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Sonic the Hedgehog: Super Forms Speed Upgrade

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ShakeResounding

ShakeResounding

He/Him
8,548
7,205
Introductio

This accepted calculatio has Super Sonic and Burning Blaze crossing the universe in a short timeframe to reach and fight Eggman and Eggman Nega.

And because there were arguments about it's validity, I'm making a CRT for anybody who has problems with this calculation to voice them here instead of in the comments of a calculation. So for those who have problems with this, speak them here or forever hold your peace.

The Current Arguments (Up To Date)
To summarize...

Super Sonic and Burning Blaze travel interstellar distances to fight Eggman and Eggman Nega before the two universes fully merge and the Eggmen create Eggmanland "beyond this dimension" (which means universe in this context). Here is the calculatio.

For Speed Upgrade

  • As Super Sonic and Burning Blaze approach their fight with the Eggmen, there are no celestial bodies visible in the darkness as they approach The Exception. If there are no celestial bodies, this implies they've left their universe to approach The Exception.
    • Counter: This is just a shared transitional screen across the game. (Addressed below)
  • The Eggmen state they'll create Eggmanland "beyond this dimension", hinting at their fight taking place outside of the universe when lined up with the previous point.
    • Counter: The Eggmen state they'll do this after they defeat Sonic and Blaze (Addressed below)
  • Super Sonic and Burning Blaze are flung back into opposite directions after the fight concludes, showing that they weren't anywhere in a position where one was in their home universe.
Against Speed Upgrade

  • They could've used a form of teleportation to take a shortcut to The Exception.
    • Counter: This goes against Occam's Razor, and all we see is them flying rather than using Chaos Control or the likes.
  • A "rift" by definition has to be inside of something. Therefore, The Exception is somewhere within the universe
    • Counter: We use the term "rift" for simplicity's sake, but never within the game is The Exception called a rift of any sort anywhere. The only time it's referred to as a rift is on the Sonic Wiki, which makes this argument fall flat.
  • The Eggmen couldn't have been out of the universe because they say they'll build the amusement park after they defeat Sonic.
    • Counter: Them stating they'll defeat Super Sonic and Burning Blaze before building Eggmanland in no way correlates to their positioning or the distance they travelled.
  • This feat was calculated by other members before, such as DontTalk. We shouldn't need a recalculation of this feat.
    • Counter: Something done long ago is not the be-all end-all of a calc when different pieces of info can be unearthed and context can change. Additionally, the assumptions the old calc made are wildly different and even caused it to be rejected iirc.
  • The universes merging don't necessesarily need to happen at the edges due to being lined up at a 5th dimensional axis.
    • Counter: That takes many more assumptions and goes against Occam's Razor, as the game implies a clear-cut merge beginning at the edges of their worlds and the seperation at the edges when the final boss concludes.
  • Super Sonic and Burning Blaze "leaving the universe" is just a shared transitional scene across the game.
    • Counter: False. Sonic and Blaze's normal boss fights begin like this, with blue and green streams and a transitional screen that is obviously just aesthetic. With Super Sonic and Burning Blaze, however, they have something completely different that actually perfectly aligns itself with where the battle is supposed to take place. The thing we see them approach and the area the boss battle takes place in is one in the same. There is no comparison to draw from.
  • We don't know how far Super Sonic and Burning Blaze travelled, even if it was outside the universe. Therefore, the feat is unquantifiable.
    • Counter: By taking a look at a clip of the feat, we can see that the surrounding darkness around The Exception dwarfs The Exception itself. Not only this, but there seem to be no repercussions of this formation just yet, implying a long distance between The Exception and Sonic's universe.
  • The graphics are bad, so the transitional scene to The Exception is clearly just a limitation of them. If it had better graphics, it would look different.
    • Counter: No. Just... No.
The Changes
All Super Forms and those who scale to MFTL+ are buffed to 183 Quadrillion x FTL.
 
I'm creating this thread not only because it's a good speed buff, but to give others who don't agree a proper thread to put their disagreement and reasonings behind it into.
 
He would still be slower than kirby and dbs wouldn't he? Especially with that ridiculously high number for kirby. And dbs would still 400+ quadrillion times, right? Immeasurable is the only way game sonic is staying above. Or am I stupid?
 
CaptainFinnigan said:
He would still be slower than kirby and dbs wouldn't he? Especially with that ridiculously high number for kirby. And dbs would still 400+ quadrillion times, right? Immeasurable is the only way game sonic is staying above. Or am I stupid?
Click to expand...
Actually Sonic will become really close to Kirby now (183 Quadrillion vs. 196 Quadrillion), and about 3 times or so slower than DBS speeds. Super Sonic still have the immesurable speed though
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
Lol what? Sonic blitzing Kirby and DBS now without Immeasurable speed shit?


