Scp 682 vs kaguya

[Kaltias]

Idk enough about 682 to say that.

Ask Weekly/Azzy/Kep, they are pretty knowledgeable about SCP

 

[Agnaa]

Wait a sec, Extremely High isn't even an intelligence rating.

Shouldn't being infinitely smarter than the entirety of humanity, including the whole foundation, be nigh-omniscient? From its description "The highest level of non-omniscient intellect, possessed by those individuals with unfathomably superhuman intelligence and extensive mastery of most, or all, branches of science... Supergeniuses can often easily process calculations beyond modern humanity's combined capabilities on their ow".

I'm not an expert either, but I still think your current argument is wrong, a 1-B consciousness with no display of mind manip resist shouldn't have mind manip resist. Same as a 4D being wouldn't automatically get resistance to 3D (non-ap dependent hax, they shouldn't get hurt by 3d fire manip) hax.

 

[Agnaa]

Because they are infinitely more complex than lower-d minds, in order to actually understand what's going on on their level of existence. It was already discussed here.

3-D plot and conceptual manipulation are 100% worthless for a 4-D being

I thought that thread wasn't very conclusive on it? Just going by memory.

Also that thread talked a lot about comprehension, which isn't always relevant in using mindhax.

And this isn't about whether higher-d mindhax is superior to lower-d mindhax (it's a more impressive feat as it would work on people who are explicitly resistant to 3d mindhax), it's about whether lower-d mindhax can ever affect higher-d beings.

Also "3-D plot and conceptual manipulation are 100% worthless for a 4-D being" seems wrong to me? I don't think it's applied that way on the wiki before, but I don't have examples on-hand.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Yes, it is apliead that way, because it be NLF otherwise.

Inteligence is subjective to the verse, night omniscients kniw everything with the exeption of a very few things, which is false for 682

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

682 makes kaguya forget how to do anything then steals her powers

 

[Agnaa]

Yes, it is apliead that way, because it be NLF otherwise.

Inteligence is subjective to the verse, night omniscients kniw everything with the exeption of a very few things, which is false for 682

NLF goes both ways, you can NLF by assuming that something has resistances to things it's never shown resistances to.

imo hax should work unless there's a good reason for it not to work. A 5-B character won't resist 6-A soul hax just because it has more dura so it has a stronger soul.

I'm not yet convinced that hax that ignores conventional durability should be rendered irrelevant for every step of a dimension.

@Zachary Kaguya has resistance to mind manip.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

False equalency. A higher D is beyond infinitly stronger. It is how thing go, if you wish to change that make a crt.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

682 makes kaguya forget how to do anything then steals her powers

682 starts at base

 

[Agnaa]

False equalency. A higher D is beyond infinitly stronger. It is how thing go, if you wish to change that make a crt.

Infinitely STRONGER, that's AP/dura. That doesn't mean "immune to every single haxx a dimension below it"

What thing do I need to change with a crt? Where's the rule that literally no hax works on higher-dimensional beings unless it's shown to work on them? Is all plot manipulation, concept manipulation, soul manipulation, etc, useless as soon as things go one dimension up?

If so then almost every 1-B match would be a stomp, since every character without the exact same number of dimensions as another one would have all their hax infinitely beat or be resisted by any other 1-B character.

 

[Overlord775]

from what i remember SCP-682 regenerated from having his mind erased, so mind manipulation is useless

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

No, mentaly infinitly stronger.

Yes, it is a rule that hax cannot affect being on a higher D then what it affected

 

[Schnee_One]

That doesn't make sense

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

from what i remember SCP-682 regenerated from having his mind erased, so mind manipulation is useless

Thazs like saying someone with lowgidly is immune to having his body trandmutated

 

[Jinsye]

Agnaa, 99.9% of 1-B matches are stomps because of that reason.

Being a higher dimension means that you're a few infinities more complex.

 

[Agnaa]

No, mentaly infinitly stronger.

Yes, it is a rule that hax cannot affect being on a higher D then what it affected

Why mentally infinitely stronger? He's never been stated or demonstrated that he's mentally infinitely stronger.

I don't believe that's a rule, where is it? In the thread linked earlier, there were even admins that were disagreeing with that interpretation.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Exept... He scales to beings beyond human comprehension

 

[Agnaa]

@Edward I thought most were stomps due to AP, and the rest the AP imbalance didn't matter because of hax. If I just hadn't noticed that, please tell me, but I thought most 1-B battles assumed that the hax worked between characters even if they weren't the exact same number of dimensions.

@Risci I don't quite get what you mean by that.

