Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken Discussion Thread 20

[Peak]

Turn null being described as chaotic energy and also being the primitive energy isn't enough? What kind of extra feat is needed?

this is the description of turn null, and if you go see it, it's similar to manipulation of chaos, I'm not stating anything and I just want to remove this doubt, what do you think?

the possible uses are also similar with turn null

Can anyone tell me if I'm talking nonsense or not? Is a crt a bad idea? I accept criticism and opposing opinions if I'm not saying something very coherent

 

[Catpija]

Turn null being described as chaotic energy and also being the primitive energy isn't enough? What kind of extra feat is needed?

this is the description of turn null, and if you go see it, it's similar to manipulation of chaos, I'm not stating anything and I just want to remove this doubt, what do you think?

the possible uses are also similar with turn null

not sure, nihility energy originated from a chaotic dimension doesnt guarantee
its also have the chaotic properties, however its arguable since the energy itself often shown uncontrollable destructive nature akin to chaos, but again is it possible to create a world using chaotic energy?

So is LN possible to have turn null because of the chaotic dimension or does it need more feats?

don't know any feat about turn null in the light novel, but Infinite Prison is stated to be a chaotic void where eveything integrates to information, thats blatant chaos manipulation

 

[Peak]

not sure, nihility energy originated from a chaotic dimension doesnt guarantee
its also have the chaotic properties, however its arguable since the energy itself often shown uncontrollable destructive nature akin to chaos, but again is it possible to create a world using chaotic energy?


don't know any feat about turn null in the light novel, but Infinite Prison is stated to be a chaotic void where eveything integrates to information, thats blatant chaos manipulation

thanks for the opinion. I don't remember much about how turn null is handled in the webnovel, if there is more information about why a chaotic energy is used to create worlds, but anyway, in LN, The description we have is this:

—Turn Null…the ultimate destructive energy that fills the chaotic world. Full control over it was possible for the first time thanks to the Manas.

Similar to the webnovel, but the uses are different, Rimuru uses it as an absorption at times, so I don't know if that works, otherwise, the explanations are very scarce, when vol16's translation comes out and there is a crt, I'll try to remember to ask if it's possible with the little information we have

 

[JV_DLS]

thanks for the opinion. I don't remember much about how turn null is handled in the webnovel, if there is more information about why a chaotic energy is used to create worlds, but anyway, in LN, The description we have is this:

Similar to the webnovel, but the uses are different, Rimuru uses it as an absorption at times, so I don't know if that works, otherwise, the explanations are very scarce, when vol16's translation comes out and there is a crt, I'll try to remember to ask if it's possible with the little information we have

This "absorption" you spoke of is not simply the Void God Azathoth who uses Turn Null to increase his capabilities?

 

[V2001]

Why would he suppress his aura in front of an enemy or if there isn't anyone friendly nearby .Like catpija said Veldora now releases his full aura all the time .So it's always active unless someone friendly but will die if he releases his aura, is nearby

Normally aura is always active for everyone but they can decide to suppress it .

And Veldora's probability manipulation is always active too .Veldora has extra 50% chance in his favour .For example If veldora has 0%/X% chance of Surviving an attack it will become 0/X%+50% =50%/?

Veldora's Passives are : Probability manipulation,Law manipulation, Fate manipulation, Spacetime manipulation (Multidimensional barrier) Death manipulation, Radiation manipulation, Sleep manipulation, Corruption type-2 ,Fear,madness,

I understand thank you very much But you enough can scan about Veldora's Passive Aura(Web Novel)can you?

 

[Peak]

This "absorption" you spoke of is not simply the Void God Azathoth who uses Turn Null to increase his capabilities?

No, Rimuru claimed to be an absorption technique rather than releasing, but perhaps turn null may have other more convincing functionings and abilities later, he said that he puts the energy of the turn null on the sword and has the effect of devouring everything he touches, giving the name of 'imaginary cut', anyway, i'll leave all of Rimuru's descriptions about the skill, he only uses the null turn at this point against Feldway and uses the void collapse against Michael, but but against Michael it is only detailed about the sword technique and not about the operation of the turn null

I asked it to use ‘Turn Null,’ which I still had a difficult time understanding even after it was explained to me, and to make it more powerful.


That is how the ‘Imaginary Blade’ was born.


