Sword Art Online CRT: More Additions To The Entire Verse

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Characters in the Underworld gets Unconventional Resistance to Soul Manipulation and Matter Manipulation due to the Minds/Souls being described as Quantum Fields:

“Soul…… in other words, the collection of those lights is a human’s soul?”

“RATH engineers call it «Quantum Field». But, by giving the machine such a name, they must have thought about it already…… That quantum field, and the human’s soul.”

“But then, what does it mean? Soul Translator is the machine that doesn’t access the human brain, but the soul itself……?”

“When said like that, it doesn’t sound like a machine anymore, but a magic item in a game instead, huh.”

What he said had softened the atmosphere slightly, and Kazuto then continued speaking as he grinned,

“But, it isn’t an act of magic or god’s miracle. Let’s plunge into the explanation of its structure for a bit…… What it does is recording the spin and vector of each photon inside the microtubule, the «Qubit» unit data. In other words, the brain cell isn’t just a single gate switch to let electrical signals passing through, but it could be said that the cell itself is a unit of a quantum computer…… well, this part is already the limit of my understanding though……”

“It’s alright, I have already passed that limit a long time ago.”

“Me too……”

Shino and “Asuna surrendered together before Kazuto exhaled his breath in relief.

“The collection of photons which is the memory of that computer, perhaps, it might even be the human’s soul…… RATH has given it an original name. «Fluctuating Light», which they abbreviated to——”

He paused slightly,

“«Fluctlight»”

“............Fluct...light.”

Subtilizer gets Void Manipulation and/or Existence Erasure (Via his void blade) and Nonexistent Physiology (Likely Type 1) as he was described by Kirito to be akin a black hole and what stood in front of him was a patch of nothing. And Kirito will get resistance to Void Manipulation and/or Existence Erasure.

No, it wasn’t right to describe him as having an air. All that existed
before me was a patch of nothing. A black hole devouring all
information, from which not even a sliver of light could escape.

The void filling the inside of the enemy was like a black hole, but
my own body was also swirling with a gargantuan, gleaming
galaxy created with the prayers of each and every human being.

Alice gets another Key: End of Alicization which includes Air Manipulation and the same range as Kirito and Asuna as her voice created a wind throughout the universe:

"The voice that then came from her mouth conjured thoughts of a wind that blew through the entire universe. The mechadragon’s Incarnation meter shattered with a faint explosion."

and possibly 5-A AP due to shaking every stars in the universe:

"Every star in the universe began to shudder. Azure planets gleamed brightly as one, as though in synchronized breath."

Human Realm Arc Kirito gets Supernatural Willpower due to Kirito still having the strength to fight Quinella even after losing blood and being severely injured

War of Underworld Kirito gets a little upgrade: 8-A with the Blue Rose Sword's Release Recollection, possibly 7-C (Shouldn't be inferior to the other super accounts)

Same goes for Alice (The same reason as Kirito)

Star King Kirito's/End of Alicization Kirito's Lifting Strength goes from Multi-Stellar with the Night Sky Sword's Release Recollection to just Multi-Stellar or Multi-Stellar with Incarnation

Eugeo gets a War of Underworld and End of Alicization Keys:
AP: Low 6-B, likely 4-B (He is merged with Kirito) | 4-A (Same as before)

Merged with my consciousness itself, never to be separated.

The pain of my heart getting torn to shreds was brutalized beyond description. But this moment was my biggest and final opportunity. There wouldn’t be a second chance if I missed it. Eugeo was still fighting when his body got cut in half.

Speed: Unknown, possibly Subsonic with Relativistic reaction speed (Should be comparable to Kirito as he is merged with him)

Durability: Small Country level, likely Solar System level (Clashed with Subtilizer) Immortality and having invulnerability and being invisible makes the opponent very hard to deal with him.

