Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers

[HenshinIntervention]

Simple. Sonic and Co. Failed to stop Solaris, they needed to reset everything. So, of course, Solaris is still the strongest. He also has the best visually feat and for many, visuals are the most important thing.

The Titans and The End never destroyed universes on-screen. So, to people, they aren't that strong. (Doesn't help that Ian claimed Solaris is the most powerful)

This is the most ironic thing I've seen today (not at you specifically)

 

[Alexander]

This is the most ironic thing I've seen today (not at you specifically)

oh yeah,visual feats,but that logic does not makes sense,considering that again,visually,solaris only destroyed a city.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Nah it just means True Form End might not even exist

It must be like where people see the same embodiment of Death differently but the being itself is still capable of being harmed/killed/defeated.

Unless the Sonic games introduce a horrible reality where Death is no longer a thing in the universe, ala the End of Death canon from SCP, then either Kishimoto is going to retcon The End as not being Death or is only the physical avatar of the concept and not the real deal

 

[HenshinIntervention]

oh yeah,visual feats,but that logic does not makes sense,considering that again,visually,solaris only destroyed a city.

Ok..?

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Ok..?

I think Alexander is saying that Solaris is Multiversal+ based off feats, statements, and scaling (on here I should stress, I'm sure you have different beliefs on Solaris' power), but that Solaris was shown to have visually only destroyed a city when he merged back to himself....even though honestly it's much more logical to say that Solaris straight up erased the universe, but I'm just trying to figure out what he's saying.

 

[Alexander]

I think Alexander is saying that Solaris is Multiversal+ based off feats, statements, and scaling (on here I should stress, I'm sure you have different beliefs on Solaris' power), but that Solaris was shown to have visually only destroyed a city when he merged back to himself....even though honestly it's much more logical to say that Solaris straight up erased the universe, but I'm just trying to figure out what he's saying.

correct

 

[HenshinIntervention]

I think Alexander is saying that Solaris is Multiversal+ based off feats, statements, and scaling (on here I should stress, I'm sure you have different beliefs on Solaris' power), but that Solaris was shown to have visually only destroyed a city when he merged back to himself....even though honestly it's much more logical to say that Solaris straight up erased the universe, but I'm just trying to figure out what he's saying.

Yeah I have Solaris higher
But I don't think Alexander understood my replyup there, I was referring to something else.

 

[Alexander]

But I don't think Alexander understood my replyup there, I was referring to something else.

oh,well i understand

 

[Alexander]

Yeah I have Solaris higher

in what level?

 

[MysticMania]

I know right, but during my search I did find this pretty cool comic on Tumblr.




Seeing The End's dialogue mixed in with what Sonic said to Merlina at the end of Black Knight is pretty pungent. As if Sonic is seeing himself fighting against a more extreme, more cosmic version of his own beliefs. Where as Sonic knows everything will end yet lives to the fullest, The End chooses to destroy everything because it's the ultimate fate of the multiverse.

I really like how they draw everyone, and how they replicated the coloring and shading of Black Knight's cutscenes.

 

[MysticMania]

Actually there's a pretty sick fan art of The End that takes on the physical form of a rabbit, like the Rabbit on the Moon, with a scythe which I think really invokes grim reaper vibes. It'd be pretty cool if The End took that form normally but, when enraged or wanting to get serious, takes on a more eldritch form to invoke the force of nature vibe it has.

This is cute.

 

[MysticMania]

I really like Dr.Starline, in regards to canon Sonic villains.
Clutch could also be really cool. He's cute to me so far, but, as he's a Sonic character and thus can only be as evil as cheating on a math test, I worry Ian and Evan won't be allowed to make him a b@stard.

 

[ShakeResounding]

Clutch to me seems like barely anything more than a logjam in storytelling. I want to find him interesting but his overarching motives of picking up after fights between Eggman and the Restoration to gain profit is just... Bleh to me.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Clutch to me seems like barely anything more than a logjam in storytelling. I want to find him interesting but his overarching motives of picking up after fights between Eggman and the Restoration to gain profit is just... Bleh to me.

Tbf I think it is kind of a fresh breath of air to have a Sonic villain that's more grounded in his scope of villainy, being more of a criminal mastermind as opposed to a world conquering mad scientist like Eggman and Starline, a destructive force of nature like the Zeti, a cold blooded assassin like Mimic, and you could count Surge as the antithesis of Sonic and being the opposite of what he stands for.

But I can understand why you would find Clutch boring, he doesn't get a lot of screen time in the comic and needs to be given some characterization or examples of how much a criminal mastermind he can be to get people to be more interested in him.

 

[ShakeResounding]

But I can understand why you would find Clutch boring, he doesn't get a lot of screen time in the comic and needs to be given some characterization or examples of how much a criminal mastermind he can be to get people to be more interested in him.