Rather than slashing through the spirit, this technique eats it. It’s the main characteristic of this technique.


Because it eats the target and throws it into ‘Imaginary Space,’ it has a broken performance that is virtually impossible to defend against.


The only effective way to counter this is to avoid it. Even if it is caught with a sword, because it has a one-hit kill effect, the battle ends immediately.

I was using ‘Turn Null,’ but it was not as fatiguing because it was an absorptive rather than a releasing system. However, the same was true for Feldway who was not receiving damage.

 

[Diablo_]

I understand thank you very much But you enough can scan about Veldora's Passive Aura(Web Novel)can you?

I don't have any WN scan sorry .
Ah just found some ...I'll send them

 

[Diablo_]

These Scans indicates that aura is truly passive but can be suppressed Guy ,Dino and Luminous's Butler were suppressing their aura on purpose while Leon and Luminous and also Dagruele wasn't doing the same it was working as a passive .If you aren't satisfied then I can try to find some more convincing ones .

The farthest was a man with bewitching red hair. If he was a woman, he'd undoubtedly be a beauty.

I understood from a glance, this person was dangerous.

When I tried to analyze him, I only obtained trivial information.

He has the same wavelength of irregular Energy quantity;just like Diablo.

In other words, His Energy level was high, but the data shows that he was a novice that’s not able to completely control his demonic aura.

However, my eyes cannot be deceived.

Or possibly, she may have deceived the analysis power of『Wisdom Lord Raphael 』, this information was likely fake.

To make the opponent see false information and misjudge histrue power.This allows someone to grasp victory before a fight by having an opponent underestimate them.

In my terms, it was to conceal power. In other words, it was for making it hard for an opponent to gauge your true power through suppressing your demonic aura.

But this person’s idea was to exploit the opponent’s information analysis ability.

Someone who’s made afraid by this kind of information was not worthy to be considered as an opponent.

Of course, someone who can’t perceive this as false information was out of question. But the problem is, even disregarding what was seen and just by deducting his Level, it was at Diablo’s level of power.

Scan 2 :
Behind her was a man who looked like a butler, he doesn’t make any movement just like a statue.

He certainly was an expert butler; with great etiquette.

He might have the same idea as me, as he suppresses his Demonic Aura, his ability level can’t be read.

Like this, I was surprised that he was the subordinate.

As for the beautiful girl, she leaked out enormous amount of Demonic Aura.

But, the girl’s demonic aura had random change in quality and quantity so it makes any reading pointless.

Scan 3:
And the one who tried to had a friendly talk with the girl was Dino.

As expected. A completely KY-person. (ED: KuukiYomenai, lit: Someone who can’t read air/mood)

This man was fearless.

But, he had enough power to back his attitude.

He emitted a large amount of energy, but most likely he suppressed most of it.

This one too, by using Jamming, he concealed his true ability.

If I try to analyze him seriously he would surely notice. What a shrewd guy.

Scan 4:
If I was my old-self, I would say, Explode! Or so I thought.

Though he was formerly a human, his aura was impressive.

He was fully clad with Demon Lord’s dignity.

In fact, his true power cannot be analyzed.

 

[Diablo_]

I understand thank you very much But you enough can scan about Veldora's Passive Aura(Web Novel)can you?

"Wouldn’t they find out the moment he exists?

(Hey, now that we cracked the seal and you have been reborn, will you go outside?

But, the problem is, you leak so much aura that everyone will find out soon I think…)"


Velzard also releases her aura all the time .The result is an entire frozen Continent .

 

[LoganKroos]

I think really rereading Tensura the verse does fit in at least 5d, in the epilogue of volume 15 Velgrind travels through different worlds and eras wandering between past, present and future and arrives at a time when she is in a world that has changed up to time, but in the light novel in volume 19 and in volume 15 it is clear that there are differences between the time described, the time in volume 19 being the very concept of time and in volume 15 the temporal directions, and in slime it is explained that there are transcendent worlds and that each world has its own laws, that is, it is explicit that there is a realm/world that has different laws than ours, is transcendental compared to our world, and that is beyond temporal directions, that is, yes an overworld of 5 dimensions, although there is no character that scales to it yet, at least the back has 5 dimensions apparently

 

[V2001]

These Scans indicates that aura is truly passive but can be suppressed Guy ,Dino and Luminous's Butler were suppressing their aura on purpose while Leon and Luminous and also Dagruele wasn't doing the same it was working as a passive .If you aren't satisfied then I can try to find some more convincing ones .