Range: Unknown, possibly Planetary (Should be comparable to Dark God Vector and Kirito with Enhance Armament and Release Recollection)

Powers and Abilities: All previous abilities, in addition to Invulnerability and Intangibility (Can't be damaged), Invisibility (Enemies can't see him), Non-Physical Interaction (Able to interact with Subtilizer, a being made out of amorphous darkness), Non-Corporeal (Exists as a spirit), Immortality (Type 7; Is already physically dead), and Flight (Fought in the air alongside with Kirito)
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Agree: Zencha9, EternalMoment, Cloozuma, Helestias, AnonymousBlank (Subtilizer having Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1) and Unconventional Resistance to Soul Manipulation and Matter Manipulation, Void Manipulation, and Existence Erasure and Kirito resisting it)

Neutral: EternalMoment (Subtilizer having Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1)), Viethai96 (Eugeo and Alice, Unconventional Resistance to Soul Manipulation and Matter Manipulation, Void Manipulation, and Existence Erasure)

Disagree: AnonymousBlank (Eugeo and Alice), Vietthai96 (Subtilizer having Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1))

 

[Zencha9]

Already know about these so i naturally agree

 

[EternalMoment]

Neutral on likely Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1) for Subtilizer. Agree with the rest

 

[Cloozuma]

Have to agree ig

 

[Vietthai96]

Disagree with NEP, Void manip and EE stuff. Lost arm feat more like High Pain Tolerance than Supernatural Willpower. The rest is neutral for now.
Currently busy with work and being restricted to mobile, i will read more thoroughly after work with a PC at home, sorry

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Disagree with NEP, Void manip and EE stuff.

Reasons?

1: Material Nonexistence: The lack of any conventional existence. Such a character will exist as something beyond the normal scope of the physical and metaphysical worlds, instead existing as an idea or other unconventional state. Such entities can be conceptualized by individuals, but do not exist in a physical or normal metaphysical form, such as a soul. In terms of binary, this would be a 0, where existence is 1 and nonexistence is 0.

There's also this quote:

“You must shed your bloodlust, youngster. His empty soul cannot be cut by the Incarnation of murder.”

Eh... I don’t understand why this is difficult to understand cuz’ he is described as a black hole and a void.

Lost arm feat more like High Pain Tolerance than Supernatural Willpower

Eh... Fair Enough IG

 

[Helestias]

Agree with most of the stuff.I kinda don't know about Nep so much.So neutral at that topic.

 

[Vietthai96]

Now i'm back, pretty busy nowadays. Alright time for NEP, Void, EE and other stuffs

• NEP: Empty Soul doesn't mean he lack a soul, it could be flowery/figurative speech depend vastly on interpretation, so not a solid proof for NEP. Next is void, this proof you need to bring more context, and proof/statement; to be honest with you, only single word void could mean many thing, so i hope you bring more evident of his body totally is a void of nothingness, and i read the proof you currently posted, more like flowery language to make the scene more dramatic than truly describe thing. If the line is legit, Kirito should have a physical size of a galaxy atleast by his own description about his body.
• Void Manip: uhhh...ohhhhhhh, i could understand if this have a possibly because of the name void blade but still, need more context
• EE: I see absolute nothing what could grant EE, even if void manip get pass and EE being a subset ability of void manip, still have feat or statement of it actually erase thing from existence
• Soul Manip: I still don't understand much about the series describe soul as quantum field.
• Matter Manip: I think even if "soul" being quantum field get accepted, they still get affect by matter manip unless there are a statement of characters in underworld have body completely made of quantum, if their body is still being made by conventional matter, they are still being subjected to matter manip
• Supernatural Willpower: I think in order to grant this abilitiy you need a feat of resisting, withstanding supernatural effect with sheer willpower. Got an arm cut off is just feat of withstanding physical pain which grant High Pain Tolerance.

I'm neutral with Alice, now come to Eugen stuff, i think you should bring more evidences to why he should have those abilities as you have listed. I will absence for a while cause need work after rest

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Agree on Subtilizer having NEP Type 1, disagree on the rest of this stuff.

I agree on SAO goons getting unconventional resistance to soul manip but for completely different reasons. Underworld characters shouldn’t get the resistance, every other VRMMO should get it. Why? Because they specifically lack the soul in the avatar while UW guys do have souls. Someone is gonna have to explain how the fluctlight description gives someone soul manip resistance or resistance to matter manip.

Kirito should have NPI for hitting Subtilizer and shouldn’t get any of the proposed stuff above (besides soul manip, I’m down for someone explaining that part).

• The willpower part is just pain tolerance or else we about to give half the wiki supernatural willpower.
• Subtilizer doesn’t have void or EE so Kirito wouldn’t get a resistance.
• Why does BRS’ RR scale to the super accounts?
• Kirito’s lifting never scales to NSS, and when does Incarnation ever amp his lifting to such a degree?

