Sans Resistance Negation Addition

[ShionAH]

Flowey is accepted to be soulless

Flowey shows fear of Sans and Sans caused Flowey to die a bunch of times. It is also implied he could never get past sans

So Sans should get a resistance negation

Agree: 7 (@Georredannea15, @ForkMorkPork, @Spectral69420, @Adem_Warlock69, @Originlima, @Greatsage13th, @BoastJr [With no negation])
Disagree: 2 (@Rikimarox2, @ExSENNA)

 

[Thelastmlg]

Immunity to soul is not a resistance and i'm pretty sure soul hax affecting them without information is regarded as a inconsistence.

More importantly, undertale attacks damage you both physically and spiritually feom what i recall, so sans can still damage flowey regardless of him lacking a soul

 

[ShionAH]

Immunity to soul is not a resistance and i'm pretty sure soul hax affecting them without information is regarded as a inconsistence.

I asked this to some people and seems like this is actually wrong.

More importantly, undertale attacks damage you both physically and spiritually feom what i recall, so sans can still damage flowey regardless of him lacking a soul

Flowey would beat the shit out of sans if he used his attacks normally and did 1 damage. Thats why its more likely he used KARMA but since theres a possibility I am not proposing a full one

 

[ShionAH]

bump

 

[Georredannea15]

Make sense for me. I agree with the OP

 

[Ikelaggan]

Flowey would beat the shit out of sans if he used his attacks normally and did 1 damage. Thats why its more likely he used KARMA but since theres a possibility I am not proposing a full one

I'm definitely neutral on that for "plucks him out of the ground and puts him in a jar mid timestop" reasons.
I'm still waiting this thread reaches some conclusion cause immunity negation towards lacking a aspect to attack looks interesting. Definitely not planning another Garfield thread

 

[Chariot190]

The issue is how did he beat him? We don't actually know, for all we know he could have just avoided everything and DPS'd his ass after awhile with bones or something.

 

[ShionAH]

The issue is how did he beat him? We don't actually know, for all we know he could have just avoided everything and DPS'd his ass after awhile with bones or something.

We dont know for sure but its more likely he used his hax still since it is unknown I am asking for a possibly rating

 

[ForkMorkPork]

This makes sense I agree with OP above.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

I guess since Flowey was most likely 8-C in at least one of those runs, a likely might work

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Probably Sans just putted bones in ground lmao

 

[ShionAH]

Probably Sans just putted bones in ground lmao

?? That literally would do 1 dmg and disappear

 

[Rikimarox2]

?? That literally would do 1 dmg and disappear

It is still more logical to assume that than somehow assuming a soul attack works on a soulless dude.

Even if it just does 1 dmg, it just means Sans spammed the shit out of his abilities or smth.

Disagree with the CRT.

Sans is a skillgod fr fr

 

[ShionAH]

It is still more logical to assume that than somehow assuming a soul attack works on a soulless dude.

Even if it just does 1 dmg, it just means Sans spammed the shit out of his abilities or smth.

Disagree with the CRT.

Sans is a skillgod fr fr

Spamming the shit out of your abilities dont matter when your opponent is literally Tier 8 or 9-A and you have 9-B attacks

 

[Rikimarox2]

Then that's a problem with the scaling, or it just works like that in-verse. There's a shit ton of series where a dude who is 50-100x weaker than his opponent and could still damage him. It isn't new. Or you can just label it as an inconsistency. Also, I assume sans scale to 0.002 tons? If so, It ain't even that big of a gap if Flowey was 9-A, literally only a 2.5x gap.

As ridiculous as it sounds, that is still more logical than assuming dude is able to soul hax someone without a soul lmfao. It's like me manipulating the blood of a rock, despite the latter not having blood at all. It's an Oxymoron.

Like, unless you have a very explicit statement saying sans can soul hax a dude without a soul, then I disagree with this completely.

 

[ShionAH]

Then that's a problem with the scaling, or it just works like that in-verse. There's a shit ton of series where a dude who is 50-100x weaker than his opponent and could still damage him. It isn't new. Or you can just label it as an inconsistency. Also, I assume sans scale to 0.002 tons? If so, It ain't even that big of a gap if Flowey was 9-A, literally only a 2.5x gap.

You must be trolling. Flowey had LV to be Tier 8 at this point theres no way sans can beat him

As ridiculous as it sounds, that is still more logical than assuming dude is able to soul hax someone without a soul lmfao. It's like me manipulating the blood of a rock, despite the latter not having blood at all. It's an Oxymoron.

Like, unless you have a very explicit statement saying sans can soul hax a dude without a soul, then I disagree with this completely.

Wtf is this logic? This is fiction sans being able to soul hax soulles beings is possible.