The farthest was a man with bewitching red hair. If he was a woman, he'd undoubtedly be a beauty.

I understood from a glance, this person was dangerous.

When I tried to analyze him, I only obtained trivial information.

He has the same wavelength of irregular Energy quantity;just like Diablo.

In other words, His Energy level was high, but the data shows that he was a novice that’s not able to completely control his demonic aura.

However, my eyes cannot be deceived.

Or possibly, she may have deceived the analysis power of『Wisdom Lord Raphael 』, this information was likely fake.

To make the opponent see false information and misjudge histrue power.This allows someone to grasp victory before a fight by having an opponent underestimate them.

In my terms, it was to conceal power. In other words, it was for making it hard for an opponent to gauge your true power through suppressing your demonic aura.

But this person’s idea was to exploit the opponent’s information analysis ability.

Someone who’s made afraid by this kind of information was not worthy to be considered as an opponent.

Of course, someone who can’t perceive this as false information was out of question. But the problem is, even disregarding what was seen and just by deducting his Level, it was at Diablo’s level of power.

Scan 2 :
Behind her was a man who looked like a butler, he doesn’t make any movement just like a statue.

He certainly was an expert butler; with great etiquette.

He might have the same idea as me, as he suppresses his Demonic Aura, his ability level can’t be read.

Like this, I was surprised that he was the subordinate.

As for the beautiful girl, she leaked out enormous amount of Demonic Aura.

But, the girl’s demonic aura had random change in quality and quantity so it makes any reading pointless.

Scan 3:
And the one who tried to had a friendly talk with the girl was Dino.

As expected. A completely KY-person. (ED: KuukiYomenai, lit: Someone who can’t read air/mood)

This man was fearless.

But, he had enough power to back his attitude.

He emitted a large amount of energy, but most likely he suppressed most of it.

This one too, by using Jamming, he concealed his true ability.

If I try to analyze him seriously he would surely notice. What a shrewd guy.

Scan 4:
If I was my old-self, I would say, Explode! Or so I thought.

Though he was formerly a human, his aura was impressive.

He was fully clad with Demon Lord’s dignity.

In fact, his true power cannot be analyzed.

Oh this thing makes me understand more Because I've seen some people say that the Tensei character must be activated before the aura can be used. So I'm confused Thanks again for the scan you gave me.

 

[JV_DLS]

I think really rereading Tensura the verse does fit in at least 5d, in the epilogue of volume 15 Velgrind travels through different worlds and eras wandering between past, present and future and arrives at a time when she is in a world that has changed up to time, but in the light novel in volume 19 and in volume 15 it is clear that there are differences between the time described, the time in volume 19 being the very concept of time and in volume 15 the temporal directions, and in slime it is explained that there are transcendent worlds and that each world has its own laws, that is, it is explicit that there is a realm/world that has different laws than ours, is transcendental compared to our world, and that is beyond temporal directions, that is, yes an overworld of 5 dimensions, although there is no character that scales to it yet, at least the back has 5 dimensions apparently

The problem is that it needs more explanation than just "transcendental world" or "Beyond space-time", but I also think that Slime can at least go to 1-C or 1-C low even, in fact it can reach up to 1-B with the promised land, as her description matches that level, difficult but not impossible

By the way something I didn't understand about dimensionality, someone who is from a lower dimension, like a 4D character cannot interact with a character higher dimensional like a 6D character, but if it's the other way around and the 6D character wants to interact with 4D is it possible?
I was thinking about this because if there really are higher dimensions in Slime, I wanted to know what interactions with lower characters would be like.

Guesses aside, is there any proof or any valid citation that puts Slime at least 2-A?

 

[LoganKroos]

The problem is that it needs more explanation than just "transcendental world" or "Beyond space-time", but I also think that Slime can at least go to 1-C or 1-C low even, in fact it can reach up to 1-B with the promised land, as her description matches that level, difficult but not impossible

By the way something I didn't understand about dimensionality, someone who is from a lower dimension, like a 4D character cannot interact with a character higher dimensional like a 6D character, but if it's the other way around and the 6D character wants to interact with 4D is it possible?
I was thinking about this because if there really are higher dimensions in Slime, I wanted to know what interactions with lower characters would be like.