Alice

• She shouldn’t get a new key as she logged out in War of Underworld and then logged back in. She never gets stronger or has the opportunity to do so unlike Kirito and Asuna who were logged in for 200 years.
• She doesn’t even create a wind, it says her voice conjured thoughts of a wind, not that she did. Probably should be sound manip since it was her voice.
• Agree with the range, disagree on 5-A cuz she basically does the same feat as Kirito and her RR (which is the same one she used throughout Alicization) harmed the AH who survived hits from Star King and Goddess Asuna.

Eugeo ...... oh boy.

• The very fact that he has fused with Kirito and is now part of him means he shouldn’t get new key.
• Speed is already the most useless stat on the wiki so sure. I honestly think Eugeo and Kirito should scale to the subsonic back when they were climbing the tower.
• Seeing as Eugeo is now the BRS, I technically agree with all the AP and Dura stuff but once again, he is standard equipment for Kirito and not someone who can fight himself.
• His range would only scale to Kirito negging the army with BRS’ RR and nothing else. This isn’t a stat that you can scale unless people have the same feats or use the same gear.
• Why invulnerable? He is the sword now, we know that breaks.
• Intangibility for his spirit form is a hard no since we see he physically interacts with things and has no statements or feats of being intangible.
• Non-Physical Interaction is a yes.
• Non-Corporeal is the same as intang.
• Immortality (Type 7) and Flight, if he gets a key for being Kirito’s standard equipment, sure.

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Agree on Subtilizer having NEP Type 1, disagree on the rest of this stuff.

The willpower part is just pain tolerance or else we about to give half the wiki supernatural willpower.

Fair Enough (We don't have a page for Pain Tolerance tho)

I agree on SAO goons getting unconventional resistance to soul manip but for completely different reasons. Underworld characters shouldn’t get the resistance, every other VRMMO should get it. Why? Because they specifically lack the soul in the avatar while UW guys do have souls. Someone is gonna have to explain how the fluctlight description gives someone soul manip resistance or resistance to matter manip.

Fluctlight = Soul
The goal of Alicization was to retrieve Alice's fluctlight in which they succeeded retrieving. Even the Underworld characters have a soul.

Quantum: Quantum Mechanics is a fundamental theory in physics that provides a description of the physical properties of nature at the scale of atoms and subatomic particles. It is the foundation of all quantum physics including quantum chemistry, quantum field theory, quantum technology, and quantum information science

which would bet Matter Manipulation. Soul Manipulation is already given in the quote.

• Subtilizer doesn’t have void or EE so Kirito wouldn’t get a resistance.
• Why does BRS’ RR scale to the super accounts?
• Kirito’s lifting never scales to NSS, and when does Incarnation ever amp his lifting to such a degree?

• Subtilizer has a weapon called a Void Blade which should give a clear idea of what it does (The website doesn't seem to be working for me right now)
• I'm saying that Kirito's own incarnation should be equal to the other super accounts as he shouldn't be weaker than them. That's why is a possibly. You should check out Sinon's recent updated page.
• During his clash with the Abyssal Horror when his sword increased in size. The Blue Rose Sword should scale to the Night Sky Sword just as they are both Kirito's sword. Asuna has Multi-Stellar Lifting Strength with Incarnation and The Abyssal Horror has just pure Multi-Stellar Lifting Strength.

• She shouldn’t get a new key as she logged out in War of Underworld and then logged back in. She never gets stronger or has the opportunity to do so unlike Kirito and Asuna who were logged in for 200 years.
• She doesn’t even create a wind, it says her voice conjured thoughts of a wind, not that she did. Probably should be sound manip since it was her voice.
• Agree with the range, disagree on 5-A cuz she basically does the same feat as Kirito and her RR (which is the same one she used throughout Alicization) harmed the AH who survived hits from Star King and Goddess Asuna.

• Yes. Alice probably does not scale to Kirito and Asuna (4-A) as she didn't get stronger, but she still has a feat of shaking stars which according to Kirito's profile is (5-A).
• Fair Enough
• for the range. The same reason as my first point.

Eugeo ...... oh boy.

• The very fact that he has fused with Kirito and is now part of him means he shouldn’t get new key.
• Seeing as Eugeo is now the BRS, I technically agree with all the AP and Dura stuff but once again, he is standard equipment for Kirito and not someone who can fight himself.
• His range would only scale to Kirito negging the army with BRS’ RR and nothing else. This isn’t a stat that you can scale unless people have the same feats or use the same gear.
• Why invulnerable? He is the sword now, we know that breaks.
• Intangibility for his spirit form is a hard no since we see he physically interacts with things and has no statements or feats of being intangible.
• Non-Physical Interaction is a yes.
• Non-Corporeal is the same as intang.
• Immortality (Type 7) and Flight, if he gets a key for being Kirito’s standard equipment, sure.