 

[Rikimarox2]

Already said my piece. We don't know the fight went, but if we were to index it, I believe that it is more likely to assume Sans either just shat on him via tons of bones, and that maybe in-verse it is possible for a dude to hurt someone who is 100x stronger than to assume sans can soul hax a dude with no soul.

If ya think the logic is shit, then that's on you. I believe the logic of assuming soul hax works on flowey is even dumber, especially when your counterargument is the infamous "LOL its fiction so what"

I'm honestly thinking of just labelling this as inconsistency or smth.

 

[ShionAH]

Already said my peace. We don't know the fight went, but if we were to index it, I believe that it is more likely to assume Sans either just shat on him via tons of bones, and that maybe in-verse it is possible for a dude to hurt someone who is 100x stronger than to assume sans can soul hax a dude with no soul.

If ya think the logic is shit, then that's on you. I believe the logic of assuming soul hax works on flowey is even dumber, especially when your counterargument is the infamous "LOL its fiction so what"

I'm honestly thinking of just labelling this as inconsistency or smth.

Your opinion. I think it makes no sense to says Sans was able to defeat someone that is Tier 8 without hax.

 

[Vietthai96]

Soul hax someone soulless isn't resistance negation, just a feat of being able to soul hax soulless being, since being soulless make you normally immune to soul hax because you lack a soul for people to hax you to begin with, not actual resistance

 

[ShionAH]

Soul hax someone soulless isn't resistance negation, just a feat of being able to soul hax soulless being, since being soulless make you normally immune to soul hax because you lack a soul for people to hax you to begin with, not actual resistance

Immunity is a strong resistance-? I asked this to several people and everyone told me this was the correct hax

 

[Vietthai96]

Immunity is a strong resistance-? I asked this to several people and everyone told me this was the correct hax

I said this many time before and no, this immunity isn't actual power, but it is because you lack something, thus the hax can't target what you lack to hax, like if you don't have bone, bone hax can't hax you because there is nothing for it to hax, not actual resistance power, it is unconventional immunity/resistance. You only get resistance negation when you actually nullify one's resistance, it is also be mentioned in the Power Nullification page, Resistance Negation section

Idk who you asked, but clearly they are wrong

 

[ShionAH]

I said this many time before and no, this immunity isn't actual power, but it is because you lack something, thus the hax can't target what you lack to hax, like if you don't have bone, bone hax can't hax you because there is nothing for it to hax, not actual resistance power, it is unconventional immunity/resistance. You only get resistance negation when you actually nullify one's resistance, it is also be mentioned in the Power Nullification page, Resistance Negation section

Idk who you asked, but clearly they are wrong

So what hax is this?? Immunity Negation? Instead of saying no can you actual give your idea?

 

[Deleted member 16409]

You must be trolling. Flowey had LV to be Tier 8 at this point theres no way sans can beat him

you must be ridiculous, Sans can beat the shit out of Frisk with more than 100 DEF, if Locket is wearing

 

[Vietthai96]

So what hax is this?? Immunity Negation? Instead of saying no can you actual give your idea?

It isn't grant anything aside from the soul hax in question have better feat that can hax soulless being in a fight while normal soul hax can't, you can write this line on the hax description, that all

 

[ShionAH]

you must be ridiculous, Sans can beat the shit out of Frisk with more than 100 DEF, if Locket is wearing

Yes because he has his hax. Against flowey he doesnt have it so theres no other logical answer

 

[ShionAH]

It isn't grant anything aside from the soul hax in question have better feat that can hax soulless being in a fight while normal soul hax can't, you can write this line on the hax description, that all

What if I just do it like [[Power Nullification|Immunity Negation]]

 

[Vietthai96]

What if I just do it like [[Power Nullification|Immunity Negation]]

Like i said, it don't grant anything because it isn't immunity or resistance negation, because the power isn't even stated to be able to nullify resistance/ability. It just got a better feat of haxing a guy with no soul

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Yes because he has his hax. Against flowey he doesnt have it so theres no other logical answer

I mean, he basically slams Frisk against the ground in the end, making enough force to make a damage to 8-C tier as you say it.
And also it should be noted that Sans can simply pull Flowey out of the ground, since he has shown the ability of gravity on the objects, meaning that he actually could do that to Flowey.

Or you know, he can simply ruin Flowey plans, causing him to reset without any fight. Undertale isn't just about "uh ahh fighting only fighting", think a little bit outside of vsbattle box.

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Also, it just will grant him a better soul hax, nothing else.