Guesses aside, is there any proof or any valid citation that puts Slime at least 2-A?

if a 4d character has a tier 6d skill it can affect that being like an accelerator which is 3d but has hax ranging from 11 to 14d i think

 

[Iiliminal]

yes accel has 11d vector hax

 

[LoganKroos]

and i'm talking about 5d nothing higher than that for now, the upper world i talked about is a world that is beyond past present and future which fits as 5d

 

[LoganKroos]

yes accel has 11d vector hax

I don't remember for sure, but in the novel his tier went up again, but that's not the topic here, but to prove my point

 

[JV_DLS]

and i'm talking about 5d nothing higher than that for now, the upper world i talked about is a world that is beyond past present and future which fits as 5d

yes I know, but confirming this 5D world is the same as raising Slime to 1-C and the problem is that more information and details are needed for that.

The 1-B I mentioned is just my speculation, because rereading the description of the promised land it seems to fit in 1-B, although it takes a hierarchy of higher dimensions for that, but as I said it's just theory

 

[LoganKroos]

yes I know, but confirming this 5D world is the same as raising Slime to 1-C and the problem is that more information and details are needed for that.

The 1-B I mentioned is just my speculation, because rereading the description of the promised land it seems to fit in 1-B, although it takes a hierarchy of higher dimensions for that, but as I said it's just theory

it's not necessarily to increase the tier since even slime being 5d, outside veldanava no one can affect that world, you surviving a 5d world doesn't mean you automatically become 5d too

 

[JV_DLS]

it's not necessarily to increase the tier since even slime being 5d, outside veldanava no one can affect that world, you surviving a 5d world doesn't mean you automatically become 5d too

yes but the level of the slime universe goes up to Low 1-C, and if the ending is the same or similar to the ending of WN, automatically rimuru becomes Low 1-C.

Low 1-C: Low Complex Multiverse level
Characters who can affect, create and/or destroyty of spaces whose size corresponds to the entirety of one to two levels of infinity greater than a standard universal model (Low 2-C structures, English.) In terms of "dimensional" scale , this can be equated to 5 and 6-dimensional real coordinate spaces (R^5 to R^6)

 

[JV_DLS]

Guesses aside, is there any proof or any valid citation that puts Slime at least 2-A?

Leaving that aside, do you know anything about it?

 

[LoganKroos]

yes but the level of the slime universe goes up to Low 1-C, and if the ending is the same or similar to the ending of WN, automatically rimuru becomes Low 1-C.

Low 1-C: Low Complex Multiverse level
Characters who can affect, create and/or destroyty of spaces whose size corresponds to the entirety of one to two levels of infinity greater than a standard universal model (Low 2-C structures, English.) In terms of "dimensional" scale , this can be equated to 5 and 6-dimensional real coordinate spaces (R^5 to R^6)

if that happens then he really would be low1c, but so far he is not, just Veldanava, of course only if the official translations stay the same

 

[LoganKroos]

Leaving that aside, do you know anything about it?

in different translations the worlds that Velgrind traveled are described as uncountable and others as innumerable, if it is innumerable it is 2A, uncountable 2b, that's all

 

[Peak]

To be tier 1 you don't need to have infinite worlds?

 

[LoganKroos]

To be tier 1 you don't need to have infinite worlds?

a world beyond 4 dimensions is beyond infinite 3d worlds

 

[Peak]

a world beyond 4 dimensions is beyond infinite 3d worlds

I get it, if Fuse is going to delve into this, I hope it's only after the series ends

 

[Catpija]

in different translations the worlds that Velgrind traveled are described as uncountable and others as innumerable, if it is innumerable it is 2A, uncountable 2b, that's all

in another translation its also described to be only several

 

[rainheart]

Ok wanna ask why luminous dont have IM2 in her profile while he can use disintigration...
And does anyone that can control souls and erase it will get IM2 since souls are IP..

 

[LoganKroos]

in another translation its also described to be only several

if it is several it is at least 2C possibly 2B

 

[Peak]

Ok wanna ask why luminous dont have IM2 in her profile while he can use disintigration...
And does anyone that can control souls and erase it will get IM2 since souls are IP..