So... in a nutshell, he only gets the stats if his New Key is As Kirito's Standard Equipment?
This was a long ride... :/
Anyways, thanks for the input

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Fair Enough (We don't have a page for Pain Tolerance tho)

Yeah, this kind of stuff tend to go in the stamina section.

Fluctlight = Soul
The goal of Alicization was to retrieve Alice's fluctlight in which they succeeded retrieving. Even the Underworld characters have a soul.
which would bet Matter Manipulation. Soul Manipulation is already given in the quote.

See, I sort of agree that the fluctlight is a soul but also disagree at the same time. The description describes it as something more akin to information and a copy of the brain than a typical soul and even say that it is "The collection of photons which is the memory of that computer, perhaps, it might even be the human’s soul". This honestly makes it seem like the fluctlight can be messed with if you have light manip and the perhaps means it isn't even a guarantee that its a soul.

• Subtilizer has a weapon called a Void Blade which should give a clear idea of what it does (The website doesn't seem to be working for me right now)

Does the Void Blade have a description or any feats of acting like how the wiki treats a void? If so then I am much more inclined to agree.

• I'm saying that Kirito's own incarnation should be equal to the other super accounts as he shouldn't be weaker than them. That's why is a possibly. You should check out Sinon's recent updated page.

What makes his incarnation = to those Super Accounts though?https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sinon

• During his clash with the Abyssal Horror when his sword increased in size. The Blue Rose Sword should scale to the Night Sky Sword just as they are both Kirito's sword. Asuna has Multi-Stellar Lifting Strength with Incarnation and The Abyssal Horror has just pure Multi-Stellar Lifting Strength.

So his sword became the size of solar systems? If I have a scalpel and a plastic butter knife, they don't scale to each other. Asuna doesn't have it tho? She has 4-A AP with Incarnation but her Lifting is Unknown.

• Yes. Alice probably does not scale to Kirito and Asuna (4-A) as she didn't get stronger, but she still has a feat of shaking stars which according to Kirito's profile is (5-A).

But the fact that you agree that Alice didn't get stronger would mean Human Realm Kirito, Eugeo, Quinella, Bercouli and Fanatio, which in turn buffs the Super Accounts as well, are all 5-A, massively above any feats they have. The feat can be 5-A but I'd call it an outlier and move on unless we are about to upscale half the relevant characters to it.

So... in a nutshell, he only gets the stats if his New Key is As Kirito's Standard Equipment?

Kinda. I just feel there is no real point to Eugeo's page getting a new key though I do feel the stuff unique to his new ghost form should be added to Kirito's P&A. Also does it count as regen that Kirito and Eugeo could fix Blue Rose?

This was a long ride... :/
Anyways, thanks for the input

No problem. I like SAO so if Imma bother with a CRT, no reason to half ass it.

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Yeah, this kind of stuff tend to go in the stamina section.

See, I sort of agree that the fluctlight is a soul but also disagree at the same time. The description describes it as something more akin to information and a copy of the brain than a typical soul and even say that it is "The collection of photons which is the memory of that computer, perhaps, it might even be the human’s soul". This honestly makes it seem like the fluctlight can be messed with if you have light manip and the perhaps means it isn't even a guarantee that its a soul.

Hmm... The Sword Art Online Fanon Wiki's description In terms of quantum mechanics, the «Fluctlight» (フラクトライト, Furakutoraito?) is the quantum particle that contains the human consciousness, the soul.

Does the Void Blade have a description or any feats of acting like how the wiki treats a void? If so then I am much more inclined to agree.

Void Manipulation, also known as Nothingness Manipulation is the ability to control and manipulate a void: nothingness or non-existence.

Empty space and black holes are not examples of a void as they possess energy and exist in the conventional sense. Manipulating either is Spatial Manipulation and Black Hole Creation respectively.