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

 

[Ultima_Reality]

If 682 really does have a Higher-Dimensional Consciousness, then Kaguya's mindhax won't affect him at all

Being Higher-Dimensional is not by any means a feat of AP, it means you are of a Higher-Complexity when compared to lower-dimensional creatures, every single aspect of your being partakes in that nature unless stated otherwise

Besides, isn't Kaguya's mindhax one that requires a bit of Preparation Time?

 

[Agnaa]

@Ultima Reality Why does higher-dimentionality necessarily mean higher-complexity in all aspects of your being? The concept of a tesseract isn't infinitely more complex than the concept of a square. I think I'd need an explicit statement/feat to believe that higher-d beings in that verse automatically resist all soul/mind/concept/plot of lower-d beings.

If Kaguya's mindhax requires prep time then I'll retract my vote for now.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

My reaction to the OP.

 

[Kaltias]

@Agnaa

Let's put it this way.

Would you assume that a fictional character can mind hax a real life human?

That's the equivalent of a lower dimensional being trying to mind hax a higher dimensional one

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I can see this not going well.....

 

[Huesito88]

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

Put the whole lower-d hax works on higher-d being aside, I'm pretty sure the whole higher-d mind/consciousness got restricted by default.

 

[Agnaa]

@Kaltias No, because humans aren't authors of reality, so they can't write what powers other things have in the domain of reality.

Reality-fiction abstraction isn't the same as higher dimension-lower dimension abstraction. Fiction is not a dimension lower than us. It's a different kind of abstraction.

It is also extremely easy for me to conceptualize a lower-dimensional being haxxing a higher-dimensional being; it isn't inherently impossible. Why should a higher-dimensional being's soul/mind/concept/plot be immune to all hax? Those things aren't being destroyed with a certain amount of energy (which would make them immune to lower-level harm), they're being haxxed.

 

[Huesito88]

@Homu Sweet Homu

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

@Kaltias No, because humans aren't authors of reality, so they can't write what powers other things have in the domain of reality.

Reality-fiction abstraction isn't the same as higher dimension-lower dimension abstraction. Fiction is not a dimension lower than us. It's a different kind of abstraction.

It is also extremely easy for me to conceptualize a lower-dimensional being haxxing a higher-dimensional being; it isn't inherently impossible. Why should a higher-dimensional being's soul/mind/concept/plot be immune to all hax? Those things aren't being destroyed with a certain amount of energy (which would make them immune to lower-level harm), they're being haxxed.

NANI!

 

[Bigrupert]

No.

 

[Schnee_One]

I'm done.

 

[Agnaa]

Do we really need all these frivolous reaction image/two word posts?

 

[Kaltias]

Humans are quite literally authors of all of fiction.

It is actually similar in nature. Heck that's why 001 Swann is one dimension above the SCP multiverse.

Conceptualizing? No. Doing it? Yes.

Take the most obvious 4-D Low 2-C ever, aka a living timeline. 3-D soul hax by default fails, because you aren't affecting it throughout all of time, meaning that you are affecting only an infitesimal portion of it.

Why it's immune? Because hax has a scale. TOAA doesn't have a single showing of mind resistance, but you can be sure that Luke Skywalker wouldn't stall him because "who shoots first"

 

[Kepekley23]

SCP-682 is explicitly unable to resist potent enough mindhax from 3-D beings, having to adapt in order to be able to do so

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

@Agnaa
Let's put it this way.

Would you assume that a fictional character can mind hax a real life human?

That's the equivalent of a lower dimensional being trying to mind hax a higher dimensional one

^^^^

 

[Overlord775]

@Kaltias
It is also extremely easy for me to conceptualize a lower-dimensional being haxxing a higher-dimensional being; it isn't inherently impossible.

if a character has shown to be able to affect higher dimensional beings with hax, that character has higher dimensional hax

 

[PaChi2]

Im against using something considered as fiction as proof that you are of higher dimensions.

Triangles are not fiction, bois.

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

Triangles are not fiction, bois.

Are you sure about that?

 

[Kaltias]

Im against using something considered as fiction as proof that you are of higher dimensions.

Triangles are not fiction, bois.

You got it backwards.

A reality-fiction interaction can be akin to a higher dimension (although it's case by case)

A higher dimension doesn't necessarily include a reality-fiction interaction.

 

[Overlord775]

Im against using something considered as fiction as proof that you are of higher dimensions.
Triangles are not fiction, bois.

you can't see or immagine a true 2-D object

 

[Kepekley23]

2-D shadows have infinite speed.

Humans don't.