Some Random RWBY CRT

[Sir_Ovens]

No one made a positive claim as such. Besides saying something is inconsistent, is the same thing as saying every other interpretation is not consistent.

Why would Neo being able to knock out Yang being a contradiction? Her semblance would help why?

Weekly made the claim that all Aura is 4x the character's durability. I'm debunking that claim on top of any claim that a certain character's Aura would scale league above their base durability.

Because it didn't. And it's a huge contradiction because based on Weekly's rhetoric, Aura would have blocked that attack no problem and wouldn't have just poofed after one hit from someone physically weaker than Yang herself.

 

[Community_Gamer]

My guy did you forget that Yang's aura was alrady low due to having fought several times that day?

Well no I wouldn't say that. There's no real reason to think it was low here. Especially since they were just hanging out at the mansion and didn't fight against until a brief confrontation with Cinder. Neo can just one shot her...no issue.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

My guy did you forget that Yang's aura was alrady low due to having fought several times that day?

So we're the other girls and they weren't all one-shot.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

You missed the part I said it was an inconsistency.

Except its not inconsistent, on the contrary its entirely consistent with the cap of what aura is shown to protect characters from without breaking

Except I'm arguing that they don't scale 4x greater than their base durability. You want to defend this case? Post the scans or you lose this point. I don't have to prove a negative, you have to prove a positive.

Ah yes, the best argument, 'your not allowed to argue your own points thoroughly, you have to argue them when i say and if you dont then you dont get to argue them at all'.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

So we're the other girls and they weren't all one-shot.

The other girls dont have one-use semblances that drain their aura immediately like Yang's does

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Because it didn't. And it's a huge contradiction because based on Weekly's rhetoric, Aura would have blocked that attack no problem and wouldn't have just poofed after one hit from someone physically weaker than Yang herself.

Neo isnt physically weaker than Yang, theyre equal and Yang had activated her semblance which drains her aura massively

 

[Community_Gamer]

Weekly made the claim that all Aura is 4x the character's durability. I'm debunking that claim on top of any claim that a certain character's Aura would scale league above their base durability.

Because it didn't. And it's a huge contradiction because based on Weekly's rhetoric, Aura would have blocked that attack no problem and wouldn't have just poofed after one hit from someone physically weaker than Yang herself.

Neo isn't weaker than Yang......

You can counter Weekly's claim, yes. That's fine. But the moment you say anything is an outlier you have substantiate it.....which means proving every valid interpretation that doesn't account or allow for an outlier to be false.

This is why typically you only see the term "outlier" in reference to data. Because you can see all the points of interest. Although this only works for abductive argumentation. Its exponentially harder when talking about deductive or inductive argumentation (which is what we are using).

 

[Community_Gamer]

Neo isnt physically weaker than Yang, theyre equal and Yang had activated her semblance which drains her aura massively

I wouldn't say equals personally especially since Neo scales closer to Cinder who can 4 v 1 RWBY.

Regardless, Yang semblance would only drain her if she spends time absorbing kinetic energy beforehand. Which she did not. Everyone at this point seems pretty capable of spamming their semblances. Yang could use against Elm and not even be remotely fatigued afterward.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

I wouldn't say equals personally especially since Neo scales closer to Cinder who can 4 v 1 RWBY.

Eeeeh this kinda brings up the point of base vs maiden powers but then again that would be consistent with neo's feat...

Regardless, Yang semblance would only drain her if she spends time absorbing kinetic energy beforehand. Which she did not. Everyone at this point seems pretty capable of spamming their semblances. Yang could use against Elm and not even be remotely fatigued afterward.

Is that necessary tho? Wasnt the whole point of her original timeskip training that she needed to not rely on her semblance because using it drains her?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

So what is the issue here?

 

[Thestrikingzebra]

Yang, Ren and Jaune were in more combat than Ruby and the others. They not only dealt with the Hound in the beginning, but they also fought Salem, tanked the huge explosion that killed Monstra and hardly getting any rest from that point to the vault stuff.

 

[Spinoirr]

Team RWBY, JNPR should at least backscale from penny as they did manage to restrain penny with help and Blake makeing sure the hound didn't fly away as the hound should scale to penny as it did hold her back and knock her out too even if taken over

 

[WeeklyBattles]

So what is the issue here?