Her profile is probably out of date, she also doesn't have law manipulation via ultimate skill.
And if I'm not mistaken spiritual lifeforms have low-godly regeneration, for they can survive as long as their soul is not destroyed, but I don't know if this is just WN or LN too

 

[ImmortalDread]

Her profile is probably out of date, she also doesn't have law manipulation via ultimate skill.
And if I'm not mistaken spiritual lifeforms have low-godly regeneration, for they can survive as long as their soul is not destroyed, but I don't know if this is just WN or LN too

What about mind?

 

[LoganKroos]

Her profile is probably out of date, she also doesn't have law manipulation via ultimate skill.
And if I'm not mistaken spiritual lifeforms have low-godly regeneration, for they can survive as long as their soul is not destroyed, but I don't know if this is just WN or LN too

half god regeneration, they can regenerate themselves as long as their soul core is not destroyed, and Guy and Rimuru are HGR

 

[Peak]

What about mind?

Tensura's spirit life forms nullify any attack on the mind, for they think like soul, therefore, Tensura's mental attacks are always aimed at the soul and if you don't resist, your soul will be erased along with your body, Diablo did this by using his most powerful mental attack 'Temptation' in the three luminaries in Farmus in vol7, he can also choose to collect his soul like he did in vol13, giving them to Rimuru

 

[Peak]

half god regeneration, they can regenerate themselves as long as their soul core is not destroyed, and Guy and Rimuru are HGR

I thought so, but I couldn't find the scans, so I think it's just low-godly, Guy may be since he scales to higher than Diablo

 

[rainheart]

By the way so i acutally come to conclude that to manipulate soul/mind in tensura cant be manipulate by a regular mind/soul cuz its has a information basis or made up by information.. so to manipulate soul/mind in tensura u also need to be able manip information.. what u guys think.

 

[Diablo_]

I thought so, but I couldn't find the scans, so I think it's just low-godly, Guy may be since he scales to higher than Diablo

No regeneration doesn't work that way .Guy being stronger than Diablo doesn't mean he has better regen.

 

[Peak]

By the way so i acutally come to conclude that to manipulate soul/mind in tensura cant be manipulate by a regular mind/soul cuz its has a information basis or made up by information.. so to manipulate soul/mind in tensura u also need to be able manip information.. what u guys think.

just not, this just means mind/soul hax works at type 2 information level, which is not uncommon in Tensura, any being that has ultimate skill has type 2 information manipulation

 

[Peak]

No regeneration doesn't work that way .Guy being stronger than Diablo doesn't mean he has better regen.

We are talking about the same verse and the same race, I believe it can be measured that way, Diablo and Guy are the most powerful primordials and Diablo is no longer comparable when it ceased to seek power, and yet Diablo can regenerate, it wouldn't make sense for Guy not to get it unless it's stated that Diablo's regeneration is an anomaly of the race

 

[Tempestdragon6]

We are talking about the same verse and the same race, I believe it can be measured that way, Diablo and Guy are the most powerful primordials and Diablo is no longer comparable when it ceased to seek power, and yet Diablo can regenerate, it wouldn't make sense for Guy not to get it unless it's stated that Diablo's regeneration is an anomaly of the race

that make sense

 

[Diablo_]

We are talking about the same verse and the same race, I believe it can be measured that way, Diablo and Guy are the most powerful primordials and Diablo is no longer comparable when it ceased to seek power, and yet Diablo can regenerate, it wouldn't make sense for Guy not to get it unless it's stated that Diablo's regeneration is an anomaly of the race

All the demons already have sufficient scans to qualify for HGR .I don't think chaining is necessary .

 

[Metalballrun]

1. V17 has confirmed that all Primordial Demons have the same regeneration, but core destruction takes time for them to regenerate from. Diablo is special because his regeneration lets him revive instantly.
2. At the end of the year or next year when I'm no longer busy, it's possible for High Godly for the verse to be reviewed and reassessed. As far as I can tell, information particles should be impossible to destroy, and regardless of whether that's truly the case or not, destroying the soul does not equate to destroying information particles. (Just like destroying magicules doesn't mean destroying spirit particles).
   1. This will happen after the speed downgrade of the verse.
3. In the same vein, not all spiritual lifeforms would/should get Mid Godly regeneration either. Demons are all spiritual lifeforms, but only the Primordials and the demons closest to them have regeneration qualified for Mid Godly.