become uninhabitable frozen earth.

 

[Elizhaa]

Metalballrun, I got it on the first point.
I see on the second point.