I just wanted Ovens to hold off on trying to downgrade Aura for the entire verse until the blog explaining its mechanics and feats is completed is all, the rest of the discussion is fine

 

[Thestrikingzebra]

Yang, Ren and Jaune were in more combat than Ruby and the others. They not only dealt with the Hound in the beginning, but they also fought Salem, tanked the huge explosion that killed Monstra and hardly getting any rest from that point to the vault stuff.

So if I had to say, Yang was probably at about 20-30% aura reserves which is enough for Neo to one shot through the aura

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Except its not inconsistent, on the contrary its entirely consistent with the cap of what aura is shown to protect characters from without breaking

A cap you have consistently refused to back up with scans so I will choose to ignore this until you do.

Ah yes, the best argument, 'your not allowed to argue your own points thoroughly, you have to argue them when i say and if you dont then you dont get to argue them at all'.

Let's look at your past history shall we? You took 3 years before pushing one SCP CRT even when you said you wanted nothing to do with SCP then ghosted that thread and left applying all of the revision to me, ghosted a Bayonetta thread after you promised you'd provide scans and dragged it out for days, and stonewalled a Steven Universe CRT.

Forgive me if I don't trust you, but I don't. Substantiate your claims with scans or don't claim them at all.

 

[Community_Gamer]

Eeeeh this kinda brings up the point of base vs maiden powers but then again that would be consistent with neo's feat...

Well it doesn't have necessarily go into that debate.

Is that necessary tho? Wasnt the whole point of her original timeskip training that she needed to not rely on her semblance because using it drains her?

The activation itself doesn't drain her any more than anyone else's semblance. The problem is that she has to take damage first which means letting someone pound on your Aura shield which drains your reserves. Its especially bad if that person is really powerful.

Basically her semblance encourages her to wait until to most optimal moment. Her problem was using regardless of the possible consequences. She didn't change or improve herself just mainly when she uses it.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

So if I had to say, Yang was probably at about 20-30% aura reserves which is enough for Neo to one shot through the aura

Where are you people pulling these numbers from? The show never makes it clear when the girls are full strength or not. Assuming she was half or full strength when she was hit is complete speculation.

 

[Community_Gamer]

So if I had to say, Yang was probably at about 20-30% aura reserves which is enough for Neo to one shot through the aura

Stop, you can't even remotely prove that. It's so much simpler and takes less assumptions to say Neo can just one shot Yang. Its not really surprising especially when she then 2 v 1s Blake and Ruby like she's on some Cinder shit.

 

[Community_Gamer]

Its really not though, the entirety of Volume 8 takes place over the course of two days, they were never really shown to properly rest in order to recover their aura at any point

They've also never been shown to be especially tired either. Not even after their aura breaks. And no else in series are they implied have lengthy recovery time.

Also they literally spent over a few hours without any combat before the Central Location fight.

As for the whole volume:
For Ruby's team its since EP 3 until EP 8. For Yang's its EP 4 to EP 7 and then again for Ruby's team from EP 9 to EP 13. Lastly for Yang's team it was EP 10 to EP 13.

 

[Spinoirr]

Also they mentioned with jaune, Ren and yang that the cold was chipping away at their aura and even show their aura levels go down to the yellow range (close to red)

 

[Community_Gamer]

Anyway, I'm going leave this thread alone for a while I think. Although I ultimately don't think anyone not a Maiden is town level. Nor is any individual relative to Maiden...save for possibly Neo and likely Hazel.

I would like you get 8-A and MHS as cap but I don't know its going happen. So I'll just wait until completion....I don't feel debating or convincing the entire RWBY thread.

See yah.

(Penny doesn't count because she a lot weaker than the benchmark being Cinder. Also her strength varies from depending if she has a human body or not)

 

[Community_Gamer]

Also they mentioned with jaune, Ren and yang that the cold was chipping away at their aura and even show their aura levels go down to the yellow range (close to red)

Yes, then they took an extended break for the almost the entire night in the outpost. Jaune even slept. It was literally morning in EP7 when they got picked up.

P. S. I know they got disturbed by the cracking but that was still after the events of EP 5. And they still stayed there afterwards.

 

[Spinoirr]

I mean Ren was chilling (hah) in the snow for a while

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

I'll restate the reasoning for why top Huntsmen/Huntresses somewhat downscale from Maidens:

Gathered clips that will help us evaluate the sitch.

