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STRONGEST One-Punch Man Discussion Thread!

Arguing about either Dimension slash is infinite speed or something. As if you can translate infinite/immeasurable visually without using statements. Double standards kicking in huh
 
Kin201 said:
This is what I and RinneItachi were saying, yes. What could you be mistaking otherwise? Neither of us suggested that the speed at which the blade extends from any location toward Earth is perceived by anyone, including Blast.
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😁😁
Aight, my bad.
Yeah, the descend would still be possibly infinite/immeasurable speed (the one that Saitama catch, since it was thrusting attack, not slashing), but the slash speed would varies depend on the subject.
 
Ok so im really confused. Are people here arguing that DS isn't THAT fast, on the basis that flashy flash perceived it?

The same flashy flash that couldn't perceive a serious void moving? The same ff who can't perceive blast speedblitz him? The same blast who is faster than void? The same blast who CANT DODGE THE DS WITHOUT TELEPORTATION AND PRECOG?

Did flashy flash get prescription glasses or something?
 
The Dimensional Slash itself is instant, it just moves on its own time when in the universe. Flashy Flash saw the attack approaching him but he couldn't dodge because it had already occurred. It's the same reason why Flashy Flashy said that it can't be countered via speed.
 
Wardokman69 said:
😁😁
Aight, my bad.
Yeah, the descend would still be possibly infinite/immeasurable speed (the one that Saitama catch, since it was thrusting attack, not slashing), but the slash speed would varies depend on the subject.
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That will be a discussion in a CRT yeah. It depends if you think the descend is instantaneous or if it has a travel speed, and the starting point, whether it begins near Earth or at the edge of the universe. I did say I don't think it started from the edge of the universe.
ReusedOil said:
Ok so im really confused. Are people here arguing that DS isn't THAT fast, on the basis that flashy flash perceived it?
Click to expand...
We are arguing that Flash and Sonic can perceive the slash while it moves towards them based off visuals, but not the speed at which the blade extends from its starting point to Earth, which is what Saitama reacted to.
 
Kin201 said:
That will be a discussion in a CRT yeah. It depends if you think the descend is instantaneous or if it has a travel speed, and the starting point, whether it begins near Earth or at the edge of the universe. I did say I don't think it started from the edge of the universe.
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I mean, it's didn't matter where the starting point was because it's akin to teleportation that ignore distance altogether.
 
ReusedOil said:
It might be less why garou didnt die from the punch and more why he didn't die from the power leaving his body, and why the power left in the first place.

as you said, god is outside causalty. When the timetravel happened he was aware of it and was already manipulating things in the background for void to be in the right time and the right place. We know its him guiding void, because if it was purely void's concious decision, then void would have appeared in the original timeline when god blessed garou introduced himself.

But no, it just so happened that he didn't appear. Blast was already there at the point the timeline diverged, and unless void only appears because his ability to sense god's powers allows him to differentiate when its inside someone and when its leaving, then he should atleast check what was going on and at that point his presence noticed by blast.

In the new timeline however, he is INSTANTLY there, PERFECTLY timed.

The last two times god's power left someone, they either died from being burned from the inside or it transmutes them to salt. The varying effects might have to do with what the target could endur so its adjusted accordingly, but what I believe happened is that GOD instead of wasting time bothering to use the powers inside garou to kill him, he instead put all his effort in making it leave garou as fast as possible. Blast is there after all and every moment its trying to do anything else on garou's body is a moment its not outside for void to suck
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yea that what i mean , the power leaving not killing him since saitama obviously didnt wanna kill garou
 
Kin201 said:
We are arguing that Flash and Sonic can perceive the slash while it moves towards them based off visuals, but not the speed at which the blade extends from its starting point to Earth, which is what Saitama reacted to.
Click to expand...
Thats the thing tho. If flash and sonic can perceive the slash as it moves towards them, then they should perceive a serious void or blast. Bottom line, they cant. There isn't any explanation for this inconsistency, but them "perceving" it based on the visuals can be explained away by either coincidence, flashy flash's superhuman danger sense/instincts recognizing the energy from what happened with the cube that might be something similar with blast's precoging the slash too, the panel wherein it shows the blade travelling towards them as flashy flash gives out a warning is just the slash appearing after said warning and both of them are now frozen as its travelling, to etc etc. Any number of interpretations to discredit it.
 