True, and I see your point about a more grounded villain. I could probably become more invested in him if we see him fit better into that cold-and-cunning villain. I get it's an all-ages comic book, but I think it'd be fun alluding to Clutch as a cold-blooded murder who's buried plenty of people six feet under before getting outta the game.

 

[MusicRelaxing]

God, I'm rereading Archie Comics... I feel my soul ache. It was during the pendering, not when Flynn took over.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

True, and I see your point about a more grounded villain. I could probably become more invested in him if we see him fit better into that cold-and-cunning villain. I get it's an all-ages comic book, but I think it'd be fun alluding to Clutch as a cold-blooded murder who's buried plenty of people six feet under before getting outta the game.

Given the implications that exist regarding how Clutch treated and severely abused the Chao that he raced with before Amy, Cream, and Rogue exposed it to the public and forced Clutch out of retirement, I can totally buy the idea that Clutch also murdered people who threatened his empire or double crossed him in the past.

I mean it's not like the IDW comics have shied away from dark as **** moments; Mimic selling the Diamond Cutters to Eggman and watching them get slaughtered by Shadow Androids without a hint of remorse, the backstory of Surge and Kit and how Dr. Starline was such a monster that he straight up brainwashed them by ridding them of their past memories to make them better at slaying Sonic and his friends, and of the course the ENTIRE Metal Virus arc should be enough for SEGA to let IDW go wild with Clutch.

 

[Eseseso]

Given the implications that exist regarding how Clutch treated and severely abused the Chao that he raced with before Amy, Cream, and Rogue exposed it to the public and forced Clutch out of retirement, I can totally buy the idea that Clutch also murdered people who threatened his empire or double crossed him in the past.

I mean it's not like the IDW comics have shied away from dark as **** moments; Mimic selling the Diamond Cutters to Eggman and watching them get slaughtered by Shadow Androids without a hint of remorse, the backstory of Surge and Kit and how Dr. Starline was such a monster that he straight up brainwashed them by ridding them of their past memories to make them better at slaying Sonic and his friends, and of the course the ENTIRE Metal Virus arc should be enough for SEGA to let IDW go wild with Clutch.

Starline was an absolutely vile villain, which is what made him so entertaining. It's a shame he had to be such an Eggman fan boy.

That said, it's notable how he's one of, if not the only villain Sonic ever hated.

 

[Alexander]

Starline was an absolutely vile villain, which is what made him so entertaining. It's a shame he had to be such an Eggman fan boy.

That said, it's notable how he's one of, if not the only villain Sonic ever hated.

i will say,infinite,black doom,erazor,the end,are more evil than even eggman and starline

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Starline was an absolutely vile villain, which is what made him so entertaining. It's a shame he had to be such an Eggman fan boy.

That said, it's notable how he's one of, if not the only villain Sonic ever hated.

I mean can you blame Sonic for genuinely hating the guy? Starline jumpstarted an avalanche with the intention of burying hundreds of innocent civilians all so he could escape from the heroes. Eggman can be vile at times, especially during the Metal Virus arc, but I think the difference between Starline and Eggman is that the later has some standard when it comes to being evil and he can cooperate when it's necessary, where as Starline is only obsessed with being Eggman's fan boy and then later surpassing Eggman.

 

[Eseseso]

I mean can you blame Sonic for genuinely hating the guy? Starline jumpstarted an avalanche with the intention of burying hundreds of innocent civilians all so he could escape from the heroes. Eggman can be vile at times, especially during the Metal Virus arc, but I think the difference between Starline and Eggman is that the later has some standard when it comes to being evil and he can cooperate when it's necessary, where as Starline is only obsessed with being Eggman's fan boy and then later surpassing Eggman.

Eggman in the games is basically like Dr. Doom:

• Supergeniuses, duh.
• Have both come terrifyingly close to succeeding in their villainous goals on numerous occasions.
• Have done terrible things, both on the universal scale (Doom destroyed a universe, Eggman briefly destroyed the multiverse with the Time Eater) and the local scale (Doom murdered his ex-girlfriend to create magical armor, Eggman turned the town that took him in when he lost his memory into Zombots with glee).
• Have a mutual hate yet respect for their archenemy.
• Have loved ones (Doom cares for his god-daughter Valeria as well as his dead mother, Eggman cares for Sage and Metal Sonic).

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Eggman in the games is basically like Dr. Doom:

• Have done terrible things, both on the universal scale (Doom destroyed a universe, Eggman briefly destroyed the multiverse with the Time Eater) and the local scale (Doom murdered his ex-girlfriend to create magical armor, Eggman turned the town that took him in when he lost his memory into Zombots with glee).

Yeah the IDW comic really helped refresh the fandom's memory that beyond the silly name and goofy moments, Eggman is a genuinely formidable and terrifying villain that has done a lot of evil over the years and shouldn't be underestimated. I mean if you wanted my personal opinion on the matter, I think Sonic Adventure 2 was Eggman at his most intimidating in the games and the closet he got to killing Sonic

 

[Eseseso]

Yeah the IDW comic really helped refresh the fandom's memory that beyond the silly name and goofy moments, Eggman is a genuinely formidable and terrifying villain that has done a lot of evil over the years and shouldn't be underestimated.