Winter blocking Ironwood's BFG with gylph Winter Maiden Winter reflecting Ironwood's BFG back at him Vine containing the bomb's explosion Cinder piercing Penny with her Grimm arm Non-Maiden characters keeping up with Cinder and surviving her attacks

Okay, I think there is sufficient evidence that top-tier Huntsmen/Huntresses can somewhat keep up with the AP of Maidens.

We have Vine containing the nuke which would blow up Mantle with his Sembalance, in which case we need to speed up with calcs for Monstra's size and for the size of Mantle/Atlas.
We have Cinder failing to one-shot the protagonists. They can exchange multiple melee attacks with her and survive her ranged attacks, and Cinder had to put in effort in order to snap Jaune's sword. This is consistent with Ace Ops harming Maiden Penny, which we previously dismissed as Penny being an inexperienced Maiden but Winter is an inexperienced Maiden and she did fine.

There is also the issue that there is an other piercing anti-feat. This makes the fourth, despite keeping Aura on being described to be second nature for anyone with training.

1. Adam stabbed Sienna
2. Weiss' Queen Lancer summon stabbed Hazel (Miles confirmed that it momentarily pierced through his Aura)
3. Cinder stabbed Vernal with her Grimm arm
4. Cinder stabbed Penny with her Grimm arm

I think we should make piercing attacks a weakness, something like: "Sufficiently strong stabbing attacks can momentarily pierce through Aura without depleting it".

In addition, Ironwood's BFG (the bulky thing being designed to work by attaching the pistols to it looks kinda dumb, ngl) was prepared specifically to fight Maiden Penny if she refuses to cooperate, but Winter managed to block it with her Gylph and Ironwood survived it.

Adam's Moonslice was able to deplete Yang's Aura and maim her with one strike, through sheer firepower. That Cinder was incapable of doing the same implies that her firepower was not overwhelming to the cast.

There is a line in the guide book that Flynt's Killer Quartet amplifies his attack. But the x4 multipler is supposed to scale to Yang using her Semblance. Don't think there is enough evidence to claim that Aura's defensive benefits are a certain multiplier above its offensive benefits. We should just equate AP and durability, instead of going for something convoluted over unreliable speculation.

There is nothing wrong with Neo being much stronger than Roman; their relationship is not a hierarchy of strength, Neo just feels loyal to Roman. Judging by her theme song, Neo used to be lonely and miserable, but Roman introduced her to a new life, and he became the one good thing she has in her life and her only friend. White Fang henchmen were listening to Roman (even though he was insulting them) because they were ordered to do so by Adam (who is collabing with Cinder).

 

[Scottycj256]

That would make for 7-C Volume 8 main cast. This would not scale to anyone pre-Volume 8.

Volume 8 starts the night Volume 7 ends, Volume 7 scales to it too

 

[Scottycj256]

There is nothing wrong with Neo being much stronger than Roman; their relationship is not a hierarchy of strength, Neo just feels loyal to Roman. Judging by her theme song, Neo used to be lonely and miserable, but Roman introduced her to a new life, and he became the one good thing she has in her life and her only friend. White Fang henchmen were listening to Roman (even though he was insulting them) because they were ordered to do so by Adam (who is collabing with Cinder).

this makes the most sense to me. Roman just begrudgingly going along with what Cinder wants him to do in Volume 1-3, while Neo in Volume 6 being capable of putting up a good fight with post-Maiden Cinder makes me think that it isn't just about who is stronger than who, but loyalty and stuff.

Something like this is always present in a **** ton of fiction. Characters that are far stronger than the people they're serving that could easily stomp them and take power for themselves not doing so because they feel loyal to their master's cause is more common than you think.

 

[Scottycj256]

like how Ymir Fritz in AoT had ******* Stockholm syndrome despite her Founding Titan being the supreme being of the verse

I will NEVER forgive Isayama for ******* up the ending so badly

 

[Spinoirr]

Or like how stanley is a great marksman vs his leader xeno who is weak and doesn't use weapons or fight

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

Hellsing has overpowered underlings (Alucard and the Captain) serving much weaker strategists out of loyalty.