Ok
Click to expand...
Kirby is faster by about 13 Quadrillion, and DBS top tiers are faster than both
 
ShakeResounding said:
Kirby is faster by about 13 Quadrillion, and DBS top tiers are faster than both
Click to expand...
Are there some DBS character that 4-A Super Sonic actually outspeeds? And does all Kirby characters scale to him in speed?
 
Afaik even BoG scales to Beerus, who os "3/4th the speed of Whis" or whatever, which would still put them over 300 Quadrillion C iirc.

As for Kirby, iirc there are seperate speed feats but I'm not well-versed in Kirby to who scales and doesn't.
 
Tbf tho, the feat is admittedly vague. Who's to say the light they emerge from isn't a portal or something (Chaos Control can apparently create rifts too if we want a canon explanation for that weird blue light) and that they werent already inside the new dimension? The stars could simply be because of the apparent nebula that's forming at the center of this new world. This probably wouldn't pass on the OBD but I guess if y'all want to use it, go shear. Kinda wondering how the Millennium Star crossing the universe in MP in somehow slower even though every gif I see has it happening in a faster timespan than this feat as well but whatever.

It suffers fron the vague Kirby feats which I also still have a problem with because the Warp Star is heavily focused on but it's practically magical (and canonically can warp and travel to other dimensions and has auto-pilot) and was also summoned by magical people
 
Talking about other sites and what they accept is irrelevant.

Also I'm 100% sure you just ignored the entire context of the feat. There's no indication they used Chaos Control, or that they used a rift, or that they somehow used a shortcut. The context is here, and you calling it vague doesn't make it true. We have the context we need, we know what was done, and we go from there.
 
Because there's no portal? At all? And it's baseless so, plus Chaos Control wasn't used in the scene

And it wasn't a new dimension, but they flew to a rift that was between both dimensions created by their merging, thus the edge, that's where a merge would start

Everything else is irrelevant, like OBD, Mario, or Kirby
 
Or maybe, just maybe, we can stop inflating verses with vague feats like this because that bright blue light they emerge from can be seen as two entirely different things so it's complete headcanon on both sides for and against this if they simply flew the whole way or if there was a rift.

The only evidence y'all have is maybe contextual evidence because we don't see them create one, but when the enemy they face and Supers themselves can do it, then people can use that argument to bring that one down and we're left with practically no substance on either side.

Prove that it is undoubtedly them crossing a universe. If it's so vague and worthy of contention, then clearly you haven't proved anything and this isn't a feat that can be added due to the vague nature of it. I'm positive similarly vague feats in the past have been opposed so why should this one be accepted? Flying toward a "rift" when said rift doesn't even look like one but a nebulae isn't good evidence when the light they come out of actually appears more similar to other rifts in the series. The Exception Zone could be the place they were flying in and as such, we have no context as toward the timeframe of them flying across the universe to get there IF they even did that. This "rift" is a nebula within a mostly empty space with nothing else but small stars after they emerge from a bright light.

If we wanna be funny, what evidence do we have to support Sonic's universe even being one similar to ours in size? The stars have repeatedly shown in Colors DS and in thus very scene to look barely bigger than Sonic himself.
 
>Or maybe, just maybe, we can stop inflating verses with vague feats like this because that bright blue light they emerge from can be seen as two entirely different things so it's complete headcanon on both sides for and against this if they simply flew the whole way or if there was a rift.

Or maybe you can stop saying any verse you don't like is being wanked, plus this headcanon comment is completely hyprocritical from other things you say on this same comment, plus they flew to the rift, not through one, You can't fly from point A to C through B if B and C are the same

>Prove that it is undoubtedly them crossing a universe. If it's so vague and worthy of contention, then clearly you haven't proved anything and this isn't a feat that can be added due to the vague nature of it.

It has been, you saying "vague" doesn't make it so, it has beeen explained

>I'm positive similarly vague feats in the past have been opposed so why should this one be accepted?

Irrelevant

>Flying toward a "rift" when said rift doesn't even look like one but a nebulae isn't good evidence when the light they come out of actually appears more similar to other rifts in the series.

Explained above, plus it doesn't look like anyhing to other rifts, plus that's not proof as well, Sonic looks like Metal so he is Metal I guess, plus the feat is flying from earth to the final boss, what it actualy is, is irrelevant

>The Exception Zone could be the place they were flying in and as such, we have no context as toward the timeframe of them flying across the universe to get there IF they even did that. This "rift" is a nebula within a mostly empty space with nothing else but small stars after they emerge from a bright light

Also explained above, you are fundamentaly not understanding that the feat is Sonic flying to there, the destination is irrelevant

>If we wanna be funny, what evidence do we have to support Sonic's universe even being one similar to ours in size? The stars have repeatedly shown in Colors DS and in thus very scene to look barely bigger than Sonic himself.

Now this is baseless headcanon and completely downplay, let's downgrade Mario because the planets and galaxys in Mario Galaxy are super small, and unlike Sonic Colors ds there's no perspective justyfying that, the stars are small for the exact same reason the sun and the stars in our planet appear small
 
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