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Wardokman69 said:
I mean, it's didn't matter where the starting point was because it's akin to teleportation that ignore distance altogether.
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If you think the starting point is irrelevant then you have to argue that it is instantaneous. People will start asking for your evidence and if you claim it's based on the statement of "ignoring distance," then they might propose an argument that it could be referring to the fact that Void can project his attacks across universes regardless of location, rather than being a definitive statement that his attacks are undodgeable. Heck, from what I see, there are people in this thread who find themselves agreeing with this.

Even if you can get it accepted, it's not going to be easy one.
 
Kin201 said:
If you think the starting point is irrelevant then you have to argue that it is instantaneous. People will start asking for your evidence and if you claim it's based on the statement of "ignoring distance," then they might propose an argument that it could be referring to the fact that Void can project his attacks across universes regardless of location, rather than being a definitive statement that his attacks are undodgeable. Heck, from what I see, there are people in this thread who find themselves agreeing with this.

Even if you can get it accepted, it's not going to be easy one.
Click to expand...
That ctr is going to be a thing
 
Kin201 said:
If you think the starting point is irrelevant then you have to argue that it is instantaneous. People will start asking for your evidence and if you claim it's based on the statement of "ignoring distance," then they might propose an argument that it could be referring to the fact that Void can project his attacks across universes regardless of location, rather than being a definitive statement that his attacks are undodgeable. Heck, from what I see, there are people in this thread who find themselves agreeing with this.

Even if you can get it accepted, it's not going to be easy one.
Click to expand...
Tbh its those who disagree with it being instantaneous are the ones who would have to disprove it being the case.

Why would flashy flash say that speed is irrelevant? Why would blast only use teleportation to avoid it, and that void himself states it can only be dodged by doing so? Why do 5 cuts appear instantaneously after the hero assocation HQ is teleported? If the causes that affect how time moves and other such causes that affect how things function and operate are part of causalty of the universe; why would a sword that is connected to and actively being moved by someone, following the movement outside of causalty, be affect by causalty? Why has void from his perspective not completed his swordswing already if the blade is the only thing affected by causalty? Why is the blade being treated as if it moves based on the flow of time in the universe, when its moving at the same speed of the one thats holding it outside causalty? Why can the blade cut space, a property that clearly implies its ignoring all the causes that affect how things in the universe shouldn't do that, but is somehow stripped of all other hyperspace properties?
 
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Kin201 said:
All three of them clearly looked in the right direction the blade descended while it moved toward them or even before it started moving toward them, lol. But you will choose the interpretation that fits your agenda the best.
Click to expand...
except they only looked that way after saitama stopped it
 
Swagoorago said:
except they only looked that way after saitama stopped it
Click to expand...
It's the panel before Saitama stopped it.
ReusedOil said:
Tbh its those who disagree with it being instantaneous are the ones who would have to disprove it being the case.
Click to expand...
I mean it's the otherwise around. The one arguing for it has to prove it is instantaneous. They have to prove the positive.
ReusedOil said:
Why would flashy flash say that speed is irrelevant? Why would blast only use teleportation to avoid it, and that void himself states it can only be dodged by doing so? Why do 5 cuts appear instantaneously after the hero assocation HQ is teleported?
Click to expand...
When did Flash say speed is irrelevant and it can't be dodged? I don't remember this. Void is confident that Blast cannot move fast enough to dodge it by himself but needs teleportation. He doesn't say his attacks cannot be dodged regardless of how fast you are. Even if this is true, that would imply Blast can react fast enough to open a portal and then teleport.
ReusedOil said:
If the causes that affect how time moves and other such causes that affect how things function and operate are part of causalty of the universe; why would a sword that is connected to and actively being moved by someone, following the movement outside of causalty, be affect by causalty? Why is the blade being treated as if it moves based on the flow of time in the universe, when its moving at the same speed of the one thats holding it outside causalty?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure how to answer this, so I'll neglect this point. Probably because I don't quite get the question.
ReusedOil said:
Why can the blade cut space, a property that clearly implies its ignoring all the causes that affect how things in the universe shouldn't do that, but is somehow stripped of all other hyperspace properties?
Click to expand...
The blade cuts space could be because his swords are called dimension swords, which presumably have properties of cutting space.
 