 

[AKM sama]

I just wanted Ovens to hold off on trying to downgrade Aura for the entire verse until the blog explaining its mechanics and feats is completed is all, the rest of the discussion is fine

I mean, anybody is free to make whatever changes if they have evidence and it gets accepted. If your blog gets made and accepted in the future, you can revise them again.

Of course, people can also wait if they want to. That's their choice.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

I mean, anybody is free to make whatever changes if they have evidence and it gets accepted. If your blog gets made and accepted in the future, you can revise them again.

Of course, people can also wait if they want to. That's their choice.

I mean

1. This thread isnt even about Aura

2. Even if it was would it not make more sense and save time and energy to wait a day for a blog that is already being worked on to be completed than to argue for a downgrade, somehow get that downgrade to go through, edit the entire verse, and then have to reedit it after the blog crt is done?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

So I expect the blog to be done within the next 24 hours because by your own admission I would only need to wait a day.

Also this is a CRT for all their current stats which would also put into question the completely arbitrary 4x base dura you set for Aura.

Furthermore the calcs in question while being fine on paper, still need to be reviewed to check for context.

Speaking of, the 8-A feat shouldn't scale to the cast, since the feat was caused by Ruby pushing the mech back and it falling. The cast themselves only made minor holes in the mech's hide and unless you want to scale real life anti-tank rounds to 9-A, I doubt the RWBY cast should scale to 8-A.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Speaking of, the 8-A feat shouldn't scale to the cast, since the feat was caused by Ruby pushing the mech back and it falling. The cast themselves only made minor holes in the mech's hide and unless you want to scale real life anti-tank rounds to 9-A, I doubt the RWBY cast should scale to 8-A.

The mech's hide is Low 7-C and the 8-A feat was done by Ruby herself so

 

[AKM sama]

Even if it was would it not make more sense and save time and energy to wait a day for a blog that is already being worked on to be completed than to argue for a downgrade, somehow get that downgrade to go through, edit the entire verse, and then have to reedit it after the blog crt is done?

It depends. If I am confident that the downgrade has enough evidence to go through and the other blog won't be accepted due to evidences already brought up in the downgrade thread and me being confident in my ability to debunk them because I know the source material very well, plus I don't know how much time it will take to make a blog and I don't like to take someone's word for it and wait for my own revision, then it would make more sense for me to just carry out my revision first.

Anyway, I guess that's derailing so I'll take my leave and let you guys carry on.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

The mech's hide is Low 7-C and the 8-A feat was done by Ruby herself so

Ruby pushed it. The earthquake was though the mach falling over, not Ruby. We don't scale people to pushing over people without any damage received from the attacking party.

 

[Community_Gamer]

Ruby pushed it. The earthquake was though the mach falling over, not Ruby. We don't scale people to pushing over people without any damage received from the attacking party.

So you don't think that the force of toppling the Atlesian Colossus would be relative to the tremor? Which was a direct result of said attack?

Have you seen a Newton's cradle? Just curious.

Not even considering the totally kinetic energy of said mech is in small town ranges.

Its not like leverage was used or it had a poor center of gravity.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

We don't scale pushing through punching if the person being pushed wasn't damaged at all. And the mech wasn't. All Ruby did was cut a tiny hole in it which would be unfathomably lower than 8-A.

And even if Ruby scaled to the mech it would only be unquantifiably greater than their current AP, not 8-A, since the mech is Low 7-C.

 

[Community_Gamer]

We don't scale pushing through punching if the person being pushed wasn't damaged at all. And the mech wasn't. All Ruby did was cut a tiny hole in it which would be unfathomably lower than 8-A.

How are dictating damage? Its made of metal. Besides its a matter area of effect and DC whether she creates a "tiny hole" or something more prominent.

Despite all that, it doesn't even matter whether she damaged the mech. We are scaling her to the tremor not necessarily the mech itself.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Why would we scale her to the tremor when the mech was the thing that performed the 8-A feat? Ruby pushed it, the mech tripped and caused the tremor. She wouldn't scale to it.

 

[Community_Gamer]

Why would we scale her to the tremor when the mech was the thing that performed the 8-A feat? Ruby pushed it, the mech tripped and caused the tremor. She wouldn't scale to it.

Bro.....I just explained this to you.

Do you know what a Newton's cradle is?

Let me put it another way,
If "Z" capable of effecting "X" and X can effect "Y" then shouldn't "Z" also be capable of effecting "Y"?