Shinza banshou discussion thread~Revival~

[Infera28]

That's actually just one of the thing the Throne God do.
Should the Throne be left vacant, things will stop to be created and slowly die.

Yeah i know.

Almost like Google translator.

It was not Google Translator. But I can not speak Japanese anyway, so it is clear that I use a machine translator that, despite the drawbacks, still express the main meaning.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Another proof for large size:

神は宇宙そのものであり、その力も宇宙規模の破壊力がある。
『覇道神』は殺意のみで宇宙規模の質量を叩き込んでおり、神にダメージを与えるには最低でも宇宙を削り取るだけの規模と威力が必要。

"God is the universe itself, and its power is destructive on a cosmic scale."
"The "Hadou God" strikes a cosmic mass with only killing intent, and in order to damage the God, it must be at least large enough and powerful enough to shave off the universe."

Also shouldn't hadou gods have reactive power level and absorbtion? Their laws are constantly expanding, absorbing more beings, souls, reality and increasing the power of the gods.

己が至った太極を永劫展開し続ける永久不変の存在。

"An eternal and unchanging existence that continues to expand the Taiji that it has reached."

比喩でなく宇宙規模の質量を持ち、無限に拡大し続ける。

"It is not metaphorical, but has a mass on the scale of the universe and continues to expand infinitely."

Let me get another proof from patheon i am sure i saw it there

 

[QuasiYuri]

There's a CRT which is giving them accelerated development actually.
The rest is obvious and already a thing.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Found it

And more prove of omnipresence

神となった存在、またはその統治世界や法則を指して神座と言う。<br>

神とは森羅万象そのものであり、すなわち宇宙という生命体。<br>
ゆえに星も、自然も、そこに生きる者たちも、すべては神の一部にすぎない。<br>
個人の細胞がすべて同一の遺伝子を持つように、神となった者の気質や属性にその時代の万象は支配される。<br>
よって、覇者たる神は複数同時に存在することが原則不可能。新たな神が誕生するごと、覇権を賭けた殺し合いが発生し、勝者が己の理想で宇宙を創る。
<br>それが神座世界の要諦で、現在七代目までの神と法則が確認されている。

Taken from this page

Dies irae PANTHEON -ディエス・イレ パンテオン- l ティザーサイト

日本のクラウドファンディング史上最高額を達成し、アニメ化が決定した学園伝奇バトルオペラ『Dies irae』。その最新作『Dies irae PANTHEON（ディエス・イレ パンテオン）』が、スマホゲームとして公開予定！

dies-p.net

This is the main page for pantheon tho

Dies irae PANTHEON -ディエス・イレ パンテオン- l ティザーサイト

日本のクラウドファンディング史上最高額を達成し、アニメ化が決定した学園伝奇バトルオペラ『Dies irae』。その最新作『Dies irae PANTHEON（ディエス・イレ パンテオン）』が、スマホゲームとして公開予定！

dies-p.net

You can check the characters, the world and the story

You can add the google translate tag to your browser it will auto translate to your preferred language

 

[Infera28]

There's a CRT which is giving them accelerated development actually.
The rest is obvious and already a thing.

I think a Downgrade is needed for Methuselah's AP and Durability, and I also find it unlikely that the commanders and Wilhelm should be scaled to Methuselah.

I've been thinking about making a Revision Thread for a while now.

What do you think?

 

[Infera28]

There's a CRT which is giving them accelerated development actually.
The rest is obvious and already a thing.

Is large size accepted? there isn't anything about it in profiles.

It can also be said about the struggle between Gudou and Hadou or the Throne gods that they only fight against the image/avatars of the gods, not the real form of the gods, which is the size of the world itself.

 

[Kanogami]

Is large size accepted? there isn't anything about it in profiles.

Hadou already have large size tho?

 

[PrinceofPein]

commanders and Wilhelm should be scaled to Methuselah.

Machina was directly stated to be able to one shot methuselah so yeah it is fine

 

[QuasiYuri]

I think a Downgrade is needed for Methuselah's AP and Durability, and I also find it unlikely that the commanders and Wilhelm should be scaled to Methuselah.

I've been thinking about making a Revision Thread for a while now.

What do you think?

There's a (jap) friend of mine who made a VSB account and intend to downgrade/change that.

 

[QuasiYuri]

Machina was directly stated to be able to one shot methuselah so yeah it is fine

Machina isn't AP + special case tho.

 

[Infera28]

Hadou already have large size tho?

Nvm then.

Machina was directly stated to be able to one shot methuselah so yeah it is fine

It was hax not AP.

 

[QuasiYuri]

It can also be said about the struggle between Gudou and Hadou or the Throne gods that they only fight against the image/avatars of the gods, not the real form of the gods, which is the size of the world itself.

