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(Spoilers!) The Ring of Truth at the Final Horizon: Sonic the Hedgehog

ShakeResounding said:
Alright, folks! As promised, I've updated the sandbox to include gifs for nearly everything within it. I'm missing an ability or two, which I'll wrap up over the course of the rest of the day. For all you non-believers, this should suffice.
Click to expand...
Eseseso said:
One thing: Shouldn't Super Sonic have higher durability with Cyber Corruption?

Also, the End should probably get an AP justification addition for being far superior to Tethered Supreme considering that it could casually refuel it with its own energy multiple times without any issue during the fight.
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What do you think?
 
By the way, Does this mean when he is Cyber Super Sonic (Full corruption mode), He can one shot people comparable to his hidden potential unlocked form?

Or did i understand it wrong?
 
XxZetsuxX said:
By the way, Does this mean when he is Cyber Super Sonic (Full corruption mode), He can one shot people comparable to his hidden potential unlocked form?
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Yup. It's basically a martyr move though, as it'd leave him vulnerable after the fact due to it knocking him out.
 
omegabronic said:
The fact that he is losing rings is him not taking damage, them flying back while rings go out of him is how the rings mechanics work, being pushed back =/= taking damage
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His health bar goes down, though. If he isn't getting hurt, then, the bar should reflect that, but it goes down just the same with Rings as it does without.
And, if Rings can survive a base-level character against a Super level attack, then no base stats should ever harm anyone with Rings. Multiple games show base level characters dealing damage to one another, despite them holding Rings.
We also have various examples of characters having Rings in-game, then going to cutscene, and getting hurt without losing any Rings. If Rings protect against damage, then in this scenario: Sonic has Rings, gets hit, drops Rings in exchange for no harm done.
But, there are things directly contradicting this behavior working outside of gameplay, and even then it gameplay, it isn't always consistent (see SA2 character battles and Fighters).
 
(Rings are something that seem to function differently in-game than they do in-universe. Super Sonic is another example, as he requires Rings in-game. Sonic, according to one of the mobile games, has collected over 70 Billions Rings. In 06, he was one-shot and killed by Mephiles. I honestly wouldn't believe he wasn't holding any Rings on him at all, especially since Rings also function as currency in-game, and some upgrades from Shop are mandatory in parts of the game. Sonic also mentions needing Super, in Frontiers, to survive the Titans. If Rings were so potent as to protect him from harm to begin with though, then I feel he would also mention going out of his way for Rings, and Rings would likely be more plot-relevant throughout the franchise, overall. IDW, which is canon, has also consistently never mentioned getting Rings to defend oneself.)
 
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Just want to say that rings do not grant 2-B to 2-A durability, they just allow characters to live from attacks on that scale by transferring all the damage to the rings. They can still be hurt by lower tier attacks, they just need to transfer less damage and thus lose less rings.
 
JJSliderman said:
Just want to say that rings do not grant 2-B to 2-A durability, they just allow characters to live from attacks on that scale by transferring all the damage to the rings. They can still be hurt by lower tier attacks, they just need to transfer less damage and thus lose less rings.
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I have a question. How many rings a Base character lose by taking Tier 2-B/2-A attacks then? From the video I saw, Base Sonic lost between 40-60 rings from an amped Supreme's big energy ball, but I could be wrong
 
MysticMania said:
And, if Rings can survive a base-level character against a Super level attack, then no base stats should ever harm anyone with Rings. Multiple games show base level characters dealing damage to one another, despite them holding Rings.
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You should re read the blog, that is not a contradiction at all for what is being proposed, you don't need 2-A AP to make someone drop rings

MysticMania said:
We also have various examples of characters having Rings in-game, then going to cutscene, and getting hurt without losing any Rings.
Click to expand...
Gameplay vs cutscene, in gameplay sonic may have the rings there, but in story he may very have not, we have no way to know when sonic canonically has rings in story of the games, in frontiers we know he does in the boss fight against the end since they are used to make him survive enough to defeat it, but in the cutscene you showed we don't know

MysticMania said:
If Rings protect against damage, then in this scenario: Sonic has Rings, gets hit, drops Rings in exchange for no harm done.
But, there are things directly contradicting this behavior working outside of gameplay, and even then it gameplay, it isn't always consistent (see SA2 character battles and Fighters).
Click to expand...
For the first one we don't have such a thing, and for the second examples i already covered as well, the instances of rings not protecting the user are outliers, in every game and situation we know they had them they did just that, bringing 2 gameplay examples out of the more than 20 where they indeed protect the user, with some of those even being from non gameplay/getting priority such as sonic prime and sonic frontiers, will not get priority anyway, those would be the few outliers against the stablished rule of rings, not the norm, specially the frontiers one would get more priority than anything else since it is a pivotal plot moment and point in cutscene/in story
 
MysticMania said:
(Rings are something that seem to function differently in-game than they do in-universe. Super Sonic is another example, as he requires Rings in-game.
Click to expand...
That is a mechanic constantly contradicted even by the first ever appearence of super sonic there is where he turned super without any rings

MysticMania said:
Sonic, according to one of the mobile games, has collected over 70 Billions Rings.
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what of it?