Kin201 said:
I mean it's the otherwise around. The one arguing for it has to prove it is instantaneous. They have to prove the positive.
Click to expand...
unless the manga has all these evidences that both show and say in support of it?
Kin201 said:
When did Flash say speed is irrelevant and it can't be dodged? I don't remember this. Void is confident that Blast cannot move fast enough to dodge it by himself but needs teleportation. He doesn't say his attacks cannot be dodged regardless of how fast you are. Even if this is true, that would imply Blast can react fast enough to open a portal and then teleport.
Click to expand...
"An opponent that can't be defeated with speed only" -flashy flash. Its a very pointed detail. The problem they face is that they can do nothing reliable against the dimensional slash, but if its dodgeable, then why would flashy flash say that speed isn't enough? Also there is evidence of a time dilation before, during, and after blast charging up a teleport, such as him outspeeding serious punch squared inches before it happens and void who was in the middle of teleporting.

Like yeah void doesn't straight up say you cannot dodge it with speed, but the points stack up to a very valid interpretation
Kin201 said:
I'm not sure how to answer this, so I'll neglect this point. Probably because I don't quite get the question.
Click to expand...
Imagine me inside a room and holding a sword. Theres an open door infront of me into another room. Im outside the causalty of the universe in my room while the other room is the universe.

The flow of time is affected by factors such as gravity and etc; essentially cause and effect; aka a part of causalty. This logic extends to other factors and its effects on how things are, further supporting my interpretations.

when I swing my sword through the open door, unless shown otherwise, the blade is still following my movement of which is outside causalty.
Kin201 said:
The blade cuts space could be because his swords are called dimension swords, which presumably have properties of cutting space.
Click to expand...
enchanted swords that doesn't cut flashy flash's swords when the latter blocks and is forcibly pushed back when the former pushes through the guard?
 
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ReusedOil said:
unless the manga has all these evidences that both show and say in support of it?
Click to expand...
Yes, I'm saying you will present what you call evidence to them.
ReusedOil said:
"An opponent that can't be defeated with speed only" -flashy flash. Its a very pointed detail. The problem they face is that they can do nothing reliable against the dimensional slash, but if its dodgeable, then why would flashy flash say that speed isn't enough? Also there is evidence of a time dilation before, during, and after blast charging up a teleport, such as him outspeeding serious punch squared inches before it happens and void who was in the middle of teleporting.

Like yeah void doesn't straight up say you cannot dodge it with speed, but the points stack up to a very valid interpretation
Click to expand...
I mean if Void just sits in hyperspace and spams Dimension Slashes, then obviously no amount of speed will reach or defeat him. There could be another way to interpret the statement without taking it too literally. Especially when you have visuals contracting it.

Are you suggesting that Blast's portal-based teleportation is somehow faster than instantaneous? I don't quite get the implication.
ReusedOil said:
Imagine me inside a room and holding a sword. Theres an open door infront of me into another room. Im outside the causalty of the universe in my room while the other room is the universe.

The flow of time is affected by factors such as gravity and etc; essentially cause and effect; aka a part of causalty. This logic extends to other factors and its effects on how things are, further supporting my interpretations.

when I swing my sword through the open door, unless shown otherwise, the blade is still following my movement of which is outside causalty.
Click to expand...
Do you think when Void looks into the bubble, he sees Flash, Sonic, and Blast moving or being frozen? This is when the statement about how much distance, size, and energy can be ignored depends on the user's capabilities comes into play.

There could be limitations to what Void can do while in hyperspace.
ReusedOil said:
enchanted swords that doesn't cut flashy flash's swords when the latter blocks and is forcibly pushed back when the former pushes through the guard?
Click to expand...
Either the sword's effect only activates while in hyperspace or Void can control whether it cuts space or not. His blades are called dimension swords, there must be properties to them. In the webcomic, they weren't called that but it's clear that they have some unique abilities.
 
It's not like I'm going to argue against Infinite speed Saitama or Dimension Slash in the upcoming CRT anyway. So that was probably my last response on the matter. I don't feel like arguing against or for it here anymore.
 
GeUuymWXUAAYOhW
GeUuytwXQAAHR9_
 
Kin201 said:
Yes, I'm saying you will present what you call evidence to them.