Since Gudo can kill Throne Gods and all, there's no reason for them to only hit avatars shitz.

 

[Infera28]

There's a (jap) friend of mine who made a VSB account and intend to downgrade/change that.

What would be his new tier? At least 6-A, likely far higher makes sense?

Since Gudo can kill Throne Gods and all, there's no reason for them to only hit avatars shitz.

I meant image / avatar of the gods but at the same time containing all their power. So the death of the image will also destroy God. Unless we think a human-sized Gudou was fighting the world-sized Throne God.

 

[Infera28]

That's only my theory tho not a claim.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Machina isn't AP + special case tho.

It was hax not AP.

Yes, but considering all the commanders are comparable to each other in strength it is given they will sclae of Machina although in the context of machina against methuselah it is a matter if compatibility so it is understandable but again the commanders could each hold their own against methuselah but could not end him permanently

 

[QuasiYuri]

What would be his new tier? At least 6-A, likely far higher makes sense?

Idk yet. Whilhelm would lose his scaling to Meth most likely since it was really based on circumstances.

I meant image / avatar of the gods but at the same time containing all their power. So the death of the image will also destroy God. Unless we think a human-sized Gudou was fighting the world-sized Throne God.

Gudo are supposed to be stronger than Hado in some ways, so why not?
They just need to touch you and their law do the rest (just like how Machina does for dudes like Meth which are massive).

 

[QuasiYuri]

Yes, but considering all the commanders are comparable to each other in strength it is given they will sclae of Machina although in the context of machina against methuselah it is a matter if compatibility so it is understandable but again the commanders could each hold their own against methuselah but could not end him permanently

Wolfgang was stated to litteraly be a ant to Meth iirc.

 

[Infera28]

Yes, but considering all the commanders are comparable to each other in strength it is given they will sclae of Machina although in the context of machina against methuselah it is a matter if compatibility so it is understandable but again the commanders could each hold their own against methuselah but could not end him permanently

They are only at the level of Machina in Attack Potency. No one can survive Machina's EE, not even Reinhard. Wolfgang was only able to make very small holes in Methuselah, and Eleonore could not hurt Methuselah, and her attacks returned to her and legion.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Wolfgang was stated to litteraly be a ant to Meth iirc.

This should be wrong since wolfgang is superior to gladshelm wilhelm that could destroy meth jaws of darkness easily. and again going by the lore wolfgang has higher soul stock than everyone else bar reinhard so he will be stronger than all of them


Will Meth durability change? cause it seems wonky asf
Durability: Universe level (He embodies the mystery of all nights from the time of Mercurius to 1944, including his time loops, with their numbers being in the Novemdecillion. A single night's mystery requires the destruction of half the planet)

 

[PrinceofPein]

They are only at the level of Machina in Attack Potency. No one can survive Machina's EE, not even Reinhard. Wolfgang was only able to make very small holes in Methuselah, and Eleonore could not hurt Methuselah, and her attacks returned to her and legion.

Wilhelm was a matter of AP and the commanders are superior to him. also Machina said his EE is trash in front of Reinhard so yes he is surviving it, unless you think Reinhard is inferior to fodder ren that kept on creating new stories everytime he was EE'd by Machina?

 

[PrinceofPein]

Also I dont know what ability it should be but Wolfgang should have something that says with Briah he is always faster than his opponent no matter what in his speed section

 

[QuasiYuri]

This should be wrong since wolfgang is superior to gladshelm wilhelm that could destroy meth jaws of darkness easily. and again going by the lore wolfgang has higher soul stock than everyone else bar reinhard so he will be stronger than all of them

With help from Claudia and circumstances helping him*
And Wolfgang litteraly was described like that after attacking Meth.

 

[QuasiYuri]

Also I dont know what ability it should be but Wolfgang should have something that says with Briah he is always faster than his opponent no matter what in his speed section

He already has it as a ability and all.

 

[QuasiYuri]

Wilhelm was a matter of AP and the commanders are superior to him. also Machina said his EE is trash in front of Reinhard so yes he is surviving it, unless you think Reinhard is inferior to fodder ren that kept on creating new stories everytime he was EE'd by Machina?

Context is entirely different both for Whilhelm thing and Reinhard being affected.

 

[Infera28]

Gudo are supposed to be stronger than Hado in some ways, so why not?
They just need to touch you and their law do the rest (just like how Machina does for dudes like Meth which are massive).

Mercurius and Marie met several times and were the same size. The size of Habaki and Yato and Habaki and Hajun were the same size in the pictures. Although in the first one Habaki was Gudou and in the second one Hajun had to be infinitely bigger because of his spread in the infinite universes. The throne gods must also be infinitely larger than the other Hadou gods, but we see that they are the same size.