MysticMania said:
In 06, he was one-shot and killed by Mephiles. I honestly wouldn't believe he wasn't holding any Rings on him at all, especially since Rings also function as currency in-game, and some upgrades from Shop are mandatory in parts of the game.
Click to expand...
That is a problem of your own disbeliefs and nothing more, nothing says that he has rings, and since the stablished mechanic didn't activated then it is safe to conclude that he didn't

MysticMania said:
Sonic also mentions needing Super, in Frontiers, to survive the Titans.
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we, because knight and giganto can negate this hax, they would both gain "damage transferal negation" also, he says that he needa them to beat them, not to survive them, and even then, it is true, they would overlast him even with rings

MysticMania said:
If Rings were so potent as to protect him from harm to begin with though, then I feel he would also mention going out of his way for Rings, and Rings would likely be more plot-relevant throughout the franchise, overall. IDW, which is canon, has also consistently never mentioned getting Rings to defend oneself.)
Click to expand...
This is a nothing point, not being mentioned all the time =/= not existing, shadow's inhibitor rings are also rarely ever mentioned nowdays, are they not cannon as well?

Also also, rivals 2, prime and frontiers directly mention and show them, so you literally can't deny them at all
 
Mystic, I feel you just jumped straight to arguing without actually reading anything anybody is saying about Rings.

We've already discussed them being used as currency, or how having Damage Transferal DOES NOT EQUATE to durability, or Sonic having 70 billion Rings, etc., there isn't anything new you're presenting that's enough hardline evidence against Rings having canonical Damage Transferal that we now see happen within a cutscene.

Also, Sonic needs Super Sonic for the Titans because he doesn't have the AP to harm them whatsoever without the form. I'm unsure how that's an argument against Rings, tho, because protection doesn't matter if you don't gave the means to harm your opponent.
 
BTW I still feel that if we aren't using Super Sonic 2 as a name then Cyber Super Sonic shouldn't be used either and it should be change to "even higher at full power"
 
Pathetic, Sonic & Shadow lose up to 100 rings when getting hit by each others homing attacks in Gens
 
Btw, not sure if this affects anything but I read that, regarding Super Supreme's attack that briefly knocks Sonic out of Super, even after Sonic regains his Cyber Super form, he has only 100 Rings to face the last round. And that's only if you have enough rings: If you don't have enough by the time the cutscene starts, it's an instant kill.

Also, at least the final fight confirms that The End's standard energy can negate invulnerability.

Speaking of, since Super Sonic looks very battered and bruised after using his Cyber energy to kill The End, does that mean the Cyber Energy somehow negated his invulnerability?
 
Eseseso said:
Btw, not sure if this affects anything but I read that, regarding Super Supreme's attack that briefly knocks Sonic out of Super, even after Sonic regains his Cyber Super form, he has only 100 Rings to face the last round. And that's only if you have enough rings: If you don't have enough by the time the cutscene starts, it's an instant kill.
Click to expand...
It doesn't change much. This is hands-down the most difficulty we've ever seen Super Sonic experience, with his Hidden Power itself seeming to be strenuous for Super Sonic to take (as noted by both the caution Super Sonic needed to exercise when assuming the form and when he undergoes the transformation). Sonic dying is a hypothetical scenario, just like it's a hypothetical scenario to never experience the cutscene because you Perfect Parry everything (from what I heard, I can't confirm that atm).
Speaking of, since Super Sonic looks very battered and bruised after using his Cyber energy to kill The End, does that mean the Cyber Energy somehow negated his invulnerability?
Click to expand...
Hard to say, because that's Super Sonic incorporating it directly within his own power.
 
^^ I imagine so. I don't think there's any indication of only a certain number of people being able to grab Rings.
That would make close-range combat/getting hit close-by dangerous for a Sonic character, then, since they risk getting hit and the Rings touching their target. (Rings being currency and the currency at Casinopolis, with humans existing in 06 and SA1, and being used in the Black Markets, could further back Rings just being a general thing. I also assume they're used as currency for food in Unleashed, but I'm literally just guessing there.)
 
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ShakeResounding said:
Nah, otherwise any mook or being could grab one when we know that isn't the case. Sonic and Shadow don't pick up each other's Rings in Gens for example, iirc
Click to expand...
I would argue game mechanics for that given it is the currency in universe and assuming they magically become intangible to everyone but the one who picked them up previously when dropped from a hit but otherwise can be exchanged freely is not what we should do.
 
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