And to quote the top comment:

People tend to forget that eggman loses all the time because his opponent is a hedgehog who breaks the laws of physics.

 

[ShakeResounding]

God, I'm rereading Archie Comics... I feel my soul ache. It was during the pendering, not when Flynn took over.

I started re-reading it a few weeks back to start the attempt of making a Rotor profile, and yeahhhh sometimes I feel like I'm reading through the issues as fast as possible lol.

I mean if you wanted my personal opinion on the matter, I think Sonic Adventure 2 was Eggman at his most intimidating in the games and the closet he got to killing Sonic

SA1/2 is how I feel Eggman is captured at his best. It's the small hints of cold calculations and threats that really get me, like stating he'll turn Tails into mince meat or pigeon-holing the entire planet into hopeless despair with the Space Colony Ark.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

SA1/2 is how I feel Eggman is captured at his best. It's the small hints of cold calculations and threats that really get me, like stating he'll turn Tails into mince meat or pigeon-holing the entire planet into hopeless despair with the Space Colony Ark.

Not to mention that Eggman was able to capture Amy at gun point and was willing to spray her brains on the floor if Sonic didn't give Eggman the Chaos Emerald....and then he straight up entrapped Sonic in a capsule while tricking Tails into revealing that the Chaos Emerald they had was fake before leaving Sonic to blow up in the vaccum of space.

Like Jesus, SA2 Eggman was such a menace and one of the doctor's most intimidating versions in the games. It's nice that Frontiers humanized the good doctor, but moments like that make you remember why Eggman's one of the most consistent threats to Sonic's world.

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Not to mention that Eggman was able to capture Amy at gun point and was willing to spray her brains on the floor if Sonic didn't give Eggman the Chaos Emerald....and then he straight up entrapped Sonic in a capsule while tricking Tails into revealing that the Chaos Emerald they had was fake before leaving Sonic to blow up in the vaccum of space.

Like Jesus, SA2 Eggman was such a menace and one of the doctor's most intimidating versions in the games. It's nice that Frontiers humanized the good doctor, but moments like that make you remember why Eggman's one of the most consistent threats to Sonic's world.

I mean he is...

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

I mean he is...

Indeed, he is THE Eggman after all.

 

[JJSliderman]

Eggman also captured Amy again in Riders.

 

[Alexander]

Eggman also captured Amy again in Riders.

that scene with the tornado

 

[JJSliderman]

Yeye

 

[thetechmaster36]

So I dunno if anyone's talked about it yet, but apparently there's going to be an upcoming patch for Frontiers at some point in the future (I'd have to find the tweet where this was stated). I'd assume around the game's anniversary, but we'll have to wait and see.

On that note, though, what would you like to see out of this patch? It's definitely not going to be some sort of game-altering update or anything, but I think making plenty of hotfixes and/or necessary changes to make the game feel a bit more complete as a package is a good idea.

Personally, I'm not sure what exactly I would want out of this patch. There are obviously a lot of things that are fairly jank and broken, especially in Update 3, but at the same time, I feel like that's part of what makes it really fun to play.

 

[JJSliderman]

I’m personally fine with the way it is now but I think they should make the Master King trial a bit more forgiving. Maybe allow a limited number of ring Cyloop for each boss.

 

[Spilxson2]

Is there going to be a profile for the Sonic that appeared in OK KO?

 

[Fireld]

IIRC Laser is working on it.

 

[ThatBusyDude]

Any idea when this 1-C Archie revision will come out?

No, I waited too long for my Arabian nights thread. Before that can we at least review the arguments for that first?

 

[Spilxson2]

I saw a CSAP Wiki page that had Archie Sonic at possibly 1-C

 

[MysticMania]

True, and I see your point about a more grounded villain. I could probably become more invested in him if we see him fit better into that cold-and-cunning villain. I get it's an all-ages comic book, but I think it'd be fun alluding to Clutch as a cold-blooded murder who's buried plenty of people six feet under before getting outta the game.

so breaking bad coded i don't know I didn't play the game

But yeah, I agree with you.

 

[MysticMania]

Starline was an absolutely vile villain, which is what made him so entertaining. It's a shame he had to be such an Eggman fan boy.

That said, it's notable how he's one of, if not the only villain Sonic ever hated.

I'm weirdly obsessed with him, and the dude being f-cked up is a big reason I like him. he's so silly

 

[ShakeResounding]

Dr. Starline had a great arc in his showdown with Dr. Eggman, I think the issue was he largely reminds people in the fandom of that cringy theatre kid you avoid in middle school.

 

[Alexander]

Dr. Starline had a great arc in his showdown with Dr. Eggman, I think the issue was he largely reminds people in the fandom of that cringy theatre kid you avoid in middle school.

me?