And that was just the humanoid pattern of Methuselah.

人間に見えている部分も本質は人型の模様があるというだけにすぎず闇という体を持つ大巨人というのが正しい。

This should be wrong since wolfgang is superior to gladshelm wilhelm that could destroy meth jaws of darkness easily. and again going by the lore wolfgang has higher soul stock than everyone else bar reinhard so he will be stronger than all of them

The only reason Wilhelm could hurt Methuselah was because Methuselah had Claudia in himself, which contained Wilhelm's blood, and it connected all three of them, and Methuselah believed that he was weaker than light (Claudia). So he became weaker than Wilhelm.

Wilhelm was a matter of AP and the commanders are superior to him. also Machina said his EE is trash in front of Reinhard so yes he is surviving it, unless you think Reinhard is inferior to fodder ren that kept on creating new stories everytime he was EE'd by Machina?

I mentioned above why Wilhelm could have hurt Methuselah, and the reason he called EE trash was that he would not be able to punch Reinhard, and Reinhard would kill him thousands of times before he received any blow. The Suppressed Machina destroyed Reinhard's body with two punches while Trifa's was in control. Ren also said that Machina's fists could kill Reinhard, and it was also said that one of the ways to defeat Reinhard was with Machina's fists.

 

[QuasiYuri]

Mercurius and Maries met several times and were the same size. The size of Habaki and Yato and Habaki and Hajun were the same size in the pictures. Although in the first one Habaki was Gudou and in the second one Hajun had to be infinitely bigger because of his spread in the infinite universes. The throne gods must also be infinitely larger than the other Hadou gods, but we see that they are the same size.

Habaki was Hado in both.

The only reason Wilhelm could hurt Methuselah was because Methuselah had Claudia's blood in himself, which contained Wilhelm's blood, and it connected all three of them, and Methuselah believed that it was weaker than light (Claudia). So he became weaker than Wilhelm.

That's what the downgrade would be based on yeah.

I mentioned above why Machina could have hurt Methuselah, and the reason he called EE trash was that he would not be able to punch Reinhard, and Reinhard would kill him thousands of times before he received any blow. The Suppressed Machina destroyed Reinhard's body with two punches while Trifa's was in control. Ren also said that Machina's fists could kill Reinhard, and it was also said that one of the ways to defeat Reinhard was with Machina's fists.

That's also part of the many things we have to remove from some DI misunderstood stuff.

 

[PrinceofPein]

With help from Claudia and circumstances helping him*
And Wolfgang litteraly was described like that after attacking Meth.

Sorry let me rephrase it this way, a single night was stated to be half of the world(planet), wilhem could destroy meth jaw of darkness which is hundreds of nights. wolf gang >>>> wilhem(claudia) >>>>> jaw of darkness.

the ant stuff is for meth durability not AP, his Durability is all the nights till 1944 including the novemdecillion time loops. so yes durability will be superior to his jaws of darkness which is only hundreds of nights

let me quote something "Infact Albedo might have actually been damaging him but....... His scale was too vast, his history too dense meaning schreiber lacked the fire power to damage him. Even So, by no means did that made it fair to assume schreiber was weak a single night was as large as half of the world and meth as accumulated countless of them"

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

Who'd wanna **** Hajun? Who would Hajun wanna ****? lol

Probably the entirely of the union academy according to fanfictions

 

[PrinceofPein]

The only reason Wilhelm could hurt Methuselah was because Methuselah had Claudia in himself, which contained Wilhelm's blood, and it connected all three of them, and Methuselah believed that he was weaker than light (Claudia). So he became weaker than Wilhelm.

Dont get me wrong i agree with the downgrade i mean it is unanimous and i doubt a CRT is needed for it, i am saying the commanders should scale to Meths Ap not Durability, well 7A commanders looks cool and i will get to make lots of stomp matches but it just seems odd honestly they are way higherr than 7A

I mentioned above why Wilhelm could have hurt Methuselah, and the reason he called EE trash was that he would not be able to punch Reinhard, and Reinhard would kill him thousands of times before he received any blow. The Suppressed Machina destroyed Reinhard's body with two punches while Trifa's was in control. Ren also said that Machina's fists could kill Reinhard, and it was also said that one of the ways to defeat Reinhard was with Machina's fists.

Actually true, i remembered machina destroying reinhard's body.

 

[Infera28]

That's what the downgrade would be based on yeah.

That's also part of the many things we have to remove from some DI misunderstood stuff.