 

[ExSENNA]

Disagree. Soulhaxing a soullex being is not resistance negation, it at most implies that your soulhax works in a way it can affect soullex beings, no different than deathhaxing undead people. Not having a soul is not a resistance to begin with

Besides, this looks more of an insonsistency caused by random implication to hype up Sans, we have no idea how the fights between Flowey and Sans even went

 

[ShionAH]

I mean, he basically slams Frisk against the ground in the end, making enough force to make a damage to 8-C tier as you say it.

Irrelevant. We agreed his TK also had some kind of dura neg. Make a CRT for Tier 8 sans then

And also it should be noted that Sans can simply pull Flowey out of the ground, since he has shown the ability of gravity on the objects, meaning that he actually could do that to Flowey.

How do you know Flowey would suddenly die because he is out of the ground? Also Flowey can still spam his own danmaku

Or you know, he can simply ruin Flowey plans, causing him to reset without any fight. Undertale isn't just about "uh ahh fighting only fighting", think a little bit outside of vsbattle box.

The context was about general fighting and he was obviously talking about death. Either stop trolling like the other threads or leave

Disagree. Soulhaxing a soullex being is not resistance negation, it at most implies that your soulhax works in a way it can affect soullex beings, no different than deathhaxing undead people. Not having a soul is not a resistance to begin with

This isnt a disagreement of the thread only for the ability?

Besides, this looks more of an insonsistency caused by random implication to hype up Sans, we have no idea how the fights between Flowey and Sans even went

Yes we dont know. Thats the entire point. Both of it is possible but sans having a weird ability is way more likely. I am tired of repeating myself just listen to me gosh dammit

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Irrelevant. We agreed his TK also had some kind of dura neg. Make a CRT for Tier 8 sans then

wait when

How do you know Flowey would suddenly die because he is out of the ground? Also Flowey can still spam his own danmaku

Yeah, and his danmaku isn't that great tbh, actually we don't even know how his danmaku usually looks like

The context was about general fighting and he was obviously talking about death. Either stop trolling like the other threads or leave

your ass is trolling, you just headcanonned whole interaction between sans and papyrus and trying to say something like, wth man.

Its actually unknown what happened, like no information available about it, and we just speculating and you be like "my speculation is better than yours" fr

This isnt a disagreement of the thread only for the ability?

Yes we dont know. Thats the entire point. Both of it is possible but sans having a weird ability is way more likely. I am tired of repeating myself just listen to me gosh dammit

again, it's just a better soul hax lmao.

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Also, it should be said that putting Flowey outside of ground just make him more immobile than he already is, just making his ass easier to defeat

 

[ShionAH]

wait when

Use your mind. Why is sans TK not listed as 9-A like it was once was?

Yeah, and his danmaku isn't that great tbh, actually we don't even know how his danmaku usually looks like

Ignored the other part for?

your ass is trolling, you just headcanonned whole interaction between sans and papyrus and trying to say something like, wth man.

Its actually unknown what happened, like no information available about it, and we just speculating and you be like "my speculation is better than yours" fr

“Uhh here when flowey talks about fighting and then says sans caused him to reset several times and says that he feats sans? Yeah it was not about FIGHT!!!!! ”

again, it's just a better soul hax lmao.

I am fine with that

 

[ShionAH]

Also, it should be said that putting Flowey outside of ground just make him more immobile than he already is, just making his ass easier to defeat

Headcanon with zero implications

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Use your mind. Why is sans TK not listed as 9-A like it was once was?

dunno man give me the thread where this topic is elaborated more than usual

“Uhh here when flowey talks about fighting and then says sans caused him to reset several times and says that he feats sans? Yeah it was not about FIGHT!!!!! ”

Here is ******* when? Like, you just slapped it on, where he just says that we shouldn't have more interaction because he caused fair amount of RESETs. Where the **** is fight? Like, when it was implicated firstly, you immobile creature?

I am fine with that

same, I just agree with better soul hax lmao

 

[Deleted member 16409]

Headcanon with zero implications

at least has more sense than any thing you learned and said

 

[ShionAH]

dunno man give me the thread where this topic is elaborated more than usual

no idea where it happened

Here is ******* when? Like, you just slapped it on, where he just says that we shouldn't have more interaction because he caused fair amount of RESETs. Where the **** is fight? Like, when it was implicated firstly, you immobile creature?

Did you call me a immobile creature? What kind of half ass insult is that. By the way if you cannot see these lines talking about fights I think you may have a problem, resetting nearly always means you died and came back

same, I just agree with better soul hax lmao

You agree with better soul hax?

 

[ShionAH]

at least has more sense than any thing you learned and said

“at least has more sense than any thing you learned and said”

 

[Deleted member 16409]

You agree with better soul hax?

yes I do

it's just easy to assume so and has like, more sense to do so, even game wise he has better soul hax than anyone in the game lmao