Possible Uses​

• Manipulation of Nothingness: The primary use of this ability, one's control over a 'nonexistent substance'. Naturally this may allow them to be resistant to the effects of existence erasure, as often interacting with a Void also causes one to be converted into a Void, although this may not always be the case.
• Conversion to Nonexistence: The user of this ability might be capable of turning targets to nothing. This can range from only turning the matter of the target to nothing to also turning things like its energy, mind, soul, space, time and/or concept to nothing. Note that most users of this ability have not the full range of the ability. Further note that one shouldn't list a character to have resistance against this ability in total, as that requires a character to have shown resistance against every imaginable ability which can erase a target.
• Conversion to Existence: The inverse of Existence Erasure. The user may be able to move something from a state of nonexistence to existence, such as reversing the effects of the aforementioned power through their innate control over nothingness. Note that this alone is not justification for Void Manipulation as much as it can be a side-effect of having it. Like conversion to nonexistence, this may be limited in scope, such as only being able to conjure physical objects as opposed to minds, souls, or concepts.
• Nonexistent Interaction: Since the user of this ability can treat "nothingness" as if it was a physical object they could manipulate, they can, in turn, affect beings that do not exist given that they also have the ability to perceive them. Note that it should not be assumed a character can 'manipulate' another character who is nonexistent, although it can be assumed that they can at least interact with characters who do not exist.

As the blade impaled its back, the creature emitted a short screech and was immediately sucked in by the void. Data traveled through the sword to Gabriel’s right arm, which he moved behind his back, then he focused his thoughts.

The blade caused the creature to get sucked in by the void aka nothingness. This can possibly be followed up by Existence Erasure through the Possible Uses.

What makes his incarnation = to those Super Accounts though?

This is just my opinion, but do you think Kirito's AP would fall behind the Super Accounts? I believe there are two options:
Kirito's and Alice's Release Recollection stays 8-A or they get buffed to possibly 7-C due to them most likely not falling behind in strength to the Super Accounts.

So his sword became the size of solar systems? If I have a scalpel and a plastic butter knife, they don't scale to each other.

The sword was heavier than the tentacles of the space beast, most likely meaning that the sword is heavier than space.

Then, he shouted again:

“Release… recollection!!”

What came shooting out was darkness, deeper, heavier, and denser than the tentacles of the space beast.

Here's the video if you want a second look

Asuna doesn't have it tho? She has 4-A AP with Incarnation but her Lifting is Unknown.

Whoops. This was my bad. I accidentally looked at the Striking Strength section.

But the fact that you agree that Alice didn't get stronger would mean Human Realm Kirito, Eugeo, Quinella, Bercouli and Fanatio, which in turn buffs the Super Accounts as well, are all 5-A, massively above any feats they have. The feat can be 5-A but I'd call it an outlier and move on unless we are about to upscale half the relevant characters to it.

Ehh... Fair Enough

Kinda. I just feel there is no real point to Eugeo's page getting a new key though I do feel the stuff unique to his new ghost form should be added to Kirito's P&A. Also does it count as regen that Kirito and Eugeo could fix Blue Rose?

Hmm... Let's maybe wait for the other user's inputs. The second part is interesting.

No problem. I like SAO so if Imma bother with a CRT, no reason to half ass it.

 

[Vietthai96]

So no one address my point?????
Have Void Manip doesn't mean you automatically have possible EE despite EE being a subset and vivece verse, have EE doesn't mean user automatically have void manip

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

So no one address my point?????

Sorry. That was bad on my end.

Have Void Manip doesn't mean you automatically have possible EE despite EE being a subset and vivece verse, have EE doesn't mean user automatically have void manip

As the blade impaled its back, the creature emitted a short screech and was immediately sucked in by the void. Data traveled through the sword to Gabriel’s right arm, which he moved behind his back, then he focused his thoughts.

So tell me... Does this quote sound like Void Manipulation and/or Existence Erasure to you?

 

[AnonymousBlank]

I dunno if we can trust a fanon wiki, or any wiki in general. From what I recall, if something is cited, we just look at that instead rather than someone else’s interpretation of it all.

Honestly looks like info manip to me. Wasn’t Gabe’s whole thing that he liked absorbing and eating people’s souls cuz he got off that stuff? Makes it seem like fluctlight souls are information similar to how Slime has souls made of information.

I honestly can’t think of a way to scale anything Kirito does to the Super Account Special moves. Now if you want what I basically think, I scale everybody to but below Star King tier for the memes since random starter accounts were able to harm Goddess Asuna who could bop around PoH who was relative to Gold Eyes Kirito

I’d disagree with that interpretation and just say that the sword is now heavier than AH’s tentacles which now that I am aware of such a quote, should give Kirito a much better Lifting Strength than his current one.

Sure, I got no problem seeing what others have to say.

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

I think I just found another scan that supports Subtilizer's Void Manipulation/Existence Erasure and Kirito resisting it:

Before my eyes, my puncture wounds were already crawling with bluish-black void, threatening to consume my existence.