I mean if Void just sits in hyperspace and spams Dimension Slashes, then obviously no amount of speed will reach or defeat him. There could be another way to interpret the statement without taking it too literally. Especially when you have visuals contracting it.
Click to expand...
theres an infinite amount of difference between being unable to do anything at all against dimensonal slash, and being able to actually dodge it. Theres also an infinite amount of difference between dodging once, and dodging indefinitely with enough speed. Why would flashy flash's words be talking about the threat of dimensional slash spam, on the topic about what they will need to deal with ONE attack? They dont know how many times he can attack, or how long the wait time until another one or any of the mechanics. All they know is that they can't dodge one.

Theres not a reason why flashy flash would cross that infinite amount of difference to talk about a hypothetical that doesn't have anything to do with their current problem.
Kin201 said:
Are you suggesting that Blast's portal-based teleportation is somehow faster than instantaneous? I don't quite get the implication.
Click to expand...
The blackhole looking teleportation thing blast does AND the charge up of bashing his fists together has shown to create a time dilation that appears instant, yes.
Kin201 said:
Do you think when Void looks into the bubble, he sees Flash, Sonic, and Blast moving or being frozen? This is when the statement about how much distance, size, and energy can be ignored depends on the user's capabilities comes into play.

There could be limitations to what Void can do while in hyperspace.
Click to expand...
if void is attacking at a speed blast and co cant react to to the point they are statues, then yes, void is most likely also perceiving them frozen. Only supports my theory
Kin201 said:
Either the sword's effect only activates while in hyperspace or Void can control whether it cuts space or not. His blades are called dimension swords, there must be properties to them. In the webcomic, they weren't called that but it's clear that they have some unique abilities.
Click to expand...
Ah yes lets imagine up a turn on and off button that never once existed nor mentioned for the sword when theres an in-universe established "outside causalty" explanation right there
 
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ReusedOil said:
Ok so im really confused. Are people here arguing that DS isn't THAT fast, on the basis that flashy flash perceived it?

The same flashy flash that couldn't perceive a serious void moving? The same ff who can't perceive blast speedblitz him? The same blast who is faster than void? The same blast who CANT DODGE THE DS WITHOUT TELEPORTATION AND PRECOG?

Did flashy flash get prescription glasses or something?
Click to expand...
For right now I'm gonna go with the notion that he just realized ahead of time what was going to happen since there is not enough evidence for a cosmic precog. To be clear, I am responding to the first part of the page that shows Flash's head light up in shock, not the rest. Overall it's all highly susceptible to differing interpretations.

Either side of this debate could tell me their version and I'd think it's good enough as an explanation. And trigger a "yeah that makes sense" response.
 
It's just the sword of actuation skull knight uses minus the soul/astral part. Plus higher-D pilled.
 
It might be the arc ender, wich would be the perfect chapter to be the last chapter of the year.
Also i hope we get a Santa Blast, Tatsumaki elf Saitama reindeer cover. Would be funny.
 
Epiccheev said:
It's kinda unfair if you think about it, Flashy was already stronger than Atomic Samurau, and the magic blade he gets is already better than the sun blade by miles. Even atomic precision dura neg slashes would be inferior to actual spatial cutting
Click to expand...
Except dimension sword's slash full potential only works when its outside the universe. I'm hoping moon and sun blade combined has the properties of cutting even astral or soul. Because Samurai's in OPM might line up with mythology while Ninja's are Space.
 
I really hope it's not the end of the arc next chapter...

It's only been 85 pages since Empty Void first appeared as genjutsu flash and 55 pages since Blast showed up (42 pages of Blast action before Saitama intervened). If these are really half chapters which will be later merged as I have been told, the entire Flashy vs ninjas fight up until Void's defeat/retreat won't even be a full volume's worth of content.

I know this fight was never going to be as long as Cosmic Garou vs Saitama or something like that, but at least it could be as long as a fight like Tatsumaki vs Psykorochi (135 pages from the fusion's complete appearance to Tatsumaki coughing up blood during the twist) or longer than Garou vs Darkshine (56 pages from sleeping Garou wailing on a flexing darkshine to Darkshine being floated away).

I mean, seriously! We're talking about Blast's real debut fight against a god-level monster who's the key to unlocking the final boss. Not is that just narratively a top 10 (maybe top 5?) most important fight in the series, it's also the fight with the most choreography potential so far- Blast and Void could easily have all kinds of insane feats and abilities we haven't seen yet. I'll be disappointed if Empty Void gets KOed in the next 20 pages.
 
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