What do you think about giving Briah Conceptual Manip or Limited Conceptual Manip? Because it was said that Briah Wolfgang could damage Methuselah but only to the point of making very small wounds. Or is it just Non-Physical Interaction?

 

[QuasiYuri]

What do you think about giving Briah Conceptual Manip or Limited Conceptual Manip? Because it was said that Briah Wolfgang could damage Methuselah but only to the point of making very small wounds. Or is it just Non-Physical Interaction?

That's NPI yeah.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

@QuasiYuri Do you think that Shinza low-godly regen would be downgraded?

 

[Infera28]

I'm waiting for countless layers into 1-B thread.

 

[QuasiYuri]

I'm waiting for countless layers into 1-B thread.

We're working on it, but it's more stuff for a "likely".

 

[QuasiYuri]

@QuasiYuri Do you think that Shinza low-godly regen would be downgraded?

I don't see a specific reason for it as of now.

 

[Infera28]

There is many problems with K3 profiles.

1. I feel there is a problem with giving 1-B durability to Tenmas and the power to destroy the universes and countries as the AP. EE traded blows with the Tenmas (blow = something from your body) but couldn't hurt them and their durability was 1-B? (durability = also something from your body).

2. why Tenma Momiji is At least 7-B, likely 7-A and Tenma Akuro is Comparable to Tenma Morei. Why they are comparable? any reason?

3. why EE have At least 7B, likely 7-A tier? because we have Tenmas as High 6-B and 3-A.

4. This isn't mountain level but used in Keishirou's profile: Stated by the narration to be able to cut apart entire mountains and pierce through entire mountain ranges

 

[QuasiYuri]

There is many problems with K3 profiles.

1. I feel there is a problem with giving 1-B durability to Tenmas and the power to destroy the universes and countries as the AP. EE traded blows with the Tenmas (blow = something from your body) but couldn't hurt them and their durability was 1-B? (durability = also something from your body).

2. why Tenma Momiji is At least 7-B, likely 7-A and Tenma Akuro is Comparable to Tenma Morei. Why they are comparable? any reason?

3. why EE have At least 7B, likely 7-A tier? because we have Tenmas as High 6-B and 3-A.

4. This isn't mountain level but used in Keishirou's profile: Stated by the narration to be able to cut apart entire mountains and pierce through entire mountain ranges

1. Pseudo Gods kinda have the power to regulate their flow and strength, hence why they have "varies" (although whether this should be handled differently is up to debate). Also most fights weren't really them going toe-toe.
While durability comes from their unchangeable nature as higher D beings + protected by Yato's Armor.

2. She's scaled to her previous self for some reason, but since K3 profiles weren't unlocked or edited, it stayed that way. Basically outdated.
Main guess would be that they both have a strength (筋力) value of 40 and that they appeared as a duo.

3. Nobody fought with Sukuna/Ootake without either Taiji or circumstances being in play. Morei fought Yakou who's who he is.
And overall they needed the Kikei Mandala to actually do something, so them scaling to the Tenmas is iffy (especially since Masada said that without Yakou, the EE wouldn't have been able to beat Awaumi without Ryuumei's help)

4.It has to be removed then. Main reason is that it is harder to correct the top tier and coe than the god tier.

And believe me, this is far from being the only problems on the profiles.

 

[Chasekilleen]

btw, where did we get that the layers of singularity transcend each other? is it because singularity of a higher taiji is infinitely bigger then singularity of lower taiji?

Errr Singularity has layers?? I just interpret Singularity as the opening to the 神座.
I just think of the Singularity as the opening to the womb and the Shinza as the womb itself. Where new lives and matter get born a new and the next God as sperms.
I'll do Yakou's 無形 profile tomorrow. I finally finished my C#, finally got a bit of leeway (I detest and hate programming)

 

[QuasiYuri]

Errr Singularity has layers?? I just interpret Singularity as the opening to the 神座.
I just think of the Singularity as the opening to the womb and the Shinza as the womb itself. Where new lives and matter get born a new and the next God as sperms.
I'll do Yakou's 無形 profile tomorrow. I finally finished my C#, finally got a bit of leeway (I detest and hate programming)

Yakou talks about some form of layers when he explains stuff to the rest of the EE.

and oof for programming.

 

[Akuma]

I think a Downgrade is needed for Methuselah's AP and Durability, and I also find it unlikely that the commanders and Wilhelm should be scaled to Methuselah.

I've been thinking about making a Revision Thread for a while now.

What do you think?

Hi, I intended to do the downgrade for commanders and Wilhelm, who as you and Yuri said, really shouldn't be scaled to Methuselah ( the guy who literally trashed all LDO members besides Reinhard and Merc. ) But it would be cool if I you intend to do it Instead, kinda hesitating mainly cuz of motivation rn.