“Ugh…!”

I groaned again, then took a deep breath, and yelled. I barely managed to blow away the void, but a great deal of blood spurted from my fresh wounds.

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

I’d disagree with that interpretation and just say that the sword is now heavier than AH’s tentacles which now that I am aware of such a quote, should give Kirito a much better Lifting Strength than his current one.

What do you think his new Lifting Strength should be then?

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Now i'm back, pretty busy nowadays. Alright time for NEP, Void, EE and other stuffs

• NEP: Empty Soul doesn't mean he lack a soul, it could be flowery/figurative speech depend vastly on interpretation, so not a solid proof for NEP. Next is void, this proof you need to bring more context, and proof/statement; to be honest with you, only single word void could mean many thing, so i hope you bring more evident of his body totally is a void of nothingness, and i read the proof you currently posted, more like flowery language to make the scene more dramatic than truly describe thing. If the line is legit, Kirito should have a physical size of a galaxy atleast by his own description about his body.
• Void Manip: uhhh...ohhhhhhh, i could understand if this have a possibly because of the name void blade but still, need more context
• EE: I see absolute nothing what could grant EE, even if void manip get pass and EE being a subset ability of void manip, still have feat or statement of it actually erase thing from existence
• Soul Manip: I still don't understand much about the series describe soul as quantum field.
• Matter Manip: I think even if "soul" being quantum field get accepted, they still get affect by matter manip unless there are a statement of characters in underworld have body completely made of quantum, if their body is still being made by conventional matter, they are still being subjected to matter manip
• Supernatural Willpower: I think in order to grant this abilitiy you need a feat of resisting, withstanding supernatural effect with sheer willpower. Got an arm cut off is just feat of withstanding physical pain which grant High Pain Tolerance.

I'm neutral with Alice, now come to Eugen stuff, i think you should bring more evidences to why he should have those abilities as you have listed. I will absence for a while cause need work after rest

Sorry I didn't reply to this, but I believe we covered most of this up within the conversation between me and AnonymousBlank. I will wait patiently for your reply. As I said already, I am sorry I forgot to reply to this. Yea. Supernatural Willpower is just High Pain Tolerance/Stamina. That's for sure tho.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

I think I just found another scan that supports Subtilizer's Void Manipulation/Existence Erasure and Kirito resisting it:

I would personally argue EE but I have no issues if people were to conclude this was void manip. Nice find. I can agree with Kirito having the EE resistance.

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

What do you think his new Lifting Strength should be then?

.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Not a calc guy so not sure, especially with how the only real scale we have to go off of is the anime where AH seems to be kind inconsistent in size, ranging from the tentacles being as wide as Kirito is tall to the diameter 4 or so times thicker than BR’s vines to Kirito being a tiny speck to AH from Ronie and Tiese’s descendants perspectives.

 

[Vietthai96]

Currently busy with work so i must reply through phone
Sorry to be brutal, most of you point in this thread aside from AP rating which i'm not even bother with it is vague at best, and at worst it just flowery language/figurative speech that can be interpeted in many way around. I will return later with a PC at home to fully commenting on this

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

Currently busy with work so i must reply through phone
Sorry to be brutal, most of you point in this thread aside from AP rating which i'm not even bother with it is vague at best, and at worst it just flowery language/figurative speech that can be interpeted in many way around. I will return later with a PC at home to fully commenting on this

• Yea... We pretty much putted AP aside.
• Literally, like almost everybody, seems to agree with upgrading Alice's Range, Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1), Void Manipulation, and Existence Erasure for Subtilizer (And Kirito resisting it), and Characters in the Underworld getting Unconventional Resistance to Soul Manipulation and Matter Manipulation
• What's left now is Star King Kirito's/End of Alicization's Lifting Strength

The scan for Void Manipulation and Existence Erasure for Subtilizer (And Kirito resisting it):

I think I just found another scan that supports Subtilizer's Void Manipulation/Existence Erasure and Kirito resisting it:

.

 

[Vietthai96]

Alright, it's time:

• NEP is a no until further evidence show
• About Void Manip and EE

Before my eyes, my puncture wounds were already crawling with bluish-black void, threatening to consume my existence.

“Ugh…!”

I groaned again, then took a deep breath, and yelled. I barely managed to blow away the void, but a great deal of blood spurted from my fresh wounds.

As the blade impaled its back, the creature emitted a short screech and was immediately sucked in by the void. Data traveled through the sword to Gabriel’s right arm, which he moved behind his back, then he focused his thoughts.

This is at best Absorption, Void Manip could pass if we have more evidences about it being an actual Void, but i don't care much if it get accept or not. EE is a hard no, more evidence is need to comfirm the guy can totally erase someone from existence. And why Kirito should have resist, could you post me the scan

• The whole point of soul being Quantum Field is a big what, could you explain more
• Resistance to Matter Manip is a no, their body is made of physical matter, they are still being subjected by Matter manip that could affect their body, unless their body also made of quantum
• Also why Eugen should have those abilities as you have listed
• I will touch Alice after all point above is finish

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

NEP is a no until further evidence show

No, it wasn’t right to describe him as having an air. All that existed
before me was a patch of nothing. A black hole devouring all
information, from which not even a sliver of light could escape.

The void filling the inside of the enemy was like a black hole, but
my own body was also swirling with a gargantuan, gleaming
galaxy created with the prayers of each and every human being.

Again. Subtilizer was described as a patch of nothing and to be akin a void filling the inside of the enemy was like a black hole which should be enough to qualify for Nonexistent Physiology (Type 1).

Alright, it's time:

• NEP is a no until further evidence show
• About Void Manip and EE

This is at best Absorption, Void Manip could pass if we have more evidences about it being an actual Void, but i don't care much if it get accept or not. EE is a hard no, more evidence is need to comfirm the guy can totally erase someone from existence. And why Kirito should have resist, could you post me the scan

BruH. Did you even read carefully the scan that you replied? That was Kirito resisting Subtilizer's Void Manipulation. Why would that be at best, Absorption?

Before my eyes, my puncture wounds were already crawling with bluish-black void, threatening to consume my existence.

“Ugh…!”

I groaned again, then took a deep breath, and yelled. I barely managed to blow away the void, but a great deal of blood spurted from my fresh wounds.

^ That was from Kirito's perspective

• The whole point of soul being Quantum Field is a big what, could you explain more
• Resistance to Matter Manip is a no, their body is made of physical matter, they are still being subjected by Matter manip that could affect their body, unless their body also made of quantum

The souls/minds in SAO are described as quantum fields which should give them Unconventional Resistance to Soul Manipulation and Matter Manipulation. The souls in SAO are literally described as being made of quantum fields. This was how Alicization was possible.

In theoretical physics, quantum field theory is a theoretical framework that combines classical field theory, special relativity and quantum mechanics. QFT is used in particle physics to construct physical models of subatomic particles and in condensed matter physics to construct models of quasiparticles.

“RATH engineers call it «Quantum Field». But, by giving the machine such a name, they must have thought about it already…… That quantum field, and the human’s soul.”

“But then, what does it mean? Soul Translator is the machine that doesn’t access the human brain, but the soul itself……?”

“When said like that, it doesn’t sound like a machine anymore, but a magic item in a game instead, huh.”

What he said had softened the atmosphere slightly, and Kazuto then continued speaking as he grinned,

“But, it isn’t an act of magic or god’s miracle. Let’s plunge into the explanation of its structure for a bit…… What it does is recording the spin and vector of each photon inside the microtubule, the «Qubit» unit data. In other words, the brain cell isn’t just a single gate switch to let electrical signals passing through, but it could be said that the cell itself is a unit of a quantum computer…… well, this part is already the limit of my understanding though……”

“It’s alright, I have already passed that limit a long time ago.”

“Me too……”

Shino and “Asuna surrendered together before Kazuto exhaled his breath in relief.

“The collection of photons which is the memory of that computer, perhaps, it might even be the human’s soul…… RATH has given it an original name. «Fluctuating Light», which they abbreviated to——”

He paused slightly,

“«Fluctlight»”

“............Fluct...light.”

The STL provides Unconventional Resistance to the human's soul and quantum fields

Macro-Quantum Manipulation
The ability to manipulate quarks, bosons (Gluons, Photons, Higgs Bosons, etc.), and leptons (Electrons, Muons, Positrons, Tau Particles, and Neutrinos). This also endows the ability to tinker with other properties at this level, such as electron arrangement and spin.

• Also why Eugen should have those abilities as you have listed
• I will touch Alice after all point above is finish

We've pretty much concluded that nothing else will most likely not get added/upgraded except Alice's Range. Also, we are now discussing about this:

Kinda. I just feel there is no real point to Eugeo's page getting a new key though I do feel the stuff unique to his new ghost form should be added to Kirito's P&A. Also does it count as regen that Kirito and Eugeo could fix Blue Rose?

Edit: I will probably see the replies tomorrow

 

[Fixxed]

I think void in here meaning vacuum space in outer space

 

[RitsuØ1]

I think void in here meaning vacuum space in outer space

But the fight didn’t take place in space during that time

 

[VinnyXD]

The EE and void manipulation looks and sounds like more of Gravity manipulation and Black hole creation.

 

[RitsuØ1]

The EE and void manipulation looks and sounds like more of Gravity manipulation and Black hole creation.

There are no Gravity Manipulation and Black Hole Creation in SAO

 

[VinnyXD]

There are no Gravity Manipulation and Black Hole Creation in SAO

That's what it sounds like doesn't sound like EE

 

[Cloozuma]

The EE and void manipulation looks and sounds like more of Gravity manipulation and Black hole creation.

Except it's not? It was stated to be like a black hole, but it is NOT a Black Hole.

 

[VinnyXD]

Except it's not? It was stated to be like a black hole, but it is NOT a Black Hole.

Still sounds closer to a Black hole than EE. If it's not a black hole sure but it's not EE.

 

[Vietthai96]

1. Consume could mean many thing, it could be eating or absorbing, so Gabriel's feat is at best Absorption, unless you tell me that eating something erase it from existence.
2. Void could also mean many thing, it could be actually void of nothingness like you trying to interpret, or it is just void = empty, the context is pretty vague, same with nothing, that why i ask if you have more evidence than the current things that already post here to justify the NEP stuff
3. Kirito feat is yes he resisting, but the narrative more like a figurative speech, it is in gray area, you could exaggerate it to EE based on your interpretation, but i don't it have enough feat or statement to qualify a solid EE.
4. Already reading the whole thing about Quantum Field, look like you exaggerate it again and have a wrong interpretation, i still see soul here so no Resistance to Soul Manipulation, what the scan describe it was the soul doesn't made up by Quantum Field, but the brain cell, what the scientist or engineer said that each brain cell is like a quantum computer itself, you just focus on some line:

"That quantum field, and the human’s soul", "Soul Translator is the machine that doesn’t access the human brain, but the soul itself……?” "What it does is recording the spin and vector of each photon inside the microtubule, the «Qubit» unit data. In other words, the brain cell isn’t just a single gate switch to let electrical signals passing through, but it could be said that the cell itself is a unit of a quantum computer"

Above are those line you just focused on and interpreted them as soul made by Quantum Field, totally invalid. So disagree with the whole thing of Soul made up by Quantum Field, and it Unconventional Resistance.
Also you doesn't even understand what i'm trying to say is if the soul are Quantum, character's body is still made up by matter, that mean their body are still being subjected to Matter Manip that could affect their body, unless something prove that their body also made up of Quantum

Edit: also what happen to your acc name???

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Void could also mean many thing, it could be actually void of nothingness like you trying to interpret, or it is just void = empty, the context is pretty vague, same with nothing, that why i ask if you have more evidence than the current things that already post here to justify the NEP stuff

Being a void of nothing is textbook Type 1 NEP going by how the site treats it, so yeah

Also you doesn't even understand what i'm trying to say is if the soul are Quantum, character's body is still made up by matter, that mean their body are still being subjected to Matter Manip that could affect their body, unless something prove that their body also made up of Quantum

Going to note that this is not really how it works. Etheldrea has Unconventional resistance to soul and concept manip due to her soul being made of her concept. Her body is still made of normal matter, its not conceptual (her soul is) but we still give them resistance to concept manip. Same case here.

 

[Cloozuma]

Edit: also what happen to your acc name???

He goes by Problem.exe since he's a problem in VSBW

 

[RitsuØ1]

He goes by Problem.exe since he's a problem in VSBW

Has a problem*

 

[Cloozuma]

Has a problem*

Ah, so you have a problem

 

[RitsuØ1]

1. Consume could mean many thing, it could be eating or absorbing, so Gabriel's feat is at best Absorption, unless you tell me that eating something erase it from existence.

OK. It does seem like Absorption now which Kirito will get resistance to it. I would honestly put it as Absorption or possible Existence Erasure. Void Manipulation stays tho.

 

[Zencha9]

No it's pretty blatant void manip

 

[Zencha9]

Now that i look at it it looks like both absorption and Void manip so it's more likely that